From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Fri Feb 1 20:16:56 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id UAA04592 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 20:16:56 -0800 Received: from smtp014.mail.yahoo.com (smtp014.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.173.58]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id UAA17617 for ; Thu, 31 Jan 2002 20:57:56 -0800 Received: from unknown (HELO procrastan8r) (209.48.222.22) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2002 04:57:56 -0000 Message-ID: <001101c1aadd$3b48b6c0$16de30d1@procrastan8r> From: "Vince Bradley" To: "Sandra O'Connor" , "Ted Huff" Cc: , "Steve Blough" References: <55.21c5732e.298a1f62@aol.com> <001701c1aa65$bbd67f20$504897cc@computer> Subject: Re: [footbag] Nomination for Hall of Fame Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 23:59:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I second this nomination. No matter how you look at it Steve Blough has made an impression on footbaggers. No matter what your impression of what footbag 'should be' adversarial viewpoints are what keep a sport in tune with its roots and constantly developing into new things. To be sure I havent' read the content of the message, so if it does happen to take pot shots at any viewpoint of what footbag is, i don't endorse that. I do endorse recognizing the influence, mastery, and hard work of an enthusiastic leader of footbag. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sandra O'Connor" Subject: [footbag] Nomination for Hall of Fame > Dear Mr. Huff and announce recipients: > > Please accept this nomination for Danceman Steve Blough to the Hall of Fame. [ Moderator's ] From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Fri Feb 1 20:18:25 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id UAA04631 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 20:18:25 -0800 Received: from foundationcomputing.net (donorport.org [207.160.174.56]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id UAA04061 for ; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 20:01:20 -0800 Received: from dfiatx96-236.dfiatx.dsl.gtei.net ([4.3.96.236] verified) by foundationcomputing.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.3.2) with ESMTP id 807406 for footbag@footbag.org; Fri, 01 Feb 2002 21:56:57 -0600 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 22:02:45 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v480) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Subject: [footbag] Nomination for Ida Bettis Fogle From: Derrick Fogle To: footbag@footbag.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.480) Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I've been nominated for my role in footbag promotions, but there's another person who has worked just as hard as I have in every promotional effort I've ever undertaken. She's also a current women's world record holder (and *I* think she's awful cute, too). So I hereby nominate Ida Bettis Fogle for the Footbag Hall of Fame. -Derrick From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Sun Feb 3 08:59:30 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id IAA29752 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Sun, 3 Feb 2002 08:59:30 -0800 Received: from mtiwmhc22.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc22.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.47]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id SAA04959 for ; Sat, 2 Feb 2002 18:26:56 -0800 Received: from hacky10 ([63.27.222.124]) by mtiwmhc22.worldnet.att.net (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020203022637.XQDV941.mtiwmhc22.worldnet.att.net@hacky10> for ; Sun, 3 Feb 2002 02:26:37 +0000 Message-ID: <001101c1ac5a$b24e6200$7cde1b3f@earthlink.net> From: "Julianne Smith" To: Subject: [footbag] Re: Nomination for Ida Bettis Fogle Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2002 20:30:06 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I second the nomination of Ida Bettis Fogle. All tournaments I have gone to that Derrick and Ida have hosted, both of them have put so much effort and time into them. Plus, I have always seen Ida kicking with "newbies" when others wouldn't. Steve Smith From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 4 09:22:59 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id JAA03305 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 09:22:59 -0800 Received: from FootbagCanada.com ([208.20.109.216]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id NAA05643 for ; Sun, 3 Feb 2002 13:39:02 -0800 Received: from richarda1hc7od [24.83.198.157] by FootbagCanada.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.06) id ADEE10330148; Sun, 03 Feb 2002 16:38:54 -0500 Reply-To: From: "Chard Cook" To: Cc: Subject: [footbag] 2002 Hall of Fame Nomination Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2002 13:37:13 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I'd like to nominate Scott Milne for the Footbag Hall of Fame. He's been playing since 1981. Holds a 1998 World title in Distance One Pass. Was 3rd Overall in the World three years in a row and was among the top ten all through the 90's. Competed in tournaments across North America since the late 80's with many podium finishes. Co-founded the Kitsilano Footbag Association and was one of the original Kits Kickers. Has been a mainstay organizer for the Vancouver Open, virtually since its inception. Toured the states and performed school shows for the WFA, with Animal, which is a huge accomplishment in itself. :) Represented the WFA at Expo '92 in Sevilla, Spain for 6 months promoting Footbag. Has served on the International Footbag Committee (IFAB) since 1992? or'93?. Has stitched The Habit 12 panel footbag for over ten years and took over the production of The Kanga 32 panel footbag for a couple of years, before the Canadian Footbag Alliance assumed the role. Co-founded the Canadian Footbag Alliance to further promote and develop the sport in Canada and worldwide. Toured Australia for 3 months promoting, performing, and selling footbag. Created The Cure 80 panel footbag. Authored Kick the Habit, an informative, fun, interactive instructional cd-rom on the Sport of Footbag. Co-creator and webmaster of www.FootbagCanada.com, website for the Canadian Footbag Alliance. And has generally been an inspiration and well respected by anyone playing footbag. Has always encouraged and helped new players. I don't know of a more deserving individual who is not already in the Hall of Fame. This guy has given heart and soul to Footbag. Always kickin', Chard Cook CFA From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 4 13:00:37 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id NAA14385 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 13:00:37 -0800 Received: from petasus.iil.intel.com (petasus.iil.intel.com [192.198.152.69]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id MAA14019 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 12:49:26 -0800 Received: from hasmsxvs01.iil.intel.com (hasmsxvs01.iil.intel.com [143.185.63.58]) by petasus.iil.intel.com (8.9.1a+p1/8.9.1/d: relay.m4,v 1.49 2002/01/25 02:16:58 root Exp $) with SMTP id UAA18700 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 20:49:29 GMT Received: from hasmsx17.iil.intel.com ([143.185.63.203]) by hasmsxvs01.iil.intel.com (NAVGW 2.5.1.16) with SMTP id M2002020422492211068 for ; Mon, 04 Feb 2002 22:49:22 +0200 Received: by hasmsx17.iil.intel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 22:49:22 +0200 Message-ID: <99A434EE7B5DD411ADE20090274FA27701D20181@hasmsx33.iil.intel.com> From: "Westberg, Amy" To: footbag@footbag.org Subject: [footbag] Hall of Fame nomination for Chris "Gator" Routh Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 22:49:18 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I would like to nominate Chris "Gator" Routh for the 2002 Hall of Fame. He has made significant contributions to the sport. As a four time world champion, he has inspired others by his grace and talent. He touched the lives of many and recruited new players from all over the country. (Tennessee, Seattle, and Arizona) Everyone knows Gator and his success in the footbag community. He is such an easy person to be around and his love for footbag affected my life personally. If I hadn't have met him, I don't think I would have ever played this game that has become such an important part of my life. I'm sure that others feel the same. Gator will not ever be able to play footbag again due to his hip replacement, but he will always be an important part of the community. In summary, I would like to nominate him to the Hall of Fame 2002. Thanks and best regards, Amy From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 5 17:22:05 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id RAA16297 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 17:22:05 -0800 Received: from smtp2.mail.iamworld.net (smtp2-out.mail.iamworld.net [204.91.241.117]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id GAA25697 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 06:34:01 -0800 Received: from acsdallas.com ([205.197.220.222]) by smtp2.mail.iamworld.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA435827 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 09:34:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from bbrantley [205.197.220.206] by acsdallas.com [127.0.0.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v3.5.0.R) for ; Tue, 05 Feb 2002 08:33:28 -0600 From: "James Roberts" To: Subject: RE: [footbag] Hall of Fame nomination for Chris "Gator" Routh Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 08:34:43 -0600 Message-ID: <006201c1ae4b$7beb8f60$cedcc5cd@acsdallas.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <99A434EE7B5DD411ADE20090274FA27701D20181@hasmsx33.iil.intel.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-MDRemoteIP: 205.197.220.206 X-Return-Path: jroberts@acsdallas.com X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: footbag@footbag.org Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I second that nomination... "Bub-ba!" Sincerely, JR Amy Westberg wrote: >I would like to nominate Chris "Gator" Routh for the 2002 Hall of Fame. From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 5 17:23:30 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id RAA16345 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 17:23:30 -0800 Received: from FootbagCanada.com ([208.20.109.216]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id NAA07144 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 13:44:09 -0800 Received: from cs769715a [24.83.209.35] by FootbagCanada.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.06) id A2208E02FE; Tue, 05 Feb 2002 16:44:00 -0500 Reply-To: From: "Scott Milne" To: Cc: Subject: [footbag] Footbag Hall of Fame nomination for Ian Kobayashi Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 13:43:29 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Hello Sir Huff and the footbag world, I would like to nominate Ian Kobayashi for the 2002 Footbag Hall of Fame. Ian's many years of leadership, fantastic sense of humour, and truly genuine gentle spirit is what laid the foundation for what the sport of Footbag has become in Vancouver Canada today. His never ending devotion to helping out the 'new players' on the net court (like me) lead to the inception, organization, and development of the "Kitsilano Kickers". Ian Kobayashi embodies that perfect blend between competition and comradery that has helped set our sport apart from others. There aren't many other organized sports out there where you can be picked up at the airport in a distant city by a fellow competitor, and get put up for the night. The next morning you have coffee and breakfast together, then spend the rest of the day trying to kick their butt on the net court, or on stage. That night you get to go party with all the competitors, then get up the next day and try to crush them all again. Win or loose, there's usually tears at the airport when you have to say goodbye. That type of spirit is what the pioneers of our sport envisioned, and Ian's influence has helped keep that spirit alive. I would also like to invite other kickers who have been influenced by Ian's Footbag wisdom to come forward and share your sentiments. Bust a lace, Scott Milne Canadian Footbag Alliance From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 5 17:25:12 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id RAA16445 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 17:25:12 -0800 Received: from hotmail.com (f103.law7.hotmail.com [216.33.237.103]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id PAA12451 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 15:39:20 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 15:39:20 -0800 Received: from 64.228.237.81 by lw7fd.law7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Feb 2002 23:39:20 GMT X-Originating-IP: [64.228.237.81] From: "Yves Archambault" To: Thehuff1@aol.com Cc: footbag@footbag.org Subject: [footbag] Footbag Hall of Fame nomination for Alan Petersen Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 23:39:20 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Feb 2002 23:39:20.0408 (UTC) FILETIME=[5568C580:01C1AE9E] Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I would like to see Alan Petersen nominated for this year HOF as one of the most gifted players of all times. There is not much more to be said as he said it all on the court and else. Yevez Nuts'n'Bolts From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 12 11:12:45 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id LAA13769 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 11:12:45 -0800 Received: from moutvdom00.kundenserver.de (moutvdom00.kundenserver.de [195.20.224.149]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id UAA23924 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 20:22:45 -0800 Received: from [195.20.224.219] (helo=mrvdom03.kundenserver.de) by moutvdom00.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 16YJbK-000817-00 for footbag@footbag.org; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 05:22:30 +0100 Received: from [217.230.167.99] (helo=x) by mrvdom03.kundenserver.de with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 16YJbK-0008N2-00 for footbag@footbag.org; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 05:22:30 +0100 Message-ID: <002101c1aec5$fec50680$b77ba8c0@x> From: "Matthias Lino Schmidt" To: Subject: [footbag] Photos wanted Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 05:23:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Ahoy... ...between all the officiary nominations I'm coming up with something pretty banal: I'm looking for photos of people playing footbag golf and four square and doing consecutives (one can't "play consecutives", right?)! I need them for our club's website which I'm currently rebuilding. There is going to be section about all the various disciplines of footbag and I want to illustrate each of them. Of course, I'll add proper copyright information to every image I use. Please email me first before you send photos and tell me about the file size and resolution. Or immediately send to tonne@linoschmidt.de. Thank you, Matthias... From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 12 11:14:54 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id LAA13857 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 11:14:54 -0800 Received: from dnvrpop1.dnvr.uswest.net (dnvrpop5.dnvr.uswest.net [206.196.128.7]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id VAA07639 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 21:06:53 -0800 Received: (qmail 8492 invoked by uid 0); 7 Feb 2002 05:06:51 -0000 Received: from dnvrdslgw13poola194.dnvr.uswest.net (HELO qwest.net) (63.228.80.194) by dnvrpop5.dnvr.uswest.net with SMTP; 7 Feb 2002 05:06:51 -0000 Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 22:18:51 -0700 Message-ID: <3C620E3B.927544A2@qwest.net> From: "David Leberknight" To: footbag@list.footbag.org X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [footbag] Footbag Hall of Fame nomination for Alan Petersen Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Hi everyone, I would like to 2nd Yves nomination of Alan Petersen, adding that Alan is not only a staggeringly consistent and talented all-around player, but also a major innovator in the art and craft of footbag stitching, producing some of the world's most beautiful and functional footbags over many many years. -Dave Leberknight From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 12 11:15:45 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id LAA13930 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 11:15:45 -0800 Received: from imo-d07.mx.aol.com (imo-d07.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.39]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id KAA17808 for ; Sat, 9 Feb 2002 10:42:47 -0800 From: Ted Huff Received: from Thehuff1@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v32.5.) id z.103.10717de5 (3980) for ; Sat, 9 Feb 2002 13:42:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <103.10717de5.2996c784@aol.com> Date: Sat, 9 Feb 2002 13:42:12 EST Subject: [footbag] Nominations, to date, for Footbag Hall of Fame voting in 2002 To: footbag@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Dear friends of the sport, This is an update of who has been nominated so far this year. This is a reminder that nominations are open until 3/31/02, AND, more importantly, that the nomination process is understood by all. 1. Anyone can nominate anyone, based on their leadership in the growth of the sport worldwide. Leadership should be considered as via their individual and/or team play, promotion/teaching/tournament direction/ demonstration/club development, game /sport innovation & invention, inspiration, and development of the sport's communication assets worldwide. Leadership from 1972 to 2002. 2. Anyone can encourage others to do the same, via their nomination + with a brief testimonial covering what their nominee has done for leading the sport forward in its development worldwide. Anyone can add whoever agrees with them to a single email/nomination, or encourage others to speak up via their personal email nomination. 3. The top 5 nominee's, determined by the total number of nominations received for that person by 3/31/02, will be added to the final ballot. NOTE: This fact is the key. 4. 5 nominee's , including ties, were carried over from last year's final ballot voting, and automatically are on this year's final ballot. They are: Eric Cole, Sam Conlon, Derrick Fogle, Sabra Jean Hall, Maxell Smith, and Tim Vozar ! 5. All nomination information, including all key testimonials, will be copied and sent to all current members of your sports Hall of Fame. As is your right, these members may be solicited to support your nominee's induction. 6. Induction will be determined by a 66% majority vote on the final ballot by the current members of your Footbag Hall of Fame. Announcement will be the 1st week of June. 7. Best method, per webmaster's previous instructions, is to send nomination to me ( just a volunteer directing / keeping all the feedback from & for you) at: thehuff1@aol.com, AND, very important to the nomination, cc'ing the footbag public at footbag@footbag.org !!!! Don't just send to me, unless your nomination is really personal ! So, the nominations received to date are: Chris "Gator" Routh, Ian Kobiyashi, Ida Fogle, Alan Petersen, Chris Ott, "Rippin' " Rick Reese, Peter "The Executioner" Irish, Scott Milne, Chard Cook, Tony Robinson, Justin Sexton, Peter Shunny, Randy Nelson, Steve Blough, "Pop" Warner, Gary Griggs, Jeremy Kumbruck, Jubal Hume, Etienne Constable, Ed LaMacchia, Brett Welch, Jody Welch, Julie Symons, Lisa McDaniel, and Steve Goldberg. ( Special note: Steve Goldberg, player and webmaster, has requested that is name be withdrawn from consideration this year, as he feels that there are many others that deserve to be noted and honored before him, such as those that inspired him to become such a key to the development of the game/sport worldwide. ) Good luck to all !! Ted Huff, co-director Footbag Hall of Fame Historical Society From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 12 11:17:01 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id LAA13979 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 11:17:01 -0800 Received: from imo-m06.mx.aol.com (imo-m06.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.161]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id IAA17551 for ; Sun, 10 Feb 2002 08:58:25 -0800 From: Ted Huff Received: from Thehuff1@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v32.5.) id z.49.1839b946 (4232) for ; Sun, 10 Feb 2002 11:58:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <49.1839b946.299800a2@aol.com> Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 11:58:10 EST Subject: [footbag] Personal seconding of some nominations for Hall of Fame in 2002 To: footbag@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org To friends of the sport, With the opening ceremonies of the winter Olympics, I am reminded why I felt that sport, for the sake of sport alone, was something I am motivated to be a part of and encourage.Why I believe Footbag is a sport worthy of respect worldwide. Someday, maybe in the Olympics itself ? Therefore, those that have led this sport's growth deserve to be recognized and honored by their peers, as encouragement to others to lead the sport further worldwide. This year, with world's in San Francisco area again,courtesy of B.A.F.L. volunteers, I would like to add the following seconds to some fresh nominations/re-nominations this year: Chris Ott --- great part of what has made California a key to the sport's growth. player/promoter/tournament director/inventor: FootC junior net sets. Alan Petersen --- world champion from Denmark, world tour team teacher, demonstrator, inspiration, footbag designer. Should be sought after in Europe + as a player and trainer for the net sport. Peter Irish --- world champion. 1 of freestyle's Big Add Posse, inspirational & innovative sport leader. A great spirit to meet. Rippin' Rick Reese --- world champion. 1 of freestyle's Big Add Posse, inspirational & innovative sport leader. Rippin' = shred Brent Welch --- world champion. part of the core of organizing footbag as a sport. enough said. Jody Welch --- world champion. ( better?) half of Team Welch. tough competitor even while pregnant ! Chris "Gator" Routh --- world champion. took the bag high in net duels in 80'/90's. hip replacement, not all due to his play, makes him a fan now, but not forgotten as a competitor. A net partner many wanted in his day's of inspiration to the sport. Scott Milne --- world class in every facet of the sport's growth. part of what makes it happen worldwide via touranment direction, product design/sales, world tour promotions, and as a key director of the sport worldwide. Chard Cook --- Scott's partner in play + in founding Canadian Footbag Alliance. another person making the sport's growth worldwide a part of their life's legacy. Randy Mulder ---- world net champion in singles & doubles. teacher. He set standards in tournament play. Can you say spike ? Brenda Solonoski --- Funtastic. key tournament organizer for longest running event in eastern U.S., game/sport promoter. Where else would players go for fun Labor Day weekend in N. America ?!? This event has made a difference in bringing players & sport together annually. These are a few of this sport's leaders. Certainly, others already on the final ballot deserve to be honored, such as Derrick Fogle and Sam Conlon. Again, just to name a few. I encourage all players to speak up for their favorite peers now, as it's open to send nominations and/or brief testimonials , such as mine, until 3/31/02. From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 12 11:18:33 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id LAA14020 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 11:18:33 -0800 Received: from web9808.mail.yahoo.com (web9808.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.34]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id KAA18946 for ; Sun, 10 Feb 2002 10:14:44 -0800 Message-ID: <20020210181440.37107.qmail@web9808.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.40.248.51] by web9808.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 10 Feb 2002 10:14:40 PST Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 10:14:40 -0800 (PST) From: Paul Munger Subject: [footbag] Hall of Fame Nomination for Jay Mouldenhauer To: footbag@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I nominate Jay "J-Man" Mouldenhauer to the Footbag Hall of Fame. His contributions to this sport are inumerable. He constantly put footbag in front of crowds, large and small alike. Doing footbag/frisbee demos and shows all over the midwest for alot of years. He took time to talk to kids and teach them tricks, give them tips and show them what they are doing wrong.. Always with a smile... He was the originator of the X-Mas Jam. He helped out in huge amounts in the mid 90's to fund and coordinate the X-Mas Jams and the World Record attempts. He is SOLEY responsible for all of footbag in Michigan. He inspired Greg Nelson, Myself (Paul Munger), Josh Casey and Steve Kremer to first learn how to kick/shred and then to go on and become B.A.P. members!! Hell he even took Scott Davidson to his first worlds.... and he is now a singles freestyle World Champion and B.A.P. Member. He helped to create the moves and set the standard for the way Team Freestyle is played today. There is sooo many other things that I am not going to go into them here. I feel that he deserves to be in the Footbag Hall of Fame.. CAN I GET A SECOND PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Paul "Hu-Mungis" Munger ps I guess I made this sound as if he is dead. The fact is he is still alive and kickin....(no pun) From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 12 11:28:17 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id LAA14414 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 11:28:17 -0800 Received: from m16.boston.juno.com (m16.boston.juno.com [64.136.24.79]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id LAA22139 for ; Sun, 10 Feb 2002 11:56:41 -0800 From: Andy Linder Received: from cookie.juno.com by cookie.juno.com for <"s7RXUGEiahw/m/OaQrFvy/C62488DBNLdo5RjYJzcuNrrJtpkmY/kA=="> Received: (from alinder12@juno.com) by m16.boston.juno.com (jqueuemail) id GTBGXHZ6; Sun, 10 Feb 2002 14:56:23 EST To: Thehuff1@aol.com Cc: footbag@footbag.org Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 13:54:33 +0000 Subject: [footbag] Re: Nominations, to date, for Footbag Hall of Fame voting in 2002 Message-ID: <20020210.135437.-100915.0.alinder12@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Once again here's my list of FHF nominations. The following have all, to my knowledge, been retired or semi-retired since before i retired from competition in 1997: Jay Moldenhauer - started club in michigan, significance in team freestyle is known to all Fred Kipley and Gary Preston - started club in Wisconsin, toured, and were fine all-around players in the early 80s Lee Guenther and R.B. Benedetti - directors of Memphis Footworks club that put on two major tournaments each year Dutch Holland - former full time WFA staff and touring pro Jeff Haas - former touring pro who, I believe, formed the f.e.a.t. club with Derrick Fogle (Derrick and wife Ida I believe belong in the FHF as well) Jon Lind - former touring pro. great overall player. Everyone knows his impact on freestyle Beal Betherum and Randy Nelson - I think everyone knows about them - Footboltz, former team freestyle champs, Randy currently working with wfa full-time Max Smith - he's been out of the sport for a long time, but I hope there are enough of us in the FHF who remember him and his contibution to our sport. God Bless, Andy Linder From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Wed Feb 13 13:52:28 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id NAA05768 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 13:52:28 -0800 Received: from casmail.ucsf.edu (casmail.ucsf.edu [128.218.117.148]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id TAA02808 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 19:37:17 -0800 Received: from 128.218.117.134 by casmail.ucsf.edu (AppleShare IP Mail Server 6.3.1) id 89605 via TCP with SMTP; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 19:35:24 -0800 Message-id: <1020212193524.27876f.80da7594.ASIP6.3.1.89605@casmail.ucsf.edu> Date: 12 Feb 02 19:35:24 -0800 From: Tu Vu Subject: Re: [footbag] Hall of Fame Nomination for Jay Mouldenhauer To: s s X-Mailer: QuickMail Pro 1.5.4 (Mac) X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Reply-To: Tu Vu Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-Ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by llic.net id TAA02808 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Footbag players, I would like to formally second the nomination for Jay mouldenhauer to the footbag hall of fame. Besides the fact that he is one footbag freestyle's greatest innovators in the 80's/90's and multi-time world doubles champion. This man has been one of the most positive role models in the entire history of the footbag with his friendliness, helpfulness, and being overall great human being. Tu "Huge" Vu Original Message Follows---- >From: Paul Munger > >I nominate Jay "J-Man" Mouldenhauer to the Footbag >Hall of Fame. From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Thu Feb 14 08:59:25 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id IAA07917 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 08:59:25 -0800 Received: from press.ripcity.com (press.ripcity.com [157.238.145.132]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id MAA16532 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 12:17:18 -0800 Received: by press.ripcity.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2655.55) id <1JVYCQ9S>; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 12:17:38 -0800 Message-ID: From: Steve Dusablon To: "'footbag@footbag.org'" Subject: [footbag] Seconds for Hall of Fame nominations Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 12:17:06 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2655.55) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I wish to add my seconds to those folks who I am familiar with and whom I appreciate and have influenced myself and my fellow competitors since I have had the good fortune to be associated with the best game on earth. I second Ian Kobiashi's nomination. The team of players in Vancouver B.C. is one of the best on the planet. They are not only some of the finest competitors in the sport but their fun attitudes never waver. This is in no small part, due to Ian's influence and ongoing participation. My personal thanks to him and best of wishes with this well deserved Hall of Fame bid. I second Alan Peterson's nomination. Indeed, one of the finest players I have ever had the pleasure of witnessing. Aside from beating me for 3rd place in golf in Portland, I have nothing but the fondest respect for Alan and the sport as a whole would be diminished were it not for his involvment. I second Chris Routh's nomination. What more needs to be said than... bubba! Thanks, Steve From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Sun Feb 17 06:53:18 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id GAA29320 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 06:53:18 -0800 Received: from hotmail.com (f41.pav1.hotmail.com [64.4.31.41]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id PAA09299 for ; Sat, 16 Feb 2002 15:45:04 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 16 Feb 2002 15:44:59 -0800 Received: from 203.164.7.213 by pv1fd.pav1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 16 Feb 2002 23:44:59 GMT X-Originating-IP: [203.164.7.213] From: "Dan Ednie" To: footbag@footbag.org Subject: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 10:44:59 +1100 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Feb 2002 23:44:59.0382 (UTC) FILETIME=[F1FF5960:01C1B743] Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Hello list In the midst of the Winter Olympics my mind drifted to footbag, and I asked myself whether Footbag should or could become an olympic event? Looking at the figure skating in salt lake city added a precint to events like Footbag. I really think the footbag could easily be an event at the summer Olympics, not to mention the Good Will Games and the Commonwealth Games. Footbag freestyle's elements make it perfectly suited to the Olympics. It looks good, it has artitistic merit, it is highly competitive, and it's not so radical that it scares people. It is in my opinion that many footbag sub directories also have the potential to feature at the olympics in their own right but the one that spings to mind is the 2 minute freestyle, (f you can't picture footbag at the olympics look at ryan's final run in 2000) Another possiblity lies in all-around footbag, where all competitors compete in net, 45 second freestyle and consecutives. If there are any IOC memebers in our midst, i ask that you put footbag foward at the next IOC meeting or maybe steve or someone could give a written proposal to the Olympic Commitee dan ednie From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Sun Feb 17 09:41:37 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id JAA02327 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 09:41:37 -0800 Received: from rly-ip02.mx.aol.com (rly-ip02.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.160]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id IAA32408 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 08:27:49 -0800 Received: from logs-wb.proxy.aol.com (logs-wb.proxy.aol.com [205.188.192.135]) by rly-ip02.mx.aol.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/AOL-5.0.0) with ESMTP id LAA15618 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 11:26:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from JasonFrost (AC847917.ipt.aol.com [172.132.121.23]) by logs-wb.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id g1HGPx2294970 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 11:25:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <000b01c1b7cf$c2d81960$177984ac@JasonFrost> From: "Jason Frost" To: Subject: Re: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 10:25:48 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 Disposition-Notification-To: "Jason Frost" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Apparently-From: FrostJuggling@aol.com Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I, for one, would love to see Footbag in the Olympics. But that will NEVER happen. First off unless I'm mistaken, 55 countries at the least have to be playing a sport before it's even considered, right? I do think there are 55 countries that have some sort of kicking game, but it's not Footbag. Second, there has to be a MAJOR push for Footbag in America and I don't mean just at the tournaments. Footbag is a lot of things, but it's not very friendly to new players. Meaning... if a "newbie" comes up in a circle (or even net) of freestylers and try to "hack in" they are quickly ousted. In order for any sport to grow you have to welcome in and teach the new players, as frustrating as it may be at times. We all started as "newbie's". Third, there has to be more exposure. The tournaments I go to are totally awesome but we need to get out there to the concerts, on the corners, on TV, in commercials, America's Most Wanted (jk), get into schools more, and find some major sponsor. Every sport in the Summer/Winter Olympics has a major sponsor. I do a school program and have been at it for the past eight years and I put Footbag in the show. In this day and age you would be surprised at the number of people who haven't seen or heard of it. I would be the first to sign up for Footbag in the Games but we have a lot of work to do before this can happen. oh! I think there needs to be more Oprah and less Jerry Springer between certain Footbag communities. Just a few of my thoughts on a Sunday morning while watching 'First Knight'. Till next time... Jason Frost FrostJuggling@aol.com From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Sun Feb 17 09:43:22 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id JAA02436 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 09:43:22 -0800 Received: from imo-r02.mx.aol.com (imo-r02.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.98]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id IAA00348 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 08:43:55 -0800 From: Tedd Huff Received: from Thehuff1@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v32.5.) id i.d5.1340fbd0 (4442); Sun, 17 Feb 2002 11:43:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 11:43:37 EST Subject: Re: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics To: ednie@hotmail.com CC: footbag@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org You're right, Footbag is worthy of being an Olympic quality sport, but can't make it without support of an organization, an organization that starts at club levels, and rises to state/province, to national , to world levels of respect. All of that means is the players must get committed to showing they are organized, respecting themselves and their chosen sport first, then their organizers , their local public expectations for worthiness of respect, and sponsors needs. When was the last time you or your friends kicked in a public area, and wore a t-shirt that showed you were part of an organization ? When was the last time your club set up public demonstration and teaching? When was the last time you tried to get sponsors without telling them that you were part of a worldwide sport? Personally, the Olympic dream carried me to commit to being a part of the development of Footbag in 1975, after meeting John Stalberger and Mike Marshall in 1973. Stalberger, I thought , was similar to Dr. Naismith when he thought of basketball, and asked for support of this little idea. It was an opportunity I could not resist. I had my chance to help lead, now it's others turn to lead by example, by earning respect. The players today, need to consider why Footbag is not better recognized today, after 25 years of attempts to organize and promote it as a sport. It's not because of a lack of leaders that have tried ( Bruce Guettich of WFA ought to be thanked by all players for sticking with it for 24 years !!, as prime example. ) , but due more to a lack of players unwilling to follow . "rebels without a cause" comes to mind. I am not knocking what has grown in quality of play in all types of Footbag play, especially freestyle, and in net, which is the truest sport version of Footbag. And, I applaud all players and promoters to date. But, right now, Steve Goldberg and others at the head of founding the IFPA, need anyone on this website to step up and ask of them " what can I do to be a part of the future of Footbag as an organized sport ? " If you wait for others to do it, it will never happen for you, and those that support your enjoyment of the sport today. Someday, you may look back at your sport and say " what if I had got into organizing my sport, what difference could I have made then...............?" What pride is there in watching ? I say you gain more by giving back. I suggest now is the time for you to jump in and make IFPA a force in sport worldwide. Selfserve ? I say "PASS IT ON !" Sincerely, Ted Huff, co-director Footbag Hall of Fame Historical Society From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Sun Feb 17 11:01:12 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id LAA04715 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 11:01:12 -0800 Received: from I (brat.footbag.org [209.125.90.60]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id LAA04712 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 11:01:11 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: brat@209.125.90.2 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 11:01:09 -0800 To: footbag@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org At 10:44 AM +1100 2/17/02, Dan Ednie wrote: >In the midst of the Winter Olympics my mind drifted to footbag, and >I asked myself whether Footbag should or could become an olympic >event? Dan, you've hit on exactly the reason we created the IFPA. To be recognized as a sport by the Olympics, you basically have to have an international "federation" (called an International Governing Body). IFPA is meant to be that international governing body. In a nutshell, the long-term goal (it will take many years -- we've been working on just *forming* the IFPA for 8!) of the IFPA is to see footbag become a recognized Olympic sport, and to target the sport world-wide to youths of all economic and social classes as an excellent athletic activity, promoting health, individual discipline, and "peace through play". IFPA has affiliated clubs in over 30 countries. Join today and help us along the way to this dream: http://www.footbag.org/ifpa/join Thanks. Steve From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Sun Feb 17 19:03:17 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id TAA19630 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 19:03:17 -0800 Received: from I (brat.footbag.org [209.125.90.60]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id TAA19627 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 19:03:16 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: brat@209.125.90.2 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <000b01c1b7cf$c2d81960$177984ac@JasonFrost> References: <000b01c1b7cf$c2d81960$177984ac@JasonFrost> Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 19:03:15 -0800 To: footbag@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org At 10:25 AM -0600 2/17/02, Jason Frost wrote: >But that will NEVER happen. Jason, Jason, Jason. :-( >First off unless I'm mistaken, 55 countries at the least have >to be playing a sport before it's even considered, right? No. As far as I understand it, you must have an international governing body, and then *7* demonstrable national governing bodies. Today, we are very close to that number. > Second, there has to be a MAJOR push for Footbag in America and I don't >mean just at the tournaments. This is something I think *everyone* needs to get their heads around. These assumptions everyone has the "for something to be a success, it must first succeed in the U.S.A." are misguided and ill-informed. To move the sport forward, our best bet is to embrace what's really happening out there, and leverage it. For example, the scene in Europe is seeing astronomical growth, much better media coverage, and world class competitors. The U.S. government has no "Department of Sport", for example, unlike almost every other civilized country. So, why would we be beating our heads against a wall trying to make footbag fly using "public" sponsorship in the U.S. in a down economy, when we can rely on brilliant athletes and organizers in Canada and Europe to form official government-support organizations in their countries? I don't know if you saw it, but just as a case in point, Jan Struz recently announced that the Czech Republic now officially recognizes the Czech Footbag Association as the "national governing body" of footbag within the Czech Republic. This is no accident. It's all part of the "grand plan", country by country, with the IFPA as the back-bone, to build the sport anew as a *world-wide* sport, not as a uniquely American thing. Like atmospheric pressure, where the pressure around the globe is a constant, but the level is constantly changing in any given location, we need to find the high-pressure zones of footbag and focus our attention *there*. Right now, it's just not the U.S. as much as it is Canada, Finland, Czech Republic, Germany, France, Switzerland, and many other places (sorry if I left out your favorite country). That's not to say that there's anything wrong in the U.S., just that I have to refute comments like Jason's that make assumptions that somehow the U.S. is the "center" of the sport, and get him and everyone to realize the only way we can be truly successful in our Olympic mission is to embrace a center of gravity that is in *no* single country, but in our virtual world-wide community, where the atmospheric pressure is a constant. >Footbag is a lot of things, but it's not very >friendly to new players. Again, while I know what you mean, your comment has behind it an assumption that I think most people wouldn't share with you. Footbag as an olympic sport is not a "hack circle". I wouldn't expect you to walk into the U.S. Olympic Training Center, either, and just hop into a game of volleyball with the Olympic Volleyball team. >In order for any sport to grow you have to welcome in and teach the new >players, as frustrating as it may be at times. I'm not sure if you're talking about net or freestyle here, but I can say that we are seeing literally exponential growth of the sport of freestyle, year on end, for about 8 years and counting. So, whatever you may personally feel about the ability of our sport to recruit and train new freestylers, obviously the statistics are proving you wrong. > Third, there has to be more exposure. The tournaments I go to are >totally awesome but we need to get out there to the concerts, on the >corners, on TV, in commercials, America's Most Wanted (jk), get into schools >more, and find some major sponsor. This is a vacuous statement, sort of like, "If we were already an Olympic sport, it would be much easier to get into the Olympics." >Every sport in the Summer/Winter >Olympics has a major sponsor. You're stuck in the American way of thinking. That sport is only something you can achieve success with through sponsorship. Though of course we would want to have all the attention of other sports, and all the funds to make it easier for us to meet our objectives as we grow the sport, the reality is we *can* and *do* make leap and bound progress on a shoe-string budget. And that's fine. Get used to it. We've seen waves of sponsorship come and go, and through it all we as a community have just kept plugging along. We can't lose focus on our goal, but we also can't be depressed because we take one step forward and two steps back sometimes. I think Bruce may be the only person reading this who will really understand what I'm saying here. (Thanks for your commitment, Bruce.) >I would be the first to sign up for Footbag in the Games but we have a >lot of work to do before this can happen. And we *are*. :-) Join us. Steve From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 18 14:53:00 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id OAA18838 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:53:00 -0800 Received: from clem.mscd.edu (clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id QAA15631 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 16:49:46 -0800 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.clem.mscd.edu by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V6.1 #39412) id <0GRP01X01EAT20@clem.mscd.edu> for footbag@footbag.org; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:49:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from webmail ([147.153.1.20]) by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V6.1 #39412) with ESMTP id <0GRP01TGVEAT5K@clem.mscd.edu>; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:49:41 -0700 (MST) Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 17:32:05 -0700 From: Brad Kaplan Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics To: footbag , Jason Frost Message-id: <3C5FFF30@webmail> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: WebMail (Hydra) SMTP v3.61 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-WebMail-UserID: kaplanb X-EXP32-SerialNo: 00002971 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org >===== Original Message From Jason Frost ===== > Footbag is a lot of things, but it's not very >friendly to new players. Meaning... if a "newbie" comes up in a circle (or >even net) of freestylers and try to "hack in" they are quickly ousted. I wholeheartedly disagree. Fottbag is very friendly to new players. It's the established Players who can be rather unfriendly (I speak from experience on both ends). To some degree it is really understandable. In order to be a great freestyler players need to put in A LOT of personal practice time. So when they go out to have a shred circle there is a lot of pressure (from themselves) to totally bust out everything they've been practicing. With all of that going on it's hard to want to take the time to teach someone else how to kick the bag only to watch them hog the bag and practice in the circle. Is there a solution to that... sure! 1) Explain the rules to shred. 2) Always have an extra bag that you can offer to lend someone if they want to step out and pratice. As for people being "ousted" from a cirlce. In circles that I've been in, the only people who get "ousted" are drunks and people who bring a whole group of friends who stand behind them, talking and yelling and disrupting the flow of the circle. When I was beginning I was never in a circle where I was ousted. And to conclude, I often find that the snobby ones are the "newbies" who come into a shred circle and bitch and complain about not getting a "hack". So the moral of the story is: Be nice and patient and educative until someone pisses you off so much you want to shove your footbag up their @#$*er &^@#ing @$$. Later, Brad "the Gastronentologist" From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 18 14:55:22 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id OAA19003 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:55:22 -0800 Received: from priv-edtnes04-hme0.telusplanet.net (fepout2.telus.net [199.185.220.237]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id SAA18903 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 18:30:11 -0800 Received: from terry ([209.107.125.206]) by priv-edtnes04-hme0.telusplanet.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.01 201-253-122-122-101-20011014) with SMTP id <20020218023002.CGQO5012.priv-edtnes04-hme0.telusplanet.net@terry> for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 19:30:02 -0700 Message-ID: <000d01c1b824$2b1fead0$ce7d6bd1@terry> From: "Ryan Bott" To: "Footbag List" Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 19:30:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I was reading Popular Science today and they did a spot on a new old Olympic event, the one man luge I think it is called. Anyways, therer are only 12 countries in the event and only 32 athletes competing in it. So I'm not sure if I agree with Jason Frost's comment that 55 countries need to be playing the sport. Ryan Bott From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 18 14:57:57 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id OAA19137 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:57:57 -0800 Received: from rly-ip02.mx.aol.com (rly-ip02.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.160]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id UAA21986 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 20:10:32 -0800 Received: from logs-tf.proxy.aol.com (logs-tf.proxy.aol.com [152.163.197.135]) by rly-ip02.mx.aol.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/AOL-5.0.0) with ESMTP id XAA00490 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 23:06:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from JasonFrost (AC9E86EC.ipt.aol.com [172.158.134.236]) by logs-tf.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id g1I41fi465115 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 23:01:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <001101c1b830$f5cc9150$ec869eac@JasonFrost> From: "Jason Frost" To: Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 22:01:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Apparently-From: FrostJuggling@aol.com Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org >>These assumptions everyone has the "for something to be a success, it must first succeed in the U.S.A." are misguided and ill-informed.<< I don't think it's misguided at all. If a sport was "invented" in the US then it would make sense to me for the US to take the lead. I'm not talking about a generalization...I'm talking about Footbag. I'll use the example that snowboarding didn't start in Africa or some warm temperature country. There are plenty of "American" sports that started here and countries caught on and vice versa. >>obviously the statistics are proving you wrong.<< What I said was that we need to welcome the new players in. that's a fact. period. I don't see that is a disputable point. if footag is going to be an Olympic sport I don't think it would happen by the time it gets to Athens. so the earliest we are looking at is, what, six years? it's the players that we recruit today who will be a major factor in that. >>This is a vacuous statement<<. This was in my reference to my comment about footbag getting more exposure. I think a major part of the problem is that when someone makes a truthful statement you take it personally. do you actually think you can get in the games with just the people that show up at tournaments? come on! >>As far as I understand it, you must have an international governing body, and then *7* demonstrable national governing bodies. << I have to check this out, but I'm almost positive that there has to be more than 7 nations and governing bodies for a sport to be considered. >> have to refute comments like Jason's that make assumptions that somehow the U.S. is the "center" of the sport<< I really do think that the United States is the center of action for footbag. This isn't a diss to my other fellow players, but it's just fact. we wont' get it as an Olympic sport alone, but yes we are the center. >>You're stuck in the American way of thinking. That sport is only something you can achieve success with through sponsorship.<< That is not what I meant at all. see? guys, there has to be major backing from a major sponsor. I'm not the only one who feels this way either. I never said that in order for footbag to be successful we have to have a major sponsor. there are plenty of tournaments and players that prove otherwise. I said that for it to be an Olympic sport we need a sponsor. I don't get where you have a problem with this. I've read numerous time on this board about the pursuit of major sponsors for tournaments. so we need one for a tournament but not the Olympics? makes no sense to me. >>Join us.<< I have. I also think that there is too much arrogance within the footbag community that the only people that make a difference in this sport are the ones who post or read this board. I swear, from what I've seen, there are hundreds of thousands of people who would jump in this sport if they had only seen it or tried it. I log (easily) 1,000+ miles per week driving all over the United States going to schools and such and I see circles of players who have no idea there is a Footbag.org. I, of course, happily tell them about the sport and the history and how far it's come. despite that they forge on kicking and jamming without a thought of a board or a website. should footbag become an Olympic sport you can be sure that some "unknown" (to us) will spank us all. there always is. ok, I'm tired of typing and OZ is about to come on. :-) Jason F. From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 18 15:05:31 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id PAA19497 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 15:05:31 -0800 Received: from mailcity.com (fes3.whowhere.com [209.185.123.188]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id BAA30130 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 01:42:23 -0800 Received: from Unknown/Local ([?.?.?.?]) by mailcity.com; Mon Feb 18 01:41:56 2002 To: footbag@footbag.org Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 01:41:56 -0800 From: "Hung Chang" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: off Reply-To: hungchang@lycos.com X-Mailer: MailCity Service X-Priority: 3 Subject: Re: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics X-Sender-Ip: 65.184.6.109 Organization: Lycos Mail (http://mail.lycos.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org But Steve, America is the center of the universe! ;-) But seriously, the three recently added Olympic sports, mountain biking, snowboarding, and beach volleyball were all invented here in California. Also, it should be noted that there are many more sports vying for the summer olympics compared to the winter olympics. Takraw (already in the Asian games) had a demonstration for the IOC, but I wondered what happened to that. Regarding exposure for net in general, I would like to see video footage of net on the web and a quality vhs tape be made available. As for freestyle, I could see freestyle footbag cooperating with other freestyle sports (like break dancing, flatland bmx, flatland skateboard, etc.) participating in a multi sport freestyle festival in the same fashion as X-games for extreme sports. Check these links regarding flatland skateboarding, very similar to freestyle. http://www.reversefreestyle.com/f/ (see their article about the barrio games and other freestyle articles) for a humorous perspective, http://www.geocities.com/sk8sanjose/mullenbigbrother.txt hc From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 18 15:06:10 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id PAA19537 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 15:06:10 -0800 Received: from clem.mscd.edu (clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id NAA15476 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 13:23:35 -0800 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.clem.mscd.edu by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V6.1 #39412) id <0GRQ03L01ZFAG2@clem.mscd.edu> for footbag@footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:23:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from webmail ([147.153.1.20]) by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V6.1 #39412) with ESMTP id <0GRQ03L2TZFAAM@clem.mscd.edu> for footbag@footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:23:34 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:05:57 -0700 From: Brad Kaplan Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics To: footbag Message-id: <3C608B07@webmail> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: WebMail (Hydra) SMTP v3.61 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-WebMail-UserID: kaplanb X-EXP32-SerialNo: 00002971 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org >===== Original Message From Steve Goldberg ===== >We've seen waves of sponsorship come and go, and through it all we as >a community have just kept plugging along. We can't lose focus on our >goal, but we also can't be depressed because we take one step forward >and two steps back sometimes. I think Bruce may be the only person >reading this who will really understand what I'm saying here. (Thanks >for your commitment, Bruce.) I've been on the list for a few years now and I've read most of the threads. I remember a little over a year ago a thread somewhere along the lines of "the death of footbag" or some such. I think everyone was feeling a little depressed at the idea that footbag might die off. Worlds 2001 was feared to never happen. Steve was sendning some of the most depressing messages about self blame that I've ever read. Today I read this message from Steve and others that have been posted over the last year that have been similar to it and I'm amazed at the turn around. It was truly, straight to the heart, inspiring. I give thanks to people like Steve and Bruce and many of the Organizers and Coordinators and Volunteers in the San Fran area and Around the World who have risen to the challenge of continuing the sport of footbag. Footbag is in global full force. Brad From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 18 15:06:54 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id PAA19589 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 15:06:54 -0800 Received: from falcon.prod.itd.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id OAA16938 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:05:30 -0800 Received: from 1cust19.tnt4.manassas.va.da.uu.net ([63.26.198.19] helo=Elncbsiebert) by falcon.prod.itd.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 16cvub-0005uU-00 for footbag@footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:05:30 -0800 From: "Chris and Beth Siebert" To: Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 17:00:49 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Well said, Steve! Hurrah! I would just like to add that "sponsorship" as we know it in the U.S. is only thought of as "necessary" because of the lack of support from the government. There are a number of sports in the U.S. that are now widely accepted but have lacked major competitions and sponsors e.g. rock climbing and other outdoor sports. Conan From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 18 15:09:35 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id PAA19761 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 15:09:35 -0800 Received: from hercules.ihermes.com (hercules.ihermes.com [206.180.207.9]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id OAA17504 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:16:28 -0800 Received: from intouch.bc.ca (206-180-207-47.ihermes.com [206.180.207.47]) by hercules.ihermes.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id g1IMG6s28894 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:16:10 -0800 Message-ID: <3C717DF5.2797B185@intouch.bc.ca> Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:19:33 -0800 From: Juliet Pendray X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: footbag@footbag.org Subject: Re: [footbag] Footbag Hall of Fame nomination for Ian Kobayashi Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Hello Footbaggers, I would like to 2nd the nomination for Ian Kobayashi as well. Ian was instrumental in my development in footbag. And the same can be said of any kicker in Vancouver. From intermediate to world class players. His involvement, generosity of time, patience, encouragement,..... are the foundation of this club. Ian's contribution's to this sport should be an example for us all. An example that can only help the growth, enjoyment, and caliber of play for footbag. Juliet Pendray From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 18 15:11:04 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id PAA19854 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 15:11:04 -0800 Received: from falcon.prod.itd.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id OAA17853 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:25:15 -0800 Received: from 1cust19.tnt4.manassas.va.da.uu.net ([63.26.198.19] helo=Elncbsiebert) by falcon.prod.itd.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 16cwDj-0002Mx-00; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:25:15 -0800 From: "Chris and Beth Siebert" To: , "Ted Huff" Subject: [footbag] Seconds for Hall of Fame nominations Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 17:20:34 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Here's my two cents: I think that you really should be at least semi-retired to get inducted. I second Gator, Ian Kobayashi, Chris Ott, Jay Moldenhauer, and the Fogles. Conan From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 18 15:13:01 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id PAA19922 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 15:13:01 -0800 Received: from falcon.prod.itd.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id OAA17864 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:25:18 -0800 Received: from 1cust19.tnt4.manassas.va.da.uu.net ([63.26.198.19] helo=Elncbsiebert) by falcon.prod.itd.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 16cwDl-0002Mx-00 for footbag@footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:25:17 -0800 From: "Chris and Beth Siebert" To: Subject: Re: [footbag] Sepaktakraw vs net Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 17:20:36 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Also, here's my take on the whole takraw/footbag thing: The biggest difference between the games is not spiking or team size, but legal contact surfaces. Footbag net is the only net sport which allows ONLY the feet. Takraw rules are closer to soccer. This makes net inherently more difficult, if for no other reason than simply less legal square inches on the body. Yes, I've seen King's Cup and played takraw. There is no question that there are more huge spikes and blocks in takraw. Net is often more of a finesse sport. But again, body surfaces come into play. Many of the blocks in takraw are done with leg surfaces that are illegal in net. And many of the digs, and most service receptions, are done with the head - also illegal in net. The ball size is, of course, the most obvious difference between the sports. The larger ball discourages dinking in takraw, and I think I know why. Imagine the center of each ball: the center of a footbag could pass about an inch over the net, and also drop an inch on the other side of the net; the center of a takraw ball passes several inches higher over the net, and could only drop an equal distance on the other side of the net, due to its larger circumference. This means that a takraw ball must pass higher over the net and drop closer to the opponents. Plus, they have an extra person to dig, so placing shots out of opponents' reach is less likely. Therefore, power shots are the way to go. My biggest problem with the rules of takraw is that one player can hit it three times! You don't see it much in high-level competitions, but in theory one great player could hit every shot for his "team." Footbag net originally had similar rules, but they were changed, I suppose, to create more team play (or to penalize Kenny, probably). Conan From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 18 17:06:29 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id RAA24555 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 17:06:29 -0800 Received: from mail.anu.edu.au (mail.anu.edu.au [150.203.2.7]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id QAA21808 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 16:03:42 -0800 Received: from [150.203.236.52] (burgmann42.anu.edu.au [150.203.236.52]) by mail.anu.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA02911 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 11:03:32 +1100 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: mattsb@mail.ozemail.com.au Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <000d01c1b824$2b1fead0$ce7d6bd1@terry> References: <000d01c1b824$2b1fead0$ce7d6bd1@terry> Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 11:10:50 +1100 To: footbag@footbag.org From: Matthew Baker Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Hello, I think that footbag is an awful long way off the olympics. I am boosted in enthusiasm from seeing some events get into the winter olympics, such as snowboard half pipe, but I really think footbag could wait at least 50 years. The IOC is extremely reluctant to allow new sports, and does not really want to increase the medal count. Recently there were lots of problems within the sport of Fencing, because finally the International Fencing Federation decided that they must admit Women's Sabre to the olympics, but the IOC will not grant fencing any more medals. The result is that certain events have to be culled, and combined to accommodate for the new event. I think that the winter olympics is perhaps more open to sports like Snowboarding as it doesn't have as much conservative history behind it, and some people would not regard it as the 'real olympics'. The real key for me is that I can't see street style skating, or even half-pipe skating being in the olympics in the next 10-15 years, let alone footbag. I think footbag could gain acceptance in an extreme games arena, alongside BMX flatlands, but this would still be hard to get. Perhaps I am negative, but the Summer Olympics and the IOC are very very conservative. I think I have heard too many times when discussing footbag "is it an Olympic sport? [laughter]", and thus have a pessimistic outlook. Matt. From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 19 13:40:38 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id NAA00468 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 13:40:38 -0800 Received: from mailcity.com (fes3.whowhere.com [209.185.123.188]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id WAA05140 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 22:23:02 -0800 Received: from Unknown/Local ([?.?.?.?]) by mailcity.com; Mon Feb 18 22:22:44 2002 To: footbag@footbag.org Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 22:22:44 -0800 From: "Hung Chang" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: off X-Mailer: MailCity Service X-Priority: 3 Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics X-Sender-Ip: 65.184.6.109 Organization: Lycos Mail (http://mail.lycos.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Couple of thoughts. General kicking If you truly look at "kicking" (regardless of type of objects) from a global perspective and historical stand point, Asia is way ahead of in terms of number of players and have its own forms of freestyle and net game, and have thoundsands of years in terms of history. The US would be next with its hacky sack phenomenon in the 80's, and it's development of its own 'brand' of freestyle and net. Europe is actually quite late in the game, actually just being exposed to 'hacking' recreating the "1st wave" that the US had in the 80's and taking advantage of all the knowledge that has accumulated. Footbag Net Net vs Takraw. You can split hairs about the differences, but it truly doesn't really matter. They both fall under the 'foot volleyball' concept. To me, I would be happy to see either version gets recognition from the public. But (as i said before) this will not happen until some key changes occur either in net or takraw. (Just my predictions.) Freestyle Jason, I hear what you are saying about the gap between general kicking and freestyle. It probably worsened after the "stalling" concept was developed, making technical freestyle harder to relate for the average hackers. (Flatland skateboarding suffered the same exact problems as top tricks became more and more impossible to do, but interestingly build the basis for today's street skating) It will be interesting to see what happen to freestyle when it reach a plateau in terms of tricks development. check this article http://www.reversefreestyle.com/f/html/articles_2001/who_stopped.html hc From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 19 13:41:27 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id NAA00535 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 13:41:27 -0800 Received: from sm13.texas.rr.com (sm13.texas.rr.com [24.93.35.40]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id GAA16183 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 06:36:07 -0800 Received: from Tina (cs666857-213.austin.rr.com [66.68.57.213]) by sm13.texas.rr.com (8.12.0.Beta16/8.12.0.Beta16) with SMTP id g1JEbn6D021232; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 08:37:49 -0600 Message-ID: <005401c1b952$c18043b0$b47ba8c0@Tina> From: "Tina Lewis" To: "Jason Frost" , References: <001101c1b830$f5cc9150$ec869eac@JasonFrost> Subject: Re: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 08:36:02 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org All jokes aside, The U.S. is not the center of the universe and I credit footbag for teaching me that. Spend some time in Europe, Canada, Mexico, etc. and you will see that Americans are rightfully considered arrogant jerks for just such attitudes. Study your World history, take a look at our foreign policies, etc., make some friends from foreign countries. Yes we are a great country but we are a very new country in the grand scheme of things and the rest of the World doesn't think nearly as much of us as we do. Read the list, check out the foreign web pages, the tournaments in Europe are HUGE compared to here. At Texas State we had a new player, high school age who had only competed in Germany. Needless to say he was a little disappointed at the turnout, as he was expecting it to be as big as the ones in Germany. In Europe they actually get help from the government. In the US all we get is BS from the parks departments about fees, insurance, taking up space for other "established" sports, etc..... very discouraging. I credit the WFA for reaching out to Europe very early on, the Canadians who have a broader World view than most Americans and Steve and all the web page workers for making this a Global sport. Footbag has opened up the World to me and I have learned a lot about my own country and its true place in the World. Its very different from what you hear in the American media and what they taught you in school - we are brainwashed from a very early age. Just my 3 cents. Tina. From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 19 14:52:19 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id OAA03927 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 14:52:19 -0800 Received: from itsa.ucsf.edu (itsa.ucsf.edu [128.218.95.21]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id OAA02250 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 14:14:26 -0800 Received: from localhost (sjani@localhost) by itsa.ucsf.edu (AIX4.3/UCB 8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA76524 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 14:14:26 -0800 Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 14:14:26 -0800 (PST) From: "Sunil S. Jani" To: footbag@footbag.org Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org On Mon, 18 Feb 2002, Hung Chang wrote: > It will be interesting to see what happen to freestyle when it reach a plateau in terms of tricks development. The only plateaus are the ones we create ourselves. Sunil From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 19 14:53:17 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id OAA03947 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 14:53:17 -0800 Received: from scaup.prod.itd.earthlink.net (scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.49]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id OAA03361 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 14:40:05 -0800 Received: from 1cust90.tnt4.manassas.va.da.uu.net ([63.26.198.90] helo=Elncbsiebert) by scaup.prod.itd.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 16dIvc-0004cZ-00 for footbag@footbag.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 14:40:04 -0800 From: "Chris and Beth Siebert" To: Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 17:35:22 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org My first thought is, why? Why do we want footbag at the olympics? The obvious answer is "exposure". What do we gain from more exposure? More future pro players, I guess. We already have millions of amatuer footbag players. Is the goal to have tens, hundreds of millions? If the answer is "sponsorship", what does that give us? Money. So, is the point of this money? What is the money for? Well, let's be realistic. There are big fees associated with running a big event (at least in the U.S.). I personally witnessed this when Steve Dusablon and I directed the 2000 U.S. Open. You know how much money Ted Huff paid out of his own pocket? Others certainly supported it, too. Will we ever know how much Steve Goldberg and countless others have spent? Money also provides what I believe is the real future of big pro growth in the sport...prize money. What if Worlds paid out to last place like golf? What if top prizes were in the $thousands$? My bet is you'd see more players travelling farther more often. We also wouldn't be losing top players to retirement in their primes. We've had some fat paydays at Worlds before, but nothing consistent. Personally, I think that it will take a private foundation, made up of donations from players and former players, to give Worlds the financial support it needs to grow. [Special thanks here to the Worldwide Footbag Foundation for all they do!]. I'm talking about at least $100,000 in donations to start something that can make a difference now and in the future. Impossible? We'll see. Why a private Worlds foundation? Let's face it, the only people who care about this sport are the players. I'm fine with that, but it will take some serious support from the players to see serious growth. I welcome responses :) Conan From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 19 15:01:59 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id PAA04315 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 15:01:59 -0800 Received: from I (brat.footbag.org [209.125.90.60]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id PAA04312 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 15:01:59 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: brat@209.125.90.2 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 15:01:55 -0800 To: From: Steve Goldberg Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org At 5:35 PM -0500 2/19/02, Chris and Beth Siebert wrote: >Personally, I think that it will take a private foundation, made up of >donations from players and former players, to give Worlds the financial >support it needs to grow. Just to be clear, this is one of the primary charters of the IFPA, and the reason we are requesting "charitable" status from the U.S. Government. (Which is, by the way, the only way the government "sanctions" sports organizations, through giving tax benefits. Unfortunately, it's a chicken-and-egg problem because the U.S. uses the Olympics as the standard against which they compare sports organizations. And in case anyone's interested, our charitable status is still pending. Cross your fingers.) So, the IFPA is not just a player-elected body of rule-makers, but also a foundation for the funding of the development of the sport, primarily through the World Championships, but also through a sponsorship program we will be developing for other tournaments. (See our by-laws online for some idea of what I mean.) But of course, until we get "critical mass" of memberships by having players around the world join our organization, we won't have much of a budget to do these types of things. To join, and help support the World Championships, go to http://www.footbag.org/ifpa/join If/when we get our charitable status, you'll also be able to donate to IFPA as a charity and deduct it from your income on your (US) taxes. Until then, we'll still be happy to take your donations. http://www.footbag.org/ifpa/donate Thanks. Steve From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Mon Feb 25 19:10:54 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id TAA02211 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 19:10:54 -0800 Received: from foundationcomputing.net (donorport.org [207.160.174.56]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id TAA01817 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 19:04:28 -0800 Received: from dfiatx96-187.dfiatx.dsl.gtei.net ([4.3.96.187] verified) by foundationcomputing.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.3.2) with ESMTP id 842733 for footbag@footbag.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 20:59:58 -0600 Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 21:06:11 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v481) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Subject: [footbag] Message Correction From: Derrick Fogle To: footbag@footbag.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.481) Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org This message: http://list.footbag.org/majordomo/letter/footbag?id=%3C3C717DF5.2797B185%40intouch.bc.ca%3E regarding a second for the HOF nomination of Ian Kobayashi, was written by James Holkko, not Juliet Pendray. Sorry for the confusion. -Derrick Fogle -footbag.org list moderator From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 26 06:31:50 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id GAA17424 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 06:31:50 -0800 Received: from imo-r07.mx.aol.com (imo-r07.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.103]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id FAA29799 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 05:59:36 -0800 From: Ted Huff Received: from Thehuff1@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v32.5.) id s.e5.13fbd891 (4442); Wed, 20 Feb 2002 08:58:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 08:58:53 EST Subject: Re: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics To: s3374182@student.anu.edu.au CC: footbag@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Good points !! Maybe we could get the IOC to cut out synchro swimming, and give that slot to Footbag net !! How about Freestyle vs. ballroom dancing !!?? I guess if we don't plan to support an organization, we'll never show we deserve to be a part in "X" type games or Olympics, or even fear factor !! What the Olympics really show is that it's time for all footbag players to figure out how to be a part of the solution, not part of the continual "do it for me" exercise in the sport's development. Make it happen for your own good & future !! Join in ! From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 26 06:31:09 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id GAA17396 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 06:31:09 -0800 Received: from imo-m02.mx.aol.com (imo-m02.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.5]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id FAA29614 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 05:51:10 -0800 From: Ted Huff Received: from Thehuff1@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v32.5.) id f.166.91d6cf1 (4442); Wed, 20 Feb 2002 08:51:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <166.91d6cf1.29a503c5@aol.com> Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 08:51:01 EST Subject: Re: [footbag] Sepaktakraw vs net To: cbsiebert@earthlink.net CC: footbag@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Good point !!! Footbag is played with a bag, not a ball . Footbag was invented in Oregon, U.S.A. in mid 1970's, and had most of it's inspiration from John Stalberger being a football halfback, and a baseball shortstop, then having a knee injury. When he met Mike Marshall, he changed the game of "hack the sack" ( with a flat bean filled homemade bag) , to one that required no use of upper body, so that more lateral quickness and flexibility would be developed, thus an exercise game for all sports and physical education. That's where his original theory of using 5 basic kicks for control ( blocking of angles of flight of a now round , specifically designed footbag for game of Footbag ) came into being, and the base of this game was founded. Net Footbag became a sport to show team play outside the circle, and different ideas about using/playing angles of flight, and distance. Freestyle obviously developed from that same circle, or individual practice, to what is is today, including escaping from consecutive kicks to a sport where upper body contact was allowed, etc. , and big add tricks were developed , and specific footbags. Footbag is original, and doesn't need to be associated to any other sport or game. It's development has nothing to do with takraw, and certainly doesn't require another sport to "carry it" worldwide, or grope for support from any footbag player today. Footbag players should be proud to play their chosen sport, and promote the fact they are a footbag player, and a member of a new sport's worldwide association of players. Enough said about takraw, as it has nothing to do with this game except eye-foot coordination. Regards, Ted Huff, co-director Footbag Hall of Fame Historical Society From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 26 06:32:31 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id GAA17451 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 06:32:31 -0800 Received: from imo-m10.mx.aol.com (imo-m10.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.165]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id GAA19479 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 06:03:15 -0800 From: Ted Huff Received: from Thehuff1@aol.com by imo-m10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v32.5.) id f.b9.1c01535d (4254); Thu, 21 Feb 2002 09:02:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 09:02:49 EST Subject: Re: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics To: cbsiebert@earthlink.net CC: footbag@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org What if every entrant had to raise $200 or whatever was set as the minimum for his sponsorship in the tournament? What if the entrants were based on what their club put up in their sponsorship ? What if those sponsorships were based on their ability to raise local sponsors and/or national sponsors ? What if all the clubs & players decided to recognize 1 organization, and decided to support it for their sport's common good? What if sponsors finally recognized that Footbag was "geting it's act together", and decided to re-consider all the efforts by WFA, and now IFPA, in providing a "vehicle" to drive up sales of their own products or services? What if Footbag players finally realized that all their fun in Footbag, could be made better by giving besides just asking someone to do it all for them? What if it was their business to make their sport recognized? Gee, what if ...................................? From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 26 06:33:06 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id GAA17461 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 06:33:06 -0800 Received: from www5.networkshosting.com (www5.networkshosting.com [66.96.128.104]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id JAA27467 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 09:46:10 -0800 Received: (qmail 70 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2002 17:47:31 -0000 Received: from bolsan.dp.net (HELO LynnK) (204.171.79.29) by -H with SMTP; 21 Feb 2002 17:47:31 -0000 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 12:43:10 -0500 Message-ID: <01C1BAD5.520452E0.bhamilton@bolsan.com> From: Bill Hamilton Reply-To: "bhamilton@bolsan.com" To: "'footbag@footbag.org'" Subject: [footbag] Video ideas Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 12:43:08 -0500 Organization: Bolsan Company Inc. X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I first kicked a "hacky sack" back in 1979, enjoyed kicking for a while and then I did nothing for a few decades. Then I kicked again with a few high school kids, did some surfing and realized what the sport had become while I was away from the sport. I thoroughly enjoy working on freestyle moves, but I do not have anyone nearby (I live in Southwest PA) that is at a significantly higher level of experience to teach me new tricks. As a result I am very dependent on the descriptions and video on the internet. Here is the reason I am writing......I am extremely appreciative of persons who have taken time to make videos of the various moves, especially some basic moves. These have been very helpful and encouraging for me. But I often have trouble following the moves on the videos. The following suggestions might help when making videos. When making a demo video, avoid backgrounds that make it difficult to spot the footbag. Trees, buildings, and other varied backgrounds make it hard to spot the bag. Also be aware of the clothing you are wearing and how it contrasts or conceals the footbag. A light background (a wall or sheet hung on the wall), light colored clothing and a dark footbag would help tracking the flight of the bag and thus make it easier to follow the move. Maybe not a big deal, but a more user friendly video will help encourage those who are as patient or help draw in the curious. Again, thanks for the time spent in making these videos, they have been really helpful! Even if you don't take my suggestions, I will still be using the videos and thankful for your efforts. Sincerely Bill Hamilton From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 26 06:34:36 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id GAA17537 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 06:34:36 -0800 Received: from valinet.com ([208.171.246.3]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id WAA05644 for ; Fri, 22 Feb 2002 22:15:15 -0800 Received: from computer (atlanta-ip-3-109.dynamic.ziplink.net [206.15.153.109]) by valinet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA16191 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 01:15:09 -0500 Message-ID: <008901c1bc33$9b291780$6d990fce@computer> From: "Daniel Botkin" To: References: <200202192326.PAA05707@llic.net> Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 01:30:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org > My first thought is, why? Why do we want footbag at the olympics? Conan. Yes, right on, Conan. Why? Surely I've been one to so fantasize about it over the years... But why? For me it's twofold simple, it boils down to two basic human impulses: "share the love" and "the desire for recognition". It's entirely sweet and natural to seek to deeply share what you love with people, whether colleagues, friends, soulmates, even strangers the world over. That's what it is to be human. We illuminate, celebrate and gift the things that move us. But are the Olympics the best/only way to pass/gift footbag on to the future? Equally understandable is the impulse we share to be seen, recognized and appreciated in what we do, small and large. The Olympics have come to symbolize being seen in a BIG way, being official, pre-eminently globally (if not downright corporate!) seen. But the Olympics don't hold a lien on being seen, on citizen movements, ideas, art, cultural diplomacy, grassroots phenomena, peacework, nor on sport itself. Each of us has an angle, a skill, a sport, a story. Each of us has been a hero, has performed for a crowd, started something, become the conduit of peace. You can do it in Guatemala as in your own home town. Big Thinking is available to all parties and spreading our sport can be as personal or as businesslike as we make it. Recognition can come in beaming smiles, accruing implicitly. Terror in the world doesn't mean we must cringe, mistrust foreigners, not leave our homes. I say we all become "Big Brothers" (Sisters), in the loving sense. There are countless opportunities every day still to channel tolerance, mentor peace and promote cooperation in the world, through footbag, through an open heart. Take them. > The U.S. is not the center of the universe and I credit > footbag for teaching me that... Study your World history, take a look at our > foreign policies, etc., make some friends from foreign countries. Footbag has opened up the World to > me and I have learned a lot about my own country and its true place in the > World. Tina. Yeah, Tina. I will repeat what I've been putting out through 16 years of merry (and serious) footbag promotion and peace diplomacy through the western hemisphere... What makes this game unique, amazing, awesome and special transcends the tricks, the rules and the tournaments. What sets our sport apart from ice dancing, from skating, skiing, boarding or biking is the endless potential for unbounded lightness and fluidity in improvisational teamwork. It is the transcendent group movement mobilization experience where we surrender our "ego", our "me's and you's, us and them's", our prejudices, attachments, assumptions and belief systems, for one blessed instant. Don't get me wrong. I have LOVED competition. The top level, competitive version of footbag (net, freestyle) is always and still astonishing. But if you were to look out across this country and the globe, at the vast, vast majority of footbag playing and players, almost entirely they are just common folk, novice-intermediate players who kick in parks and backyards where a a flying clipper is a top trick, at school during recess, always in a circle. For better or worse, that's the predominant footbag paradigm currently out there. It's actually pretty amazing how ubiquitous it's finally become, albeit mostly at a modest level and eternally branded with the silly "hacky sack" name. Whether or not the competitive version ever gets "recognized", we who love (all aspects) of footbag should especially strive to pass on the cooperative and magical essence of the game to the next generation. What unifies those hundreds of thousands, yes, millions of "basic Joe(lle) kickers" now walking the earth is a simple but compelling circle game. What compels their participation (still) is likely to be that initial chemistry of working together toward a common goal. The same juice which elicits teamwork, belonging and kinship between jocks and goths and punks, among old and young, between disparate persons, personalities and cultures. This is a widely repeated, variously documented phenomenon, a powerful piece of footbag lore, describable really only with allusions to "spontaneous group energy" and semi-mystical states. This aspect of our sport may not be possible to wrap words and rules around -- or sell to an Olympic committee. Can't see it selling many a Chevy. But this is our gift and our strength. Call it what you wish, but we should not lose track of this gem in our urge to "develop" and promote the footbag sport. Kick for peace. Put your heart first. The Olympics would be lucky to have us. Daniel Botkin Footbag Peace Initiative www.valinet.com/~dbotkin From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Tue Feb 26 06:37:49 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id GAA17804 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 06:37:49 -0800 Received: from mailcity.com (fes3.whowhere.com [209.185.123.188]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id DAA14332 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 03:57:41 -0800 Received: from Unknown/Local ([?.?.?.?]) by mailcity.com; Tue Feb 26 03:57:25 2002 To: footbag@footbag.org Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2002 03:57:25 -0800 From: "Hung Chang" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: on Reply-To: hungchang@lycos.com X-Mailer: MailCity Service X-Priority: 3 Subject: RE: [footbag] Footbag at the Olympics X-Sender-Ip: 65.184.6.109 Organization: Lycos Mail (http://mail.lycos.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Whew, that was a cool winter olympic, now back to footbag... Getting in, 75 countries... http://www.racqmag.com/racqmag/1998/9803/983glob.htm recognition by ioc... http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sports/longterm/olympics1998/sport/articles/newsports.htm recognized sports by ioc but not yet accepted http://www.olympic.org/uk/sports/recognized/index_uk.asp here is an article on snowboarding's entry into the olympics (interesting comment from jake burton) http://www.usolympicteam.com/cfdocs/borg/newsTemplate.cfm?spID=53&newsID=386 draw your own conclusions, hc From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Thu Feb 28 12:37:52 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id MAA01386 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Thu, 28 Feb 2002 12:37:52 -0800 Received: from mailcity.com (fes3.whowhere.com [209.185.123.188]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with SMTP id TAA09475 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 19:12:09 -0800 Received: from Unknown/Local ([?.?.?.?]) by mailcity.com; Wed Feb 27 19:12:02 2002 To: footbag@footbag.org Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 19:12:02 -0800 From: "Hung Chang" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: on Reply-To: hungchang@lycos.com X-Expiredinmiddle: true X-Mailer: MailCity Service X-Priority: 3 Subject: [footbag] Re: video ideas X-Sender-Ip: 65.184.6.109 Organization: Lycos Mail (http://mail.lycos.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Bill, good to know that people are using those videos (guessing you are refering to the footbag.org videos.), but watching these internet clips is far from the quality of a vhs tape. The only good part is that you don't have to pay for them. The only good quality commercial freestyle tapes that i know of is the 'trick of the trade' how-to video (but it's like 15 years old and from what i have heard never made much of a profit) and these newer ones made by zohar production (flipsider.com)?. I also saw some cool clips on freefootbag.com that use fisheye lens which is quite common in skateboarding videos. Hopefully, even better guality videos will be available in the future, but it takes time and money to make a good video, and a big enough market to justify it. For footbag net, we really need a good video. Having a good quality video available will probably be a better promotional tool to attract beginners than anything else suggested so far. And so far I haven't seen any descent videos, except maybe that 98 montreal worlds coverage that was sold by Eve for a short time. An example of excellent video coverage is the 97 Kings's cup done by by ESPN, but from what I have heard, it's got nothing to do with footbag net. ;-) hc ---- From: Bill Hamilton Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 11:43:08 AM US/Central >When making a demo video, avoid backgrounds that make it difficult to spot >the footbag. Trees, buildings, and other varied backgrounds make it hard >to spot the bag. Also be aware of the clothing you are wearing and how it >contrasts or conceals the footbag. A light background (a wall or sheet >hung on the wall), light colored clothing and a dark footbag would help >tracking the flight of the bag and thus make it easier to follow the move. > Maybe not a big deal, but a more user friendly video will help encourage >those who are as patient or help draw in the curious. From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Thu Feb 28 13:16:16 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id NAA03246 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Thu, 28 Feb 2002 13:16:16 -0800 Received: from imo-m02.mx.aol.com (imo-m02.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.5]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id GAA02111 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 06:25:14 -0800 From: Thehuff1@aol.com Received: from Thehuff1@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v32.5.) id 8.24.218295f2 (4158); Wed, 27 Feb 2002 09:25:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <24.218295f2.29ae4643@aol.com> Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 09:25:07 EST Subject: [footbag] Footbag's Origination To: footbag@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org There is no doubt that using eye-foot coordination, or eye-hand coordination is one of the foundations fof being a human. From that, throwing or kicking has always been part of our nature. From that kicking a feathered object, a rock, a skull, a woven ball, or a skin filled bag have become games and sports throughout history. I don't doubt that someone in England in the 1400's may have described & prescibed use of a beanbag for therapy. But, when John Stalberger met Mike Marshall in Oregon City, Oregon in 1972, and Mike showed him his homemade , flat beanbag he had discovered was fun to kick, or "hack" the "sack", the idea for what became footbag was born. Before John got into using his background in sports, as a baseball shortstop, or football halfback, or his study of physical therapy , or his recuperation from an injured knee, no one had taken the beanbag kicking concept into a game or sports arena. John simply decided/discovered that this fun could be a taken a step further. From his background, first he decided to play without using his upper body, so that he was forced to use more lateral quickness. Second he determined that if he forced himself to use both feet equally, he must block the angle of flight vs. chase it , the bag, to control it. Example: bag coming from right to left - use left foot. Third, he decided that he must use 5 basic motions, or kicks, to control all areas around him, without turning: inside, outside, toe, knee, and back kicks. If the bag's angle of flight was coming into an area in front of him, he had inside kick as first option, if he used his quickness as a developed asset. From this, he determined that to be ready for all bag flight's, he could use a basic ready position for sports, such as baseball, tennis, etc. of being slightly on the toes, with feet about shoulder width apart. Lastly, he determined that a round bag, a footbag, needed to be specifically designed for optimum use in this new game. When Mike died in his sleep in early 1975, John determined to follow through on what they had started. Today, what you see as Footbag all came from very humble beginnings in Oregon, by an athlete with vision. Not by copying any other game. He got this game and sport started by his thinking that this fun could be used as a developmental exercise, and conditioning exercise by use of basic athletic movements in a controlled game idea. This is why it works to teach the basics in schools, and to athlete's in other sports: footbag develops concentration and coordination, especially if taught correctly first. After that, sports ideas & innovations came, such as Net Footbag, and where Freestyle Footbag goes back to the roots of the fun of kicking, or Footbag Golf as another example. Pass it On !! Best regards, Ted Huff, co-director Footbag Hall of Fame Historical Society From owner-footbag@list.footbag.org Thu Feb 28 14:39:57 2002 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) id OAA08033 for footbag-outgoing@list.footbag.org; Thu, 28 Feb 2002 14:39:57 -0800 Received: from smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.62]) by llic.net (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id NAA02564 for ; Thu, 28 Feb 2002 13:02:59 -0800 Received: from 66-44-104-168.s676.apx2.lnhdc.md.dialup.rcn.com ([66.44.104.168] helo=assistant) by smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #10) id 16gXhZ-0003qS-00 for footbag@footbag.org; Thu, 28 Feb 2002 16:02:58 -0500 Message-ID: <053b01c1c09a$e0067260$f0aefea9@assistant> From: "Matthew Quint" To: References: Subject: Re: [footbag] Re: video ideas Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 15:59:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-footbag@list.footbag.org I'm with you here, Hung. I talked with Yves during Funtastik last Fall about the need to spread the sport not through VHS video sales, but through CD-rom give-aways. You are right, the quality won't quite be as good, but if someone puts together a nice 'net promo' video and does a .vcd or .mpg version, it will be super cheap to burn many copies of this promo. Someone approaches while you are kicking and is interested in net...'here, take this free CD'. I feel a little weird suggesting this, since I'm not competent to produce it myself :-) But it seems like a good thing to take from the 'jamband' music trading world (which contains many kickers, of course). Clearly the spreading of videos is one of the things that helped skate boarding and snow boarding, etc. explode over the last ten years. Now lets shake off this winter and get back out on the court! Matt Quint Washington, DC Here's to a world full of listening and understanding. ----- Original Message ----- From: Hung Chang > For footbag net, we really need a good video. Having a good quality video available will probably be a better promotional tool to attract beginners than anything else suggested so far. And so far I haven't seen any descent videos, except maybe that 98 montreal worlds coverage that was sold by Eve for a short time.