From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 1 04:07:27 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA04970 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 04:07:23 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA04966 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 04:07:22 GMT Received: from scalf@utdallas.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4963) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA04961 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 04:07:21 GMT Received: from utdallas.edu (utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA32622 for ; Fri, 31 Oct 1997 20:07:27 -0800 Received: from apache.utdallas.edu (scalf@apache.utdallas.edu [129.110.16.9]) by utdallas.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA28142 for ; Fri, 31 Oct 1997 22:07:25 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (scalf@localhost) by apache.utdallas.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA22092 for ; Fri, 31 Oct 1997 22:07:25 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: apache.utdallas.edu: scalf owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 31 Oct 1997 22:07:25 -0600 (CST) From: Derric Scalf To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] footage of net... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I remember at worlds how there were a few cameras set up filming the finals net matches. I was trying to get the last match just to have some net footage, but I ran out of tape. To make a long story short, I want a few of those net matches. Especially the part where the announcer (I can't remember his name) asked the crowd how many people had never seen footbag net before. I remember there were a lot of first time spectators there. That made an impact on me, and I'm thinking that that would be a good indicator of how much the sport can grow. I'm trying to get a tape together of some freestyle and net to give to potential sponsors and to just pass around to help get community support for the Southern Regionals next spring. Any net footage would be appreciated, but I would really like the finals with that badass crowd. If you have this, or know where I could find it, please let me know. Thanks. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 1 08:13:35 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id IAA05808 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 08:13:21 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id IAA05804 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 08:13:06 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5801) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA05799 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 08:13:05 GMT Received: from imo08.mx.aol.com (imo08.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.100]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA01573 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 00:13:13 -0800 From: Gimmie Zo Message-ID: <299bc6b4.345ae44a@aol.com> Date: Sat, 1 Nov 1997 03:12:39 EST To: scalf@utdallas.edu, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] footage of net... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv10) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org uh, shouldn't that go under a different mailing list catagory? From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 1 22:24:52 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA01414 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 22:23:08 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA01410 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 22:23:06 GMT Received: from c655664@showme.missouri.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1407) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA01405 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 22:23:06 GMT Received: from mail.missouri.edu (mail.missouri.edu [128.206.2.169]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA08226 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 14:23:08 -0800 Received: from sp2n09.missouri.edu (sp2n09.missouri.edu [128.206.2.17]) by mail.missouri.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA186692 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 16:23:07 -0600 Received: from localhost (c655664@localhost) by sp2n09.missouri.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA361326 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 16:20:12 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: sp2n09.missouri.edu: c655664 owned process doing -bs Date: Sat, 1 Nov 1997 16:20:12 -0600 (CST) From: Joe Marschall X-Sender: c655664@sp2n09.missouri.edu To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Columbia Jam Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Greeting Stylers: Next weekend in Columbia Mo. : Nov. 7 - 9 I will be hosting a very informal freestyle (or whatever else it is you do) jam, or get together or party(?), or whatever you would like to call it. I have secured kicking space at a local rock climbing gym and am looking into a room at the university here in town. Kind kicking facilities. Call or E - mail me for specifics. All are invited and encouraged to come. Lodging is a definite possibility (lots of floor space). Joe Marschall 573-874-3152 From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 1 23:02:12 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA01593 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 23:02:07 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA01589 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 23:02:04 GMT Received: from stuart.macferson.1@uni.massey.ac.nz () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1586) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA01584 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 23:02:02 GMT Received: from cc-server9.massey.ac.nz (cc-server9.massey.ac.nz [130.123.128.11]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA08691 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 15:02:02 -0800 Received: from stu (actually p63-tnt-ak-1.auck.ihug.co.nz) by cc-server9 with SMTP(PP); Sun, 2 Nov 1997 12:00:15 +1300 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19971102115838.006fc5bc@uni.massey.ac.nz> X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Sun, 02 Nov 1997 11:58:41 +1300 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Stuart Macferson Subject: Re: [freestyle] Stu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 02:42 PM 31/10/97 -0500, you wrote: >At 02:06 PM 10/31/97 -0500, Ethan Klein wrote: >>provide me with Stuart Macferson's digits > > Aye, 'ere in a jar I have them, hanging off the port bow, but there only >be nine left...one I did throw into the sea, for so violent was she. The >rest will be auctioned this night at precisely 10 bells...follow the path >of the silver monkey if ye wish to bid on these forbidden objects. Yarrr! > >-- >Ernest "Kraken" Crvich > > Ayeeeeee, me was wondering were those hud gotten too ma laddy..... Ethan, Stuart 'Black Beard' Macferson (thats I, with a capital I), can be contacted at the email address above and below in regards to digits: stuart.macferson.1@uni.massey.ac.nz (yes, it is in the guiness book of records as the longest email address) stu From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 3 18:33:41 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01536 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 18:32:06 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01532 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 18:32:04 GMT Received: from tuhuge@sfsu.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1529) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA01527 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 18:32:03 GMT Received: from diana.sfsu.edu (diana.sfsu.edu [130.212.10.239]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA32236 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:32:03 -0800 Received: from station33.sfsu.edu (24hrlab-233.sfsu.edu [130.212.37.233]) by diana.sfsu.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA21021 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:31:47 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19971103103059.006a0004@sfsu.edu> X-Sender: tuhuge@sfsu.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Mon, 03 Nov 1997 10:30:59 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: 2 Huge Subject: [freestyle] 1997 Worlds Routines Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Howdy all you footbag players! I just finished editing the 1997 Worlds Routines tape and it's jam packed (A full 2 hours) of some of the best routines from this years world championships. It features dropless routines from Eric Wulff, Ryan Mulroney, and Peter Irish. This is your chance to actually see what everyone is talking about! If anyone is intrested in obtaining this PRIcless footbag heirloom: send a check for $15 made out to Tuan Vu to: Vu Brothers 4533 California Street San Francisco, CA 94118 Also available: 1997 SHRED Featuring the Greatest stuff from this years Western Regionals and World Championship including kenny shults LAST freestyle JAM! The tape is 1 hour of the sickest stuff freestyle has to offer Coming soon!!!! 1997 NET This will be a net tape of some of the great matchs from this year's World championship including the *EPIC* finals match between Randy Mulder and Kenny Shults. BTW, I have been hearing great things about Shreeded Wheat (Sean Wingert's tape). I can't wait to get my copy!!!! thanks a bunch, 2 Huge From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 4 01:18:12 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA04494 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 01:18:05 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA04490 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 01:18:03 GMT Received: from anaesthetized@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4487) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA04485 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 01:18:02 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F101.hotmail.com [207.82.250.220]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA06762 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 17:18:04 -0800 Received: (qmail 2689 invoked by uid 0); 4 Nov 1997 01:17:40 -0000 Message-ID: <19971104011740.2688.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 199.183.41.65 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 03 Nov 1997 17:17:38 PST X-Originating-IP: [199.183.41.65] From: "j p" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] my new elitist club Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 03 Nov 1997 17:17:38 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Salutations, Freestylers of Earth; I have been skooling harder than usual recently, because I don't have much good weather left in my region and have yet to find an indoor facility. The other day my cohort Daniel was heard to utter something like 'you're gonna be in BAP next year for sure, if you keep up like that' ... some of us (select few, actually) don't know how I feel about this.... Many players have gone guiltless, but honestly... the Big Add Posse has some of the best players on the planet... The hardest shredding muthas ever to grace the freestyle arenas with the wildly spinning blades of an iron scrapper, absolutely and beyond any shadow of a doubt. I've also been hearing from my compatrtiots that if asked to join, I would be kissing toes and leaping in all four cardinal directions. But I could never join a group that would deign to call me 'shut up', even affectionately. Thus, even if I *do* make the commitment to try to get THAT GOOD at freestyle (which I might, if I find the right job in the next 2-3 months) -- I still think it would take me more than a year to accomplish such a feat-- If inducted, [I don't think those guys really give you a choice] I promise to resign my commision immediately, because I have begun recruiting for my own little group, the Big Mouth Posse. Yes, it's the Big Mouth Posse!!! Are you loquacious? Slightly hammy? Talkative? Jive-o-rific? Join the Big Mouth Posse - it's really quite easy - all you have to do is get onto at least three distributed freestyle videos, but you have to be talking about either something other than freestyle, or making an incorrect observation about what is actually happening ... for example, If I were watching Sean Wingert's new video (which I haven't got - sorry Nebraska, I'm poorer than you) and saw 'The Noodle' Ahren Gehrman - whoops I mean *The* *Torch* - pull paradox whirl, ripwalk, blur, paradon, flurry, butterfly, spinning whirl, drifter - and heard someone say, "wow, sweet gyro whirl, *Torch*" or possibly "holy crow! was that paradox whirl on both sides, and Vortex too?" I will have to write your name down on a list... the new inductee list into the BMP. Don't delay - get in front of a camera and start jawin'!!! JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 4 01:27:00 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA04526 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 01:26:59 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA04522 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 01:26:57 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4519) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA04517 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 01:26:57 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA06877 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 17:27:01 -0800 Received: from [205.219.91.196] (brat_196.bayarea.net [205.219.91.196]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA04514; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 01:26:50 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19971104011740.2688.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 17:28:25 -0800 To: "j p" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] my new elitist club Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 5:17 PM -0800 11/3/97, j p wrote: >all you have to do is get onto at least three distributed >freestyle videos, but you have to be talking about either something >other than freestyle, or making an incorrect observation about what is >actually happening ... What about me? Do I get to be on it for jumping up and down during Peter Irish's eclipse record attempt on Raw Shred? :-) I didn't say anything, but actions speak louder than words... Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 4 01:44:41 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA04588 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 01:44:25 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA04584 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 01:44:23 GMT Received: from anaesthetized@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4580) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA04578 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 01:44:23 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F86.hotmail.com [207.82.250.192]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA07128 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 17:44:27 -0800 Received: (qmail 19624 invoked by uid 0); 4 Nov 1997 01:37:46 -0000 Message-ID: <19971104013746.19623.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 199.183.41.65 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 03 Nov 1997 17:37:44 PST X-Originating-IP: [199.183.41.65] From: "It's from Josh Penney!!!!" To: anaesthetized@hotmail.com, brat@footbag.org Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] my new elitist club Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 03 Nov 1997 20:37:44 EST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >What about me? Do I get to be on it for jumping up and down during Peter >Irish's eclipse record attempt on Raw Shred? :-) I didn't say anything, >but actions speak louder than words... Well.. you can form the 'jumping up and down' posse. But we're "talking" about being annoying ONLY on the verbal level, Steve. You're annoying in so many other ways.. You encompass every level of annoyance quite adeptly... maybe you could form the... nah, it's not worth it. : - ) JP If there were a bright center to this galaxy, you'd be on the planet that it's furthest from... ps. Noah broke that record at worlds, at the Gas station. I think you were in your room, resting from all that jumping around. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 4 02:47:16 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA04873 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 02:47:14 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA04869 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 02:47:13 GMT Received: from ericwindsor@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4866) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA04864 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 02:47:12 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F62.hotmail.com [207.82.250.148]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA07986 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 18:47:17 -0800 Received: (qmail 11174 invoked by uid 0); 4 Nov 1997 02:47:15 -0000 Message-ID: <19971104024715.11173.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 204.30.73.196 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 03 Nov 1997 18:47:15 PST X-Originating-IP: [204.30.73.196] From: "Eric Windsor" To: genzu@footbag.org Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: [announce] X-must Jam Host Hotel Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 03 Nov 1997 18:47:15 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Daryl said: >This event is going to be a blast. The list of >people attending is growing quickly. Thus far >we have: > > Rippin, > Paul Munger (coming out on Jan 2), > Tim Kelly (coming out (I believe) Dec 29??) > ? possibly this means Josh Casey will also > make it? > Ryan Mulroney, > Red Fred Husted, > (Steve Kremer?), > Sean Wingert, > Cory Current from the Chicago Illinois area > Brad ?, Jonathan Schneider, Jane Jones > (possible attendees from Colorado) > Local Las Vegas players (I'm hoping anyhow) >> >Hope to see you there. > > You can count on me and Big Add Chad showing up. Eric Windsor O /|\ o \\ _// ` ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 4 14:42:01 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08301 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 14:41:31 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08296 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 14:41:30 GMT Received: from nhall@ncsa.uiuc.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (8293) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA08291 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 14:41:29 GMT Received: from ncsa.uiuc.edu (sdgmail.ncsa.uiuc.edu [141.142.103.66]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA14042 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 06:41:39 -0800 Received: from void.ncsa.uiuc.edu (void [141.142.103.20]) by ncsa.uiuc.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA11375 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 08:42:47 -0600 (CST) Received: (from nhall@localhost) by void.ncsa.uiuc.edu (8.8.2/8.8.2) id IAA19379; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 08:44:34 -0600 (CST) Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 08:44:34 -0600 (CST) From: Nicholas Hall To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] my new elitist club In-Reply-To: <19971104011740.2688.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org JP- You're leaving out an important segment of big-mouths: What about those of us who are neophytes of the sport yet offer opinions to seasoned veterans on this discussion list? I myself have been kind of remiss on this- I haven't offered up an opinion on the ongoing debates of tournament judging and net rules- but I assure you that this is because I've been so busy. I've never been to a tournament (and obviously not judged one) and never even played net, so if I post overly lengthy, ill-reasoned and (dare I even say) abusive comments to people who have worked long and hard to master as well as improve the sport, will I earn a place of special respect in the BMP? Have no fear, interminal rants are soon to follow. Keep a special watch out for my argument that net courts be sixty feet deep and four feet wide (to make it easier for spectators sitting to one side of the court to see all the action) and my suggestion that all freestyle judging incorporate a new "morality" category, rating how well a singles freestyle routine conveys a healthy message to America's children. :) Nick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 4 14:55:50 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA00156 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 14:55:42 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA00152 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 14:55:40 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (149) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA00147 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 14:55:39 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA14184 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 06:55:39 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id ya101060 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 09:05:00 -0600 Subject: Re: [freestyle] my new elitist club Message-Id: <000000451562961500362@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Tue, 04 Nov 1997 08:59:22 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org, nhall@ncsa.uiuc.edu (Nicholas Hall) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Tue, Nov 4, 1997, 8:44:34 AM US CST Nicholas Hall wrote: >a new "morality" category, rating how well a singles freestyle routine >conveys a healthy message to America's children. :) Uh-oh... I suppose my opening move in (i think) 92 would earned me a negative score, then... HAHAHAHAHAHAHaaaaaaaaaa.......... Bock! -- Derrick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 4 15:26:35 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00396 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 15:26:20 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00392 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 15:26:19 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (389) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00387 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 15:26:18 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA14247 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 06:59:08 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id aa101062 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 09:08:31 -0600 Subject: [freestyle] *MY* New Elitist Club Message-Id: <000000451582961500574@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Tue, 04 Nov 1997 09:02:54 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org (Freestyle Listserve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org The BFP, of course, for The BIG FOWL POSSE Anyone that was born and raised on a boneless chicken ranch is = automatically inducted. Others can send video for consideration... Bk bk bk bkock! -- Derrick= From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 4 16:14:40 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00687 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 16:14:27 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00683 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 16:14:26 GMT Received: from anaesthetized@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (680) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00678 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 16:14:25 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F76.hotmail.com [207.82.250.182]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA15432 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 08:14:26 -0800 Received: (qmail 29191 invoked by uid 0); 4 Nov 1997 16:14:24 -0000 Message-ID: <19971104161424.29189.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 199.35.216.135 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 04 Nov 1997 08:14:23 PST X-Originating-IP: [199.35.216.135] From: "It's from Josh Penney!!!!" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] my new elitist club Content-Type: text/plain Date: Tue, 04 Nov 1997 11:14:23 EST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > You're leaving out an important segment of big-mouths: What about >those of us who are neophytes of the sport yet offer opinions to seasoned >veterans on this discussion list? >if I post overly lengthy, >ill-reasoned and (dare I even say) abusive comments to people who have >worked long and hard to master as well as improve the sport, will I earn >a place of special respect in the BMP? You are akin to a freestyler who has just stopped kicking and doing toe stalls in the middle of strings, my friend... keep up the good work... but you must be FAMOUS... everyone must groan at the sight of you, yet continue to giggle anyway.. show up at some events this year and I'll write your name down on my special little pad. >Have no fear, interminal rants are soon to follow. Keep a special watch >out for my argument that net courts be sixty feet deep and four feet wide >(to make it easier for spectators sitting to one side of the court to see >all the action) and my suggestion that all freestyle judging incorporate >a new "morality" category, rating how well a singles freestyle routine >conveys a healthy message to America's children. :) The real dea, that which you need to concern yourself with is, you can ramble all you want, but you have to try to be *slightly amusing* --- try to keep that in mind. : ) JP ps. you, too, DF. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 4 23:49:03 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA03707 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 23:48:55 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA03703 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 23:48:50 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3700) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA03698 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 23:48:44 GMT Received: from imo06.mx.aol.com (imo06.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.86]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA23448 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 15:48:46 -0800 From: Gimmie Zo Message-ID: <51b35fa2.345fb1f7@aol.com> Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 18:28:23 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] my new elitist club Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv10) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Damn this is getting old. Joey From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 5 14:32:58 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08118 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 14:32:49 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08114 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 14:32:47 GMT Received: from crvich@raleigh.ibm.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (8111) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA08109 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 14:32:46 GMT Received: from fwns2.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns2d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.236]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA31769 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 06:32:56 -0800 Received: from rtpmail02.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail02.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.48]) by fwns2.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7RTP-FW1.1) with ESMTP id IAA26800 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 08:40:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (ode1.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.178.164]) by rtpmail02.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id IAA36648 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 08:40:46 -0500 Received: from odent1.raleigh.ibm.com by ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03-RAL) id AA31230; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 08:40:41 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19971105083859.009063d0@ode1> X-Sender: crvich@ode1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 08:38:59 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] my new elitist club In-Reply-To: <51b35fa2.345fb1f7@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 06:28 PM 11/4/97 EST, Gimmie Zo wrote: >Damn this is getting old. What do you think, Josh, does this remark alone get him in? *drum roll* From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 5 16:34:07 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00959 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:33:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00955 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:33:44 GMT Received: from tuhuge@sfsu.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (952) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00950 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:33:44 GMT Received: from diana.sfsu.edu (diana.sfsu.edu [130.212.10.239]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA00433 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 08:33:45 -0800 Received: from station36.sfsu.edu (24hrlab-236.sfsu.edu [130.212.37.236]) by diana.sfsu.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA27310; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 08:33:38 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19971105083255.0068bf90@sfsu.edu> X-Sender: tuhuge@sfsu.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 08:32:55 -0800 To: "j p" From: 2 Huge Subject: Re: [freestyle] my new elitist club Cc: freestyle@footbag.org In-Reply-To: <19971104011740.2688.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I wonder if my BAP membership is transferable with the BMP membership? There is only 1 way to find out............ 2 LOUD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 5 16:55:54 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA01108 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:55:53 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA01104 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:55:53 GMT Received: from anaesthetized@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1101) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA01099 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:55:53 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F59.hotmail.com [207.82.250.145]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA00866 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 08:55:53 -0800 Received: (qmail 21774 invoked by uid 0); 5 Nov 1997 16:55:51 -0000 Message-ID: <19971105165551.21773.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 199.35.216.148 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 05 Nov 1997 08:55:51 PST X-Originating-IP: [199.35.216.148] From: "It's from Josh Penney!!!!" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] my new elitist club Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 11:55:51 EST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 08:38:59 -0500 >At 06:28 PM 11/4/97 EST, Gimmie Zo wrote: < >>Damn this is getting old. > > What do you think, Josh, does this remark alone get him in? > > *drum roll* > This young upstart? Why I could go through the list archives and print everything he's ever said on a page of legal size paper! The emphasis is not just on what you say, but how MUCH you say it. I appreciate it for it's innacuracy, and that is all. If there were a bright center to this galaxy, you'd be on the planet that it's furthest from... ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 5 17:24:27 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01357 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 17:24:25 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01353 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 17:24:23 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1350) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01348 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 17:24:23 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA01349 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 09:24:24 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id ya102750 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 11:33:43 -0600 Subject: Re: [freestyle] my new elitist club Message-Id: <000000453882961595696@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 11:28:16 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Wed, Nov 5, 1997, 10:55:51 AM US CST It's from Josh Penney!!!! wrote: >The emphasis is not just on what you say, but how MUCH you say it. Look here, you young whippersnapper, I've killed a forest full of trees publishing footbag related schlock, and consumed enough electrons with footbag related email to power New York for a day. Hearing you scream "how MUCH" is... well... I can imagine you trying to cluck like a chicken, too, featherless boy. The day you even become worthy of your own elitist conception will be the day your forefathers of footbag have been laid to rest. And if innacuracy is what you cherish, getting rid of me could be a problem; I may just be immortal! So... shut_up_josh. 8{) -- Derrick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 5 19:34:07 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02291 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 19:33:32 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02287 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 19:33:30 GMT Received: from nhall@ncsa.uiuc.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2284) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02282 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 19:33:30 GMT Received: from ncsa.uiuc.edu (sdgmail.ncsa.uiuc.edu [141.142.103.66]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA03352 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 11:33:31 -0800 Received: from void.ncsa.uiuc.edu (void [141.142.103.20]) by ncsa.uiuc.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA29189 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 13:34:39 -0600 (CST) Received: (from nhall@localhost) by void.ncsa.uiuc.edu (8.8.2/8.8.2) id NAA23989; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 13:36:26 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 13:36:26 -0600 (CST) From: Nicholas Hall To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Sole Purpose meeting In-Reply-To: <000000453882961595696@mlerf.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org OK, just for the record I'm going to show up to the Sole Purpose meeting tonight... I haven't tried for a couple of weeks, but it's a slow day, so I'll be there at about seven. I make this point to warn any Sole Purpose members who thought I had given up on the meeting, and had thus begun attendance again. Spread the word- I'll be there, hence all the footbaggers will want to avoid the meeting at all costs. And as for Kenny's "No comment" on my conspiracy theory, well I guess we know who the ringleader of this little society is, don't we? Well, soon, it wil be I who is laughing, for little do you know that I plan to take over the Sole club by hiring Tanya Harding to bash your knees! Then the club will be mine, mine I tell you, all mine! Bwaaahahaha! Nick PS I'll be able to tell if you all see me coming and try to blend in with the modern dance class next door to the practice- your Lavers will give you away! From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 5 22:15:46 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03650 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 22:15:25 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03646 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 22:15:22 GMT Received: from anaesthetized@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3643) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03641 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 13:26:50 GMT Received: from ops.org (ops.org [204.26.70.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id FAA16883 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 05:26:59 -0800 Received: (qmail 9522 invoked from network); 6 Nov 1997 13:27:53 -0000 Received: from ops.ops.org (HELO ops.org) (204.26.70.3) by ops.org with SMTP; 6 Nov 1997 13:27:53 -0000 Received: from localhost by ops.org; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/22Jul97-0529PM) id AA14632; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 07:32:16 -0600 Date: Thu, 6 Nov 1997 07:32:16 -0600 (CST) From: Ryan Troxel To: Theron A Troxel <00201887@bigred.unl.edu> Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] mechanosis? In-Reply-To: <199711060248.UAA05223@bigred.unl.edu> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org i am fishing for some tips on the mechanosis. do you osis with the pinching leg or the opposite leg? i have tried it both ways and it seems to work going either leg. is there a preferred way? kind of looks like a torque when you do it opp. osis. rye From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 6 17:55:12 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA02129 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 17:55:12 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1873) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01871 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 17:28:35 GMT Received: from [205.219.91.196] (brat_196.bayarea.net [205.219.91.196]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA19761; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 09:28:34 -0800 X-Sender: brat@market.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <199711060248.UAA05223@bigred.unl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 6 Nov 1997 09:30:17 -0800 To: Ryan Troxel From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] mechanosis? Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 5:32 AM -0800 11/6/97, Ryan Troxel wrote: >i am fishing for some tips on the mechanosis. do you osis with the >pinching leg or the opposite leg? You just drop the bag out of your pincher and do an osis with the other foot. >kind of looks like a torque when you do it opp. osis. Exactly. But of course it's not a torque because there's no dexterity. It's just a pincher-set osis. I suppose you can do it the other side, too. The name is really a "combo", not a single move -- i.e., pincher (2 adds [unu,del], 1 contact) >> osis (3 adds [bod,xbd,del], 1 contact). Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 6 17:56:57 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA02190 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 17:56:56 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2006) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA02004 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 17:47:56 GMT Received: from mcfeely.interaccess.com (mcfeely.interaccess.com [207.70.126.131]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA20423 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 09:47:57 -0800 Received: from [207.70.66.166] (d166.cloud.interaccess.com [207.70.66.166]) by mcfeely.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id LAA23684; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 11:47:28 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 6 Nov 1997 11:55:07 -0700 To: Ryan Troxel , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson) Subject: Re: [freestyle] mechanosis? Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Ryan! >i am fishing for some tips on the mechanosis. Remember to always throw back (torture and release), oh, wrong kind of fishing... >do you osis with the >pinching leg or the opposite leg? i have tried it both ways and it seems >to work going either leg. is there a preferred way? kind of looks like a >torque when you do it opp. osis. You osis with the leg that is planted during the Pincher. For guiltless, try a cross body pincher into mechinosis. Fun stuff. Also try "Mechanosis directly into Mechanosis". I still like explaining these things in straight talk, vs. Jobes notation. Sorry guys, I *still* don't get it. It is *so* much eaiser this way than having to break out my secret decoder ring (and take forever) every time I want to figure out what is being said. See ya! Scott. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 7 18:37:05 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA02184 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 18:34:50 GMT Received: from anaesthetized@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1531) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01529 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:15:41 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F60.hotmail.com [207.82.250.146]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA05234 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 09:15:41 -0800 Received: (qmail 5070 invoked by uid 0); 7 Nov 1997 17:15:40 -0000 Message-ID: <19971107171540.5069.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 199.183.41.82 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 07 Nov 1997 09:15:39 PST X-Originating-IP: [199.183.41.82] From: "It's from Josh Penney!!!!" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] yesterday's session Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 07 Nov 1997 12:15:39 EST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Seeing as how nobody liked my last thread I'll start anew. Hi. Yesterday was an okay session for me, although 'twas a little too cold here. Anyone have a loft or gymnasium in NYC that they're not using currently? I was glad because I started hitting barfly the way I feel it should be hit- very close to the body, and not *the*. I also came really close to paradox drifter. Whoopie. Actually, Dan came to the realization (and then clued me in) that you have to move [ kinda sliding] *back* to some degree to get out of the way right after the set, and I was workin' it much better after that. Wonder what y'all think about that. Anyone have any tips for the High, High, Plains, Plains, Drifter, Drifter, Drifter, Drifter? or come to think of it, Blurriest? JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 7 19:07:52 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02444 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 19:07:41 GMT Received: from grandincredible@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2279) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA02277 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 18:52:37 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F10.hotmail.com [207.82.250.21]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA06783 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 10:52:38 -0800 Received: (qmail 5762 invoked by uid 0); 7 Nov 1997 18:52:33 -0000 Message-ID: <19971107185233.5761.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 38.249.188.156 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 07 Nov 1997 10:52:33 PST X-Originating-IP: [38.249.188.156] From: "Daniel Kramer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] mechanosis Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 07 Nov 1997 10:52:33 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >Steve wrote: > >You just drop the bag out of your pincher and do an osis with the >other foot. > >Exactly. But of course it's not a torque because there's >no dexterity. I would consider it a dexterity. A relatively easy dexterity (1/2 dexterity if you will) but certainly a dexterity. What's your opinion? We'd like to know. DK ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 7 20:15:24 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03064 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:15:03 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2853) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02851 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 19:56:30 GMT Received: from [205.219.91.196] (brat_196.bayarea.net [205.219.91.196]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA08097 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 11:56:31 -0800 X-Sender: brat@market.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19971107185233.5761.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 11:58:11 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] mechanosis Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 10:52 AM -0800 11/7/97, Daniel Kramer wrote: >>Exactly. But of course it's not a torque because there's >no >dexterity. > >I would consider it a dexterity. A relatively easy dexterity (1/2 >dexterity if you will) but certainly a dexterity. Well, this gets into a whole new discussion I'd like to start about dexterities and what they really are. But I'll save the meat of that discussion for a separate thread... On the subject of "mechanosis", I think it's kind of clear: when you drop the bag out of your pincher, you just put your setting leg down. That's not really a dexterity (even a half dexterity or 1/4 dexterity) by anyone's definition. It's just a plant. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 7 20:25:13 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03211 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:25:12 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3114) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03112 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:18:24 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA08510 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 12:18:25 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BCEB8F.EF4839F0@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 15:15:08 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: yesterday's session Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 15:15:07 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In response to Josh's thread regarding dankitty mcneuvers and how to nail them. I hit my first paradox drifter last week. Woohoo! anyway, the key for me resided in WORKING my regular drifter (the side with the same catching motion as paradox drifter) After the drifter attains full establishment in muscle memory (n-gram development) it's just a question of getting the set to the appropriate level (a little higher than paradox mirage for me) and then speeding back down and under the sack. I just think about "willing it" You've only seen paradox drifter on video about 400 times, your mind KNOWS what it looks like. It comes down to willful execution, trial and error, and patience. Your advice regarding barfly (issued at the juggling convention) (turn into it with the circling side of the body) has proved effective. Niceness! I'd imagine a similar swing tip would prove beneficial in bluriest. I need advise on paradox double leg over!!! I'm so close but just can't snake it. Also, I have major trouble with paradox torque, I just can't seem to turn back around to complete the torquing motion. Any suggestions? Shred onward and outward with determined solidity - Ethan From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 7 20:42:02 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03451 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:42:01 GMT Received: from hill9361@uidaho.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3291) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03289 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:28:38 GMT Received: from raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (raven.csrv.uidaho.edu [129.101.192.43]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA08672 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 12:28:39 -0800 Received: from localhost (hill9361@localhost) by raven.csrv.uidaho.edu with SMTP (8.7.6/8.7.1) id MAA23530 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 12:28:37 -0800 (PST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.csrv.uidaho.edu: hill9361 owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 12:28:37 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hillebrand X-Sender: hill9361@raven.csrv.uidaho.edu To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] yesterday's session In-Reply-To: <19971107171540.5069.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Yeah, my session was nice as well...I hit what I call the 'whirlwind' blurry symposium barrage, bail to opposite double over down. NOT __________________________________________________________________________ Matt P. Hillebrand hill9361@uidaho.edu http://www.uidaho.edu/~hill9361 From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 7 20:42:05 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03468 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:42:05 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3352) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03350 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:34:37 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA08798 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 12:34:38 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id fa104915 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 14:43:24 -0600 Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: yesterday's session Message-Id: <000000459372961779906@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Fri, 07 Nov 1997 14:38:26 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Fri, Nov 7, 1997, 2:15:07 PM US CST Ethan Klein wrote: > I need advise on paradox double leg over!!! I'm so close but just >can't snake it. Also, I have major trouble with paradox torque, I For me, the set for both of those moves is nearly the same: significantly higher than the 'average' set - just below waist level for me. For the PDL, the higher set allows me an extra millisecond or two of time to get back under the bag (that move is difficult all out of proportion to what it is!); for the Pdx Torque, you really have to concentrate on setting your body rotation for the torque spin, and executing the paradox mirage as an integrated, opposing sub-component of the larger spin. -- Derrick Fogle -- Heartland Eye Banks -- dfogle@mlerf.org -- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 7 22:50:54 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04560 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 22:50:52 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4436) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA04434 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 22:40:14 GMT From: GimmieZo@aol.com Received: from mrin51.mail.aol.com (mrin51.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.161]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA10976 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 14:40:16 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin51.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id RAA16148; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:40:01 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:40:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971107174000_-1509359801@mrin51.mail.aol.com> To: Klein@proscape.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: yesterday's session Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 97-11-07 16:50:33 EST, Klein@proscape.com writes: << I need advise on paradox double leg over!!! I'm so close but just can't snake it. Also, I have major trouble with paradox torque, I just can't seem to turn back around to complete the torquing motion. Any suggestions? >> Ethan, I cant help you with the paradox dbl leg over but as for the paradox torque i have a suggestion. After you set the footbag pretend like you are only going for a paradox mirage but just as soon as the miraging leg gets directly above the footbag, slightly throw your whole body in the opposite direction of where the osis is going to land. As you throw your body, use that momentum to finish the spinning motion that you started with the original mirage. I know that sounds strange but i dont know how else to say it with words. Also make sure that you spin ALL THE WAY around because if you dont then the back of your osising foot will be infront of the footbag. Good luck. Joey From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 7 22:51:44 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04580 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 22:51:44 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4507) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA04505 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 22:49:39 GMT From: GimmieZo@aol.com Received: from mrin40.mail.aol.com (mrin40.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.150]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA11112 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 14:49:42 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin40.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id RAA16217 for Freestyle@footbag.org; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:49:40 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:49:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971107174940_506435915@mrin40.mail.aol.com> To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Drifter Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey guyz I'm having problems with the drifter. it seems like every time i put my catching foot where it is supposed to be at the end of the move, the footbag is still over on the other side. Do you have to actually rotate your body or set it so that it travels across your body. I have also been working on a smear (pixie Mirage) and i cant seem to get the timing down on that as well. by the time i finish the pixie its too late to whip the other foot around. Any suggestions would be great. Thanks! Joey From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 7 23:54:47 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA05401 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 23:54:39 GMT Received: from scalf@utdallas.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5088) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA05086 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 23:44:55 GMT Received: from utdallas.edu (utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA12114 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 15:44:58 -0800 Received: from apache.utdallas.edu (scalf@apache.utdallas.edu [129.110.16.9]) by utdallas.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA27530; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:44:57 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (scalf@localhost) by apache.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA25610; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:44:57 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: apache.utdallas.edu: scalf owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:44:56 -0600 (CST) From: Derric Scalf To: GimmieZo@aol.com cc: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Drifter In-Reply-To: <971107174940_506435915@mrin40.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Not that I am an expert on either of these moves, but I'll tell you what almost works for me. As far as drifter, yes. Rotating your body helps a lot. My main problem is having the bag hit the knee of my set leg when I'm trying to catch it. Maybe someone can give me advice on that? With the smear, the pixie is the all important thing. If you work on getting that pixie set up about waist high, then you'll have plenty of time for a mirage after it. Then, of course, there are the freaks (Jeremy) who can bust a pixie double over down. Maybe they should be giving advice on pixies... Hope this helps. -D On Fri, 7 Nov 1997 GimmieZo@aol.com wrote: > Hey guyz I'm having problems with the drifter. it seems like every time i put > my catching foot where it is supposed to be at the end of the move, the > footbag is still over on the other side. Do you have to actually rotate your > body or set it so that it travels across your body. > > I have also been working on a smear (pixie Mirage) and i cant seem to > get the timing down on that as well. by the time i finish the pixie its too > late to whip the other foot around. Any suggestions would be great. > > Thanks! > Joey > > > From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 8 18:49:46 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01231 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 18:49:00 GMT Received: from mstrong.ix.netcom.com@ix.netcom.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7253) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA07251 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 04:42:03 GMT Received: from dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA16131 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:42:08 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id WAA19025 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 22:42:05 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx1-13.ix.netcom.com(207.94.120.77) by dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma012072; Fri Nov 7 21:58:49 1997 Received: by dal-tx1-13.ix.netcom.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCEBC8.26BC6A40@dal-tx1-13.ix.netcom.com>; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 21:57:33 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCEBC8.26BC6A40@dal-tx1-13.ix.netcom.com> From: Matt Strong To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] RE: Drifter Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 21:56:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Joey wrote: >Hey guyz I'm having problems with the drifter. it seems like every time i put >my catching foot where it is supposed to be at the end of the move, the >footbag is still over on the other side. Do you have to actually rotate your >body or set it so that it travels across your body. > > I have also been working on a smear (pixie Mirage) and i cant seem to >get the timing down on that as well. by the time i finish the pixie its too >late to whip the other foot around. Any suggestions would be great. Joey, What helped me with drifter's is getting my blurry set down. Once I could get the fast clipper set mirage, then torque, ripwalk and stepping butterfly came pretty easily. For the blur set, I just think about jumping off my support leg while sort of throwing the bag up with my set leg. Once I got this down, I started doing drifter in a rather stupid way, I would do a big blurry set and catch it on the opposite clipper. It was like I was trying to avoid the extra dexterity with my set foot. Now, I concentrate on doing a smaller jump and smaller dexterity. Right from the set, I immediately start getting my foot ready to catch the bag. Hope this helps. As for pixie sets, I'm still trying to get them higher. All I can figure is look at tapes of Daryl Genz. In 97 Shred and Shredded Wheat he hits several smears and pixie butterflys. -Matt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 9 09:04:07 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id JAA05021 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 09:03:44 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3639) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA03637 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 02:48:22 GMT From: GimmieZo@aol.com Received: from mrin84.mail.aol.com (mrin84.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.194]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA27041 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 18:48:27 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin84.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id VAA17909 for freestyle@footbag.org; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 21:48:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 8 Nov 1997 21:48:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971108214824_1996068162@mrin84.mail.aol.com> To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Puzzling... Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I cant seem to find a name for this move but maybe someone out there knows. TOE > OP IN > OP IN > SAME INSIDE Some kind of a blur??? Anyone know the move name? Thanks Joey From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 9 09:18:56 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id JAA05089 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 09:18:55 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5059) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA05057 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 09:18:19 GMT Received: from [205.219.91.196] (brat_196.bayarea.net [205.219.91.196]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA30024 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 01:18:27 -0800 X-Sender: brat@market.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <971108214824_1996068162@mrin84.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 9 Nov 1997 01:20:02 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Puzzling... Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 6:48 PM -0800 11/8/97, GimmieZo@aol.com wrote: >I cant seem to find a name for this move but maybe someone out there knows. > >TOE > OP IN > OP IN > SAME INSIDE > >Some kind of a blur??? Anyone know the move name? Not a blur; it would be a toe-set blur if the final delay was with the opposite foot (i.e., "toe > op in dex > op in dex > op toe" is a toe-set blur; catching on the inside surface doesn't really change the move so it'd still be a toe-set blur). However, note that toe-set blur (not the move you describe) is only worth 3 adds even though in most people's opinions (excepting Jeremy Keller and The Sock) it's harder than clipper-set blur... This is because you can't have a paradox from a toe. But the move you describe is basically a "Miraging Guay" (pronounced gwhy), although I know of a special name for it. BTW, it's not paradox, even if set from a clipper (although it should be :-)). You would call this "stepping guay" if set from clipper. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 9 19:25:08 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA01054 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 19:24:47 GMT Received: from sunilj@dept.english.upenn.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (885) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA00883 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 19:05:42 GMT Received: from dept.english.upenn.edu (DEPT.ENGLISH.UPENN.EDU [130.91.75.246]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA01090 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 11:05:43 -0800 Received: (from sunilj@localhost) by dept.english.upenn.edu (8.8.6/8.8.6) id OAA57778; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 14:05:37 -0500 From: sunilj@dept.english.upenn.edu (Sunil Jani) Message-Id: <199711091905.OAA57778@dept.english.upenn.edu> Subject: Re: [freestyle] Drifter To: GimmieZo@aol.com Date: Sun, 9 Nov 1997 14:05:37 -0500 (EST) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org (fb) In-Reply-To: <971107174940_506435915@mrin40.mail.aol.com> from "GimmieZo@aol.com" at Nov 7, 97 05:49:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23-upenn3.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org According to GimmieZo@aol.com: > > I have also been working on a smear (pixie Mirage) and i cant seem to > get the timing down on that as well. by the time i finish the pixie its too > late to whip the other foot around. Any suggestions would be great. > The best advice I can give on smear (and any other pixie set moves) is to concentrate on getting your set foot back to the ground as soon as possible, force it down as soon as you clear the bag on your dexterity. This gives you more time for the second part of the move. Sunil From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 10 07:40:25 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA04583 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 07:40:11 GMT Received: from fdtd81d@prodigy.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4538) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA04536 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 07:26:40 GMT Received: from pimaia2w.prodigy.com (pimaia2w.prodigy.com [198.83.19.115]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA08327 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 23:26:46 -0800 Received: from mime2.prodigy.com (mime2.prodigy.com [192.168.253.26]) by pimaia2w.prodigy.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA72892 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 02:26:45 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by mime2.prodigy.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) id CAA11526 for freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 02:26:45 -0500 Message-Id: <199711100726.CAA11526@mime2.prodigy.com> X-Mailer: Prodigy Internet GW(v0.9beta) - ae01dm04sc03 From: FDTD81D@prodigy.com ( JEREMY C KELLER) Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 02:26:45, -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Puzzling... Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I cant seem to find a name for this move but maybe someone out there knows. > >TOE > OP IN > OP IN > SAME INSIDE > >Some kind of a blur??? Anyone know the move name? I'm not sure of the name, is this kinda like a miraging reverse legover except not quite making around to the toe. > However, note that toe-set blur (not the move >you describe) is only worth 3 adds even though in most people's opinions >(excepting Jeremy Keller and The Sock) it's harder than clipper-set blur... >This is because you can't have a paradox from a toe. It sounds harder than a clipper set blur. Jeremy Keller From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 10 19:04:43 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02133 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 19:03:55 GMT Received: from rvbpaco@wam.umd.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (296) Received: from po3.wam.umd.edu (po3.wam.umd.edu [128.8.10.165]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00294 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 15:13:45 GMT Received: from rac10.wam.umd.edu (rvbpaco@rac10.wam.umd.edu [128.8.10.150]) by po3.wam.umd.edu (8.8.8.Beta2/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA19893 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:13:32 -0500 (EST) From: Procrastinator the VIIIth Received: (from rvbpaco@localhost) by rac10.wam.umd.edu (8.8.8/8.8.7) id KAA15291 for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:13:29 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:13:29 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711101513.KAA15291@rac10.wam.umd.edu> To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Puzzling... Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org someone asked about a move steve aptly labeled a miraging guay. i remember it being called a scrambled eggbeater some time ago. l8r- vince From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 10 19:04:43 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02124 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 19:03:52 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1788) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA01786 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 18:09:04 GMT Received: from neuman.interaccess.com (neuman.interaccess.com [207.70.126.130]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA15058 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:09:05 -0800 Received: from [207.208.101.235] (d235.avn1.interaccess.com [207.208.101.235]) by neuman.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id MAA06847; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 12:04:24 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 12:16:27 -0700 To: Ethan Klein , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson) Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: yesterday's session Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Freestylers! >In response to Josh's thread regarding dankitty mcneuvers and how to >nail them. I hit my first paradox drifter last week. Woohoo! > anyway, the key for me resided in WORKING my regular drifter (the >side with the same catching motion as paradox drifter) After the >drifter attains full establishment in muscle memory (n-gram >development) Try doing "kicking" drifters. i.e. kick-set drifters. They mimick the leg motion of paradox, but are slightly easier. If you master kick-set drifter, the next logical step is paradox drifters. Hey, it worked for me. See ya! Scott Davidson Enlightener From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 11 04:02:13 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA07105 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 04:02:00 GMT Received: from adrabek@eagle.cc.ukans.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6618) Received: from eagle.cc.ukans.edu (adrabek@eagle.cc.ukans.edu [129.237.34.3]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA06616 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 03:16:19 GMT Received: from localhost by eagle.cc.ukans.edu (8.8.7/1.1.8.2/12Jan95-0207PM) id VAA0000017035; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 21:16:16 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 21:16:16 -0600 (CST) From: Andrew Drabek To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] freestyle In-Reply-To: <199711102350.XAA04680@eniac.yak.net.taz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org This weekend I was kicking by myself, unfortunately, but I hit two tricks that I've never seen before and didn't know the name for them except for their literal description. Are both of these tricks 5 ADDs? I think that they should be. Stepping-Butterflyswirl Ducking(paradox)Whirl Ducking(paradox)DBL-legover < Didn't quite hit this one but came damn near Do any BAP members hit these tricks or have names for them? If so I'd like to hear any names people have. Andrew Drabek From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 11 18:08:44 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01660 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 18:07:53 GMT Received: from crvich@raleigh.ibm.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (10009) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA10007 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 14:19:15 GMT Received: from fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns1d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.235]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA00113 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 06:19:25 -0800 Received: from rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.47]) by fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7RTP-FW1.1) with ESMTP id JAA40910 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 09:19:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (ode1.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.178.164]) by rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id JAA38344 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 09:19:23 -0500 Received: from odent1.raleigh.ibm.com by ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03-RAL) id AA42832; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 09:19:22 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19971111091715.0090be80@ode1> X-Sender: crvich@ode1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 09:17:15 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: [freestyle] Drifting Swirl Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I hit this once last night. I couldn't find it on the Big List, but I assume it's a (yawn) known move. My question is, are Swirls considered Paradox when set from an opposite side clipper? I assume not, but I can't remember. Are people out there hitting Ripwalk Swirls? -- Ernest M. Crvich Durham, NC, USA http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 11 18:08:46 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01682 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 18:07:59 GMT Received: from 00201887@bigred.unl.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (723) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00721 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 16:43:57 GMT Received: from bigred.unl.edu (bigred.unl.edu [129.93.1.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA01847 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 08:43:58 -0800 Received: (from 00201887@localhost) by bigred.unl.edu (8.8.5/8.8.2) id KAA13774 for freestyle@footbag.org; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 10:43:32 -0600 (CST) From: Theron A Troxel <00201887@bigred.unl.edu> Message-Id: <199711111643.KAA13774@bigred.unl.edu> Subject: [freestyle] Shredded Wheat!! To: freestyle@footbag.org Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 10:43:31 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey kickers, I finally had he honor of wathcing Shredded Wheat and let me tell the people who don't have it yet: THIS VIDEO IS *HOT*!! I highly recommend it for anyone's footbag library. Later. -- --------------------------- @ Theron Troxel \_|_/ UNLFC President | o 00201887@bigred.unl.edu /_\_ http://www.unl.edu/crec/SC/footbag \ ------------------------------------- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 11 18:08:47 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01671 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 18:07:57 GMT Received: from crvich@raleigh.ibm.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (10058) Received: from fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns1d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.235]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA10056 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 14:22:42 GMT Received: from rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.24]) by fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7RTP-FW1.1) with ESMTP id JAA76690 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 09:22:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (ode1.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.178.164]) by rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id JAA05280 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 09:22:52 -0500 Received: from odent1.raleigh.ibm.com by ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03-RAL) id AA37400; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 09:22:50 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19971111092043.00904100@ode1> X-Sender: crvich@ode1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 09:20:43 -0500 To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] freestyle In-Reply-To: References: <199711102350.XAA04680@eniac.yak.net.taz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 09:16 PM 11/10/97 -0600, Andrew Drabek wrote: >Stepping-Butterflyswirl Oops, guess I should've read this first. This is essentially a Ripwalk Swirl, eh? You sicko! 8-) -- Ernest M. Crvich Durham, NC, USA http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 11 18:54:43 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA02224 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 18:54:42 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1867) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA01865 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 18:24:21 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA03406 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 10:24:22 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BCEEA4.ABE6FB20@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 13:21:08 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] guiltless strings Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 13:21:07 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Recently my compatriots and I have been intensively focusing on improving the length of our guiltless strings. Current good juggles reach up into the high teens and low twenties. Are there official records kept for guiltless and 3-free strings. Has anyone out there reached fifty?, one-hundred? I think that Scott has one on the 97 Vu shred vid with about 45! (World's footage). The sensations associated with sustained guiltlessness invigorate, fulfill and envelope the shredder in a euphoric non-consciousness of floating, n-gram driven bliss. I truly feel GUILTY when I guilt now, for better or for worse. Ethan From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 11 19:33:18 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02763 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 19:32:57 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1922) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA01920 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 18:29:37 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA03546 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 10:29:38 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BCEEA5.6840C120@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 13:26:24 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] drifting swirl Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 13:26:23 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org drifting swirl is called (at least by Tuan) - Swifter. Sickness!!! He hits paradox swifters and I believe even blurry swifters! Swifter --> swifter would be niceness. swirl from the other side does NOT get a paradox add. Ask Steve about this, I'm sure he would jump at the chance to explain the difference in explicate detail. Right Steve? Ethan Ernest - Have you heard about the East Coast Christmas Jam?? Either the weekend of the 23rd or 27th of December in or around DC. Please Come up and join us with your North Carolina Swifters. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 11 19:41:49 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02893 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 19:41:48 GMT Received: from crvich@raleigh.ibm.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2689) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02687 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 19:30:07 GMT Received: from fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns1d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.235]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA04667 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 11:30:07 -0800 Received: from rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.47]) by fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7RTP-FW1.1) with ESMTP id NAA04914 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 13:31:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (ode1.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.178.164]) by rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id NAA31960 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 13:31:31 -0500 Received: from odent1.raleigh.ibm.com by ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03-RAL) id AA30396; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 13:31:29 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19971111132920.009126b0@ode1> X-Sender: crvich@ode1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 13:29:20 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shredded Wheat!! In-Reply-To: <199711111643.KAA13774@bigred.unl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 10:43 AM 11/11/97 -0600, Theron A Troxel wrote: >I finally had he honor of wathcing Shredded Wheat and let me tell the >people who don't have it yet: THIS VIDEO IS *HOT*!! I highly >recommend it for anyone's footbag library. Later. I second the motion. The action never lets up and there are a few laughs too. Plus, the most ridiculous music you'll ever lay your ears on! 8-) -- Ernest M. Crvich Durham, NC, USA http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 12 01:06:00 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA05451 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 01:05:58 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4862) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04860 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 23:44:14 GMT Received: from mcfeely.interaccess.com (mcfeely.interaccess.com [207.70.126.131]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA09581 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 15:44:15 -0800 Received: from [207.70.66.173] (d88.cloud.interaccess.com [207.70.66.88]) by mcfeely.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id RAA22903; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:43:45 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:51:41 -0700 To: Ethan Klein , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson) Subject: Re: [freestyle] guiltless strings Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Ethan and Freestylers! >Recently my compatriots and I have been intensively focusing on >improving the length of our guiltless strings. Current good juggles >reach up into the high teens and low twenties. Are there official >records kept for guiltless and 3-free strings. Has anyone out there >reached fifty?, one-hundred? I think that Scott has one on the 97 Vu >shred vid with about 45! (World's footage). I haven't seen Tuan's video, but I thought that I wasn't in it. But anyway... No official records that I know of. But I know that Hu-Mungis has done over 160 osis's consecutively. But I know that is not the spirit to which you refer. My personal best is over 65. The longest that I know of in competition is about 35 guiltless contacts, and that was during Team freestyle at 97 Harrisburg with me and Eric. My focus is to, while remaining guiltless, to have the longest strings I can with the most 4's and 5's as I can cram in there. The 4's and 5's are the focus, 3's are just as "low" as I will go. >The sensations associated >with sustained guiltlessness invigorate, fulfill and envelope the >shredder in a euphoric non-consciousness of floating, n-gram driven >bliss. I couldn't have said it better myself! We should make a t-shirt out of that. >I truly feel GUILTY when I guilt now, for better or for worse. Great job Ethan. Keep up the great work! And for all you budding shredders, just because other people are going guiltless as mere infants, doesn't mean that is the best path for you. I strongly recommend learning as many twos as possible before limiting yourself to 3's. See ya! Scott Davidson enlightener From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 12 01:06:04 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA05440 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 01:05:54 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4443) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA04441 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 22:56:51 GMT From: GimmieZo@aol.com Received: from mrin84.mail.aol.com (mrin84.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.194]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA08829 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 14:56:54 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin84.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id RAA14993 for freestyle@footbag.org; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:56:46 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:56:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971111175116_42921707@mrin84.mail.aol.com> To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Stepping moves Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey can someone tell me exactly what the criteria for a "stepping" move is. Like how would you do a Stepping butterfly, or a stepping whirl??? thanks Joey From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 12 01:15:33 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA05523 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 01:15:32 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA05519 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 01:15:32 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5516) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA05514 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 01:15:31 GMT Received: from [205.219.91.196] (brat_196.bayarea.net [205.219.91.196]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA10835; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:15:32 -0800 X-Sender: brat@market.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <971111175116_42921707@mrin84.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:17:20 -0800 To: GimmieZo@aol.com From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Stepping moves Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 2:56 PM -0800 11/11/97, GimmieZo@aol.com wrote: >Hey can someone tell me exactly what the criteria for a "stepping" move is. "Stepping" is like "Blurry", only we use it for non-paradox moves (since Blurry moves are paradox). So in other words, it's a move that begins with a clipper set immediately followed by a mirage and then something more (i.e., it "looks" blurry but isn't paradox). (Blur would be "stepping paradox mirage", but "blurry" means "stepping paradox"...) So most moves starting: clip > op in dex > ... are "stepping". We use the term "stepping" to refer only to NON-PARADOX moves, as a way to distinguish them from their paradox (blurry) counterparts. More concretely, "Blurry Whirl" is: clip > op in dex > op whirl > op clip Whereas "Stepping Whirl" is: clip > op in dex > SAME whirl > op clip Frequently, the difference between stepping and blurry is which side the move is done on, but this is really the difference between paradox and non-paradox moves. It turns out "Ripwalk" is not blurry but is the special name for stepping butterfly where you switch sides (i.e., set left, catch right). "Stepping Butterfly" is actually an ambiguous name, but is usually meant to refer to the non-Ripwalk version, i.e., same-side miraging butterfly... Neither move (Ripwalk or Stepping Butterfly) is paradox. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 12 04:25:57 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA06886 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 04:25:50 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA06882 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 04:25:48 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6879) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA06877 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 04:25:47 GMT From: GimmieZo@aol.com Received: from mrin38.mail.aol.com (mrin38.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.148]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA13644; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 20:25:52 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin38.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id XAA26557; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 23:25:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 23:25:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971111232547_1625151582@mrin38> To: brat@footbag.org cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Stepping moves Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 97-11-11 22:01:55 EST, brat@footbag.org writes: << It turns out "Ripwalk" is not blurry but is the special name for stepping butterfly where you switch sides (i.e., set left, catch right). "Stepping Butterfly" is actually an ambiguous name, but is usually meant to refer to the non-Ripwalk version, i.e., same-side miraging butterfly... Neither move (Ripwalk or Stepping Butterfly) is paradox. >> ok, I understand blurry and stepping. Does the stepping foot have to hit the ground as in the ripwalk? Like would a stepping drifter be exactly the same as a regular drifter but the foot touches the ground? I still dont see the difference between a stepping butterfly and a ripwalk. Maybe it would help if you could write each of the moves down in notation. Thank From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 12 04:43:04 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA06957 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 04:43:03 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA06953 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 04:43:03 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6950) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA06948 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 04:43:02 GMT Received: from [205.219.91.196] (brat_196.bayarea.net [205.219.91.196]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA13815; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 20:43:05 -0800 X-Sender: brat@market.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <971111232547_1625151582@mrin38> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 20:45:09 -0800 To: GimmieZo@aol.com From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Stepping moves Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 8:25 PM -0800 11/11/97, GimmieZo@aol.com wrote: >Does the stepping foot have to hit the >ground as in the ripwalk? Yes. That's why they're called "stepping". :-) >Like would a stepping drifter be exactly the same >as a regular drifter but the foot touches the ground? No, what you describe would be a "Tapping Drifter". Your foot touching the ground when it doesn't really need to, but not changing the difficulty of a trick otherwise, is called a "tap". By the way, I didn't mean to imply earlier that any move at all that begins with a dexterity is stepping.. There are tons of moves that have nothing at all to do with stepping that begin with clip > in dex. But no matter what, if someone says "stepping X", then it's got to be an EXTRA dexterity before an X. (And such a move wouldn't be paradox, else that'd most likely be a BLURRY x.) So by definition, the difference between any stepping move and its non-stepping counterpart would be an extra dexterity (and plant). There are moves, "blurry drifter" and "stepping drifter", but they both involve two dexterities -- the initial miraging dexterity followed by the ultimate drifter dexterity: blurry drifter = clip > op in dex > op in [pdx] dex > same clip stepping drifter = clip > op in dex > same in dex > same clip >I still dont see the >difference between a stepping butterfly and a ripwalk. Maybe it would help >if you could write each of the moves down in notation. You are right in not being able to see the difference -- Ripwalk *is* Stepping Infinity (which is a form of stepping butterfly)! It's just that we only call it Ripwalk when the set goes from one clipper (i.e., right clipper) to a delay on the other clipper (i.e., left clipper). In other words, if you start on one side and end on the same side, it's not ripwalk. That's the move most people refer to as Stepping Drifter since Ripwalk already has a name. :-) It's important to know that most moves have two names: a "technical" name (like "Gyrating Torque") and a "street" name (like "Mobius"). Some names can be ambiguous (such as "stepping butterfly") so we usually just use the street name ("Ripwalk") for the first version and the technical name for the other. (Cause if it was a Ripwalk we'd call it a Ripwalk. :-)) Ripwalk = clip > op in dex [plant] > op out dex > op clip stepping butterfly = clip > op in dex [plant] > same out dex > op clip Both of the above moves have plants throughout. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 12 04:50:30 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA07032 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 04:50:29 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA07028 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 04:50:29 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7025) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA07023 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 04:50:28 GMT Received: from [205.219.91.196] (brat_196.bayarea.net [205.219.91.196]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA13888; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 20:50:29 -0800 X-Sender: brat@market.net (Unverified) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 20:52:12 -0800 To: GimmieZo@aol.com From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Stepping moves Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Oh, an addendum to what I wrote a second ago: I wrote: >There are moves, "blurry drifter" and "stepping drifter", but they both >involve two dexterities -- the initial miraging dexterity followed by the >ultimate drifter dexterity: > > blurry drifter = clip > op in dex > op in [pdx] dex > same clip > stepping drifter = clip > op in dex > same in dex > same clip I should have clarified that "stepping drifter" has a plant after the first dexterity, as with other stepping moves, because: stepping drifter = clip > op in dex [plant] > same in dex > same clip high plains drifter = clip > op in dex > same in dex > same clip "High-Plains Drifter" is a double-dexterity drifter. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 12 06:06:00 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id GAA07668 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 06:05:58 GMT Received: from genzu@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for announce@majordomo.footbag.org (7523) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA07521 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 05:52:36 GMT Received: from ra.nilenet.com (ra.nilenet.com [204.227.31.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA14721 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 21:52:42 -0800 Received: from footbag.org (slip1.den.nilenet.net [206.247.98.1]) by ra.nilenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA14062 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 22:48:46 -0700 Message-ID: <34680E9B.CB54F7B7@footbag.org> Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 23:51:56 -0800 From: Daryl Genz X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] More 97 X-Mas Jam Info Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello Everyone! Just passing on a little more info on the hotel situation for the X-mas Jam... *IMPORTANT* The Stratosphere (along with the majority of hotels on the "Strip") is NOT taking reservations for Wednesday, December 31st UNLESS you also stay on the 30th. However, there are still rooms available. Also the following people are planning to attend and *may or may not* be looking for people to share hotel expenses ... but you may want to contact each other. (Thus far, nearly everyone coming has e-mail) Scott and Valeria Davidson enlightener@footbag.org Paul Munger humungis@blclinks.net Eric Windsor/Chad D. (Big Add) ericwindsor@hotmail.com Brad Kaplan kaplanb@mscd.edu Ryan Mulroney/Red Fred Husted regul8tr@uclink4.berkeley.edu Jonathan Schneider schneija@ucsu.Colorado.edu Jane Jones iguana04@SPRYNET.com Sean Wingert swingert@creighton.edu Roy Newman roykara@west.net Jeremy C Keller FDTD81D@prodigy.com Sam Lane neon088@pacbell.net Note, I believe Jane, Brad, and Jonathan may be driving down with "Teva" Dave Holton. Hope to see you there too, Daryl Genz From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 12 07:37:47 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA08344 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 07:37:44 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA08340 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 07:37:43 GMT Received: from eric@netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (8337) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA08335 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 07:37:37 GMT Received: from stick.netcomi.com (fit.netcomi.com [204.58.155.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA15821 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 23:37:43 -0800 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by stick.netcomi.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA27879 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 01:37:31 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: stick.netcomi.com: eric owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 01:37:30 -0600 (CST) From: Eric Burgess To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] barroque? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org hey guys i just started hitting barrage, so now naturally i'd like to turn it into a barroque (if that's the right name for a double-dex torque). the problem is, i have a really hard time getting my body rotated around. anyone have some advice on this? btw, my torques are the all-at-once jumping style rather than the two-step stepping-osis-looking style, if that makes any difference. thanks eric From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 13 04:57:16 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA07710 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 04:56:35 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA07706 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 04:56:34 GMT Received: from fishboy@sttl.uswest.net () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7703) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA07701 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 04:56:34 GMT Received: from sttl1.sttl.uswest.net (sttl1.sttl.uswest.net [206.81.192.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA02914 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 20:56:39 -0800 Received: from bob (dial174.sttl.uswest.net [207.109.86.174]) by sttl1.sttl.uswest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA11852 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 20:56:33 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <346A888F.693A1DC7@sttl.uswest.net> Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 20:56:48 -0800 From: Rick Weber X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle footbag Subject: [freestyle] guiltless string X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Someone wanna help out a novice with the lingo? What exactly is a guiltless string? I think I have a pretty good idea, but I'm not sure. Is it just a bunch of 3+add moves in a row? -Rick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 13 05:04:19 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA07802 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 05:04:17 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA07798 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 05:04:15 GMT Received: from neon088@pacbell.net () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7795) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA07793 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 05:04:13 GMT Received: from mail-gw.pacbell.net (mail-gw.pacbell.net [206.13.28.25]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA03033 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 21:04:18 -0800 Received: from colclough (ppp-206-170-217-183.nhwd02.pacbell.net [206.170.217.183]) by mail-gw.pacbell.net (8.8.7/8.7.1+antispam) with SMTP id VAA19177 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 21:04:16 -0800 (PST) From: "Sam Colclough" To: "freestyle footbag" Subject: Re: [freestyle] guiltless string Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 21:01:25 -0800 Message-ID: <01bceff1$3178fa20$b7d9aace@colclough> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I could be wrong, as I am also a novice, but I am pretty sure it is a routine that you complete without dropping the footbag. -----Original Message----- From: Rick Weber To: freestyle footbag Date: Wednesday, November 12, 1997 8:59 PM Subject: [freestyle] guiltless string >Someone wanna help out a novice with the lingo? >What exactly is a guiltless string? I think I have a pretty good idea, >but I'm not sure. Is it just a bunch of 3+add moves in a row? > >-Rick > From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 13 05:13:38 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA07872 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 05:13:37 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA07868 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 05:13:36 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7865) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA07863 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 05:13:36 GMT Received: from [207.94.250.90] (brat_196.bayarea.net [205.219.91.196]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA03146; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 21:13:40 -0800 X-Sender: brat@market.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <346A888F.693A1DC7@sttl.uswest.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 21:15:26 -0800 To: Rick Weber From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] guiltless string Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Rick Weber wrote: >What exactly is a guiltless string? I think I have a pretty good idea, >but I'm not sure. Is it just a bunch of 3+add moves in a row? Very close. "Guilting" means bailing to a 2-add move in a combo that's otherwise composed of 3-add moves and higher. "Guilt-free" play means, after you do your first move, you try to continuously link together moves of 3-adds or higher. So a combo of all 3-add moves or higher is called a "guiltless combo". (Combos with no tricks easier than 4 adds are called "tripless", and only the best of the best can go for very long in "tripless" mode.) In case you're wondering why it's called "guilt", it's because it rhymes with "tilt". If you are doing a string of moves, and you throw in a 1-add move or a basic kick, it's time to pass the bag. We call that a "tilt" (i.e., hitting anything less than 2 add moves in a string). The reason is really simple: it's to motivate people to get better control of the footbag, and it's also a sort of limiter on the length of your rallies in a circle. Once you're *capable* of hitting 2-add moves and above, it's in your best interest to try to link them without bailing. If you have to hit a 1-add move (or a 0-add kick) to recover control, then it just means you still haven't mastered the 2-add moves yet. So that's the signal for you to pass it (since dropping it is really hard to do if you don't risk anything, and if you don't drop it or pass it, people call you a hog!). And by the way, if you're not obviously capable of playing tilt-free or guilt-free, nobody will disrespect you in a circle... It's sort of a self-imposed discipline and when you're ready, the better players will tell you. :-) Make sense? Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 13 16:39:10 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00831 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 16:37:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00827 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 16:37:44 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (824) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00822 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 16:37:44 GMT Received: from neuman.interaccess.com (neuman.interaccess.com [207.70.126.130]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA09354; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 08:37:43 -0800 Received: from [207.70.66.84] (d84.cloud.interaccess.com [207.70.66.84]) by neuman.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id KAA10772; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 10:33:01 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 10:45:16 -0700 To: Steve Goldberg , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson) Subject: Re: [freestyle] guiltless string Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Steve and Freestylers! >Very close. "Guilting" means bailing to a 2-add move in a combo that's >otherwise composed of 3-add moves and higher. "Guilt-free" play means, >after you do your first move, you try to continuously link together moves >of 3-adds or higher. So a combo of all 3-add moves or higher is called a >"guiltless combo". I will contend further, that a guiltless string is entirely made up of 3-add moves or better, including the first move. An important distinction. There are many guiltless moves you can start a string with, Butterfly is most common, but also whirl, drifter, torque, "barfly", spinning clipper, ducking butterfly, spinning butterfly (all these can be done from a kick) and there are many more. By the same token, a tiltless string should not have any one add moves in it, including the first move. Granted, it is hard to start a *tripless* string on a 4, but it can be done. Keep skoolin! See ya! Scott Davidson enlightener From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 13 18:06:26 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01687 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:06:23 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01682 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:06:22 GMT Received: from anaesthetized@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1679) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA01677 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:06:22 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F5.hotmail.com [207.82.250.16]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA10848 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 10:06:17 -0800 Received: (qmail 26367 invoked by uid 0); 13 Nov 1997 18:06:15 -0000 Message-ID: <19971113180615.26366.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 199.183.204.205 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 10:06:14 PST X-Originating-IP: [199.183.204.205] From: "It's from Josh Penney!!!!" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: guiltless string Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 13:06:14 EST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >>Very close. "Guilting" means bailing to a 2-add move in a combo that's >>otherwise composed of 3-add moves and higher. > >There are many guiltless moves you can start a string with, Butterfly is >most common, but also whirl, drifter, torque, "barfly", spinning clipper, >ducking butterfly, spinning butterfly (all these can be done from a kick) >and there are many more. Yah! symposium mirage, xbody rake, gyro mirage, drifter, spinning pinch, osis, xbody sole stall... tengo na minchia tanta! >Granted, it is hard to start a *tripless* string on a 4, but it can be done. Well, you already mentioned spinning butterfly, ducking butterfly, barfly, and torque - also dada, spinning osis (spinning almost anythin for that matter), double legover --that's HARD!! I think it's much more difficult to start a tiltless/guitless combo on a difficult move, instead of the 'gimme' clipper/toestall that we all seem to repeat through effortlessly. Howzabout we banish that initial stall from guiltless circle shred? What do we think? Dan doesn't wanna know. JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 13 18:18:22 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01887 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:18:21 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01883 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:18:20 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1880) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA01878 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:18:20 GMT Received: from [207.94.250.90] (brat_196.bayarea.net [205.219.91.196]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA11140 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 10:18:20 -0800 X-Sender: brat@market.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19971113180615.26366.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 10:20:16 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: guiltless string Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 10:06 AM -0800 11/13/97, Josh Penney wrote: >Howzabout we banish that initial stall >from guiltless circle shred? What do we think? Dan doesn't wanna know. You must be talking about BMP circles, huh... Nobody cares about the initial stall except for Scott Davidson. Only a few people in the footbag world are *that* competitive. :-) Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 13 18:49:55 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA02120 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:49:44 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA02116 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:49:43 GMT Received: from crvich@raleigh.ibm.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2113) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA02111 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:49:43 GMT Received: from fwns2.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns2d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.236]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA11707 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 10:49:38 -0800 Received: from rtpmail02.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail02.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.48]) by fwns2.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7RTP-FW1.1) with ESMTP id NAA55870 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 13:49:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (ode1.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.178.164]) by rtpmail02.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id NAA14756 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 13:49:25 -0500 Received: from odent1.raleigh.ibm.com by ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03-RAL) id AA34196; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 13:49:22 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19971113134751.00914c80@ode1> X-Sender: crvich@ode1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 13:47:51 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: guiltless string In-Reply-To: <19971113180615.26366.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 01:06 PM 11/13/97 EST, It's from Josh Penney!!!! wrote: >to repeat through effortlessly. Howzabout we banish that initial stall >from guiltless circle shred? What do we think? Dan doesn't wanna know. If you do, you might as well banish all those initial 0-add kicks too. i.e., the first move must start from a hand toss or pass from someone else. If it's guiltless purity you're after, you might as well absolve yourself of *all* sins, right? -- Ernest M. Crvich Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 13 23:23:38 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04647 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 23:23:28 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04643 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 23:23:26 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4640) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04638 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 23:23:26 GMT From: GimmieZo@aol.com Received: from mrin47.mail.aol.com (mrin47.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.157]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA15800 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 15:23:28 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin47.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id SAA06121; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:23:14 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:23:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971113182314_1002840200@mrin47> To: crvich@raleigh.ibm.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: guiltless string Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 97-11-13 18:14:05 EST, crvich@raleigh.ibm.com writes: << If you do, you might as well banish all those initial 0-add kicks too. i.e., the first move must start from a hand toss or pass from someone else. If it's guiltless purity you're after, you might as well absolve yourself of *all* sins, right? >> I cant tell if this is sarcasm or not, but in any case, basic kicks and the initial stall are vital to maintaining a good combo. If the first set is not comfortable then there is no chance of maintaining a difficult string. I agree with Steve when he says that the footbag community is not THAT competitive. It seems that some individuals are trying to push some kind of "eliteness" (did i spell that right?) and losing the spirit of the sport. Since when was a two add or a basic kick a bad thing? Joey From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 01:33:00 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA05598 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 01:32:58 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA05594 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 01:32:58 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5591) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA05589 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 01:32:57 GMT Received: from [207.94.250.90] (brat_196.bayarea.net [205.219.91.196]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA17759 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 17:33:01 -0800 X-Sender: brat@market.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <971113182314_1002840200@mrin47> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 17:34:48 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: guiltless string Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 3:23 PM -0800 11/13/97, GimmieZo@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 97-11-13 18:14:05 EST, crvich@raleigh.ibm.com writes: > ><< If you do, you might as well banish all those initial 0-add kicks too. > i.e., the first move must start from a hand toss or pass from someone else. > If it's guiltless purity you're after, you might as well absolve yourself > of *all* sins, right? >> > >I cant tell if this is sarcasm or not, Sarcasm. >It seems that some individuals are trying to push some kind of >"eliteness" (did i spell that right?) and losing the spirit of the sport. > Since when was a two add or a basic kick a bad thing? Well, hang on. One group of folks on the freestyle list is just kidding around. Another group is very serious. Those of you who don't really know what's up might get the wrong impression from comments from both of these groups (which also overlap)... So here it is again: "tilt-free" and "guilt-free" play are serious goals for players to strive for. But by the same token, nobody seriously knocks anyone who doesn't use that standard for themselves. As I explained before, it's the control required to go directly from one high-add move into another high-add move that many players strive for -- so they self-impose certain rules to keep themselves "honest" in a circle. I think I already explained why. This sport is very much about self motivation. So, no, nobody's saying there's anything at *all* wrong with two-add moves; or in fact, with just plain kicking back and having fun playing. But if you're going to strive to excel at the *sport* of freestyle, there's a path illuminated for you to follow should you so choose; mostly created by the First Ones (shredders, that is, including Kenny Shults, Dave Yevin, Rippin' Rick Reese, Joey Shaeffer, etc.), and now energized and patrolled by the Big-Add Posse (who will be the first to tell you they are but humble servants to the sport). :-) Another thing that Joey said rings true enough (and none of the top players would ever dispute this): "fundamentals" are everything. If you do 5-add combos left and right but you still can't kick it ten times in a row, you're missing the point. And I'll add, if at any time you fail to recognize and honor the spirit of the circle, you're OUTTA HERE. :-) Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 14:31:58 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA09721 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:30:33 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA09717 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:30:33 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (9714) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA09712 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:30:32 GMT Received: from mcfeely.interaccess.com (mcfeely.interaccess.com [207.70.126.131]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA24595 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 06:30:42 -0800 Received: from [207.70.66.67] (d67.cloud.interaccess.com [207.70.66.67]) by mcfeely.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id IAA13154; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:30:11 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:38:16 -0700 To: GimmieZo@aol.com, freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson) Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: guiltless string Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Joey! >If the first set is not >comfortable then there is no chance of maintaining a difficult string. I >agree with Steve when he says that the footbag community is not THAT >competitive. It seems that some individuals are trying to push some kind of >"eliteness" (did i spell that right?) and losing the spirit of the sport. If you want to make it easier on yourself, that is fine with me. You can *believe* in your own head that it is guiltless, but there will be that little nugget of doubt in the back of your head that will torment you (just like real guilt). > Since when was a two add or a basic kick a bad thing? Since you started doing guiltless, then naturally, a two or a one add move is an unacceptable thing. A basic kick, however, is necessary and fundamental. When you hold yourself to the standard of "guiltless," then I believe you should hold yourself up to that standard on all contacts. Period. I still recommend a wide base of tricks, including as many ones and twos as you can get. They are ultimately important, because all of the more advanced tricks use the ones and twos as components. Once you master the ones and twos, the threes and fours will go together like a good set of Lego's (R). Keep shredding, and don't forget your consecutives. (all with a smile!) See ya! Scott Davidson Enlightener From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 14:31:58 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA09710 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:30:30 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA09706 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:30:28 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (9703) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA09701 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:30:28 GMT Received: from mcfeely.interaccess.com (mcfeely.interaccess.com [207.70.126.131]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA24590 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 06:30:37 -0800 Received: from [207.70.66.67] (d67.cloud.interaccess.com [207.70.66.67]) by mcfeely.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id IAA13148 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:30:08 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:38:13 -0700 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson) Subject: [freestyle] New move(s)? Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Freestylers! I've got three new ones for you... First, I have told about this one before, but I never had a name for it. Now I call it "TorqueScrew". For a while I thought it was a "blurry reverse blender" or "blurry dyno". But I have given up on the notion that it is paradox. Now I realize it is just a torque with a reverse swirl (dyno motion) at the end. Here is my bastardization of the move in Johovah's notation: TorqueScrew (from above) Clip > Op Dex In > Op Reverse Swirl Second, I am sure someone else has been trying this... In-spinning torque. This seems to be a difficult 5-add move. Is it perhaps 6 adds for the extra spin? Hmm... Third, Inspinning Infinity... "Spinfinity" I can only do this from my left clipper to my right, so here it is in longhand: Left clipper, spin to the left 1.25 ish times and initiate the motion of a gyro butterfly ending on the right clipper. Hint: the set is above the head, so you don't hit the FB with your shoulders or head as you turn, and to give you more time. I hit it a bunch of times yesterday. Fourth, is "Ocean" (like Motion, but from a "down-double" type set, same side as dex) Clip > Same Out Dex > Same Out Dex > Same Osis (which is probably wrong, but here it is longhand...) >From R Clip set, make the set like a down-double down set (about mid thigh level), do a down double down except instead of ending in R Clip, end in L Clip. Feels like an osis at the end. Don't read too much into the in-spinning thing, I have not mastered it yet. I feel that just *understanding* it is a major step for me. Keep spinning! See ya! Scott Davidson enlightener From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 14:38:28 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA09813 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:38:27 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA09809 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:38:27 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (9806) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA09804 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:38:26 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA24693 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 06:38:36 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id la109003 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:47:16 -0600 Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: guiltless string Message-Id: <000000465762962363357@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:42:37 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, Nov 13, 1997, 5:23:14 PM US CST GimmieZo@aol.com wrote: > Since when was a two add or a basic kick a bad thing? Never has been. Never will be. To think that they are is self-limiting. -- Derrick Fogle -- Heartland Eye Banks -- dfogle@mlerf.org -- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 15:06:21 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00234 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 15:04:57 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00230 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 15:04:54 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (227) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00225 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 15:04:53 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA24975 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 07:04:53 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BCF0E4.4991C170@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 10:01:33 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] new moves Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 10:01:32 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In response to Scott's new moves. First of all, AWESOME! in-spinning butterfly is damn sick, and I'm psyched to try the "Ocean." I thought that "Torquescrew" was the name for a miraging refraction??? Close to blurry dyno but a bit easier. Anyway, my ankle is hurting, I can't decide whether to play today or not, thinking about purchasing an ankle brace, feeling depressed about such a small, nagging injury, continually spelling out the alphabet with my foot all day (thanks Joey or whoever described that technique), feel like I am imprisoned from the emancipatory freedom of shredding, Unusually bummed on this Friday (usually my favorite day with the dankest session). The body so often acts as a limiting filter that impedes the realistic potential of the mind!!! I see myself hitting nemesis into inspinning barroque into blurry flurry but it just doesn't actualize through my meager physiology. Maybe I will offer my body to cyborg research and come back as the circuitry-driven Slicer!!!! I have found another medium for freestyle during this injury, and it is music creation! Footbag has taught me how to learn effectively. Focused, disciplined, interested, enjoyable repetition into muscle memory proves the optimal pathway to learning for me, be it footbag, guitar, writing, love making, programming or speaking. Enough rambling - good buy - Ethan From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 16:23:45 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00644 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 16:23:28 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00640 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 16:23:27 GMT Received: from dennis_jones@dantz.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (637) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00635 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 16:23:27 GMT Received: from amalthea.ccnet.com (amalthea.ccnet.com [192.215.96.98]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA25925 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:23:28 -0800 Received: from [199.108.15.50] [199.108.15.50] by amalthea.ccnet.com with esmtp (Exim 1.71 #9) id 0xWOWa-0000n0-00; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 08:23:16 -0800 Received: from 199.108.15.46 by 199.108.15.50 with SMTP (1.0); 14 NOV 97 08:22:52 UT Date: 14 Nov 97 08:24:02 -0800 From: Dennis Jones Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: guiltless string To: Freestyle List X-Mailer: QuickMail Pro 1.5.1r2 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Reply-To: Dennis Jones Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-Ascii" Message-Id: Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >Since when was a two add or a basic kick a bad thing? Much wisdom flows from these words my friends. Dennis Jones From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 19:06:16 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA01800 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 19:06:10 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA01796 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 19:06:08 GMT Received: from allman144@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1793) Received: from mrin41.mail.aol.com (mrin41.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.151]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA01791 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 19:06:07 GMT From: Allman144@aol.com Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin41.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id OAA08255 for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:05:47 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:05:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971114140547_-357071139@mrin41.mail.aol.com> To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #266 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey everyone, I have a few questions so please bear with me: 1)In July I bought a 50 panel *Dream* footbag and now that it is November, it still is not broken in. I have done the old wash it with soap and water and I kick with it all of the time. Whats up? Can anyone help my stiff bag blues? 2)Can someone please explain a paradox and symposium blizzard? 3)Finally, what does "blurry" really mean? I am confused. Tony From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 20:55:24 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02756 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 20:55:07 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02752 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 20:55:05 GMT Received: from anaesthetized@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2749) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA02747 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 20:55:05 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (liberty7.hotmail.com [207.82.250.167]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA30041 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 12:55:07 -0800 Received: (qmail 24822 invoked by uid 0); 14 Nov 1997 20:54:25 -0000 Message-ID: <19971114205425.24821.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 199.183.41.233 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 12:54:23 PST X-Originating-IP: [199.183.41.233] From: "It's from Josh Penney!!!!" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #266 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 15:54:23 EST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >Hey everyone, I have a few questions so please bear with me: Hi Tony, I think I can address all these issues: >1)In July I bought a 50 panel *Dream* footbag and now that it is November, it >still is not broken in. I have done the old wash it with soap and water and I >kick with it all of the time. Whats up? Can anyone help my stiff bag blues? Throw it in with your laundry, keep it in your front pocket, be patient. The more panels a bag has, the rounder it is, therefore the 'truer' the response... unfortunaltely, it makes the break-in time even longer. Most folks tend to stay within the 42 panel range (either 42 or 32 is a good balance point between break-in time and roundness). >2)Can someone please explain a paradox and symposium blizzard? Okay. Pardox blizzard is just like blizzard except the paradox reverse dexterity is done before the mirage. Normally it's mirage, paradox reverse mirage, but as it's swiched around, so it goes. This could be called 'frontside paradox' but that's another story. >3)Finally, what does "blurry" really mean? I am confused. 'Blurry' *really* means "miraging really quickly from a clipper set into anything paradox." A fast mirage from the clipper into anything *else* is called "stepping". What's the difference? Well, what's paradox? I don't really want to get into it, suffice to say that if you check the list archive at http://www.list.footbag.org then do a search on the word "paradox" you'll find more reading material than your philosophy 101 course requires. So : There are two different names for the same part of many different moves, it's just that the difference is contextual. In other words, what I do after the veryfastmiragefromclipper determines if it's called "blurry" or "stepping". I personally felt that it should have been called "original recipie" and "extra crispy" but nobody listens to me. : ) JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 21:23:42 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03152 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:23:40 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03148 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:23:39 GMT Received: from hill9361@uidaho.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3145) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03143 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:23:38 GMT Received: from raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (raven.csrv.uidaho.edu [129.101.192.43]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA30495; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 13:23:40 -0800 Received: from localhost (hill9361@localhost) by raven.csrv.uidaho.edu with SMTP (8.7.6/8.7.1) id NAA25459; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 13:23:35 -0800 (PST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.csrv.uidaho.edu: hill9361 owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 13:23:34 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hillebrand X-Sender: hill9361@raven.csrv.uidaho.edu To: Scott Davidson cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] New move(s)? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Fourth, is "Ocean" (like Motion, but from a "down-double" type set, same > side as dex) > > Clip > Same Out Dex > Same Out Dex > Same Osis > (which is probably wrong, but here it is longhand...) > >From R Clip set, make the set like a down-double down set (about mid thigh > level), do a down double down except instead of ending in R Clip, end in L > Clip. Feels like an osis at the end. cool. you should take that Ocean into a barfly!~ My favorite thing to do is a double-over-down into an osis, whish is much like this Ocean move of yours, but from a toe set. Lately, I have been getting it from a paradon set as well, but it looks kinda goofy because I often kick myself in the butt (I guess from trying to go too fast). I've been working on getting the barfly right after those two moves...an awesome combo for a novice like me =D Scott, you'll probably just take the Ocean right to barfly swirl or something insane like that.....no wait, barfly bail to ripstein? __________________________________________________________________________ Matt P. Hillebrand hill9361@uidaho.edu http://www.uidaho.edu/~hill9361 From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 21:25:21 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03201 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:25:20 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03197 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:25:20 GMT Received: from crvich@raleigh.ibm.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3194) Received: from fwns2.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns2d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.236]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03191 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:25:15 GMT Received: from rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.47]) by fwns2.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7RTP-FW1.1) with ESMTP id QAA43748; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 16:25:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (ode1.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.178.164]) by rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id QAA23988; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 16:25:05 -0500 Received: from odent1.raleigh.ibm.com by ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03-RAL) id AA32416; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 16:24:59 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19971114162321.00900480@ode1> X-Sender: crvich@ode1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 16:23:21 -0500 To: Allman144@aol.com, freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #266 In-Reply-To: <971114140547_-357071139@mrin41.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 02:05 PM 11/14/97 -0500, Allman144@aol.com wrote: >1)In July I bought a 50 panel *Dream* footbag and now that it is November, it >still is not broken in. I have done the old wash it with soap and water and I >kick with it all of the time. Whats up? Can anyone help my stiff bag blues? It's likely you've got a synthsuede bag, not facile (a facile bag would be WELL broken in by now). If so, you're pretty much out of luck. A synthsuede bag never gets as sexy as a facile one, no matter what you do to it (believe me, I've tried). Be careful when ordering from WFA; many of the Flying Clipper bags they carry are synthsuede by default...you either have to request a facile bag specifically (if available), or you'll have to order from Flying Clipper directly (1-800-FOOTFUN, http://www.flyingclipper.com/). -- Ernest M. Crvich Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 21:31:38 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03279 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:31:37 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03275 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:31:36 GMT Received: from hill9361@uidaho.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3272) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03270 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:31:36 GMT Received: from raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (raven.csrv.uidaho.edu [129.101.192.43]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA30647 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 13:31:38 -0800 Received: from localhost (hill9361@localhost) by raven.csrv.uidaho.edu with SMTP (8.7.6/8.7.1) id NAA26153; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 13:31:36 -0800 (PST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.csrv.uidaho.edu: hill9361 owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 13:31:36 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hillebrand X-Sender: hill9361@raven.csrv.uidaho.edu To: "It's from Josh Penney!!!!" cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #266 In-Reply-To: <19971114205425.24821.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Throw it in with your laundry, keep it in your front pocket, be patient. > The more panels a bag has, the rounder it is, therefore the 'truer' the > response... unfortunaltely, it makes the break-in time even longer. > Most folks tend to stay within the 42 panel range (either 42 or 32 is a > good balance point between break-in time and roundness). Is it true that the stitching to fabric ratio can be too high in some bags (like the dream), which could make for a bag that'll never break in as well as a fewer panelled bag made of the same materials? Some guy was telling me this once somewhere, I forgot who it was..... __________________________________________________________________________ Matt P. Hillebrand hill9361@uidaho.edu http://www.uidaho.edu/~hill9361 From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 14 22:06:02 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA06194 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 22:05:29 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA06190 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 22:05:26 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6187) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA06185 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 22:05:25 GMT Received: from [207.94.250.90] (brat_196.bayarea.net [205.219.91.196]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA31091; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:05:27 -0800 X-Sender: brat@market.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.32.19971114162321.00900480@ode1> References: <971114140547_-357071139@mrin41.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:06:21 -0800 To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Breaking in a Dream.. Cc: Allman144@aol.com Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 1:23 PM -0800 11/14/97, Ernest Crvich wrote: >Be careful when ordering from WFA; many of >the Flying Clipper bags they carry are synthsuede by default... Actually, the facile "Juice" is clearly marked as such on WFA's new online catalog ; but you have to understand two problems with facile: (1) it costs more (and is usually only hand-sewn in USA, further inflating the cost), i.e. $25 versus 10 or so for the non-facile; (2) if's VERY likely to tear (the facile fabric clearly wasn't originally meant for kicking), so nobody will guarantee it -- if you but facile, it will be SWEET but its life is almost guaranteed to be relatively short. Expect it to tear, have a tube of freesole or rubber cement handy to repair it, and you'll be happy. That said, I highly recommend the facile Juice for people trying to do advanced freestyle moves (as opposed to just kicking it). The 42-panel Dream Tony bought is also a very good footbag, but if you're not happy with it's "stiffness", then you must be trying to do some of the moves discussed here. If that's so, you almost HAVE to go to a "professional" model freestyle bag -- not one of the mass-produced non-facile general-purpose bags, but a facile 32-panel "Juice" hand-made by Flying Clipper for advanced freestylers. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 15 16:46:24 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00578 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 16:45:39 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00574 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 16:45:37 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (571) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00569 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 16:45:37 GMT From: GimmieZo@aol.com Received: from mrin47.mail.aol.com (mrin47.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.157]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA08320; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 08:45:36 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin47.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id LAA03842; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 11:45:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 11:45:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971115114534_1482093627@mrin47> To: enlightener@footbag.org, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: guiltless string Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 97-11-14 10:12:16 EST, enlightener@footbag.org writes: << Since you started doing guiltless, then naturally, a two or a one add move is an unacceptable thing. A basic kick, however, is necessary and fundamental. When you hold yourself to the standard of "guiltless," then I believe you should hold yourself up to that standard on all contacts. Period. >> I know what it means to be guiltless. I think maybe people did not understand what i was getting at. When i say "since when was one or two add moves bad?" i was trying to point out that not EVERYONE can be guitless. I understand if you want to be then they are out of the question. My problem, i should have said exactly what i meant. Lates! Joey From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 15 17:05:45 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA00706 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 17:05:44 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA00702 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 17:05:42 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (699) Received: from mrin41.mail.aol.com (mrin41.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.151]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA00697 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 17:05:41 GMT From: GimmieZo@aol.com Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin41.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id MAA06460 for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 12:05:12 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 12:05:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971115120511_-21373895@mrin41.mail.aol.com> To: Allman144@aol.com, freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #266 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 97-11-14 15:33:46 EST, Allman144@aol.com writes: << Hey everyone, I have a few questions so please bear with me: 1)In July I bought a 50 panel *Dream* footbag and now that it is November, it still is not broken in. I have done the old wash it with soap and water and I kick with it all of the time. Whats up? Can anyone help my stiff bag blues? >> Yeah, trust me i have had a 50 panel dream (by the way mine is yellow and blue, i dont think they make em in all colors anymore) for about 2 years and it still doesnt work right for me. I recently gave up on it and ordered a facile juice (now 25$) from the WFA and my kicking seriously INSTANTLY improved. Invest some cash in a new facile bag and i promise you will feel the difference after your new one breaks in. Good luck. By the way i still wish i could get my hands on a facile dream! or legend. Joey From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 15 18:12:39 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA00927 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 18:12:13 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA00923 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 18:12:11 GMT Received: from aaron_j@usa.net () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (920) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA00918 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 18:12:11 GMT Received: from dns01.ops.usa.net (dns01.ops.usa.net [204.68.24.137]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA09150 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 10:12:12 -0800 Received: (qmail 24937 invoked by alias); 15 Nov 1997 18:12:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 24921 invoked from network); 15 Nov 1997 18:12:09 -0000 Received: from pm2-20.sundial.net (204.181.150.90) by dns01.ops.usa.net with SMTP; 15 Nov 1997 18:12:09 -0000 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19971115131511.2a8f7b24@pop.netaddress.com> X-Sender: aaron_j@pop.netaddress.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 13:15:11 -0500 To: GimmieZo@aol.com, enlightener@footbag.org, freestyle@footbag.org From: Aaron Juttelstad Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: guiltless string In-Reply-To: <971115114534_1482093627@mrin47> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org could i please be unsubscribed from all the lists. thanx aaron juttelstad aaron_j@usa.net From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 15 20:16:05 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA01282 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 20:15:48 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA01278 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 20:15:46 GMT Received: from anaesthetized@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1275) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA01273 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 20:15:45 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F73.hotmail.com [207.82.250.159]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA10607 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 12:15:48 -0800 Received: (qmail 6381 invoked by uid 0); 15 Nov 1997 20:15:44 -0000 Message-ID: <19971115201544.6380.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 208.196.104.170 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 12:15:44 PST X-Originating-IP: [208.196.104.170] From: "It's from Josh Penney!!!!" To: sunilj@dept.english.upenn.edu Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Freestyle Digest V1 #266 / P@ blizzard: Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 15:15:44 EST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Sunil, my friend from the east/west has corrected me, thus I stand corrected: > I think p@ blizzard would be a paradox miraging reverse mirage... >not a paradox reverse miraging mirage...paradox reverse miraging mirage is >p@ atom smasher.. > > >whew... i wrote a mouthfull. It could also be thought of as a paradox double legover, bail opposite toe. Think I'll try it backside symposium -- pardox symposium blizzard? Boy, that sounds HARD! Thank you my prend! JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 16 19:24:06 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA01121 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 19:23:40 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA01117 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 19:23:38 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1114) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA01112 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 19:23:37 GMT From: GimmieZo@aol.com Received: from mrin40.mail.aol.com (mrin40.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.150]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA23358 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 11:23:39 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin40.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id OAA19631 for Freestyle@footbag.org; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 14:23:38 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 14:23:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971116142338_206369807@mrin40.mail.aol.com> To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Torques Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey guys I'm having a lot of trouble nailing the torques. I have been trying for a while and I haven't hit one yet. Any tips??? Thanks Joey From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 16 21:11:23 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA01435 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 21:11:18 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA01431 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 21:11:16 GMT Received: from marigold@vcn.bc.ca () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1428) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA01426 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 21:11:15 GMT Received: from vcn.bc.ca (opus.vcn.bc.ca [207.102.64.2]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA25047 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 13:11:17 -0800 Received: from localhost (marigold@localhost) by vcn.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA19944; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 13:11:11 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 13:11:11 -0800 (PST) From: Verhoef Anne To: GimmieZo@aol.com cc: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Torques In-Reply-To: <971116142338_206369807@mrin40.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org aOn Sun, 16 Nov 1997 GimmieZo@aol.com wrote: > Hey guys I'm having a lot of trouble nailing the torques. I have been trying > for a while and I haven't hit one yet. Any tips??? Thanks Hey Joey, Practice osis to same side osis. After you have that down, add the mirage in front of it. I found that the most important thing with the torque is getting the body momentum going during the spin. You'll find it very hard at first to twist your body, but after you do it enough, it will come naturally. Try doing the "planting" method first. The planting method is where you plant your foot after the mirage, then do the osis. The "all in one" method is harder (at least I find it harder). This is where you do the whole move in one step without planting until the end of the move. This is a hard way to do the torque when learning because of the balance and body momentum involved. Hope that helped. Adrian -- marigold@vcn.bc.ca From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 17 19:22:00 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02038 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 19:21:19 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02034 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 19:21:17 GMT Received: from kaplanb@mscd.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2031) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02029 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 19:21:07 GMT Received: from clem.mscd.edu (clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA07051 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 11:21:09 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-9 #24550) with SMTP id <0EJT002011L9ZG@clem.mscd.edu> for Freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 12:17:33 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 12:17:33 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] Torques In-reply-to: To: Verhoef Anne Cc: GimmieZo@aol.com, Freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Sun, 16 Nov 1997, Verhoef Anne wrote: > aOn Sun, 16 Nov 1997 GimmieZo@aol.com wrote: > > > Hey guys I'm having a lot of trouble nailing the torques. I have been trying > > for a while and I haven't hit one yet. Any tips??? Thanks > > Adrian then wrote: > > I found that the most important thing with the torque is > getting the body momentum going during the spin. You'll find it very hard > at first to twist your body, but after you do it enough, it will come > naturally. Now I write: Here's a little more advice I was given that helped me get that spin motion down. If you're setting right clipper; once you've started the mirage "throw" you're right shoulder in the direction of your spin. Try exaggerating it so your body really moves. You may lose control the first few times but I doubt you'll have to worry about hip displasure, and then you just have to catch the bag. The spinning osis will help alot with the positioning for the catch. Also try not to set to far out on either the spinning osis or the torque. Keeping it close helps so you DON'T have to dislocate your hip to try and land it. have fun! Brad From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 21 17:27:40 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01329 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 17:25:59 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01325 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 17:25:57 GMT Received: from kenned57@pilot.msu.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1322) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01320 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 17:25:56 GMT Received: from pilot012.cl.msu.edu (pilot012.cl.msu.edu [35.9.5.112]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA10590 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 09:25:56 -0800 Received: (kenned57@localhost) by pilot012.cl.msu.edu (8.7.5/MSU-2.10) id MAA71374; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 12:25:51 -0500 Message-Id: <199711211725.MAA71374@pilot012.cl.msu.edu> Subject: [freestyle] thanksgiving jam in Chicago To: freestyle@footbag.org Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 12:25:51 -0500 (EST) From: "Cameron Dean Kennedy" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Greatings all, Is anyone from michigan driving to the thanksgiving jam in chicago that would be willing to car pool, or needs a ride there? I can mostly likely drive, and certainly could provide fundage for someone else to drive. later, cameron kennedy 517-337-9470 kenned57@pilot.msu.edu From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 22 22:35:37 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA02051 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 22:34:59 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA02047 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 22:34:57 GMT Received: from cfa@footbagcanada.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2044) Received: from srv1.reelwest.bc.ca (srv1.reelwest.bc.ca [207.194.197.99]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA02042 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 22:34:56 GMT From: cfa@footbagcanada.com Received: from chard (unverified [207.194.197.222]) by srv1.reelwest.bc.ca (EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 14:33:37 -0800 Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 14:33:37 -0800 Message-ID: X-Sender: cfa@intouch.bc.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #271 Cc: Dan@eniac.yak.net, Zaner?@eniac.yak.net Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Trying to find Dan, could someone have him call me please. Scott 604 736 SCOT (7268) From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 22 23:00:03 1997 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA02137 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 23:00:02 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA02127 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 23:00:01 GMT Received: from kilobit@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2124) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA02122 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 23:00:00 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F99.hotmail.com [207.82.250.218]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA25992 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 15:00:03 -0800 Received: (qmail 2468 invoked by uid 0); 22 Nov 1997 23:00:01 -0000 Message-ID: <19971122230001.2467.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 205.186.166.133 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 15:00:00 PST X-Originating-IP: [205.186.166.133] From: "The 'Mazin Josh Penney" To: cfa@footbagcanada.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Dan who? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 15:00:00 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >Trying to find Dan, could someone have him call me please. Scott 604 736 >SCOT (7268) There are a few. which do you mean? JP ps. Here we go again everybody, I'm back at the ole address. Sorry again. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com