From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 1 07:16:26 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA04666 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 07:14:59 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA04661 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 07:14:56 GMT Received: from allman144@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4658) Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com (imo17.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.174]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA04654; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 07:14:55 GMT From: Allman144 Message-ID: <4b1737ea.34ab4253@aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 Jan 1998 02:14:25 EST To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org, freestyle-digest@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #290 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey everyone. Santa brought me a new facile juice this past week! Last night I was kicking in my living room with my brother and he accidentally kicked it into the fireplace! Luckily, there was no fire at the time. So it got pretty grimy in all of those ashes. My question is, should I take any special care in cleaning it because it is faclie? Will washing it with cold water and hand soap do? Thanks for the help! Tony Glick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 1 07:19:28 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA04687 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 07:18:12 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA04683 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 07:18:11 GMT Received: from allman144@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4680) Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com (imo18.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.175]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA04678 for ; Thu, 1 Jan 1998 07:18:10 GMT From: Allman144 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 1 Jan 1998 02:17:50 EST To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #290 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey everyone. Santa brought me a new facile juice this past week! Last night I was kicking in my living room with my brother and he accidentally kicked it into the fireplace! Luckily, there was no fire at the time. So it got pretty grimy in all of those ashes. My question is, should I take any special care in cleaning it because it is faclie? Will washing it with cold water and hand soap do? Thanks for the help! Tony Glick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 6 04:36:53 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA01593 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 04:34:32 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA01575 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 04:34:26 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1567) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA01565 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 04:34:23 GMT Received: from imo13.mx.aol.com (imo13.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.167]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA13297 for ; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 13:03:27 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 15:58:05 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] New bag Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Do any of yall have the new Hacky Sack Pro bag? If so, how good does it kick? Thanks, Matt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 6 15:57:23 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00845 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 15:55:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00841 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 15:55:44 GMT Received: from sunilj@dept.english.upenn.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (838) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00836 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 15:55:43 GMT Received: from dept.english.upenn.edu (DEPT.ENGLISH.UPENN.EDU [130.91.75.246]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA28241; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 07:55:43 -0800 Received: (from sunilj@localhost) by dept.english.upenn.edu (8.8.6/8.8.6) id KAA90778; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 10:55:36 -0500 From: sunilj@dept.english.upenn.edu (Sunil Jani) Message-Id: <199801061555.KAA90778@dept.english.upenn.edu> Subject: Re: [freestyle] move name? To: brat@footbag.org (Steve Goldberg) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 10:55:35 -0500 (EST) Cc: eric@netcomi.com, freestyle@footbag.org In-Reply-To: from "Steve Goldberg" at Dec 31, 97 10:20:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23-upenn3.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org According to Steve Goldberg: > > >there's a move that i've been doing for a very long time, and i wonder if > >it has a name. i started out by calling it "pixie drifter", which is flat > >wrong...then "toe drifter" which is close but still wrong i believe. the > >move is: toe > same in dex > same clip. i think that "pixie clipper" is > >correct but i was wondering if it has its own name. > > It's "drifter" from a toe set. > > Steve I beg to differ... drifter from toe set would be toe set > OP in dex > same clip... because a drifter is a miraging clipper, not a pixie clipper. The move Eric asked about should just be called pixie clipper. Whereas, toe set > same in dex > op clip should be called pixie same side clipper to distinguish it from the previous move. Sunil From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 6 16:03:04 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00997 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:03:02 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00992 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:03:00 GMT Received: from footbag13@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (989) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00986 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:03:00 GMT Received: from imo13.mx.aol.com (imo13.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.167]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA28345 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 08:03:00 -0800 From: Footbag13 Message-ID: <450fa82e.34b25438@aol.com> Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 10:56:38 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Sorry?! Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Some thoughts...... Mom always taught me to be polite.... I think this might be a common unspoken rule...but just just in case everyonne's not familiar with it, here's what my little group of friends does. First off, the bag always proceeds around the circle in one direction (usually to the left). If you have a poor string, no string or anything that would indicate that you are not living up to your usual standards, it is the responsibilty of the next person recieving the bag to pass it back and give you another chance. You may get it back multiple times in a row or you may not get it back at all...all depending on how the next person judged your performance. This gives everyone an opportunity to do well and an incentive to do well the first time (so as not to hold up the circle for too long). Even someone who can only kick the bag 3 times before dropping will get the bag back if they only kick it once. I point out this system because this is how the people i kick with eliminate the need to say "sorry". A bad toss or pass usually results in a bad string or more comonly no string at all. As long as all of us toss "backs" when neccesary, there is no need for apologies because people usually get a second chance. It's something that's never really expected but even newcomers usually get the idea after seeing it a few times. So in other words...if the bag is moving clockwise around the circle, everyone is happy as long as kindness moves counterclockwise! :) Jason Phillips Ground Phlor Digs "DIG" From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 6 19:25:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02898 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 19:25:49 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02893 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 19:25:46 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2890) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02888 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 19:25:37 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA32052 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 11:25:36 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BD1AAE.6F453480@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 14:21:52 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: "'Brian Jones'" Cc: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] RE: [footbag] clipper? help Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 14:21:52 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org To achieve the oft - elusive clipper delay. Learn inside kicks. Learn inside delays. Practice inside delays. Watch the video. Try and practice clipper delays. Practice clipper delays (BOTH SIDES!!), watch the video, practice clipper delays, stay OVER the bag, practice clipper delays, practice, have fun with clipper delays, practice, think about clipper delays, practice, practice clipper delays, practice clipper delays, and finally.... Practice clipper delays. Good luck! I know it's a lot of practice, but the rewards prove astronomical!!!!! Ethan -----Original Message----- From: Brian Jones [SMTP:jonebc00@uleth.ca] Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 1998 2:03 PM To: footbag@footbag.org Subject: [footbag] clipper? help well I too am new to this sport and have seen those awesome movies and want to know how to achieve that clipper stall/delay. Any tips are appreciated! Brian From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 6 20:14:13 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03758 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 20:13:54 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03754 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 20:13:52 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3751) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03749 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 20:13:52 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA00129 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 12:13:54 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.03.0014/4c.adoc) with ESMTP id ga134998 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 14:23:07 -0600 Subject: [freestyle] Fwd: Re: Footbag judging Message-Id: <000000507512966962754@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 14:19:13 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org (Freestyle Listserve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org An unspecified number of IFAB members have received a post similar to this regarding some proposed changes in the freestyle system. I think they are worth consideration, and got the OK from Andrew to pass them on to the freestyle list for open discussion. ------Begin Forwarded Material-------- On Tue, Jan 6, 1998, 1:24:34 PM US CST Andrew Feuerdrache wrote: As a freestyle competitor and observer at tournaments I have found the formula based judging system to be overly complicated and unbalanced. The alternate Ranked-Component judging system although far less complicated is by it's nature subjective. A player performing the same routine in the same way at two different tournaments may place differently depending not only on their competition but also on the judges opinions of what comprises a good routine. Also unlike the formula based system it doesn't ensure that many of the technical elements of a routine will be counted. For a system to be truly successful it needs to be consistent, predictable and easily understood by new players. Therefor I propose a simplified version of the formula based judging system. For the sake of space I have only outlined scoring for a singles routine. First I would no longer count drops, they are already counted against your add average and presentation scores, a third time would be redundant. Also I would no longer count raw adds (adds*multiplier) as part of the difficulty score. This comprises a very small part of the over all score and only serves to complicate the system. Average difficulty (adds/contacts) would then comprise the total difficulty score to a maximum of 3.5, a score that allows for player improvement. I would also simplify composition to award a tenth of a point for each unique move to a maximum of 3.5. You would also have to perform thirty five or so well chosen moves to have a high composition score under the old system. This also means that the composition score wouldn’t specifically ensure the variety of unusual surface, body, cross-body, dexterity and delay moves, which I have added to presentation, but it would allow far more possibilities for choreography and allow a larger variety a player styles. Lastly I would make presentation worth 3 possible points broken into three elements. I would combine Music and Movement and Floor, Planes & Travel to be Choreography, but still concerned with the same elements. Second I would combine Personality & Originality with General Form under the name General form. Thirdly I would include a concern for distribution of moves among the add elements (unusual surface, body, ect.) to Distribution and linking. In summary a “perfect” routine would have 10 points, a maximum of 3.5 awarded for difficulty, a maximum of 3.5 awarded for composition and 3 for presentation. This ensures a variety of moves, difficulty of routines and concern for artistry as with the original judging system but also simplifying the old system and adding to player flexibility. This system also wouldn't require as many judges making judging in small tournaments easier. As a final thought I would like to again say that the formula based judging system is far to complicated and needs to be changed, if not to this proposal then another to simplify it and allow for more flexibility and growth. I would appreciate any feedback. Andrew McCargar, Damocles_schwert@hotmail.com -------End Forwarded Material---------- --Derrick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 6 21:04:06 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA00530 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 21:03:38 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA00526 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 21:03:36 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (523) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA00521 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 21:03:36 GMT Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com (imo12.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.166]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA01063 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 13:03:35 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: <531ec66c.34b29b7e@aol.com> Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 16:00:44 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Clipper Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org When I do a clipper I can not keep it under control. Please drop me a line if you can help! Thanks, Matt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 6 21:39:53 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA00868 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 21:39:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA00864 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 21:39:43 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (861) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA00859 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 21:39:40 GMT Received: from dfw-ix9.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix9.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.9]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA01612 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 13:39:39 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix9.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id PAA01031; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 15:39:22 -0600 (CST) Received: from brat-2.atext.com(204.62.245.116) by dfw-ix9.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma000961; Tue Jan 6 15:38:27 1998 X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <531ec66c.34b29b7e@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 13:36:40 -0800 To: StinKyKiwi From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Clipper Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Stinky wrote: >When I do a clipper I can not keep it under control. Please drop me a line if >you can help! Set the bag farther away from your body, and think of crossing with your support leg and doing an inside delay. DO THE MAGIC HOP -- hop off your support leg just at the last second so that you land as you're catching the bag with your clipper leg. Make a fist with your toes of your catching foot just before you make contact, HOLD THE BAG, and then push it straight back up. Stay on the balls of your support foot, never put your heel down. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 6 23:05:49 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA01849 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 23:05:42 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA01845 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 23:05:41 GMT Received: from kilobit@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1842) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA01840 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 23:05:40 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F68.hotmail.com [207.82.250.154]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA03382 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 15:05:41 -0800 Received: (qmail 10608 invoked by uid 0); 6 Jan 1998 23:05:40 -0000 Message-ID: <19980106230540.10607.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 208.196.104.190 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 06 Jan 1998 15:05:40 PST X-Originating-IP: [208.196.104.190] From: "The 'Mazin Josh Penney" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Sorry?! Content-Type: text/plain Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 15:05:40 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I learned of the 'again' in Philadelphia. I always thought before then you got "one chance, don't mess up" Great thanks to those guys... Even though I will occaisonally make a pass that's so bad I get it *again*. JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 7 04:04:19 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA04662 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 04:04:19 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA04658 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 04:04:18 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4655) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA04653 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 04:04:17 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA07932 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 20:04:20 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.03.0014/4c.adoc) with ESMTP id ba135227 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 1998 22:13:02 -0600 Subject: [freestyle] Jam in the Heartland! Message-Id: <000000507842966990989@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 22:09:48 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org (Freestyle Listserve) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org WHEN: Saturday, January 17, 1998 WHERE: St. Joe, Missouri =20 WHY: Freestyle, of course! Mark the date on your calendar, make sure you have some fuel in your car, = and plan to go back home with ice in your floorboard 'cause we're gonna blister your feet! I almost guarantee you will end up with feathers in your belongings, too, because the chicken-man is flappin' his wings again. Bock Bock! For mor information, contact Josh Bowen: -- Derrick Fogle -- Heartland Eye Banks -- dfogle@mlerf.org -- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 7 18:38:22 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA02032 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 18:38:13 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA02028 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 18:38:07 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2025) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA02023 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 18:38:07 GMT Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com (imo16.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.172]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA19519 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 10:38:04 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: <6ff44148.34b3c9bc@aol.com> Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 13:30:17 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] scorpion tails? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I've just finished searching the freestyle move links and I still have no clue what a "scorpion tails" is. I tried all the links that steve send me, and thanks for them. Could some one describe this move. Thanks for your time, Josh From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 7 19:04:46 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02218 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 19:04:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02214 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 19:04:44 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2211) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02209 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 19:04:44 GMT Received: from neuman.interaccess.com (neuman.interaccess.com [207.70.126.130]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA20082 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 11:04:46 -0800 Received: from [207.208.136.120] (d120.focal.interaccess.com [207.208.136.120]) by neuman.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id MAA26676; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:59:14 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:59:14 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Nageylum , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter) Subject: Re: [freestyle] scorpion tails? Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Josh! >I've just finished searching the freestyle move links and I still have no clue >what a "scorpion tails" is. I tried all the links that steve send me, and >thanks for them. Could some one describe this move. Scorpion Tail is a spinning barfly. For instance, from the Left Clipper set, spin CCW, and barfly (double dex out-in) to left clipper. Very much like a spinning butterfly, but with an extra dex. Johova's notation would look like (although I am a prononunce non-expert on this): Clip > Spin Away > Same In > Same In > Same Clip I am sure that looks funky to all you Johovah's Witnesses, but you get the gist! Josh, where are you from and what is your last name? If you live near Eric Wulff (Ironman), then definately ask him about it, he is the master! Try mastering Spinning butterfly, and also barfly, then combine the two. Good luck, See ya! Enlightener (Scott Davidson) From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 7 20:05:59 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03044 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 20:05:48 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03040 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 20:05:48 GMT Received: from marigold@vcn.bc.ca () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3037) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03035 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 20:05:47 GMT Received: from vcn.bc.ca (opus.vcn.bc.ca [207.102.64.2]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA20981; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:05:50 -0800 Received: from localhost (marigold@localhost) by vcn.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA17538; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:05:46 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:05:44 -0800 (PST) From: Verhoef Anne To: Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter cc: Nageylum , freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] scorpion tails? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Wed, 7 Jan 1998, Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter wrote: > Scorpion Tail is a spinning barfly. > > For instance, from the Left Clipper set, spin CCW, and barfly (double dex > out-in) to left clipper. Very much like a spinning butterfly, but with an > extra dex. I thought Scorpion's Tail was a spinning down double. I don't think there is such a thing as a spinning barfly. There's gyro barfly though. A gyro barfly would be like a gyro butterfly with a double dex. The reason I think this is because the definition of a barfly is double down set from the *opposite* clipper you're catching with. Down double is catching with the *same* foot you set with. > Johova's notation would look like (although I am a prononunce non-expert on > this): > Clip > Spin Away > Same In > Same In > Same Clip Not quite, it's : Clip> Spin(back)> Op out in dex> same out in dex> op clip Adrian -- marigold@vcn.bc.ca From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 7 20:17:10 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03246 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 20:17:09 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03242 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 20:17:08 GMT Received: from hill9361@uidaho.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3239) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03237 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 20:17:08 GMT Received: from raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (raven.csrv.uidaho.edu [129.101.192.43]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA21106; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:17:10 -0800 Received: from localhost (hill9361@localhost) by raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id MAA26149; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:17:06 -0800 (PST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.csrv.uidaho.edu: hill9361 owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:17:06 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hillebrand X-Sender: hill9361@raven.csrv.uidaho.edu To: Verhoef Anne cc: Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter , Nageylum , freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] scorpion tails? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > I thought Scorpion's Tail was a spinning down double. I don't think there > is such a thing as a spinning barfly. There's gyro barfly though. A gyro > barfly would be like a gyro butterfly with a double dex. > The reason I think this is because the definition of a barfly is double > down set from the *opposite* clipper you're catching with. Down double is > catching with the *same* foot you set with. > > > Johova's notation would look like (although I am a prononunce non-expert on > > this): > > Clip > Spin Away > Same In > Same In > Same Clip > > Not quite, > it's : Clip> Spin(back)> Op out in dex> same out in dex> op clip Well, that move you just described is the gyro barfly, right? Still, nobody knows what a Scorpion Tail is from this discussion? (I know I don't.) __________________________________________________________________________ Matt P. Hillebrand hill9361@uidaho.edu http://www.uidaho.edu/~hill9361 From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 7 22:31:07 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04381 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 22:30:40 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04377 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 22:30:38 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4374) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA04372 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 22:30:37 GMT Received: from imo19.mx.aol.com (imo19.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.176]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA23444; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 14:30:40 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: <4b2440f1.34b3eba3@aol.com> Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 15:54:57 EST To: hill9361@uidaho.edu, marigold@vcn.bc.ca Cc: enlightener@footbag.org, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] scorpion tails? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org from what i've been told a scorpion tails is like a spinning butterfly with an extra dex. on the same side as the first dex. was done. If this is wrong please feel freee to tell me Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 02:37:07 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA06535 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 02:36:01 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA06531 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 02:35:59 GMT Received: from marigold@vcn.bc.ca () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6528) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA06526 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 02:35:59 GMT Received: from vcn.bc.ca (opus.vcn.bc.ca [207.102.64.2]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA27716; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 18:36:03 -0800 Received: from localhost (marigold@localhost) by vcn.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA05135; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 15:34:08 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 15:34:04 -0800 (PST) From: Verhoef Anne To: Matt Hillebrand cc: Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter , Nageylum , freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] scorpion tails? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Wed, 7 Jan 1998, Matt Hillebrand wrote: > > it's : Clip> Spin(back)> Op out in dex> same out in dex> op clip > > Well, that move you just described is the gyro barfly, right? No. The one above is scorpion's tail. So, Scorpion's Tail: clip> spin(back)> op out in dex> same out in dex> op clip Gyro barfly: clip> spin(back)> *same* out in dex> same out in dex> op clip In simple terms; scorpion's tail is a spinning down-double. Adrian -- marigold@vcn.bc.ca From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 03:09:14 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA06880 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 03:09:07 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA06876 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 03:09:07 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6873) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA06871 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 03:09:07 GMT Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com (imo11.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.165]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA28207 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 19:09:11 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: <9a6846e1.34b442dd@aol.com> Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 22:06:59 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] question Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org how do you trans late stuff like SPIN>OP>CLIP??? how do you translate that stuff? Matt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 03:45:42 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA07124 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 03:45:24 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA07120 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 03:45:24 GMT Received: from 00201887@bigred.unl.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7117) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA07115 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 03:45:24 GMT Received: from bigred.unl.edu (bigred.unl.edu [129.93.1.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA28603 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 19:45:29 -0800 Received: (from 00201887@localhost) by bigred.unl.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA04432; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 21:44:03 -0600 (CST) From: Theron A Troxel <00201887@bigred.unl.edu> Message-Id: <199801080344.VAA04432@bigred.unl.edu> Subject: Re: [freestyle] question To: StinKyKiwi@aol.com (StinKyKiwi) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 21:44:03 -0600 (CST) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org In-Reply-To: <9a6846e1.34b442dd@aol.com> from "StinKyKiwi" at Jan 7, 98 10:06:59 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Matt says: > how do you trans late stuff like > SPIN>OP>CLIP??? > how do you translate that stuff? Steve is it time to repost the secret decoding method? I'm sure there are some new and old people that don't have their decoder rings yet (Scott D =) (just joking Scott). Plus, I haven't seen ol job's message in a while. Looking forward to the Missouri Jam!!! Later. -- --------------------------- @ Theron Troxel \_|_/ UNLFC President | o 00201887@bigred.unl.edu /_\_ http://www.unl.edu/crec/SC/footbag \ ------------------------------------- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 03:55:26 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA07238 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 03:55:25 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA07233 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 03:55:24 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7230) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA07228 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 03:55:24 GMT Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA28737 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 19:55:29 -0800 Received: from [204.62.245.116] (brat-2 [204.62.245.116]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA09220; Wed, 7 Jan 1998 19:54:54 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199801080344.VAA04432@bigred.unl.edu> References: <9a6846e1.34b442dd@aol.com> from "StinKyKiwi" at Jan 7, 98 10:06:59 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 19:55:47 -0800 To: Theron A Troxel <00201887@bigred.unl.edu> From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] question Cc: StinKyKiwi@aol.com (StinKyKiwi), freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 7:44 PM -0800 1/7/98, Theron A Troxel wrote: >Matt says: >> how do you trans late stuff like >> SPIN>OP>CLIP??? >> how do you translate that stuff? > >Steve is it time to repost the secret decoding method? Sure, here goes: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Steve's 5-minute tutorial on Job's notation for e-mail freestyle talk: -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Here is "Blur" in Ben Job's notation, as a point of reference for the rest of the tutorial: clip > op in dex > op in dex > op toe (1) Ben Job realized (and it wasn't so obvious before, believe it or not) that moves basically start with one of two sets: either a toe or a clipper, so each move in his notation is "clip >" or "toe >" meaning "clipper set into" or "toe set into"; and moves basically end with one of two contacts (toe or clipper). So in the case of Blur, the move usually starts with a set out of a clipper delay and ends with a toe.. Hence: "clip > ... > ... toe". (2) The ">" can be read as "into" or "followed by", but is a special symbol because if you say "into" or "followed by" people aren't sure if you mean there's a contact in between or not. The ">" expressly means "without contacting the bag between the things on either side of the > symbol". So when we use ">" we are never talking about "strings" of moves; only about "components" that go into the moves. Hence I tend to refer to each thing after a ">" but before the next ">" as a "component". (3) Ben further noticed that in a huge percentage of the moves (and all of the basic ones), you can easily describe a move in terms of the dexterities involved -- i.e., whether a leg goes "in-out" (mirage-style) around/over the bag, or "out-in" (butterfly-style, reverse-mirage style). To avoid verbosity, these are shortened to just "in" for "in-out" and "out" for "out-in". And the word "dexterity" is shortened to "dex". So in the case of Blur, the notation would give us "... in dex > ... in dex ..." to represent that there are two sequential in-out dexterities in the move. For this tutorial, let's ignore moves like "pogo" and "symposium" and other moves where plants and spins (gyrating, in-spinning, etc.) are significant. They *are* handled by the notation, but it's best to understand the BASIC form of the notation before getting into that stuff, so I'll leave it for another tutorial. (Some of that notation is also open to debate as to whether or not it covers every case.) (4) The only other confusion might be "opposite" versus "same". We decided that, to avoid having to write a move description twice, once for the left side and one for the right, and since people aren't always in agreement about which side is which (don't ask), everything would be "relative". What I mean by "relative" is, when we say "opposite" ("op"), we mean "opposite to the leg/foot referred to just before the ">", and when we say "same", we mean "same as the leg/foot referred to just before the ">". So Blur set from either clipper would be: clip > op in dex > op in dex > op toe (The non-setting foot does the first in-out dexterity; the foot that didn't do that dexterity then does another in-out dexterity; and you catch the bag on the toe of the foot that didn't just do that final dexterity.) (5) Why do we use "relative" meanings for "op" and "same", and not use them to refer to "opposite of setting foot" or "same as setting foot"? The answer is, it really doesn't make a big difference which way we use them, but we have to be consistent and agree to a particular meaning, and most people have accepted the convention in (4) above. I personally think the one we're using now is more sensible, and if you want to spent 1 more minute, read this reasoning. Otherwise, skip it and you're done with the tutorial. Reasoning: if we write everything relative to the setting foot, it confuses the issue for variations on moves (such as "paradox" or "gyrating") where the components are exactly the same, but the set is different. So we (I?) prefer to be able to see the similarity in two moves by comparing their inner components without having to go and figure out which leg is which. If everything is relative ("opposite of or same as leg referred to in the previous component") then things are generally simpler to cut and paste in e-mail. :-) NOTE: Moves can start and end with other surfaces than toes and clippers, including insides (used like toes), dragons (used like clippers), and soles (used either way depending on whether they're cross-body or not), but the description would otherwise be identical. So a move could be "inside > ... > dragon" if it started with an inside set and ended in a dragon, for example. But the key is, regardless of which surface you use, all the stuff in the middle (after the set and before the pick-up) is the same. But let's ignore those cases for the sake of understanding the basic notation. The terms at the beginning and end of the move description are really the least interesting (especially since most of us agree the set isn't really part of the move, again not wanting to open a can of worms onto the great paradox debate :-)). ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- End of Tutorial -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 16:20:01 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00942 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:19:04 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00938 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:19:02 GMT Received: from markdenton@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (935) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00933 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:19:02 GMT Received: from f134.hotmail.com ([207.82.251.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA04509 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 08:19:03 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by f134.hotmail.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA02390 for Freestyle@footbag.org; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 08:19:02 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199801081619.IAA02390@f134.hotmail.com> Received: from 198.161.119.4 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 08 Jan 1998 08:19:01 PST X-Originating-IP: [198.161.119.4] From: "Mark Denton" To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] [Freestyle]Facile Juice vs. Twisted Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 08:19:01 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi, Can anyone tell me if there are any advantages/disadvantages to both Facile Juice footbags and Twisteds. Is this merely preferance or is one better than the other? Thanks, Mark ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 17:01:10 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01303 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:01:04 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01299 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:01:03 GMT Received: from eric@netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1296) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01294 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:01:03 GMT Received: from stick.netcomi.com (fit.netcomi.com [204.58.155.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA05420 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 09:01:03 -0800 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by stick.netcomi.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA03262; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 11:00:49 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: stick.netcomi.com: eric owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 11:00:48 -0600 (CST) From: Eric Burgess To: Mark Denton cc: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] [Freestyle]Facile Juice vs. Twisted In-Reply-To: <199801081619.IAA02390@f134.hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, 8 Jan 1998, Mark Denton wrote: > Can anyone tell me if there are any advantages/disadvantages to both > Facile Juice footbags and Twisteds. Is this merely preferance or is one > better than the other? the twisted will break in really quickly, as opposed to the juice. however, it's been my experience that later in life the juice will be a better bag, because the twisteds have a tendency to get *too* floppy. on the other hand, twisteds look *really* cool! :) but if you must pick one or the other, my advice would be to go with the juice. eric From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 17:41:28 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01624 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:41:08 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01620 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:41:07 GMT Received: from crvich@raleigh.ibm.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1617) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01615 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:41:06 GMT Received: from fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns1d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.235]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA06340 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 09:41:07 -0800 Received: from rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.24]) by fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7RTP-FW1.1) with ESMTP id MAA02770 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:41:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (ode1.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.178.164]) by rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id MAA33458 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:41:05 -0500 Received: from odent1.raleigh.ibm.com by ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03-RAL) id AA27780; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:41:02 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980108123852.0090dc60@ode1> X-Sender: crvich@ode1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 12:38:52 -0500 To: Freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] [Freestyle]Facile Juice vs. Twisted In-Reply-To: References: <199801081619.IAA02390@f134.hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 11:00 AM 1/8/98 -0600, Eric Burgess wrote: >the twisted will break in really quickly, as opposed to the juice. Agreed. >better bag, because the twisteds have a tendency to get *too* floppy. I respectfully disagree, though I'm probably in the minority. I've had a Twisted for over a year (I had two facile Juices before it), and I'm of the opinion that the Twisted has both slightly stronger fabric and slightly better stitching (probably due to it being less complex, regarding intersections). It's also a little heavier, which is a Good Thing. I have no complaints about its "floppiness", which for me seems only to depend on how moist it is. I prefer a flatter bag, anyway, since I almost never perform kicks of any sort (flyers and such) with it. It's also a couple dollars cheaper (from WFA). However, its shape gives it a decided non-spherical disadvantage to a pseudo-perfectly round Juice. But once it's broken in well, it doesn't seem to adversely affect performance. Most of the people who make their own bags (Paul Munger, Carol Wedemeyer, etc.) use a 32-panel pattern similar to the Juice. It's tried-and-true, whereas the Twisted pattern is somewhat experimental. They're both excellent bags, but I've switched to Twisted for the time being (I may switch back, who knows?). If you have the funds, I'd recommend buying one of each and judging for yourself, as it's definitely a subjective call. In any case, make sure to specify NO MAROON PANELS. 8-) -- Ernest M. Crvich Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 20:21:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03158 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:20:39 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03154 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:20:36 GMT Received: from hill9361@uidaho.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3151) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03149 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:20:36 GMT Received: from raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (raven.csrv.uidaho.edu [129.101.192.43]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA09599 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:20:38 -0800 Received: from localhost (hill9361@localhost) by raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id MAA25964; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:20:25 -0800 (PST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.csrv.uidaho.edu: hill9361 owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:20:25 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hillebrand X-Sender: hill9361@raven.csrv.uidaho.edu To: Mark Denton cc: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Facile Juice vs. Twisted In-Reply-To: <199801081619.IAA02390@f134.hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Can anyone tell me if there are any advantages/disadvantages to both > Facile Juice footbags and Twisteds. Is this merely preferance or is one > better than the other? I used to be a die-hard Twisted advocate, but I think they kind of suck now. Indeed, they are awesome when they are brand new....no breaking-in seems necessary. Then, like everyone has been telling me, they get too big to do any crazy tricks. Everyone and their dog recommends a facile juice. But if you want my humble opinion, they suck. Even the guys who make/sell them tell you to buy two because facile isn't very predictable or dependable, and you'll still need to break out the freesole all the time. No offense to flying clipper, but I think the best bag on earth is: THE STORK. They too are made from facile, which is an advantage, and they hardly every break, another advantage, but they are pricey (yep, disadvantage). I bought a facile juice at a tournament once, and the fabric broke within two hours, in several places. They were really nice about it, and gave me a new one against their policy. I have been *so* nice to this bag, and the damn filling leaks out the seams. No Stork has ever done that to me, or anyone I know. __________________________________________________________________________ Matt P. Hillebrand hill9361@uidaho.edu http://www.uidaho.edu/~hill9361 From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 20:22:32 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03193 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:22:04 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03189 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:22:03 GMT Received: from shahrayar@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3186) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03184 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:22:03 GMT Received: from imo19.mx.aol.com (imo19.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.176]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA09614 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:22:05 -0800 From: SHAHRAYAR Message-ID: <5bf78c65.34b5342e@aol.com> Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:16:45 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] [Freestyle]Facile Juice vs. Twisted Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Well I'll tell ya, When I first started kicking (for real) I was using a twisted and thought it was the hottest thing since sliced bread (of course that was an upgrade from a sipa). Then when I started kicking with Tuan, he would not let us kick with it and insisted on a facile juice; who was I to complain. After a while, I got used to the juice and prefer it to the lighter twisted bag. I'd say it's mostly personal preference but if you have ever kicked with a perfectly broken in facile juice it is the ultimate bag (cept for a perfectly broken in carol bag). Jim From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 20:40:42 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03395 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:40:36 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03391 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:40:36 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3388) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03386 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:40:35 GMT Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com (imo16.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.172]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA09880 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:40:38 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:38:38 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] juice vs. twisted Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I just got my Twisted bag yesterday, and I already have a juice facile. Right now the twisted is a beter bag for me. It is slightly heavier making it easier to stall. Mat From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 20:50:44 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03511 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:50:43 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03507 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:50:43 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3504) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03502 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:50:42 GMT Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com (imo12.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.166]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA10086 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:50:45 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: <29067bbe.34b53b13@aol.com> Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:46:10 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] move name... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I just came up with a move that looks like one I know...has it already been thought up? I think it would be a 2 or 3 ADD move: Right inside stall, bring foot around the back of Left leg holding the bag on inside into a clipper position. Kick up the bag and quickly bring right foot to the front of the left foot to stall the footbag on the toe. All this is while the left foot is planted. Matt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 20:56:31 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03611 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:56:30 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03607 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:56:29 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3604) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03602 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:56:29 GMT Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com (imo17.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.174]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA10195 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:56:32 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: <53234af5.34b53cc2@aol.com> Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:53:20 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] question Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I just wanted to get yalls opinion on the BEST footbag out! Thanks, Matt Avery From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 20:57:33 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03628 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:57:33 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03624 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:57:32 GMT Received: from adriand@callplus.co.nz () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3621) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03619 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:57:32 GMT Received: from inetsrv.callplus.co.nz (www.callplus.co.nz [202.27.101.18]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA10223 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 12:57:33 -0800 Received: by www.callplus.co.nz with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 09:53:46 +1300 Message-ID: <11FA7FAAAED1D01194C700203573F13C08B2E6@www.callplus.co.nz> From: Adrian Dick To: "'StinKyKiwi'" Cc: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: RE: [freestyle] move name... Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 09:53:45 +1300 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org That a Wrap (2 adds, delay and dexterity) to a toe delay (1 add, delay). On the bright side, you could call it a 3 add combo. Adrian -----Original Message----- From: StinKyKiwi [SMTP:StinKyKiwi@aol.com] Sent: Thursday, 8 January 1998 15:46 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] move name... I just came up with a move that looks like one I know...has it already been thought up? I think it would be a 2 or 3 ADD move: Right inside stall, bring foot around the back of Left leg holding the bag on inside into a clipper position. Kick up the bag and quickly bring right foot to the front of the left foot to stall the footbag on the toe. All this is while the left foot is planted. Matt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 22:25:23 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04398 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 22:25:04 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04394 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 22:25:03 GMT Received: from eric@netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4391) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA04389 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 22:25:02 GMT Received: from stick.netcomi.com (fit.netcomi.com [204.58.155.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA11718 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:25:05 -0800 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by stick.netcomi.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA00244; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:25:03 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: stick.netcomi.com: eric owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:25:03 -0600 (CST) From: Eric Burgess To: StinKyKiwi cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] question In-Reply-To: <53234af5.34b53cc2@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org my personal opinion is that carol wiedemeyer (i probably spelled that wrong) makes the best bags in the universe. she uses facile and makes them in the 32-panel juice pattern. my friends and i got carol bags a few months ago and haven't kicked with anything else since. eric On Thu, 8 Jan 1998, StinKyKiwi wrote: > I just wanted to get yalls opinion on the BEST footbag out! > > Thanks, > Matt Avery > From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 22:26:21 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04432 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 22:26:20 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04428 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 22:26:19 GMT Received: from scalf@utdallas.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4425) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA04423 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 22:26:19 GMT Received: from poteidaia.utdallas.edu (poteidaia.utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA11741 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:26:22 -0800 Received: from apache.utdallas.edu (scalf@apache.utdallas.edu [129.110.16.9]) by poteidaia.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA25778; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:26:21 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (scalf@localhost) by apache.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA23007; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:26:20 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: apache.utdallas.edu: scalf owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:26:20 -0600 (CST) From: Derric Scalf To: StinKyKiwi cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] move name... In-Reply-To: <29067bbe.34b53b13@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, 8 Jan 1998, StinKyKiwi wrote: > > Right inside stall, bring foot around the back of Left leg holding the bag on > inside into a clipper position. Kick up the bag and quickly bring right foot > to the front of the left foot to stall the footbag on the toe. All this is > while the left foot is planted. > > Matt > This would be two moves. The first one is catching an inside stall and bringing it around to a clipper stall. That is called a wrap and is 2 adds. The next move is just a clipper set toe stall. Since the set doesn't matter, it is just the same as any other toe stall. One add. If you can do the initial inside delay while you are bringing it around to a clipper all in one smooth fluid motion, it is a refraction. That is one of the easier three add moves. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 22:49:44 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04617 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 22:49:43 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04613 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 22:49:43 GMT Received: from grandincredible@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4610) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA04608 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 22:49:43 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F74.hotmail.com [207.82.250.180]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA12034 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 14:49:44 -0800 Received: (qmail 25605 invoked by uid 0); 8 Jan 1998 22:49:41 -0000 Message-ID: <19980108224941.25603.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 38.249.188.156 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 08 Jan 1998 14:49:41 PST X-Originating-IP: [38.249.188.156] From: "Daniel Kramer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] question Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 14:49:41 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >my personal opinion is that carol wiedemeyer (i probably spelled that >wrong) makes the best bags in the universe. she uses facile and >makes them in the 32-panel juice pattern. my friends and i got carol >bags a few months ago and haven't kicked with anything else since. > >eric Ditto. Carol's got her sh*t together. But don't overlook that Fungis of Mungis. He's got some nice stuff as well. Dan K ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 23:11:43 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04854 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 23:11:39 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04850 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 23:11:38 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4847) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04845 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 23:11:38 GMT Received: from neuman.interaccess.com (neuman.interaccess.com [207.70.126.130]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA12325 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:11:41 -0800 Received: from [207.208.136.105] (d105.focal.interaccess.com [207.208.136.105]) by neuman.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id RAA25336; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:06:03 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 17:06:03 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: SHAHRAYAR , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter) Subject: Re: [freestyle] [Freestyle]Facile Juice vs. Twisted Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Freestylers! So far you have mentioned the Twisted, the Facile Juice and the Stork. I have never had a Stork, so I can't say about that. I mostly practice with Hu-Mungis footbags, which are facile. But when I play in groups, or on cement, I use an Adidas 32-panel (of the China ilk) off the shelf tango style. I also used the Adidas Tango (china, Not Paki) at for all three rounds at '97 World Championships and placed 2nd in Pro Singles Freestyle. And I believe that Sam did the same (except she won), but I don't want to put words in her mouth. What I am saying is, that there is an affordable, off-the-shelf, footbag that is available nationally in retail outlets (and through the WFA). Choose your poison. Shred hard and prosper! See ya! Scott Davidson Enlightener@footbag.org From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 23:42:01 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA05124 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 23:41:52 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA05120 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 23:41:52 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5117) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA05115 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 23:41:51 GMT Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com (imo11.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.165]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA12644 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:41:55 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: <56a622af.34b562b6@aol.com> Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 18:35:17 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] question Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org at the top of every Email from yall it says from: then your address, then in parenthasis, it says your name. Now if you look up at my name, it says my real name is Stinky Kiwi, which it is not. How do I make it say my name? Thanks Matt Avery From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 8 23:51:10 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA05306 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 23:51:09 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA05302 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 23:51:08 GMT Received: from kilobit@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5299) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA05297 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 23:51:07 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F52.hotmail.com [207.82.250.63]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA12770 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 15:51:11 -0800 Received: (qmail 21944 invoked by uid 0); 8 Jan 1998 23:51:10 -0000 Message-ID: <19980108235110.21943.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 209.109.224.167 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 08 Jan 1998 15:51:10 PST X-Originating-IP: [209.109.224.167] From: "The 'Mazin Josh Penney" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Juice vs. Twisted Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 15:51:10 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >What I am saying is, that there is an affordable, >off-the-shelf, footbag that is available nationally in retail outlets (and >through the WFA). Choose your poison. I have to agree with (in no recognizable order) Matt, Jim, Dan, Ernest, Derrick, and Scott... This may be a first for me. I have personally worn out more twisteds than lavers, so I tend to stick to bags that last a bit longer.. but sometimes I do feel the need to get a bag I know will bust in an hour. Listen here. The fact is that you can get used to *any* footbag. You and your feet will adjust. Facile is a relatively recent innovation in the world of footbag; folks who shred harder than you (well, most of you) worked miracles like vortex, mobius, whirling swirl, blurry whirl, and diving infinities with a bag made of synthetic suede we would'n wipe our... noses... with today. Just something to keep in mind. Ernesto: I would like to personally point out to you that your maroon panels may have been from a bad batch. I have seen weak white, yellow, blue, orange. Don't jugde too harshly by one or two bags, not every footbag under the sun is from the same roll of facile. JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 00:15:38 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA05491 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 00:15:22 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA05487 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 00:15:22 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5484) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA05482 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 00:15:22 GMT Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.169]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA13186 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:15:25 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 19:01:19 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Juice vs. Twisted Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Once again, I just got my twisted yesterday and already it has gotten to be the size of the Hacky Sack Magic. Now, I would suggest that the Twisted footbag is very good for beginners. I personaly perfer the juice bag over any footbag I've used ( I haven't used the Stork). When awsome tricks like the Blur are done, you need a lightweight and smaller bag like the juice. Question: I've had my Facile Juice for about a month and its very well broken in. But if I practice on my deck, for 2 hours each day, how long will I have until it "bursts"? -Matt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 00:57:44 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA05830 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 00:57:37 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA05826 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 00:57:35 GMT Received: from scalf@utdallas.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5823) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA05821 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 00:57:35 GMT Received: from poteidaia.utdallas.edu (poteidaia.utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA13899 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 16:57:39 -0800 Received: from apache.utdallas.edu (scalf@apache.utdallas.edu [129.110.16.9]) by poteidaia.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA04777; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 18:56:52 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (scalf@localhost) by apache.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA00275; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 18:56:52 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: apache.utdallas.edu: scalf owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 18:56:52 -0600 (CST) From: Derric Scalf To: StinKyKiwi cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Juice vs. Twisted In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I couldn't resist any longer. I have to say something here. I have used many a bag. Personally, I really liked the Twisted when I was first starting out. It stayed broken in. Then, I went to a "dirty" Juice. It was a sand filled 32-panel I picked up in Portland. I still like that bag. The only problem with it is that you can see sand flying out of it each time you make contact. That is a bit distracting. But, if you fill it up once a week or so, it is nice. Lately, I've been using some of my friend's Carol bags. They rule. No problems yet. I can't forget to sing the praises of the Stork though. I had one of those as my very first freestyle bag. I didn't know how to use it then, but it served me very very well. And, I like the heavier beads the Hane Dane uses. If you go with an Allen Peterson bag (Stork, or for the well-to-do-footbagger, a Hammer), I don't think you'll be dissapointed. Now to answer the question I responded to: Facile really varies batch by batch. I have some blue facile right in front of me that is about as sturdy as a cotton ball. I have gotten to where I will try to tear the facile before I buy it. So, the moral of this story is... no one knows how long a bag will last. You just take a chance with it. If you take care of it and learn the delicate art of glueing, a bag can last many many years. My mentor, James Roberts, has had the same 32 panel juice for about 5 years. And, believe me, it has been kicked. On the other hand, I have a friend that got a facile Juice and one of the colors blew out on the first day. The key is to see the hole before it happens.. when it is just starting to show. Then, put a *thin* layer of glue on it. Woomp! The bag is fine. Now, if the deck is wood and you kick for two hours a day and a train leaves Chicago heading toward Dallas at a rate of 200 km/hour, the bag might last... hmmmmmm.... a year. On Thu, 8 Jan 1998, StinKyKiwi wrote: > Once again, > > I just got my twisted yesterday and already it has gotten to be the size of > the Hacky Sack Magic. Now, I would suggest that the Twisted footbag is very > good for beginners. I personaly perfer the juice bag over any footbag I've > used ( I haven't used the Stork). When awsome tricks like the Blur are done, > you need a lightweight and smaller bag like the juice. > > Question: I've had my Facile Juice for about a month and its very well broken > in. But if I practice on my deck, for 2 hours each day, how long will I have > until it "bursts"? > > -Matt > From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 02:17:43 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA06587 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 02:17:26 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA06583 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 02:17:25 GMT Received: from brc@ameritech.net () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6580) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA06578 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 02:17:21 GMT Received: from mailhost.chicago.il.ameritech.net (mpdr0.chicago.il.ameritech.net [206.141.192.243]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA14969 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 18:17:26 -0800 Received: from 206.141.214.130 (dyn-max14-130.chicago.il.ameritech.net [206.141.214.130]) by mailhost.chicago.il.ameritech.net (8.8.3/8.8.3-AIMS) with SMTP id UAA08577 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:17:18 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199801090217.UAA08577@mailhost.chicago.il.ameritech.net> X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail & News for Macintosh - 3.0c (405) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 20:15:25 -0500 Subject: [freestyle] 92 Panel Whirl From: Brian Carstensen To: Footbag Freestyle Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey there. I'm currently using a "Whirl 92", but am having some insane problems stalling it. It always stays perfectly round, not alowing it to "wrap around" the top of my foot. It's easier to stall with my 5 year old Magic (heheh). I was wondering if there was a special way I should break it in. Thanks, - Brian From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 02:35:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA06799 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 02:35:55 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA06795 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 02:35:54 GMT Received: from scalf@utdallas.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6792) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA06790 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 02:35:54 GMT Received: from poteidaia.utdallas.edu (poteidaia.utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA15407 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 18:35:59 -0800 Received: from apache.utdallas.edu (scalf@apache.utdallas.edu [129.110.16.9]) by poteidaia.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA09018 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:35:58 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (scalf@localhost) by apache.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA02246 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:35:58 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: apache.utdallas.edu: scalf owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:35:58 -0600 (CST) From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: Derric Scalf To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] refractions Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I just said something about a refraction which made me think. On the moves list, it says that refraction is an inside delay made while spinning into a cross-body position. The way I have always done it was to leave out the spin. I catch it on an inside delay, and then scoop it to a cross body position. I hop forward just a bit with the support leg, and there it is, a clipper. Is this a bastardized version of a refraction, or is it just a normal old refraction? Also, symposium infinity? Doing refraction the way that I have been, I have been trying to string them together. It feels kinda funny, but cool all at the same time. I watched '97 Shred (bitchin' tape!) the other day and saw Daryl Genz doing basically the same thing. Except that I thiink they are technically symposium infinities. Is the only difference the fact that on symp. infinity the bag is not contacted until it is cross body whereas on those "refractions" that I do, the bag is contacted as it is going under the dex leg? -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 02:50:33 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA06913 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 02:50:32 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA06909 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 02:50:31 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6906) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA06904 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 02:50:31 GMT Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA15987 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 18:50:36 -0800 Received: from [204.62.245.116] (brat-2 [204.62.245.116]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA21742; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 18:49:53 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 18:50:49 -0800 To: Derric Scalf From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] refractions Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 6:35 PM -0800 1/8/98, Derric Scalf wrote: >I just said something about a refraction which made me think. >..snip.. >.. I catch it on an inside delay, and then scoop it to a cross >body position. I hop forward just a bit with the support leg, and there >it is, a clipper. Is this a bastardized version of a refraction, or is it >just a normal old refraction? It sounds like you do a "butterfly". Can you clarify what the difference is in your execution of "butterfly" versus "refraction"? >Also, symposium infinity? Yes, the move exists. Is that your question? It's a different move from refraction. >Is the only difference the fact that on symp. >infinity the bag is not contacted until it is cross body whereas on those >"refractions" that I do, the bag is contacted as it is going under the dex >leg? Yes, that's most of the distinction. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 03:04:28 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA07145 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 03:04:23 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA07141 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 03:04:22 GMT Received: from scalf@utdallas.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7138) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA07136 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 03:04:21 GMT Received: from poteidaia.utdallas.edu (poteidaia.utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA16197; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 19:04:26 -0800 Received: from apache.utdallas.edu (scalf@apache.utdallas.edu [129.110.16.9]) by poteidaia.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA10076; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 21:04:25 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (scalf@localhost) by apache.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA03157; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 21:04:25 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: apache.utdallas.edu: scalf owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 21:04:25 -0600 (CST) From: Derric Scalf To: Steve Goldberg cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] refractions In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > At 6:35 PM -0800 1/8/98, Derric Scalf wrote: > >I just said something about a refraction which made me think. > >..snip.. > >.. I catch it on an inside delay, and then scoop it to a cross > >body position. I hop forward just a bit with the support leg, and there > >it is, a clipper. Is this a bastardized version of a refraction, or is it > >just a normal old refraction? > > It sounds like you do a "butterfly". Can you clarify what the difference > is in your execution of "butterfly" versus "refraction"? > when I do the refraction, the bag is most definately caught non-cross-body. My foot is almost directly beside the knee of my support leg. As I cushion the bag for the stall, I point my toes a bit and scoop the bag under my support leg. Usually, I hop forward a little on my support leg to keep from scooping the bag right into my knee. For butterfly, I jump over the bag with the dex leg landing in a xbody delay. See what I'm saying? My vote is that it *is* a refraction just without the spin. That's why I'm asking though.. so those more knowledgable can tell me what I'm doing. Later. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 04:05:31 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA07416 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 04:05:28 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA07412 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 04:05:27 GMT Received: from hill9361@uidaho.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7409) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA07407 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 04:05:27 GMT Received: from raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (raven.csrv.uidaho.edu [129.101.192.43]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA16914 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:05:33 -0800 Received: from localhost (hill9361@localhost) by raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id UAA10113 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:05:32 -0800 (PST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.csrv.uidaho.edu: hill9361 owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 8 Jan 1998 20:05:31 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hillebrand X-Sender: hill9361@raven.csrv.uidaho.edu To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Wheel of Fortune Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was watching this game show tonight, and some guy named Noel introduced himself as a "big hacky sack player." I bet he doesn't frequent this mailing list too much if he calls it hacky sack, eh? :) What really caught my attention is that he had another good luck charm in his coat pocket that he called a "popular Warner Bros. character" since it was a copyrighted name he couldn't say on the air....like how people can't say the name of the company they work for on the game show. Well, then, why is he allowed to say "Hacky Sack?" hrmmmmm. __________________________________________________________________________ Matt P. Hillebrand hill9361@uidaho.edu http://www.uidaho.edu/~hill9361 From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 05:58:11 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA07941 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 05:57:50 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA07937 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 05:57:48 GMT Received: from tuhuge@sfsu.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7934) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA07932 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 05:57:47 GMT Received: from diana.sfsu.edu (diana.sfsu.edu [130.212.10.239]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18018 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 21:57:53 -0800 Received: from tuhuge.sfsu.edu (madmax-47.sfsu.edu [130.212.201.47]) by diana.sfsu.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA26044; Thu, 8 Jan 1998 21:57:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980108095656.0068cc9c@sfsu.edu> X-Sender: tuhuge@sfsu.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 09:56:56 -0800 To: Eric Burgess From: 2 Subject: Re: [freestyle] question Cc: freestyle@footbag.org In-Reply-To: References: <53234af5.34b53cc2@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 04:25 PM 1/8/98 -0600, you wrote: > >my personal opinion is that carol wiedemeyer (i probably spelled that >wrong) makes the best bags in the universe. she uses facile and makes >them in the 32-panel juice pattern. my friends and i got carol bags a few >months ago and haven't kicked with anything else since. Ever since i first competed with a carol bag in 95' I have never used anything else in competition. As for a shred bag, it rocks!!!! 2 huge From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 14:19:18 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA10077 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 14:19:09 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA10073 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 14:19:07 GMT Received: from crvich@raleigh.ibm.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (10070) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA10068 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 14:19:07 GMT Received: from fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns1d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.235]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA23389 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 06:19:16 -0800 Received: from rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.47]) by fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7RTP-FW1.1) with ESMTP id JAA07184 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 09:19:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (ode1.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.178.164]) by rtpmail03.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id JAA30138 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 09:19:13 -0500 Received: from odent1.raleigh.ibm.com by ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03-RAL) id AA39446; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 09:19:12 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980109091651.0090bd40@ode1> X-Sender: crvich@ode1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 09:16:51 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] Juice vs. Twisted In-Reply-To: <19980108235110.21943.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 03:51 PM 1/8/98 PST, The 'Mazin Josh Penney wrote: >Ernesto: I would like to personally point out to you that your maroon >panels may have been from a bad batch. I have seen weak white, yellow, It wasn't only from my own experiences; other people have expressed the same thing to me, sometimes using their hands. I started to investigate this on my own, but the facile warehouses are guarded day and night by some kind of lobster-like creatures (resistant to both incendiary devices and stabbing/probing weapons). If the Man has added white, yellow, blue and orange to the list, then I guess I'll just have to stop footbagging and switch to dirty dancing. My signature rump stalls would serve me well... -- Ernest M. Crvich Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 15:20:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00418 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:20:39 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00414 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:20:38 GMT Received: from grandincredible@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (411) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00409 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:20:38 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F95.hotmail.com [207.82.250.201]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA24093 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 07:20:34 -0800 Received: (qmail 22152 invoked by uid 0); 9 Jan 1998 15:20:33 -0000 Message-ID: <19980109152033.22151.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 38.249.188.156 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 09 Jan 1998 07:20:33 PST X-Originating-IP: [38.249.188.156] From: "Daniel Kramer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] 92 Panel Whirl Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 07:20:33 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >Hey there. I'm currently using a "Whirl 92", but am having some >insane problems stalling it. It always stays perfectly round, not >alowing it to "wrap around" the top of my foot. It's easier to stall >with my 5 year old Magic (heheh). I was wondering if there was a >special way I should break it in. > >Thanks, > - Brian I hate to say it, but that Whirl 92 will probably never break in properly. If you want a freestyle bag, stick to 32 panels. Stalling a Whirl 92 is like trying to stall a tennis ball. Dan K ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 15:29:46 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00517 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:29:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00513 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:29:44 GMT Received: from eric@netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (510) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00508 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:29:44 GMT Received: from stick.netcomi.com (fit.netcomi.com [204.58.155.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA24191 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 07:29:44 -0800 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by stick.netcomi.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA02147; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 09:29:24 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: stick.netcomi.com: eric owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 09:29:24 -0600 (CST) From: Eric Burgess To: Brian Carstensen cc: Footbag Freestyle Subject: Re: [freestyle] 92 Panel Whirl In-Reply-To: <199801090217.UAA08577@mailhost.chicago.il.ameritech.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org while those zillion-pannel bags certainly look impressive, there's a rule of thumb that says the more panels you have, the longer it will take to break in. i'm not sure if the 92-panel bags *ever* get broken in nicely. the most panels i would recommend is 42 (legend), but i think that the juice (32) is even better, and cheaper too. eric On Thu, 8 Jan 1998, Brian Carstensen wrote: > Hey there. I'm currently using a "Whirl 92", but am having some > insane problems stalling it. It always stays perfectly round, not > alowing it to "wrap around" the top of my foot. It's easier to stall > with my 5 year old Magic (heheh). I was wondering if there was a > special way I should break it in. > > Thanks, > - Brian > From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 23:18:06 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04379 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:17:57 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04375 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:17:57 GMT Received: from f0ne@concentric.net () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4372) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04370 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:17:56 GMT Received: from darius.concentric.net (darius.concentric.net [207.155.184.79]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA31681 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:17:59 -0800 Received: from mcfeely.concentric.net (mcfeely.concentric.net [207.155.184.83]) by darius.concentric.net (8.8.8/(97/11/17 5.8)) id SAA00692; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 18:17:55 -0500 (EST) [1-800-745-2747 The Concentric Network] Received: from fone (cnc003058.concentric.net [206.83.89.58]) by mcfeely.concentric.net (8.8.8) id SAA22265; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 18:17:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <34B6B00D.3796@concentric.net> Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 17:17:33 -0600 From: "f0ne@concentric.net" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-GZone (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] new Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all, I was just wondering ... i just ordered a pair of lavers and a juice (suede) ... I hear everyone saying that facile is alot better... but really no one i play with is careful enough (in my eyes that is) to play with a facile.... alot of people at my school play strictly pass no freestyle whatsoever ...and they all play with sipa bags. Anyway do you think it was a good idea to go with the suede instead of facile. I am thinking it was, but you know figured i would get some input. see ya Steve Wallace From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 23:21:23 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04398 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:21:23 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04394 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:21:22 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4391) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04389 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:21:22 GMT Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com (imo18.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.175]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA31729 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:21:24 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: <9421c6ac.34b6af4c@aol.com> Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 18:14:19 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] B.A.P. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was just thinking about what it takes to become a member of the B.A.P. and I realized all I know(or think i know) is that you have to go guiltless, but then I thought about when are you saposed to go guiltless? If anyone doesn't mind could you explain what else is needed to become part of the B.A.P., other than a love for the sport and to go guiltless? Thanks, Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 9 23:54:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04751 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:54:50 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04747 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:54:49 GMT Received: from scalf@utdallas.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4744) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04742 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:54:48 GMT Received: from poteidaia.utdallas.edu (poteidaia.utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA32339 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 15:54:52 -0800 Received: from apache.utdallas.edu (scalf@apache.utdallas.edu [129.110.16.9]) by poteidaia.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA12981; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 17:54:51 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (scalf@localhost) by apache.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA12124; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 17:54:50 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: apache.utdallas.edu: scalf owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 17:54:50 -0600 (CST) From: Derric Scalf To: "f0ne@concentric.net" cc: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] new In-Reply-To: <34B6B00D.3796@concentric.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Fri, 9 Jan 1998, f0ne@concentric.net wrote: > Hey all, > > I was just wondering ... i just ordered a pair of lavers and a juice > (suede) ... I hear everyone saying that facile is alot better... but > really no one i play with is careful enough (in my eyes that is) to play > with a facile.... alot of people at my school play strictly pass no > freestyle whatsoever ...and they all play with sipa bags. > Anyway do you think it was a good idea to go with the suede instead of > facile. I am thinking it was, but you know figured i would get some > input. > see ya > Steve Wallace > It depends. If you want to freestyle, I don't think anything is better than facile. But, if you're going to be pplaying in a circle that will tear up facile, then go with the suede or a Sipa Sipa. You might think about getting a good facile bag to use when you are only kicking with peopple who freestyle and will take care of it. That's what I do. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 10 00:29:44 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA04887 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 00:29:36 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA04883 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 00:29:36 GMT Received: from kilobit@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4880) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA04877 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 00:29:25 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F36.hotmail.com [207.82.250.47]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA00076 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 16:29:29 -0800 Received: (qmail 26542 invoked by uid 0); 10 Jan 1998 00:29:28 -0000 Message-ID: <19980110002928.26540.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 209.109.224.208 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 09 Jan 1998 16:29:27 PST X-Originating-IP: [209.109.224.208] From: "The 'Mazin Josh Penney" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] B.A.P. and 92 Panel Whirls Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 16:29:27 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Apologies for the condensing of two subjects within a single message, but I'm sure we'va all been getting too much mail recently. >I was just thinking about what it takes to become a member of the B.A.P. and >then I thought about when are you saposed to go guiltless? >what else is needed to become part of the B.A.P., other >than a love for the sport and to go guiltless? Firstly, go guiltless when you are ready. No pressure. And, yes - you have to be really, really good. You have to "push the envelope". You must have the ability to make jaws drop from well beyond the depth of focus. I'd say that if you could comfortably hit ten moves in a row which are relatively difficult (blur, paradon, torque, blender, blizzard, atom-smasher, legbeater, flurry, double-over-swirl, blurriest, vortex, whirling swirl, symposium blur, pixie-butterfly, bedwetter, double whirl, paradox drifter, paradox whirl, paradox torque, voodoo)... gee, is that more than ten? I guess Iost track of the time... Anyway, if you can hit a whole bunch of those and keep going I and many others I know would travel several hundred miles to shred wit 'cha. Oh, and I might have to like you, too. As to the 92-panel, I can say honestly that the more panels you have, the more stitching is required. 92 panels mean fifty million stitches. You are kicking more string than anything else. Poor kitty, your aquisition will never be more than a consecutive or juggling bag. Yves told me that it was great for DDOP b|c it's so round and true, you can rarely shank (unless you're like me, and you suck). JP -oh, I TALK a good game ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 10 01:56:44 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA05321 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 01:56:31 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA05317 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 01:56:30 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5314) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA05312 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 01:56:29 GMT Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com (imo12.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.166]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA01468 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 17:56:33 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 20:54:39 EST To: f0ne@concentric.net, Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] new Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org i don't think there would be a problem the synthedic suede is just as good (in my opion) as long as you don't do toe pick ups, but it may take a little longer to brake, but besides that it should be fine, i myself don't notice a huge difference in the quality of play between the two syn. suede, annd facile. Keep kicking, Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 10 02:42:28 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA05661 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 02:42:27 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA05657 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 02:42:26 GMT Received: from brc@ameritech.net () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5654) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA05652 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 02:42:26 GMT Received: from mailhost.chicago.il.ameritech.net (mpdr0.chicago.il.ameritech.net [206.141.192.243]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA01990 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 18:42:29 -0800 Received: from 206.141.214.133 (dyn-max14-133.chicago.il.ameritech.net [206.141.214.133]) by mailhost.chicago.il.ameritech.net (8.8.3/8.8.3-AIMS) with SMTP id UAA16016 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 20:42:25 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199801100242.UAA16016@mailhost.chicago.il.ameritech.net> X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail & News for Macintosh - 3.0c (405) Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 20:40:30 -0500 Subject: Re: [freestyle] 92 Panel Whirl From: Brian Carstensen To: Footbag Freestyle Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Is the whirl-92 a good bag for the money? Is it worth it? I'd have to go with a "nope". It /won't/ break in, and is really stiff to begin with. I'm saving up some money for a Stork, which looks decently cool. One guy on here said it was the best. Anyone else use one? From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 10 04:52:08 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA06508 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 04:51:46 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA06504 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 04:51:45 GMT Received: from cactiken@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6501) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA06499 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 04:51:44 GMT Received: from imo15.mx.aol.com (imo15.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.170]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA03359 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 20:51:49 -0800 From: Cactiken Message-ID: <855d6f41.34b6fde5@aol.com> Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:49:40 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] best bags Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In my opinion the best bags are homemade bags! Learn how to sew and make a bag and then you have nobody but yourself to blame if the bag sucks! I recently learned and I could not see buying a bag now. kenny From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 10 07:41:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA07252 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 07:41:30 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA07248 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 07:41:29 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7245) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA07243 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 07:41:29 GMT Received: from imo15.mx.aol.com (imo15.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.170]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA04981 for ; Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:41:35 -0800 From: Gimmie Zo Message-ID: <5bfb60b8.34b72620@aol.com> Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 02:41:19 EST To: f0ne@concentric.net, Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] new Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 98-01-09 21:00:28 EST, f0ne@concentric.net writes: << I was just wondering ... i just ordered a pair of lavers and a juice (suede) ... I hear everyone saying that facile is alot better... but really no one i play with is careful enough (in my eyes that is) to play with a facile.... alot of people at my school play strictly pass no freestyle whatsoever ...and they all play with sipa bags. Anyway do you think it was a good idea to go with the suede instead of facile. I am thinking it was, but you know figured i would get some input. >> Actually, Last year I bought a suede juice (actually my sister gave it to me for XMAS) and even after a whole year of kicking with it, it still sucks. I recently ordered a Facile Juice and it is so much better i cant even tell you. If you think that its too delicate to play with at school then just let the others break out their sipas. But if you want to get anywhere with a footbag i think you'll probably have to buy a facile. I cant believe that they say "NO FREESTYLE!" Thats a sorry excuse for being frustrated with moves in my opinion. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 10 14:34:08 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA10175 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 14:33:55 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA10171 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 14:33:54 GMT Received: from j1876@tir.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (10168) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA10166 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 14:33:53 GMT Received: from sun.tir.com (sun.tir.com [205.138.41.6]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA08941 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 06:33:27 -0800 Received: from jaymolde (an37.tir.com [205.138.41.137]) by sun.tir.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA19696 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 09:33:25 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199801101433.JAA19696@sun.tir.com> Reply-To: From: "Jay" To: Subject: [freestyle] Type of footbag???? Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 09:36:14 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Facile footbags are the best thing you can play with if you want to take your game to places where most people can not even imagine (and gravity is your worst enemy, besides foot problems), let alone frustrating all those beginner kickers. Suede is an excellent alternative to those circles that use sipas :.( Vinyl is good for the net game. POINT! Most of the bags that are out there have merit in some capacity or another. Footbag rules! We know it and it is our job to turn people on to it. We don't want to force it down people's throats. If a group of kickers is using a sipa, then if they let us kick in, then slowly we break out a suede and explain why it might be better for them. You could also break out a dirt bag, and do a few delays. People (most) like to see what we have to offer. You always need to gauge the reaction of the circle to see if you are bumming anyone out and likewise if you are turning anyone on. If someone is bothered, you don't want to upset the balance of karma that exists. We are ambassadors for the sport and if carry ourselves that way, then we will win over more fans, kickers, and in general, RESPECT. Hope everyone had a nice holiday and is off to a great new year. Love all, Jayman (retired and lurking) From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 10 22:41:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA01937 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 22:41:24 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA01933 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 22:41:22 GMT Received: from jsbx@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1930) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA01928 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 22:41:21 GMT Received: from imo19.mx.aol.com (imo19.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.176]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA15171 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 14:41:24 -0800 From: JSBX Message-ID: Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 17:39:41 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] hydroxy Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi kickers! I recently aquired an alpha bag, which unlike the juices i have come to love has only 26 panels, composed of three different shapes and sizes. It is breaking out alright so far, but can anyone tell me from experience what sort of future i can expect from it? And another thing, why exactly is facile so much better than ultrasuede? soma From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 11 00:30:03 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA02528 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 00:30:01 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA02524 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 00:30:00 GMT Received: from zogg13@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2521) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA02519 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 00:30:00 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F44.hotmail.com [207.82.250.55]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA16495 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 16:30:04 -0800 Received: (qmail 18228 invoked by uid 0); 11 Jan 1998 00:30:02 -0000 Message-ID: <19980111003002.18227.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 206.245.145.29 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 16:30:02 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.245.145.29] From: "Stephen Miskiewicz" To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] One quick Q..... Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 16:30:02 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was playing footbag morning and i kicked a wild one to my face(i suck). Using my natuaral instincts i jumped and traped it inbetween the side of my face and my shoulder. I was wondering if this would be a legal move or if someone already thought of this? Steve Miskiewicz ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 11 02:47:19 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA00269 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 02:46:44 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA00265 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 02:46:42 GMT Received: from zogg13@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (262) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA00260 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 02:46:42 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F38.hotmail.com [207.82.250.49]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA18318 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 18:46:42 -0800 Received: (qmail 4245 invoked by uid 0); 11 Jan 1998 02:46:41 -0000 Message-ID: <19980111024641.4244.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 206.245.145.30 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 18:46:41 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.245.145.30] From: "Stephen Miskiewicz" To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Another Q on footbags Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 18:46:41 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I needs to find a bag the rules at stalling? any recommendations? I currently using a dirtbag(which i like)if any of you wanted to know. Steve Miskiewicz ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 11 04:30:05 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA00998 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 04:29:58 GMT Received: from fnord@teleport.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (756) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA00754 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 04:08:07 GMT Received: from mail1.teleport.com (mail1.teleport.com [192.108.254.26]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA19849 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 20:08:08 -0800 Received: from nick (ip-pdx05-15.teleport.com [206.163.123.144]) by mail1.teleport.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA14559 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 20:07:56 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34B84701.11CF02A8@teleport.com> Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 20:13:53 -0800 From: Nicholas Hall X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] new X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <5bfb60b8.34b72620@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On the choice of footbag debate- I've never seen what the big fuss about facile is... I think facile and synth-suede are pretty similar, and they both still suck if they're packed full of little plastic beads. I am a complete devotee of a synth-suede bag filled with super-fine sand (home-sewers- make the stitches really tight)- stalls like a dream and still kicks pretty true, although it tends to get caught on the upturned ridges along the sides of the toe of your lavers. Course, I've never seen a facile bag filled with fine sand, but I imagine it would be pretty similar. In any event, the synth-suede filled with fine sand (I have to emphasize fine- the finer the sand, the finer the delays and the truer the kicking) beats out dirt bags by a damn sight. If you like the dirtbag now, sew up a twelve-panel synth-suede and fill it with that industrial granulated white stuff they fill ashtrays with at the mall- you'll thank me for it. My two cents worth, Nick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 11 04:47:46 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA01114 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 04:47:44 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA01110 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 04:47:43 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1107) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA01105 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 04:47:43 GMT Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com (imo18.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.175]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA20297 for ; Sat, 10 Jan 1998 20:47:44 -0800 From: Gimmie Zo Message-ID: <371b0654.34b84ece@aol.com> Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 23:47:09 EST To: JSBX@aol.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] hydroxy Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 98-01-10 17:45:58 EST, JSBX@AOL.COM writes: << d another thing, why exactly is facile so much better than ultrasuede? >> The reason Facile is so much better is because when it gets broken in, it is WAY WAY softer than a suede bag. Suede bags arent as soft as faciles so they dont bend and "squish" as well. It is going to be hard to tell the difference if you are not past a certain ability level so just trust what all the pros are saying for now. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 11 05:18:24 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA01282 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 05:18:23 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA01278 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 05:18:23 GMT Received: from lsalmon3@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1275) Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com (imo12.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.166]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA01273 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 05:18:22 GMT From: L Salmon3 Message-ID: <926ed02d.34b85490@aol.com> Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 00:11:43 EST To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #296 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org FACILE RULES!! From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 12 02:37:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA07018 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 02:33:08 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA07014 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 02:33:07 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7011) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA07009 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 02:33:07 GMT Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.169]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA05885 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 18:33:11 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 21:33:02 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] STORK Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Tomorow I am placing an order for a footbag. I already have a nice facile juice and a Twisted I'm not very fond of because it's soo large now. I'm looking into getting a STORK. What do you think? Thanks for your help, Matt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 12 05:26:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA00131 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 05:24:03 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA00127 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 05:24:01 GMT Received: from eric@netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (124) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA00122 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 05:24:00 GMT Received: from stick.netcomi.com (fit.netcomi.com [204.58.155.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA09874 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 21:23:59 -0800 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by stick.netcomi.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA06932; Sun, 11 Jan 1998 23:23:45 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: stick.netcomi.com: eric owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 11 Jan 1998 23:23:45 -0600 (CST) From: Eric Burgess To: StinKyKiwi cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] STORK In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Sun, 11 Jan 1998, StinKyKiwi wrote: > Tomorow I am placing an order for a footbag. I already have a nice facile > juice and a Twisted I'm not very fond of because it's soo large now. I'm > looking into getting a STORK. What do you think? > > Thanks for your help, > > Matt my personal favorite bag is a broken-in carol bag...HOWEVER...i'd say that the second-best bag i ever kicked with was a stork that chris ryan had at the auburn fall fest in november. as has been said here before, the Hane Dane uses slightly heavier beads, and the quality of his stitching is second to none. i definitely recommend you go for the stork. eric From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 12 14:02:57 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA02976 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:02:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA02972 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:02:43 GMT Received: from crvich@raleigh.ibm.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2969) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA02967 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:02:42 GMT Received: from fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns1d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.235]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA18263 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 06:02:46 -0800 Received: from rtpmail02.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail02.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.48]) by fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7RTP-FW1.1) with ESMTP id JAA20984 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 09:02:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (ode1.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.178.164]) by rtpmail02.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id JAA08322 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 09:02:38 -0500 Received: from odent1.raleigh.ibm.com by ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03-RAL) id AA30184; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 09:02:37 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980112090023.009007b0@ode1> X-Sender: crvich@ode1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 09:00:23 -0500 To: Freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] new In-Reply-To: <34B84701.11CF02A8@teleport.com> References: <5bfb60b8.34b72620@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 08:13 PM 1/10/98 -0800, Nicholas Hall wrote: > I've never seen what the big fuss about facile is... I think facile >and synth-suede are pretty similar, and they both still suck if they're This has more to do with the level of freestyle at which you play, as has been said in other threads lately. Once you start getting into 3-add and better territory, you'll *definitely* see a difference. Plus, you may have not yet seen a facile bag after it's been broken in well...a condition which synthsuede never achieves. Synthsuede is great for kicking (I bring one when I shred in public in case any kickers join in), but only fair for freestyle. Of course, once you're as good as Scott, you can shred with a basketball. 8-) >synth-suede bag filled with super-fine sand (home-sewers- make the I've never thought about using sand from the sewer before, but perhaps I'll give it a try...do you need to wear protective clothing to collect this special sand? Are public sewers an acceptable alternative to home sewers? -- Ernest M. Crvich Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 12 14:43:01 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA03331 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:43:00 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA03325 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:42:59 GMT Received: from rvbpaco@wam.umd.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3322) Received: from po3.wam.umd.edu (po3.wam.umd.edu [128.8.10.165]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA03318; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:42:53 GMT Received: from rac5.wam.umd.edu (rvbpaco@rac5.wam.umd.edu [128.8.10.145]) by po3.wam.umd.edu (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA19645; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 09:42:32 -0500 (EST) From: Procrastinator the VIIIth Received: (from rvbpaco@localhost) by rac5.wam.umd.edu (8.8.8/8.8.7) id JAA07094; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 09:42:31 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 09:42:31 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199801121442.JAA07094@rac5.wam.umd.edu> To: freestyle-digest@majordomo.footbag.org, freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #297 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Heyhey. Just my two cents- ultra suede and facile are comparable materials. The primary difference occurs in the late break-in stage. Ultra suede will not become as floppy as facile without also stretching to a much larger size . Facile breaks in to a floppy stage with normal use much faster than ultra suede does, and stays relatively smaller, but if you treat it right ( and bad ) ultra suede can break in very nicely. Using floppy bags makes learning tricks easier, but why should this be considered a benefit? If you are training with floppy bags, the you aren't learning skills as well as you could. You'll hit tricks more consistently in quicker time, because a floppy bag has a greater fudge-factor- more room for poor timing because the floppiness can absorb the errors. But the better skills would be obtained through practicing consistently good timing by using a less kind bag. Ultra Suede bags are perfect for people trying to get good because they are good enough to learn moves with but not so good as to make learning the skills too easy. My experience with sand bags is the same. I demoed for the Juggling Capitol for a few months, and I deliberately demoed with DirtBags because I could keep the bag under control for longer periods of time. Using an easy bag is always a good idea for demos. But when I went back to train for the footbag season with my Adidas tango, it took me a long time to redevelop my timing. I recommend practicing with different bags. Learn all schools of footbag, young grasshopper, to learn to adapt to all circumstance. To Kick well no matter the circle dynamics. a dirt bag one day, a 92 whirl on another- base it on the skill you want to fine tune. sets? use a barely broken in style bag. or if you really want to tune the skill fine, use a 92, or a dream ultrasuede. want to enlarge your windows to improve dexterity consistency? use a Hacky Sack Magic, or Slo Sac. and practice. no matter what bag you use, if you practice, you get better. l8r- vince From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 12 14:44:15 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA03331 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:43:00 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA03325 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:42:59 GMT Received: from rvbpaco@wam.umd.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3322) Received: from po3.wam.umd.edu (po3.wam.umd.edu [128.8.10.165]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA03318; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:42:53 GMT Received: from rac5.wam.umd.edu (rvbpaco@rac5.wam.umd.edu [128.8.10.145]) by po3.wam.umd.edu (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA19645; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 09:42:32 -0500 (EST) From: Procrastinator the VIIIth Received: (from rvbpaco@localhost) by rac5.wam.umd.edu (8.8.8/8.8.7) id JAA07094; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 09:42:31 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 09:42:31 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199801121442.JAA07094@rac5.wam.umd.edu> To: freestyle-digest@majordomo.footbag.org, freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #297 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Heyhey. Just my two cents- ultra suede and facile are comparable materials. The primary difference occurs in the late break-in stage. Ultra suede will not become as floppy as facile without also stretching to a much larger size . Facile breaks in to a floppy stage with normal use much faster than ultra suede does, and stays relatively smaller, but if you treat it right ( and bad ) ultra suede can break in very nicely. Using floppy bags makes learning tricks easier, but why should this be considered a benefit? If you are training with floppy bags, the you aren't learning skills as well as you could. You'll hit tricks more consistently in quicker time, because a floppy bag has a greater fudge-factor- more room for poor timing because the floppiness can absorb the errors. But the better skills would be obtained through practicing consistently good timing by using a less kind bag. Ultra Suede bags are perfect for people trying to get good because they are good enough to learn moves with but not so good as to make learning the skills too easy. My experience with sand bags is the same. I demoed for the Juggling Capitol for a few months, and I deliberately demoed with DirtBags because I could keep the bag under control for longer periods of time. Using an easy bag is always a good idea for demos. But when I went back to train for the footbag season with my Adidas tango, it took me a long time to redevelop my timing. I recommend practicing with different bags. Learn all schools of footbag, young grasshopper, to learn to adapt to all circumstance. To Kick well no matter the circle dynamics. a dirt bag one day, a 92 whirl on another- base it on the skill you want to fine tune. sets? use a barely broken in style bag. or if you really want to tune the skill fine, use a 92, or a dream ultrasuede. want to enlarge your windows to improve dexterity consistency? use a Hacky Sack Magic, or Slo Sac. and practice. no matter what bag you use, if you practice, you get better. l8r- vince From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 12 18:44:06 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01800 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 18:43:35 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01796 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 18:43:33 GMT Received: from footbag13@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1793) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA01791 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 18:43:32 GMT Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com (imo16.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.172]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA22204 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 10:43:29 -0800 From: Footbag13 Message-ID: <77f559f5.34ba63b6@aol.com> Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 13:40:53 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] bad ideas Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey, all :) With all this talk of which footbag is best and wich one is worse, i think we may have gotten a little too caught up in things. We may have overlooked a basic question...are all of us using footbags? I pondered this one for a while and and came to the conclusion that although footbags are generally the best object to use for the sport of footbag, there are other things to kick... Here is a somewhat complete list of objects that i would NOT recomend to use in place of a footbag... CHUNKS OF CONCRETE: Although excellent for strength training, they tend to have an irregular surface and a great potential for injury. CLONED SHEEP: Remember, no matter how good your mobius looks with a cloned sheep, it will never look as good as it did with the original sheep. BOWLING BALLS: Good round shape and excellent for strength training but people tend to get upset when you pick up their Brunswick-24lb-custom-drilled-liquid- center-mirror-finished-ball and bounce it off the concrete a few times, attempting blurry whirls. PUPPIES AND KITTENS: Although these animals are super for delays ("nothin sticks to my foot like a nice puppy"), using them for footbag is considered abuse and therefore illegal. After a number of experiments i have also found that most small animals tend to become stiff and unusable after a few weeks of use. Note: if you don't believe me and just HAVE to try for yourself, please at least avoid using puppies and kittens for net. DERRICK FOGLE: Although Derrick has that "light feathery feel" to him, he is NOT suitable as a footbag. I have found that most grown males (excepting New Yorkers) tend to develop holes in them after only a few hours of kicking...the kind of holes that glue just can't fix. OFFICE FURNITURE: Great for points in the originality catagory but large objects such as desks and chairs make double dex moves a little tricky. SMALL CHILDREN: As of yet, I have conducted no experiments in this area but my best guess would be that small children (infants thru toddlers) would be a messy and expensive alternative to traditional footbags. I set up a babysitting gig with my neighbors tho so I will have more info on the subject later this month. That's all for now...let me know if any of you have had ny other bad experiences with substitute footbbags. Jason Phillips "see ya laver, hacksterbater" "after while, freestyle" From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 12 19:28:22 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02185 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 19:28:21 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02181 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 19:28:20 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2178) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02176 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 19:28:20 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA23136 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 11:28:21 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.03.0014/4c.adoc) with ESMTP id ya138214 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 13:37:48 -0600 Subject: Re: [freestyle] bad ideas Message-Id: <000000515672967478442@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 13:34:02 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, Jan 12, 1998, 12:40:53 PM US CST Footbag13 wrote: >DERRICK FOGLE: Although Derrick has that "light feathery feel" to him, he is Wow! I am so honored to have made your list! Especially since it was in the "Not suggested" category. 8{) Besides the holes, the squawking would get annoying, and flying feathers would obscure your vision! -- Derrick " 'not a footbag' Chicken-Man" Fogle From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 12 20:27:10 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02671 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 20:26:53 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02667 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 20:26:53 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2664) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA02662 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 20:26:52 GMT Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com (imo17.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.174]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA24372 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 12:26:54 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: <12b3b89e.34ba7b9f@aol.com> Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 15:22:53 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Carol Bags Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I've herd that carol bags are the best, and I've herd they are the exact same as facile juices. What are the differences/things that are beter about a carol bag? got footbag? Matt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 12 21:21:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03080 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 21:21:35 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03076 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 21:21:34 GMT Received: from jsbx@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3073) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03071 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 21:21:33 GMT Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com (imo17.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.174]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA25516 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 13:21:35 -0800 From: JSBX Message-ID: <46dbd0f0.34ba881a@aol.com> Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 16:16:08 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] re: bad ideas Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all. A few words. First, grown males develop holes that glue can't fix, but freesole can work wonders. On a more serious note, I have kicked with many different objects, and wish to give some advice. 1: if you ever crush a soda can in order to kick with it, tryins stiking pebbles in the can to give it weight, then twist the opneing notch hon the can so no rocks escape. 2: You can kick with any coin, but i have yet to delay with them. 3. Thick rubber bands are kickable, i have done 3 add moves with them. 4: If you do decide to kick with a tennis ball, watch out for your face. That's all for now. Happy shredding. K From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 12 22:15:00 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03363 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 22:14:59 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03359 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 22:14:59 GMT Received: from grandincredible@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3356) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03354 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 22:14:58 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F9.hotmail.com [207.82.250.20]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA26545 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:15:00 -0800 Received: (qmail 22075 invoked by uid 0); 12 Jan 1998 22:14:59 -0000 Message-ID: <19980112221459.22074.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 38.249.188.156 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:14:59 PST X-Originating-IP: [38.249.188.156] From: "Daniel Kramer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Carol Bags Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 14:14:59 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >I've herd that carol bags are the best, and I've herd they are the >exact same as facile juices. What are the differences/things that are >beter about a carol >bag? > >got footbag? > >Matt Not exactly the same. The panels on Carol's bag are a bit more rounded at the seams while the juices are flatter. (obviously due to different stitching techniques.) As far as kickability, I think Carolbags break in a little dankier, although I've seen some great juices. The Huge Fungis of Munger makes some diggity dank bags as well. Bottom line, you'll be happy with any of these bags. Whether it's a Carolbag, Juice, or a bag made by that Mungis Funger of Fungis Munger. DK P.S. Just kidding Paul :-) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 13 17:20:01 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01324 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 17:19:02 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01320 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 17:19:00 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1317) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01315 for ; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 17:19:00 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA10521 for ; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 09:19:00 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BD201C.DEED2AE0@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 12:15:00 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] Sack discussion Date: Tue, 13 Jan 1998 12:14:59 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Footbag Connoisseurs, In September I bought both a Flying Clipper "7-stitch" Facile Juice and a Carol W. facile bag at roughly the same time. Actually, I had been playing with my Juice for about a week (3 or 4 sessions) before purchasing the Carol bag. Within 20 minutes of gentle hand-kneading my Carol bag skyrocketed past my Juice in terms of softness, stallability, supple -ness, and feel. Many shredders have felt my Juice and questioned, "Synthetic suede?" because of how thick it feels. To add weight to the comparison, My Carol was the last of 8 bags that she had in the beginning of the day. (7 people chose other Carol bags while sidestepping mine) and mine is the easily the best bag I have ever owned! I have only witnessed 2 AWESOME juices in my day (JP's and my friend Raj's) while I have played with more that a dozen SUPER-SCRUMPTIOLICIOUS, DELECTABLE Carol bags. I feel justified and as objective as possible in saying that Carol makes the dankest footbag freestyle plaything available. Watch her footbag style - the essence of that style somehow miraculously transpires into the feel of her footbags. I have seen many boisterous/fugly/loud/clashing footbaggers suddenly smooth out and morph into a gentle/pleasant/meandering/poetic flow of freestyle creation upon being tossed one of her bags. Just my take on the discussion y'all - Ethan Ps - "Turbo" hit double over down --> paradox double leg over on Sunday! ALSO - atom smasher --> Legbeater!!! From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 13 21:41:47 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA04429 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 21:41:16 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA04425 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 21:41:15 GMT Received: from aloe@intouch.bc.ca () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4422) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA04420 for ; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 21:41:15 GMT Received: from srv1.reelwest.bc.ca (srv1.reelwest.bc.ca [207.194.197.99]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA16032 for ; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 13:41:17 -0800 Received: from 207.194.197.215 (unverified [207.194.197.215]) by srv1.reelwest.bc.ca (EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id ; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 13:40:27 -0800 Message-ID: <34BB6E94.6FD2@intouch.bc.ca> Date: Tue, 13 Jan 1998 13:39:34 +0000 From: "J. Pendray" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #298 References: <199801122350.XAA04543@eniac.yak.net.taz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ernest M. Crvich asked: > Are public sewers an acceptable alternative to home sewers? Only if all present are consenting adults! JSBX said: > 2: You can kick with any coin, but i have yet to delay with them. > 3. Thick rubber bands are kickable, i have done 3 add moves with them.e > 4: If you do decide to kick with a tennis ball, watch out for your face. Number Five: Eggs! raw or hardboiled...but EggsEggsEggs! thus spake JP #243 From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 14 04:22:01 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA07542 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 04:21:42 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA07538 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 04:21:40 GMT Received: from fishboy@sttl.uswest.net () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7535) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA07533 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 04:21:40 GMT Received: from sttl1.sttl.uswest.net (sttl1.sttl.uswest.net [206.81.192.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA21783 for ; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 20:21:44 -0800 Received: from sttl.uswest.net (dial136.sttl.uswest.net [207.109.86.136]) by sttl1.sttl.uswest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA24147 for ; Tue, 13 Jan 1998 20:21:30 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34BC3D93.7595C8EC@sttl.uswest.net> Date: Tue, 13 Jan 1998 20:22:43 -0800 From: Rick Weber X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle footbag Subject: [freestyle] re: Carol bags Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org With all this talk about Carol's footbags, I'm wondering how I would go about getting one. Is there a mail order for this? Also, how much do they cost? -Rick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 14 20:31:28 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02732 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 20:30:04 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02728 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 20:30:02 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2725) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA02723 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 20:30:02 GMT Received: from imo15.mx.aol.com (imo15.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.170]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA02374 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 12:19:26 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: <7c4148a3.34bd1d94@aol.com> Date: Wed, 14 Jan 1998 15:18:25 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Question... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I've always wondered if footbag can only be a hobby or if you get really good, can you take it to a pro level and make money doing it? Matt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 14 21:20:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03071 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 21:20:55 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03067 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 21:20:54 GMT Received: from scalf@utdallas.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3064) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03062 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 21:20:53 GMT Received: from poteidaia.utdallas.edu (poteidaia.utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA03453 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 13:10:00 -0800 Received: from apache.utdallas.edu (scalf@apache.utdallas.edu [129.110.16.9]) by poteidaia.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA29784; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 15:09:48 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (scalf@localhost) by apache.utdallas.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA01605; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 15:09:42 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: apache.utdallas.edu: scalf owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 14 Jan 1998 15:09:42 -0600 (CST) From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: Derric Scalf To: StinKyKiwi cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Question... In-Reply-To: <7c4148a3.34bd1d94@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org OH yeah. There is money in it. Not enough to live off of, but still some. This past worlds championship had over $15,00 prize money. I'm helping to host the Southern Regional Footbag Championships this April (http://www.dallasfootbag.org/southern.html) and so far we have over $1500 prize money. I guess if you ate a lot of ramen and carpooled to different tournaments, you *could* live that way. I wouldn't reccomend trying it until we get more sponsors and money coming in though. later -D On Wed, 14 Jan 1998, StinKyKiwi wrote: > I've always wondered if footbag can only be a hobby or if you get really good, > can you take it to a pro level and make money doing it? > > Matt > From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 14 21:38:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03143 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 21:38:38 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03139 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 21:38:37 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3136) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03133 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 21:38:36 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA03875 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 13:27:57 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BD2108.D4D0CA70@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 16:24:05 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] Money and footbag Date: Wed, 14 Jan 1998 16:24:03 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org We made lunch money in Barcelona footbagging on Las Ramblas last summer. AND enticed a cutie Spanish damsel to buy us sodas! It's not the money, It's the GLORY!!!! -Ethan From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 14 23:48:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04151 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 23:48:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04147 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 23:48:38 GMT Received: from zogg13@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4144) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04142 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 23:48:30 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F24.hotmail.com [207.82.250.35]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA06680 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 15:37:55 -0800 Received: (qmail 28234 invoked by uid 0); 14 Jan 1998 23:37:53 -0000 Message-ID: <19980114233753.28233.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 205.147.239.9 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 15:37:52 PST X-Originating-IP: [205.147.239.9] From: "Stephen Miskiewicz" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Money and footbag Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 14 Jan 1998 15:37:52 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > >We made lunch money in Barcelona footbagging on Las Ramblas last >summer. AND enticed a cutie Spanish damsel to buy us sodas! > It's not the money, It's the GLORY!!!! >-Ethan > > I agree with Ethan. I love it when you pull your footbag out in a public place and wow people who never though you could such a thing. I just smile and say "wait until I get good." -Steve- ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 15 08:07:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id IAA06727 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 15 Jan 1998 08:07:33 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id IAA06723 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 15 Jan 1998 08:07:31 GMT Received: from kilobit@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6720) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA06718 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 1998 08:07:31 GMT Received: from hotmail.com ([207.82.251.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA15255 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 23:56:57 -0800 Received: (qmail 21681 invoked by uid 0); 15 Jan 1998 07:56:57 -0000 Message-ID: <19980115075657.21680.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 209.109.224.124 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 14 Jan 1998 23:56:56 PST X-Originating-IP: [209.109.224.124] From: "The 'Mazin Josh Penney" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re:Carol's foo_bags Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 14 Jan 1998 23:56:56 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >With all this talk about Carol's footbags, I'm wondering how I would go >about getting one. Is there a mail order for this? Also, how much do >they cost? HA HA HA! Here's the tricky part.... find out through a series of sneaky and underhanded maneuvers which tournament she will be next attending, and see if you can get in on her particular Carpool - then you get first pick. Always works for me. As far as I know, Carol is not a company, nor does she intend on mass-producing or marketing her ped-agree foo_bags... they simply go fast enough as is. Find her. And it will only cost you - your immortal soul. Mwah ha ha haaa!!! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 05:04:49 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA06325 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 05:04:29 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA06321 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 05:04:29 GMT Received: from markdenton@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6318) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA06316 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 05:04:28 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F97.hotmail.com [207.82.250.216]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA08031 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 1998 21:04:34 -0800 Received: (qmail 17823 invoked by uid 0); 15 Jan 1998 23:37:52 -0000 Message-ID: <19980115233752.17822.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 209.47.115.136 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 15 Jan 1998 15:37:52 PST X-Originating-IP: [209.47.115.136] From: "Mark Denton" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle]sore shins anyone? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 15 Jan 1998 15:37:52 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all, I have a problem. I started playing freestyle about 4 months ago and about a week ago I learned how to Blur(which of course made me quite happy). But then a couple days ago I found that my shins hurt too much to footbag(freestyle anyway). Can anyone provide any insight on this? Does it happen to everyone? Mark Denton P.S.Torques kind of hurt too! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 05:24:39 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA06406 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 05:24:38 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA06402 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 05:24:37 GMT Received: from markdenton@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6399) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA06397 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 05:24:37 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F103.hotmail.com [207.82.250.222]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA08606 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 1998 21:24:43 -0800 Received: (qmail 22406 invoked by uid 0); 16 Jan 1998 01:24:40 -0000 Message-ID: <19980116012440.22405.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 209.47.115.78 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 15 Jan 1998 17:24:22 PST X-Originating-IP: [209.47.115.78] From: "Mark Denton" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle]setting question? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 15 Jan 1998 17:24:22 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey, I have been watching a few video's as of late and I was wondering if anyone could give me some input on how pro's can "blur" type set so high. It is very apparent that this would make many moves easier(I am struggling with "Ripwalks").So if anyone can tell me anything I would be much obliged Thank you, Mark Denton ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 14:08:13 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08301 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:08:00 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08297 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:07:59 GMT Received: from crvich@raleigh.ibm.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (8294) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA08292 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:07:58 GMT Received: from fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns1d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.235]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA08534 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 06:08:03 -0800 Received: from rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.24]) by fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7RTP-FW1.1) with ESMTP id JAA22576 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 09:07:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (ode1.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.178.164]) by rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id JAA03418 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 09:08:02 -0500 Received: from odent1.raleigh.ibm.com by ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03-RAL) id AA33262; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 09:08:00 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980116090559.009073e0@ode1> X-Sender: crvich@ode1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 09:05:59 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle]sore shins anyone? In-Reply-To: <19980115233752.17822.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 03:37 PM 1/15/98 PST, Mark Denton wrote: >happy). But then a couple days ago I found that my shins hurt too much >to footbag(freestyle anyway). Can anyone provide any insight on this? I felt obliged to respond for two reasons: (1) After I'd been styling for just over a year, I started developing shin problems, and (2) your name is one letter away from the protagonist in Trainspotting. There's a lot of factors: the playing surface, your style, your shoes, the amount of time you practice, and the moves you do. My favorite playing surface is low-pile carpet (perfect amount of traction and cushion, IMHO). A rubber mat with similar qualities is often used at competitions. The worst is concrete or brick, which may be too slippery (if it is the smooth kind), and definitely doesn't absorb enough shock. This is one of my main problems, since the place I like to shred in public is a brick sidewalk. I heal up in the winter, since I move indoors to a carpeted spot (no audience, but that gives me a chance to work more on the basic stuff). Many stylers recommend putting some good cushioning in your Lavers, since the stock insole isn't that great. I've had only marginal success, so someone else here can discuss brands. 8-) I've also reduced my styling frequency (at most every *other* day, never two days in a row, and only for 1-2 hours with lots of short breaks). I'd also been very eager to reach the 4/5-add moves as quick as possible, before my 2/3-add moves were smoothed out. So my movements aren't as efficient and accurate as they should be. I also acquired a bad habit last year with my left support leg, in which my heel touches the ground on each hop, and the outside surface of my right clipper ends up scuffing the ground (I have a gaping hole in my shoe to prove it). I'm *still* trying to stop doing this. So make sure you really get those basics down solid on both sides before you put much time into the big adds. I wish I had. 8-( -- Ernest M. Crvich Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 14:10:17 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08387 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:10:16 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08383 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:10:15 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (8380) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA08378 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:10:15 GMT Received: from neuman.interaccess.com (neuman.interaccess.com [207.70.126.130]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA08561 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 06:10:24 -0800 Received: from [207.208.136.38] (d38.focal.interaccess.com [207.208.136.38]) by neuman.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id IAA24159; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 08:04:43 -0600 (CST) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 08:04:43 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: "Mark Denton" , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter) Subject: Re: [freestyle]setting question? Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Mark! >"blur" type set so >high? It is very apparent that this would make many moves easier(I am >struggling with "Ripwalks"). You are correct. The higher the set, the more time you have to do things before the bag must be caught again. For Ripwalks (and blurs and the like) the only way to get them higher, is to continue your struggle... practice, practice, practice. Focus on getting at least 5 (or whatever number) good high ones, then move on. Your shins could be in pain because of too much stomping due to ripwalk and blur practice (this happens). Try working on other stuff like spins and unusual surfaces. Although some people make it look like it is an overnight process, it isn't. Practice with a focus on what you want to modify in your game, expand your base knowledge of moves, practice some more. Repeat. (Learning a good "stepping same-side butterfly" might help too, stepping anything for that matter) See ya! Scott Davidson Enlightener From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 14:15:36 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08442 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:15:35 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08438 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:15:35 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (8435) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA08433 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:15:34 GMT Received: from neuman.interaccess.com (neuman.interaccess.com [207.70.126.130]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA08615 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 06:15:43 -0800 Received: from [207.208.136.38] (d38.focal.interaccess.com [207.208.136.38]) by neuman.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id IAA24861; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 08:10:04 -0600 (CST) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 08:10:04 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: "Mark Denton" , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter) Subject: Re: [freestyle]sore shins anyone? Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Mark and freestylers! >I have a problem. ...my shins hurt too much >to footbag(freestyle anyway). Can anyone provide any insight on this? >Does it happen to everyone? I found salvation in, and I swear by this product: Spenco Insoles The cheap-o green kind without arch support. $5.95 a pair and they weigh less than 3 grams each. If you don't have them, you should consider it. And don't settle for just any insole, I have tried many and these are by far the best. They are of a fabric like a wetsuit with a green material on one side and nitrogen injected neoprene on the other. I know they have them at Sportmart in Chicago, but I am sure they are at Sports Authority and all the major big guys. See ya! Scott Davidson Enlightener From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 14:23:09 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08475 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:23:08 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08471 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:23:07 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (8468) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA08466 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:23:07 GMT Received: from imo19.mx.aol.com (imo19.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.176]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA08716 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 06:23:16 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 09:22:36 EST To: crvich@raleigh.ibm.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle]sore shins anyone? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 03:37 PM 1/15/98 PST, Mark Denton wrote: >happy). But then a couple days ago I found that my shins hurt too much >to footbag(freestyle anyway). Can anyone provide any insight on this? when i started to do blurs, i also had the same problem, but from my experience it is from using a single muscle to much, and that puts some preasure on my shin, i also went to a doctor for this when this started and they told me not to use that leg to much and to build up to using it a lot. so my advice is to just do a few blurs a day and then move on, then then start doing a couple more, then a couple more as time goes on. Good luck, and i hope what i wrote made sense Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 14:35:23 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08557 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:35:22 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08553 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:35:21 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (8550) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA08548 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:35:21 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA08851 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 06:35:21 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BD2261.8778B990@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 09:31:31 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] scruffing the outside of foot Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 09:31:30 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ernest and freestylers, I'm not sure if anyone out there other than Ernest is dealing with the developed bad habit of scuffing the outside of one of your clipper delays on the ground but I HAVE BEEN DEALING WITH IT!!! Two summers ago I first started doing blurs set from my right foot clipper. I began to really try to POP my set up in the air and as a result started pounding the outside of my foot into the ground in an (unconscious) attempt to produce more velocity on my set. After that I couldn't STOP clicking the outside of my clipper foot on the ground whenever I did a move that required a clipper set and then a quick plant by that same foot (blur, double leg over, whirl, drifter, ripwalk, etc). The hole on the outside of my Lavers was immense. I would also get BLOODY feet and little pebbles embedded in my skin on the outside of my foot!! For the last 2 or three months ALL I have been mentally focussing on with my right-foot clipper is NOT touching the ground. As a result my sets are higher and more consistent, my rhythm is smoother and cleaner and my foot doesn't' leave a trail of blood at the end of the session AND I'm not putting holes in all my socks any more. Ernest and others, I recommend simply concentrating, although I know it's deeply ingrained in muscle memory, on NOT touching the ground with the outside of your foot. A simple solution to a shitty problem. Sorry about the extendo message, I was just soo excitedly empathetic when I read Ernest's post that I wanted to post to the list. I'm still struggling with elevation on my blurry set but managed to tweak out ripwalk --> blur the other day! A long-awaited barrier finally breached! -Ethan From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 15:25:38 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00335 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 15:22:56 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00331 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 15:22:51 GMT Received: from eric@netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (328) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00326 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 15:22:50 GMT Received: from stick.netcomi.com (fit.netcomi.com [204.58.155.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA09509 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 07:22:46 -0800 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by stick.netcomi.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA10049; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 09:22:27 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: stick.netcomi.com: eric owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 09:22:25 -0600 (CST) From: Eric Burgess To: Mark Denton cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle]sore shins anyone? In-Reply-To: <19980115233752.17822.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org it seems like every time i learn a new kind of move, some part of my body rebels, whether it's shins, hips, back, knee, hamstring, whatever...i've learned that every time this happens (for me at least) it's just a muscle that isn't used to doing the job that i'm putting on it...it'll catch up in time, usually pretty quickly. if something hurts *during* a session, i back off of it, but if it hurts a little (or maybe even a lot) *afterward*, i've come to see that as a Good Thing. oh yeah, and i agree with scott's praise for the spenco insole. i got a pair on steve's advice at worlds and they have served me well. oh and about high blur sets...i'm not sure if my experience is typical, but here's my 2 cents. i tried for a long time to get a good blur set, with almost no success...i watched in dismay as my friends set it up by their chest while i struggled with 4-inch sets or smacked the bag into my support leg. i was just trying to do the set, thinking that once i got that up high, i could start doing moves with it. well that didn't work at all...so later on i just started trying the whole move (blur in this case) and the difference was amazing. i hit 5 or 6 blurs that day. now like i said, Your Mileage May Vary, but for me, learning the move piece by piece just teaches me how to do the pieces by themselves, but when i keep my attention on the move as a whole and where i'm going with it, i do far, far better. hope this helps eric On Thu, 15 Jan 1998, Mark Denton wrote: > Hi all, > I have a problem. I started playing freestyle about 4 months ago and > about a week ago I learned how to Blur(which of course made me quite > happy). But then a couple days ago I found that my shins hurt too much > to footbag(freestyle anyway). Can anyone provide any insight on this? > Does it happen to everyone? > > Mark Denton > > P.S.Torques kind of hurt too! > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 16:21:43 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00855 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 16:21:42 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00851 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 16:21:41 GMT Received: from crvich@raleigh.ibm.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (848) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00846 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 16:21:40 GMT Received: from fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (fwns1d.raleigh.ibm.com [204.146.167.235]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA10887 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 08:21:41 -0800 Received: from rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com (rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.172.24]) by fwns1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7RTP-FW1.1) with ESMTP id LAA25262 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 11:21:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (ode1.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.178.164]) by rtpmail01.raleigh.ibm.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/RTP-ral-1.1) with SMTP id LAA12128 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 11:21:39 -0500 Received: from odent1.raleigh.ibm.com by ode1.raleigh.ibm.com (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03-RAL) id AA34864; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 11:21:37 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980116111935.00907cd0@ode1> X-Sender: crvich@ode1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 11:19:35 -0500 To: From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] scruffing the outside of foot In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 09:31 AM 1/16/98 -0500, Ethan Klein wrote: >the developed bad habit of scuffing the outside of one of your clipper >delays on the ground but I HAVE BEEN DEALING WITH IT!!! Two summers Nice to know I'm not the only one that has encountered this evil. >would also get BLOODY feet and little pebbles embedded in my skin on Holy moly. I never went that far. You're hardcore, man! ;-) >the outside of my foot!! For the last 2 or three months ALL I have >been mentally focussing on with my right-foot clipper is NOT touching >the ground. I've actually been having to work with three similar problems at the same time for my right clippers: the scuffing, letting my heel down for support, and "falling away" from the set. I have a tendency (only on that side) to lean slightly away from the clipper set, so that blur/stepping sets (and the like) are pretty much impossible. On my other side, I can do blurs, blizzards, ripwalks, and paradox drifters with reasonable percentage. It's very irritating to say the least. I only recognized (and accepted) these mistakes a month or two ago, and I haven't been as strict with working on it as I should be. I guess this is what I get for not going to more jams and letting other people point out my weaknesses. Steve is smiling and nodding, I just know it. 8-) Strangely enough, this is the opposite of my problem when I first started freestyling. My right clippers were far stronger (though I wasn't doing blurs then, so I don't know if they were "correct"). I guess I ended up trying to work my left clipper sets so hard that I neglected my right. So sad. >Sorry about the extendo message, I was just soo excitedly empathetic >when I read Ernest's post that I wanted to post to the list. I appreciate it! 8-) >tweak out ripwalk --> blur the other day! A long-awaited barrier Coolness! The only nice combo breakthrough I've made recently was whirling swirl to double leg over...by "accident" (a good thing, methinks), twice in one session. -- Ernest M. Crvich Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 19:27:02 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02448 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 19:26:48 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02444 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 19:26:46 GMT Received: from damocles_schwert@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2441) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02439 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 19:26:46 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F25.hotmail.com [207.82.250.36]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA15667 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 11:26:40 -0800 Received: (qmail 6289 invoked by uid 0); 16 Jan 1998 19:26:37 -0000 Message-ID: <19980116192637.6288.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 149.175.3.55 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 11:26:36 PST X-Originating-IP: [149.175.3.55] From: "Andrew Feuerdrache" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle]setting question? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 11:26:36 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org This is the first message I've sent so hopefully I sent it to the right place. to, Mark Denton "But then a couple days ago I found that my shins hurt too much to footbag(freestyle anyway). Can anyone provide any insight on this? " "Does it happen to everyone?" It sounds like you have shin splints and they shouldn't be ignored. If you have them for too long you can cause calcium deposits to form and if your really ambitious its even possible to cause stress fractures. Cure, give up sports or don't land so hard. What I would suggest is to work on your hop. Every time you stall the bag hop down with it, land on your toes, cushion your fall. Almost everyone can tell you stepping lighter will help your game, which leads me to, "I was wondering if anyone could give me some input on how pro's can "blur" type set so high." There are many ways to set for a blur but this is how I do it. When you set the clipper make sure it is almost directly below you this means turning your planting leg across your body some. Be sure you have a good low release off of the clipper then as soon as your set leg starts to move back hop of your plant leg and turn it straight in front of you moving it over the bag. Then all you have to do is a miraje. You have to move both of your legs at the same time which means for a little while both of your legs are off the ground, this makes it a little tricky. If you watch tapes of the pro's that is usually what you will find. I would also recommend that you start out with a low set half way between your knees and waist this teaches you to do blurs without the starts and stops. A for god's sake don't slur the bag (pulling around with your set foot) you'll get no respect. -Andrew as a final thought has anyone out there seen a spinning ducking butterfly or a paradox double around osis (kind of like a barfly but caught in an osis by the dexterity foot) or can I claim to be the first? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 20:11:43 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02757 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 20:11:37 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02753 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 20:11:36 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2750) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA02748 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 20:11:36 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA16846 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 12:11:38 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BD2290.7C6C9DD0@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 15:07:39 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: "'Andrew Feuerdrache'" , "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: RE: [freestyle]setting question? Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 15:07:38 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Many have hit the double over osis set from opposite clipper (Motion) including myself and Scott Davidson (who hits pogo motion (loco motion)). So sorry to bust your bubble but you're not the first. It IS a cool move, though, and often gets cheers from the crowd!! I've been trying to set it from different spots (opp. Toe, same clip, etc.) -Ethan -----Original Message----- From: Andrew Feuerdrache [SMTP:damocles_schwert@hotmail.com] Sent: Friday, January 16, 1998 2:27 PM To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle]setting question? This is the first message I've sent so hopefully I sent it to the right place. to, Mark Denton "But then a couple days ago I found that my shins hurt too much to footbag(freestyle anyway). Can anyone provide any insight on this? " "Does it happen to everyone?" It sounds like you have shin splints and they shouldn't be ignored. If you have them for too long you can cause calcium deposits to form and if your really ambitious its even possible to cause stress fractures. Cure, give up sports or don't land so hard. What I would suggest is to work on your hop. Every time you stall the bag hop down with it, land on your toes, cushion your fall. Almost everyone can tell you stepping lighter will help your game, which leads me to, "I was wondering if anyone could give me some input on how pro's can "blur" type set so high." There are many ways to set for a blur but this is how I do it. When you set the clipper make sure it is almost directly below you this means turning your planting leg across your body some. Be sure you have a good low release off of the clipper then as soon as your set leg starts to move back hop of your plant leg and turn it straight in front of you moving it over the bag. Then all you have to do is a miraje. You have to move both of your legs at the same time which means for a little while both of your legs are off the ground, this makes it a little tricky. If you watch tapes of the pro's that is usually what you will find. I would also recommend that you start out with a low set half way between your knees and waist this teaches you to do blurs without the starts and stops. A for god's sake don't slur the bag (pulling around with your set foot) you'll get no respect. -Andrew as a final thought has anyone out there seen a spinning ducking butterfly or a paradox double around osis (kind of like a barfly but caught in an osis by the dexterity foot) or can I claim to be the first? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 20:42:43 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03034 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 20:42:27 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA03030 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 20:42:25 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3027) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03025 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 20:42:25 GMT Received: from neuman.interaccess.com (neuman.interaccess.com [207.70.126.130]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA17647 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 12:42:28 -0800 Received: from [207.208.136.38] (d38.focal.interaccess.com [207.208.136.38]) by neuman.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id OAA07532; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:36:48 -0600 (CST) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:36:48 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: "Andrew Feuerdrache" , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter) Subject: Re: [freestyle]setting question? Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Andrew! At 11:26 AM 1/16/98, Andrew Feuerdrache wrote: >Then all you have to do is a miraje. You have to >move both of your legs at the same time which means for a little while >both of your legs are off the ground, this makes it a little tricky. If >you watch tapes of the pro's that is usually what you will find. I would >also recommend that you start out with a low set half way between your >knees and waist this teaches you to do blurs without the starts and >stops. A for god's sake don't slur the bag (pulling around with your set >foot) you'll get no respect. Great insights. Where are you from? Why is it that your name isn't ringing a bell? Welcome to the listserve. >as a final thought has anyone out there seen a spinning ducking >butterfly or a paradox double around osis (kind of like a barfly but >caught in an osis by the dexterity foot) or can I claim to be the first? These both, I must lay claim to. I may not have been first, but I have hit both of these. The first I hit last year for the first time. Eric Wulffe should be able to confirm this. The second move you describe is what I have named: Motion. I have also hit "LocoMotion" which is the Pogo (true loco) version, which is either 5 or 6 adds depending on if you count the symposium. I do. Another variation of this move is "Ocean" which is more like a down-double down to an osis'ish catch with the dex leg. I've been hitting motion and locomotion for a couple of years. Ocean just came to me a few months ago (actually on accident, but that is another story). So sorry. These are great innovations on your part, and very original... it's just that you are not the first for these moves. I suggest you continue on the path you are on and your creativity will pull you to the next level. You will certainly be innovating for a long time coming. Great work! See ya! Enlightener Scott Davidson From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 21:02:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03241 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:02:37 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03237 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:02:35 GMT Received: from hill9361@uidaho.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3234) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03232 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:02:34 GMT Received: from raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (raven.csrv.uidaho.edu [129.101.192.43]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA18114 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 13:02:32 -0800 Received: from localhost (hill9361@localhost) by raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id NAA18428 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 13:02:30 -0800 (PST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.csrv.uidaho.edu: hill9361 owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 13:02:30 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hillebrand X-Sender: hill9361@raven.csrv.uidaho.edu To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] setting question? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > >stops. A for god's sake don't slur the bag (pulling around with your set > >foot) you'll get no respect. What is this slurring? (not that I get any respect anyway) I didn't understand "pulling around with your set foot). Thanks, __________________________________________________________________________ Matt P. Hillebrand hill9361@uidaho.edu http://www.uidaho.edu/~hill9361 From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 21:13:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03355 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:13:56 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03351 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:13:54 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3348) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03346 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:13:54 GMT Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com (imo11.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.165]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA18445; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 13:13:56 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: <415a5583.34bfcbbd@aol.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 16:06:03 EST To: enlightener@footbag.org, damocles_schwert@hotmail.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle]setting question? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org with all the talk of new moves, i was wondering if there is a name for a move that is pretty much a ripwalk osis. I've never heard o fanyone hitting it or seen anyone hit it befor, but that may be do to the lack to tourneys and festivals that i attend , which i plan to change. Thanks, Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 21:24:38 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03398 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:24:37 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03394 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:24:37 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3391) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03389 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:24:36 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA18693 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 13:24:39 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BD229A.AC46C8F0@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 16:20:34 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: "'Nageylum'" , "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: RE: [freestyle]setting question? Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 16:20:33 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I think that that move (ripwalking osis) would be called a torquescrew (miraging refraction), although I'm not positive. How does one specify refraction in job's notation? How about motion? Clip>same out> same out>(spin)>same clip ???? Ethan -----Original Message----- From: Nageylum [SMTP:Nageylum@aol.com] Sent: Friday, January 16, 1998 4:06 PM To: enlightener@footbag.org; damocles_schwert@hotmail.com; freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle]setting question? with all the talk of new moves, i was wondering if there is a name for a move that is pretty much a ripwalk osis. I've never heard o fanyone hitting it or seen anyone hit it befor, but that may be do to the lack to tourneys and festivals that i attend , which i plan to change. Thanks, Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 21:54:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03581 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:54:35 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03576 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:54:34 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3573) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03571 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:54:33 GMT Received: from imo19.mx.aol.com (imo19.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.176]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA19480 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 13:54:37 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 16:37:56 EST To: Klein@proscape.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle]setting question? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org i believe this is the notations for the refractionINSIDE > OP OUT [DEX] > OP CLIP [XBD] [DEL]. Hope that's right Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 22:41:25 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03904 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 22:41:24 GMT Received: from fnord@teleport.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3602) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03600 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 21:55:13 GMT Received: from mail1.teleport.com (mail1.teleport.com [192.108.254.26]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA19507 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 13:55:10 -0800 Received: from nick (ip-pdx37-06.teleport.com [206.163.127.180]) by mail1.teleport.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA01760 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 13:55:03 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34BFD869.3CB5DB53@teleport.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:00:09 -0800 From: Nicholas Hall X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle]sore shins anyone? X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all- I'm not sure how to respond to the discussion on sore shins, but I feel like I should, because my shins have done more than sipa bags to deter me from the sport. Every time I go out to try to freestyle, my shins ache, and I haven't found a good solution to it. Mainly I get shin splints (which, for the uninitiated, is the pain the feels centered in the sort of bunched up muscle on the front and to the outside of the shin bone). I also get an associated pain in the short tendon just below the kneecap. I spent about a year working on freestyle alot, ending several months ago, and it's bad enough that I can feel the pain in front of my knees when I walk up a short flight of stairs, even if I haven't kicked in a week. It's caused by landing hard when you do moves that require you to drive your foot down on to the ground quickly for a plant (for instance, the dex leg when I do paradox mirages), and by the pressure you put on your knee when you 'dip' your body on one leg (just do a clipper stall, and the lower your body gets, the more pressure you're putting on the front of your knee). This has more or less killed footbag for me- I haven't kicked in two weeks, and if I stand up and do a single right butterfly right now, my left knee will start hurting. I'm told that doing weightlifting on the knees will help, but I haven't seen much in results. My constructive comment on this is that I think the problem may have been exacerbated by a bad habit I picked up somewhere- I think that keeping your shins too tight when you do toe stalls (keeping the muscle in front of the shin flexed by over-elevating your toe) wears out that shin muscle and puts more of the pressure on the shinbone and the knee. I know it's poor form to have your toe drooping (and makes it hard to do delays), but tightening that muscle too much really hurts you. To combat this, I strongly reccomend interspersing outside stalls in your routine, and cranking the toe upwards while you hold the delay. That stretch seems to help some. Nick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 22:41:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03925 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 22:41:36 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03921 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 22:41:36 GMT Received: from damocles_schwert@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3918) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03916 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 22:41:35 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F66.hotmail.com [207.82.250.152]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA20782 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:41:39 -0800 Received: (qmail 20226 invoked by uid 0); 16 Jan 1998 22:41:37 -0000 Message-ID: <19980116224137.20225.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 149.175.3.48 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:41:37 PST X-Originating-IP: [149.175.3.48] From: "Andrew Feuerdrache" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] slur? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 14:41:37 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 13:02:30 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hillebrand And for god's sake don't slur the bag (pulling around with your set foot) you'll get no respect. "What is this slurring? (not that I get any respect anyway) I didn't understand "pulling around with your set foot)." Matt, A "slur" is basically a diffraction, or more specifically, you slur when you try to set for a blurry move but instead of releasing the bag and then doing the dexterity you hang on to the bag with your clipper foot pulling it or throwing it under your plant leg. Many players do this whether they realize it or not, some are very good (I wont point fingers) but by throwing the bag or pulling it you are sacrificing control and flow. There are no short cuts to good form. Also I'm sorry you don't get much respect, don't worry I don't get a whole lot either. Keep kicking! Andrew ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 16 23:01:13 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04074 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 23:00:52 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04070 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 23:00:51 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4067) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04065 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 23:00:51 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA21256 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 15:00:55 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.03.0014/4c.adoc) with ESMTP id wa141540 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 17:09:49 -0600 Subject: Re: [freestyle]sore shins anyone? Message-Id: <000000519902967836800@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 17:06:40 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Fri, Jan 16, 1998, 4:00:09 PM US CST Nicholas Hall wrote: >shin splints (which, for the uninitiated, is the pain the feels centered >in the sort of bunched up muscle on the front and to the outside of the Oh, how well I know these... My "Splints" always get me on the side of the shin bone that meets with the calf muscle, not the very front of the bone. Furthermore, I get them far worse in the winter playing on tight-knap carpet than when playing on concrete. I think the slightly greater grip of carpet causes some of my problems. Plus the fact that getting to kick outside (in decent weather [wish wish wish]) generally gives me a better attitude so my overall form probably improves. This is one reason I've never used Lavers (although I've promised myself to order a pair tonight!) because I've always managed to find the "For heavy people, Maximum cushioning, High-stability" design shoes somewhere. But Shoe designs get crazier every season, and even the old Brooks Beasts now have that oh-so-goshdarned-inconvenient drainage channel at the instep. I've always used Dr. Scholls Athletic Insoles (Light grey, far different from just about any of their other products and sort of hard to find). They are fractions of an ounce each, and will start to disintegrate before they will start to pack down. I'm gonna get a pair of lavers and sublimate a layer of Dr. Scholls Athletic Insoles under the normal Laver insoles and pray my shins don't kill me. I've really been working on my "Stay on the toes" technique since I've been recovering from my ankle disaster, so I have some small hopes. -- Derrick Fogle -- Heartland Eye Banks -- dfogle@mlerf.org -- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 17 02:19:46 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA05430 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 17 Jan 1998 02:19:28 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA05426 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 17 Jan 1998 02:19:26 GMT Received: from iguana04@sprynet.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5423) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA05421 for ; Sat, 17 Jan 1998 02:19:26 GMT Received: from m9.sprynet.com (m9.sprynet.com [165.121.1.209]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA25228 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 18:19:31 -0800 Received: from newmicronpc (dd75-049.dub.compuserve.com [199.174.212.49]) by m9.sprynet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id SAA03747 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 18:19:29 -0800 Message-Id: <199801170219.SAA03747@m9.sprynet.com> Reply-To: From: "Jane Jones" To: Subject: Re: [freestyle]sore shins anyone? Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 19:32:18 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I don't know if this has already been said, but I notice my shins start to hurt when I'm skooling higher adds than my muscles have had a chance to adjust to(like symposium moves to name one). Ususally, I take this moment to skool anything weakside that I don't have down solid before I develop a full blown shin splint. Never had one, don't think I ever want to. By the time I've gotten better at my weakside, my shins feel fine and I'm more balanced when I start skooling those more difficult combos once again. The hardest part...pacing myself. I have a tendancy to do more than is good for me when it comes to kicking. I guess my point is to skool weakside if you're starting to hurt, because over-use is probably the culprite for all of you sic shredders. adios, Jane From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 17 04:41:57 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA06264 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 17 Jan 1998 04:41:49 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA06260 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 17 Jan 1998 04:41:48 GMT Received: from neilbp@juno.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6257) Received: from m27.boston.juno.com (m27.boston.juno.com [205.231.100.186]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA06255 for ; Sat, 17 Jan 1998 04:41:47 GMT Received: (from neilbp@juno.com) by m27.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id XfJ23443; Fri, 16 Jan 1998 23:40:54 EST To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] the ankle bone's connected to the shin bone Message-ID: <19980116.233951.7319.0.neilbp@juno.com> References: <199801162350.XAA04452@eniac.yak.net.taz> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,3,8,15,20,24,27-28,30-32 From: neilbp@juno.com (Neil B Payne) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 1998 23:40:54 EST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello everyone, Wow, the last time I posted was probably during the last shin discussion. Sorry to post this long message and add to the already good recommendations with this thread but... I have had many bad experiences with shins. Mainly during track season in high school when I got them every season, winter and spring. The only thing that gave me long term comfort in my lower legs were ankle and shin strengthening exercises. After learning them and doing them before every practice, I had virtually no shin problems in college. =) So here's what worked for me. The idea is to simply work your muscles in the ankle and lower leg, (calf & shin muscles). Simply rotate your foot while sitting, with one leg crossed over the other one, do it until you can feel it start to burn, kind of like the burn you would shoot for doing crunches or sit-ups, whatever. Rotate each foot in each direction, I do about 25 reps. Also while sitting, tap your toes until you feel that burn in the front of your legs. Resistance exercises work really well. Ask a friend to hold your feet while you are sitting with your legs flat and together, then pull your feet towards you or push away etc. while they resist. If there isn't anyone around who can lend you a hand, a rope or belt works pretty well too. Building up the muscles in your ankles and lower legs is a great thing because they deal with almost all of the shock when we land. If you aren't blessed with nice arches (I'm almost flat footed), it is even more important to build up those little muscles. Okay, this is all just based on my experience and recommendations that I have received so take them with a grain and I hope things improve for you. Take care. still working on blur, rip walk, weak side stuff and simply motivating to kick regularly... Neil Payne Washington DC From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 18 00:01:32 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA01887 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 00:01:23 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA01883 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 00:01:22 GMT Received: from allman144@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1880) Received: from imo13.mx.aol.com (imo13.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.167]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA01878 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 00:01:21 GMT From: Allman144 Message-ID: <52aa62cd.34c14644@aol.com> Date: Sat, 17 Jan 1998 19:01:06 EST To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #303 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I am glad that someone finally brought the attention to exercises that DON'T involve using a footbag. One thing that never gets discussed on this mailing list is training. I played baseball for ten years and most of the training we did had absolutely nothing to do with using a baseball. I believe that the same holds for footbag. If we are all serious footbaggers and want to improve, we should take the time to exercise. Kicking and kicking and kicking does help, don't get me wrong. But if the extra initiative is taken to do exercise without the lavers strapped up, then I think people will improve exponentially. That is my two cents. Tony Glick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 18 04:19:05 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA02897 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 04:18:53 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA02893 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 04:18:51 GMT Received: from zogg13@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2890) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA02888 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 04:18:51 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F84.hotmail.com [207.82.250.190]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA10841 for ; Sat, 17 Jan 1998 20:18:57 -0800 Received: (qmail 6782 invoked by uid 0); 18 Jan 1998 04:18:56 -0000 Message-ID: <19980118041856.6780.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 205.147.239.17 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 17 Jan 1998 20:18:56 PST X-Originating-IP: [205.147.239.17] From: "Stephen Miskiewicz" To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] where can you download videos of tricks Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sat, 17 Jan 1998 20:18:56 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I want to learn some new tricks and I found some video clips but they are all too advanced for me. Is there any where i can download some videos that teach you a trick. I can't learn from any one I know because I'm the best I know. Don't tell me to order a video because i alreadly ordered tricks of the trade, but i want stuff i can learn until then. -Steve- P.S. If any of you live in PA, it was a great day to kick outside. It was a nice 42. I was wearing shorts and was kicking for over 3 hours. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 18 05:57:14 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA03115 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 05:57:12 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA03111 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 05:57:11 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3108) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA03106 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 05:57:10 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA11730 for ; Sat, 17 Jan 1998 21:57:17 -0800 Received: from [204.62.245.137] (max137.atext.com [204.62.245.137]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA03103; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 05:57:03 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19980118041856.6780.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 17 Jan 1998 22:58:19 -0700 To: "Stephen Miskiewicz" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] where can you download videos of tricks Cc: Freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 9:18 PM -0700 1/17/98, Stephen Miskiewicz wrote: > I want to learn some new tricks and I found some video clips but they >are all too advanced for me. Is there any where i can download some >videos that teach you a trick. I can't learn from any one I know >because I'm the best I know. Don't tell me to order a video because i >alreadly ordered tricks of the trade, but i want stuff i can learn until >then. Sorry, you'll just have to wait for Tricks of the Trade. I am in the process of trying to compile instructional materials online but it's way too much work and will not be done any time soon.. certainly not before your video arrives in the mail. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 18 20:35:31 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA01263 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 20:34:29 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA01259 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 20:34:26 GMT Received: from zogg13@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1256) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA01254 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 20:34:25 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F62.hotmail.com [207.82.250.148]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA20583 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 12:34:28 -0800 Received: (qmail 23425 invoked by uid 0); 18 Jan 1998 20:34:27 -0000 Message-ID: <19980118203427.23424.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 206.245.145.45 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 12:34:26 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.245.145.45] From: "Stephen Miskiewicz" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] the ankle bone's connected to the shin bone Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 18 Jan 1998 12:34:26 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >Hello everyone, > Wow, the last time I posted was probably during the last shin >discussion. Sorry to post this long message and add to the already good >recommendations with this thread but... > I have had many bad experiences with shins. Mainly during track season >in high school when I got them every season, winter and spring. The only >thing that gave me long term comfort in my lower legs were ankle and shin >strengthening exercises. After learning them and doing them before every >practice, I had virtually no shin problems in college. =) > So here's what worked for me. The idea is to simply work your muscles >in the ankle and lower leg, (calf & shin muscles). Simply rotate your >foot while sitting, with one leg crossed over the other one, do it until >you can feel it start to burn, kind of like the burn you would shoot for >doing crunches or sit-ups, whatever. Rotate each foot in each direction, >I do about 25 reps. Also while sitting, tap your toes until you feel >that burn in the front of your legs. > Resistance exercises work really well. Ask a friend to hold your feet >while you are sitting with your legs flat and together, then pull your >feet towards you or push away etc. while they resist. If there isn't >anyone around who can lend you a hand, a rope or belt works pretty well >too. > Building up the muscles in your ankles and lower legs is a great thing >because they deal with almost all of the shock when we land. If you >aren't blessed with nice arches (I'm almost flat footed), it is even more >important to build up those little muscles. > Okay, this is all just based on my experience and recommendations that >I have received so take them with a grain and I hope things improve for >you. >Take care. > still working on blur, rip walk, weak side stuff and simply motivating >to kick regularly... >Neil Payne >Washington DC > Hi Neil, I'm flat-footed too. Here is an exercise my doctor gave me to improve my arches(and my jump-shot). Stand strait up. Lift yourself on your toes very slowly. Once you are at the highest point lower yourself slowly back to the ground but keep all your weight on your toes. continue until you feel a burn. Then rest for a few seconds and do half of what you just did. -Steve- P.S. if anyone doesn't understand what this means e-mail me and i'll try to explain it better. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 19 01:18:59 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA02188 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 01:18:56 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA02184 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 01:18:55 GMT Received: from jsbx@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2181) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA02179 for ; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 01:18:54 GMT Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com (imo18.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.175]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA24550 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 17:18:58 -0800 From: JSBX Message-ID: <36febf6a.34c2a842@aol.com> Date: Sun, 18 Jan 1998 20:11:28 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Of swirls and spencos Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Lo kickers! There recently was some discussion as to what insoles best protect your shins, and Scott Davidson swore by Spenco insoles. Well, today while I was out hunting for some new lavers, i came across these insoles, but the pricetag was $15.95. In Scott's e-mail he said they went for $5.95. Is Modell's trying to make a huge profit, or was the $5.95 mentioned in the e-mail a typo? I'd like to get this straight, because I want to start learning how to blizzard, and I won't start until i get myself some good insoles. I want to know if i should keep on looking, or if the retail is indeed 16 bucks. In unrelated news, I have been working on my dragons, and trying to do swirls with them. I am getting real frustrated, and i was wondering if anybody has seen this done. Keep on shredding like a novacane hurricane. KeN From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 19 03:24:36 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA02984 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 03:24:29 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA02980 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 03:24:27 GMT Received: from zogg13@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2977) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA02975 for ; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 03:24:27 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f122.hotmail.com [207.82.251.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA27236 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 19:24:32 -0800 Received: (qmail 4737 invoked by uid 0); 19 Jan 1998 03:24:27 -0000 Message-ID: <19980119032427.4736.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 206.245.145.23 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 19:24:27 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.245.145.23] From: "Stephen Miskiewicz" To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Any clubs near West Chester,PA Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 18 Jan 1998 19:24:27 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Thats close to where i'm from. Does anyone know of/ belong to any clubs from that area. Any information would be helpful. Thanks. _-Steve-_ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 19 05:19:34 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA03435 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 05:19:32 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA03431 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 05:19:31 GMT Received: from eric@netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3428) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA03426 for ; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 05:19:21 GMT Received: from stick.netcomi.com (fit.netcomi.com [204.58.155.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA28935 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 21:19:26 -0800 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by stick.netcomi.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA29375 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 1998 23:19:09 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: stick.netcomi.com: eric owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 18 Jan 1998 23:19:09 -0600 (CST) From: Eric Burgess To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Name of this set? In-Reply-To: <19980119032427.4736.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org i just learned a new type of set and i wonder if it has a name yet...it's a paradox-reverse-miraging set. so far i have managed to hit it into clipper (paradox reverse drifter), mirage (paradox atom smasher), and butterfly (paradox legbeater). i'm sure that other moves could be done from this set as well...i would *really* love to see someone hit it into a drifter on the other side. eric From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 20 01:14:17 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA04853 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 01:13:48 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA04849 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 01:13:46 GMT Received: from prodidfb@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4846) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA04844 for ; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 01:13:46 GMT Received: from imo20.mx.aol.com (imo20.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.177]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA08008 for ; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 17:13:50 -0800 From: PRODIDFB Message-ID: <2c133b1d.34c3f77d@aol.com> Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 20:01:07 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Big Adds in Charlotte Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Shortly after the East Must Jam in DC on the 23rd, the charlotte boys have come to respect the art of big adds. It had not occurred to us that the potential to nail nasties was yearning to break free and it was in the subconscious that the struggle to maintain form and poise while shredding became a revelation. Tricks are no longer an issue while shredding, rather the multitude of complex combos linked smoothly and without any hesitation. FULL BLOWN CONFIDENCE in the ability to go BIG and still maintain. We are proud and excited to be a part of footbag and it's growing success,..... Personal thanks to Peter Irish, Vince Bradley, and Steve Goldberg for inspiring us to challenge our own abilities everytime we pick up the bag. Thanks, Damon , Jason , and Barrett(aka The Charlotte Boys) From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 20 05:58:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA06646 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 05:58:54 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA06642 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 05:58:53 GMT Received: from jriely@mail.coin.missouri.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6639) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA06637 for ; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 05:58:52 GMT Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA12598 for ; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 21:58:59 -0800 Received: from sloppo (Mizzou-AS8-18.missouri.edu [128.206.209.114]) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA14702 for ; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 23:58:32 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980119235456.006a6214@pop.coin.missouri.edu> X-Sender: jriely@pop.coin.missouri.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 23:54:56 -0600 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Jeremiah Riely Subject: [freestyle] I need help Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello all. I've been kicking for a while and am just learning the basic moves. I have all the basic stalls down, but I need help learning left clipper stalls and left dexterities. I can do right clipper stalls and I use correct form and everything. I have watched "Tricks of the Trade" many times and watched all the movies off the internet I have found, but I can't seem to do a left foot clipper stall. I get the contact half the time but then on the set it either falls to the floor or hits my right leg. I was wondering if anyone has any pointers on learning clippers on your bad side. When I kick the bag I use both sides of the body equally and can hit it a whole bunch of times in a row on either foot. Aslo, I can do consecutive basic stalls on both feet alternating and on the same foot over and over. But, I can't seem to do around-the-worlds or leg overs on with my left leg. I can do them fine on my right. I also cannot seem to hit a mirage. If anyone cuold help, that'd be nice. --====Jeremiah Riely====-- __________________jriely@mail.coin.missouri.edu___________________ / __^___ \ \ \ | / \ \ \ _|\/\/_ |^^^^^^| | | "A toast to alcohol, | | \ ____\ \ /_ | | | | the cause of, and ^^ (o)(o) \ / \ (o)(o) / (o)(o) | | | solution of, all of @ .--- | ( (o)(o) /____. @> C @ | | life's problems." | / .____\ | .___\ \ | /____/ | | | | \____/ | | | | \ | | \_____________________/\_____|________ooooo______oooo_______|___|__/ From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 20 06:18:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id GAA06735 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 06:18:40 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id GAA06731 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 06:18:39 GMT Received: from eric@netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6728) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA06726 for ; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 06:18:39 GMT Received: from stick.netcomi.com (fit.netcomi.com [204.58.155.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA12852 for ; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 22:18:45 -0800 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by stick.netcomi.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA00981; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 00:18:04 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: stick.netcomi.com: eric owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 20 Jan 1998 00:18:04 -0600 (CST) From: Eric Burgess To: Jeremiah Riely cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] I need help In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19980119235456.006a6214@pop.coin.missouri.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, 19 Jan 1998, Jeremiah Riely wrote: > When I kick the bag I use both sides of the body equally and can hit it a > whole bunch of times in a row on either foot. Aslo, I can do consecutive > basic stalls on both feet alternating and on the same foot over and over. > But, I can't seem to do around-the-worlds or leg overs on with my left leg. > I can do them fine on my right. I also cannot seem to hit a mirage. If > anyone cuold help, that'd be nice. your left leg, if it's anything like mine, is retarded. it's going to take mucho work to train it to do moves consistently. i don't think there is any quick way to left clipper or any other left (or off-side to be sensitive to the lefty community) move. but one thing you can do to maximize your practice is to do the move on your strong side first, paying attention to the position of every part of your body...then make sure, when doing the same move on the left, that it's a perfect mirror image. i have caught myself leaning the wrong way on left clippers because that's the way i lean on right clippers...needless to say it doesn't help a lot :) i hope this helps...heh, i hope it helps me, too, since my left-side development is, well, embarassing. eric From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 20 06:49:36 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id GAA06856 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 06:49:34 GMT Message-Id: <199801200649.GAA06856@eniac.yak.net.taz> X-Originating-IP: [209.109.225.118] From: "The 'Mazin Josh Penney" To: zogg13@hotmail.com Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Any clubs near West Chester,PA? Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 15:00:55 PST Status: Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >Thats close to where i'm from. Does anyone know of/ belong to any clubs >from that area. Any information would be helpful. Thanks. A long, long time ago in a galaxy far far away (California) there was a man with your same first name. He decided it would be really, really cool if footbag players all over the world could find each other; consequently anyone else could find out anything and everything one could want to know about the sport of footbag through a brand new invention called the internet. He then spent lots of free time developing this place of knowledge. Soon afterwards people all over the globe were sending information to this place, and taking informations.... it was like a worldwide footbag organization, dedicated to spreading the sport everywhere. Can you believe it? It's amazing what one can learn through the power of literacy. Exercise yours. Go to http://www.footbag.org and be a sponge. Learn, my son. Learn. JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 20 07:06:40 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA06910 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 07:06:23 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA06906 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 07:06:23 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6903) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA06901 for ; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 07:06:22 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA13513 for ; Mon, 19 Jan 1998 23:06:29 -0800 Received: from [204.62.245.137] (brat-2.atext.com [204.62.245.116]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA06898 for ; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 07:06:21 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.1.32.19980119235456.006a6214@pop.coin.missouri.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 23:07:53 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] I need help Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 10:18 PM -0800 1/19/98, Eric Burgess wrote: >your left leg, if it's anything like mine, is retarded. Yes, but don't forget that your right leg, if it's anything like mine, is also WEAKER if you've been standing and hopping on your left leg all this time. The fact is freestyle is necessarily a two-footed sport (well, don't tell Jacob Harkuna I said so -- he's the one-legged freestyler and *man* can he shred!).. But if you want to learn to do a stall with your left foot, you need to learn the same magic hop you were doing on your left leg (when you were catching with your right foot) on your *right*. You also have to build the strength in your right leg so that you can stay balanced on it as well as you are balancing on your left leg during a right stall. In other words, don't just focus on the stalling foot -- think about your support foot. Mimic what you are doing on your other support foot when catching with the other leg. Make sense? Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 20 22:10:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA02834 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 22:10:23 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA02829 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 22:10:22 GMT Received: from schr4160@tao.sou.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2824) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA02817; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 22:10:21 GMT Received: from TAO.sou.edu (Tao.sou.edu [140.211.92.6]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA29084; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 14:10:24 -0800 Received: from 206.151.159.47 (ip44.sou.mind.net [206.151.159.47]) by TAO.sou.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA25112; Tue, 20 Jan 1998 14:13:42 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34C4B27B.5B1C@tao.sou.edu> Date: Tue, 20 Jan 1998 14:19:39 +0000 From: "schrodt, forest" X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: footbag@footbag.org, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] [footbag] new moves? (reposted on freestyle discussion) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I know that there is allways people asking about moves and I hope I am not being redundent in asking about a few myself. I have been developing my gyrating sets and this has opened up some pretty big moves that were previously unavalable to me. I have started hitting moebius and have come really close to hitting gyrating drifter (vortex). I have been thinking that it must be possible to do a gyrating blur or even (I know it is pushing it) gyrating blurry torque. I was wondering if anyone can do these two moves and what they are called. Thanks for your help, a very dizzy Forest. PS: Steve I hope this is what you meant by reposting on freestyle@footbag.org I did not mean to put it on footbag@footbag.org I hope you will forgive my insulence, I am still learning how to use the footbag discussion.:) From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 22 21:29:01 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA02930 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 21:28:11 GMT Received: from mzelov@sun1.wetmore.amphi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for footbag@majordomo.footbag.org (2856) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA02854 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 21:23:42 GMT Received: from sun1.wetmore.amphi.com (NS.AMPHI.COM [206.210.128.2]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA16492 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 13:23:44 -0800 Received: from ams-38317.amphi_jhs.amphi.com ([206.210.140.89]) by sun1.wetmore.amphi.com (4.1/1.37) id AA18649; Thu, 22 Jan 98 14:30:58-070 Message-Id: <34C7B912.2788@sun1.wetmore.amphi.com> Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 14:24:34 -0700 From: marc zelov Organization: amphi public schools X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] whats this move? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org OK, so I have this student who can do this move and we don't know how to score and or name it... Here is an attempt at an explanation: inside stall taken behind the planted leg and flipped out and caught to a toe stall. Will Godsil is the 8th grade master of this move. we are looking forward to your response. Marc Zelov @ http://www.footbag.org/newclubs/listclub/amphi From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 22 21:55:27 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03122 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 21:55:21 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03118 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 21:55:21 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3115) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03112 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 21:55:20 GMT Received: from mcfeely.interaccess.com (mcfeely.interaccess.com [207.70.126.131]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA17121 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 13:55:23 -0800 Received: from [207.208.136.102] (d102.focal.interaccess.com [207.208.136.102]) by mcfeely.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id PAA26332; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 15:54:49 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 15:54:49 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: marc zelov , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter) Subject: Re: [freestyle] whats this move? Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Marc, Will and Freestylers! >OK, so I have this student who can do this move and we don't know how >to score and or name it... >inside stall taken behind the planted leg and flipped out and caught to >a toe stall. >Will Godsil is the 8th grade master of this move. > >we are looking forward to your response. This is a "Wrap" set to a toe stall. That was one of my first tricks as well! Great job. I would encourage him to also try it on his other side. Try setting to other moves, like right into another wrap, or to a lap catch. Then check out the www.footbag.org site for explanations of more advanced moves, as Will sounds like he is well on his way! Great job! See ya! Scott Davidson Enlightener From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 22 22:15:10 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03296 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 22:15:09 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03292 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 22:15:09 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3289) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03287 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 22:15:08 GMT Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com (imo11.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.165]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA17470 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 14:15:08 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: <730e8619.34c7bd45@aol.com> Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 16:42:27 EST To: mzelov@sun1.wetmore.amphi.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] whats this move? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org hey all, Well from what you said it sounds like a wrap, i oculd be wrong, but i'm pretty sure. While we're on the subject of new moves and names and such, i tried to do a paradon torque, i almost hit it so this leads me to believe someone out there can hit this is there a name for this, besides "paradon torque", and also would this be a 6 add? Fight gravity, keep kicking Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 22 22:45:33 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03639 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 22:45:07 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03635 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 22:45:07 GMT Received: from susan.oliver@shaw.wave.ca () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3632) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03630 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 22:45:06 GMT Received: from norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca (norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca [139.142.2.201]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA18467 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 14:45:09 -0800 Received: from shaw.wave.ca ([24.64.13.51]) by norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca (Netscape Messaging Server 3.0) with ESMTP id AAA776 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 15:44:27 -0700 Message-ID: <34C6E78B.5F893CE6@shaw.wave.ca> Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 23:30:35 -0700 From: "Susan Oliver" Reply-To: susan.oliver@shaw.wave.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Best footbag to start out with Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi I nwanted to know witch bag to start out with and what trick I should learn From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 22 22:55:02 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03852 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 22:55:02 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03846 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 22:55:01 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3843) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03841 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 22:55:00 GMT Received: from mcfeely.interaccess.com (mcfeely.interaccess.com [207.70.126.131]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA18700 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 14:55:04 -0800 Received: from [207.208.136.102] (d102.focal.interaccess.com [207.208.136.102]) by mcfeely.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id QAA12753; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 16:54:37 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 16:54:37 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: JSBX , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter) Subject: Re: [freestyle] Of swirls and spencos Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi JSBX and sore shin kickers! >Spenco's $15.95. In Scott's e-mail he said they went for $5.95. Is >Modell's trying >to make a huge profit, or was the $5.95 mentioned in the e-mail a typo? I'd >like to get this straight, because I want to start learning how to blizzard, >and I won't start until i get myself some good insoles. I want to know if i >should keep on looking, or if the retail is indeed 16 bucks. You might be looking at the ones at eye level. The displays by us are like "end of aisle" displays and are tall. At eye level, are the most expensive ones, with all the fancy arch support and heel support and all that techy stuff. I swear by the cheapo ones that have NO ARCH or HEEL support and are in a flat packaging. They are definately about $6 bucks. And usually not at eye level, sometimes buried behind other stuff. Seek and ye shall find. >Keep on shredding like a novacane hurricane. Yah, hey dare! See ya! Scott D. Enlightener From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 22 23:03:47 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA03917 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 23:03:42 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA03913 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 23:03:41 GMT Received: from jsbx@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3910) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA03908 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 23:03:41 GMT Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com (imo18.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.175]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA18947 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 15:03:43 -0800 From: JSBX Message-ID: <1610af2d.34c7cd57@aol.com> Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 17:51:00 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Best footbag to start out with Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org learn how to do a flying clipper, it is visually impressive, and requires like no skill. Just remember to jump with the leg you kick, and you should even practice it by lifting the non kicking leg off the floor before you execute it so you force yourself to jump off the right foot. After a while, you can get a routine of multiple clippers in a row off opposite feet with spins included. No skill, big applause. Also, the pendulum is another good beginner move that requires little skill yet looks great. SomA From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 22 23:20:10 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04098 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 23:20:08 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04094 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 23:20:08 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4091) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04089 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 23:20:07 GMT Received: from imo15.mx.aol.com (imo15.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.170]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA19341; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 15:20:11 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: <5150471f.34c7d0b5@aol.com> Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 18:05:23 EST To: enlightener@footbag.org, JSBX@aol.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Of swirls and spencos Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all, I agree with scott when he says they're the best insoles, and about the most expensive products at eye-level. but however, the price depends from region ot region and what stores you look in. I myself (being very cheap) looked for several days to find them, and the lowest price i found was $10.95. They are still worth every penny I paid. Fight gravity, kick long Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 22 23:39:39 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04230 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 23:39:37 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04226 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 23:39:36 GMT Received: from susan.oliver@shaw.wave.ca () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4223) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04221 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 23:39:35 GMT Received: from norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca (norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca [139.142.2.201]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA19698 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 15:39:39 -0800 Received: from shaw.wave.ca ([24.64.13.51]) by norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca (Netscape Messaging Server 3.0) with ESMTP id AAA24202 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 16:39:02 -0700 Message-ID: <34C6F455.D60FCBA1@shaw.wave.ca> Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 00:25:09 -0700 From: "Susan Oliver" Reply-To: susan.oliver@shaw.wave.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] where to buy a footbag Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I just wanted to9 know where is the best place to buy a footbag. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 00:20:38 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA04623 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 00:20:18 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA04619 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 00:20:17 GMT Received: from susan.oliver@shaw.wave.ca () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4616) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA04614 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 00:20:16 GMT Received: from norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca (norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca [139.142.2.201]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA20608 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 16:20:20 -0800 Received: from shaw.wave.ca ([24.64.13.51]) by norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca (Netscape Messaging Server 3.0) with ESMTP id AAA11033 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 17:19:44 -0700 Message-ID: <34C6FDDF.35B1EF1@shaw.wave.ca> Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 01:05:52 -0700 From: "Susan Oliver" Reply-To: susan.oliver@shaw.wave.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] where to buy footbags Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I just want to know where to buy footbags. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 04:12:24 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA05764 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 04:12:17 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA05760 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 04:12:15 GMT Received: from susan.oliver@shaw.wave.ca () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5757) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA05755 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 04:12:10 GMT Received: from norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca (norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca [139.142.2.201]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA25156 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 20:12:15 -0800 Received: from shaw.wave.ca ([24.64.13.51]) by norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca (Netscape Messaging Server 3.0) with ESMTP id AAA25173 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 21:11:38 -0700 Message-ID: <34C7343F.819C283A@shaw.wave.ca> Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 04:57:51 -0700 From: "Susan Oliver" Reply-To: susan.oliver@shaw.wave.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] The slow sack Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org There is a bag called the slow sack made by mattle if you haven't seen it go to http://worldfootbag.com/catalog. I was just wondering if you aprove of it because I might buy it. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 05:40:27 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA06079 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 05:40:11 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA06075 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 05:40:09 GMT Received: from kenned57@pilot.msu.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6072) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA06070 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 05:40:08 GMT Received: from pilot002.cl.msu.edu (pilot002.cl.msu.edu [35.9.5.102]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA26567 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 1998 21:40:14 -0800 Received: (kenned57@localhost) by pilot002.cl.msu.edu (8.7.5/MSU-2.10) id AAA52928; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 00:40:06 -0500 Message-Id: <199801230540.AAA52928@pilot002.cl.msu.edu> Subject: Re: [freestyle] of swirls and spencos To: freestyle@footbag.org Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 00:40:05 -0500 (EST) From: "Cameron Dean Kennedy" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello freestylers ! -- I just wanted to ask if swirling syposium mirage had 'common' name for it ? |clip>same swirl front-back >no plant while opp in>opp toe. I have been skooling it all week, and finally managed to integrated it into my kicking. ..>>osis>>swirling symposium mirage>>butterfly>> catch bag, go home. Also, does the swirl set have a concept name for it? I have been skooling swirl sets this week, and they are kinda cool. I also have hit swirling rake, and swirling osis, and almost swirling double legover. A lot of possibilties swirling torque, swirling dada curves, swirling butterfly, swirling blender . . From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 13:50:08 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id NAA07821 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 13:48:36 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id NAA07817 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 13:48:34 GMT Received: from kenned57@pilot.msu.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7814) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA07812 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 13:48:34 GMT Received: from pilot03.cl.msu.edu (pilot03.cl.msu.edu [35.9.5.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA31694 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 05:48:43 -0800 Received: (kenned57@localhost) by pilot03.cl.msu.edu (8.7.5/MSU-2.10) id IAA66200; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 08:48:41 -0500 Message-Id: <199801231348.IAA66200@pilot03.cl.msu.edu> Subject: [freestyle] repost: of swirls and spencos To: freestyle@footbag.org Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 08:48:41 -0500 (EST) From: "Cameron Dean Kennedy" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Sorry ffor the double post, but i think my last message got truncated somewhere along the way. I just wanted to ask if swirling syposium mirage had 'common' name for it ? |clip>same swirl front-back >no plant while opp in>opp toe. I have been skooling it all week, and finally managed to integrated it into my kicking. ..>>osis>>swirling symposium mirage>>butterfly>> catch bag, go home. Also, does the swirl set have a concept name for it? I have been skooling swirl sets this week, and they are kinda cool. I also have hit swirling rake, and swirling osis, and almost swirling double legover. A lot of possibilties swirling torque, swirling dada curves, swirling butterfly, swirling blender . . From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 14:26:28 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08035 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 14:25:08 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA08031 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 14:25:08 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (8028) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA08026 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 14:25:07 GMT Received: from neuman.interaccess.com (neuman.interaccess.com [207.70.126.130]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA32133 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 06:25:17 -0800 Received: from [207.208.136.149] (d149.focal.interaccess.com [207.208.136.149]) by neuman.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id IAA20679; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 08:19:32 -0600 (CST) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 08:19:32 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: "Cameron Dean Kennedy" , freestyle@footbag.org From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter) Subject: Re: [freestyle] of swirls and spencos Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Cameron and Freestylers! At 12:40 AM 1/23/98, Cameron Dean Kennedy wrote: >I just wanted to ask if swirling syposium mirage had 'common' name for it ? >|clip>same swirl front-back >no plant while opp in>opp toe. I have been >skooling it all week, and finally managed to integrated it into my kicking. >..>>osis>>swirling symposium mirage>>butterfly>> catch bag, go home. Which way are you swirling? Front-Back (over-under) or Back-Front (under-over)? I am having trouble visualizing this. >Also, does the swirl set have a concept name for it? I have been skooling swirl >sets this week, and they are kinda cool. I also have hit swirling rake, and >swirling osis, and almost swirling double legover. A lot of possibilties >swirling torque, swirling dada curves, swirling butterfly, swirling blender . . I have hit reverse swirling rake. Twirl is reverse swirl "bail" to osis. Also Reverse swirling symposium whirl is fun. Keep on Cameron! See ya! Scott. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 15:52:00 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00420 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 15:51:03 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id PAA00416 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 15:51:02 GMT Received: from swingert@creighton.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (413) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00411 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 15:51:01 GMT Received: from mailjay.creighton.edu (mailjay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.15]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA00912 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 07:51:01 -0800 Received: from bluejay.creighton.edu by mailjay.creighton.edu with SMTP (1.40.112.8/16.2) id AA119930659; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:50:59 -0600 Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:50:59 -0600 (CST) From: swingert Reply-To: swingert To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Paradon Torque... In-Reply-To: <199801222350.XAA04420@eniac.yak.net.taz> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Nageylum wrote: > While we're on the subject of new moves and names and such, > i tried to do a paradon torque, I don't think that paradon torque, as you call it, exists. An official "torque"-ing move must include an inside-out dexterity with either foot proceeded by a cross body delay (clipper) with the opposite--that is, non-setting--foot. Because a paradon has *no* inside-out dexterities, it doesn't qualify as a "torque"-ing move. If you meant: TOE > OP OUT [DEX] > SAME IN [DEX] > OP CLIP [DEL], then I think you mean (back me up Steve) tapping torque--a Tuan Vu speciality. But, if you meant: TOE > OP OUT [DEX] > SAME OUT [DEX] > (BACK SPIN) [BOD] > OP CLIP [XBD] [DEL], then I think you mean a Paradon Clipper (??) or a double reverse miraging torque (or, as Brian Mck. and I call it, a Double Aunt Jemima). I'm not sure of an "official" name, though. :-) > i almost hit it so this leads me to believe > someone out there can hit this is there a name for this, besides "paradon > torque", and also would this be a 6 add? As I count it, the latter move is worth 5 adds. Sean From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 16:39:18 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00732 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 16:39:12 GMT Received: from 00201887@bigred.unl.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (268) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00266 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 15:18:06 GMT Received: from bigred.unl.edu (bigred.unl.edu [129.93.1.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA00283 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 07:18:07 -0800 Received: (from 00201887@localhost) by bigred.unl.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA19814 for freestyle@footbag.org; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:16:45 -0600 (CST) From: Theron A Troxel <00201887@bigred.unl.edu> Message-Id: <199801231516.JAA19814@bigred.unl.edu> Subject: [freestyle] help To: freestyle@footbag.org Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:16:44 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org //clip//same in//op clip What is the name? -- --------------------------- @ Theron Troxel \_|_/ UNLFC President | o 00201887@bigred.unl.edu /_\_ http://www.unl.edu/crec/SC/Footbag \ ------------------------------------- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:06:29 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01011 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:06:05 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01007 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:06:04 GMT Received: from kenned57@pilot.msu.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1004) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01002 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:06:04 GMT Received: from pilot09.cl.msu.edu (pilot09.cl.msu.edu [35.9.5.19]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA02384 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:06:05 -0800 Received: (kenned57@localhost) by pilot09.cl.msu.edu (8.7.5/MSU-2.10) id MAA78988; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:05:53 -0500 Message-Id: <199801231705.MAA78988@pilot09.cl.msu.edu> Subject: Re: [freestyle] help To: 00201887@bigred.unl.edu (Theron A Troxel) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:05:53 -0500 (EST) From: "Cameron Dean Kennedy" Cc: freestyle@footbag.org In-Reply-To: <199801231516.JAA19814@bigred.unl.edu> from "Theron A Troxel" at Jan 23, 98 09:16:44 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Theron, i think it's a paradox whirl. later cdk > > > //clip//same in//op clip > > What is the name? > -- > --------------------------- > @ Theron Troxel > \_|_/ UNLFC President > | o 00201887@bigred.unl.edu > /_\_ http://www.unl.edu/crec/SC/Footbag > \ > ------------------------------------- > > > -- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:09:44 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01041 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:09:43 GMT Received: from derric@dallasfootbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (982) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA00980 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:05:49 GMT Received: from dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA02366 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:05:50 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id LAA12212; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:04:58 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx22-14.ix.netcom.com(207.94.126.110) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma012065; Fri Jan 23 11:03:29 1998 Message-ID: <34C77D90.50E2@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 11:10:41 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: derric@dallasfootbag.org X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Theron A Troxel <00201887@bigred.unl.edu> CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] help References: <199801231516.JAA19814@bigred.unl.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Theron A Troxel wrote: > > //clip//same in//op clip > > What is the name? > -- that sounds like paradox whirl. Basically whirl set from oppostie clipper. This move has been giving me hell since I hit it the first and only time about 4 months ago. Anyone have any advice on it? It keeps hitting my dexterity foot as I'm going around the bag. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:14:58 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01069 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:14:57 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01065 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:14:57 GMT Received: from 00201887@bigred.unl.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1062) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01060 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:14:56 GMT Received: from bigred.unl.edu (bigred.unl.edu [129.93.1.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA02535 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:14:57 -0800 Received: (from 00201887@localhost) by bigred.unl.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA31058; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:13:29 -0600 (CST) From: Theron A Troxel <00201887@bigred.unl.edu> Message-Id: <199801231713.LAA31058@bigred.unl.edu> Subject: Re: [freestyle] help To: derric@dallasfootbag.org Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:13:27 -0600 (CST) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org In-Reply-To: <34C77D90.50E2@dallasfootbag.org> from "Derric Scalf" at Jan 22, 98 11:10:41 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > > //clip//same in//op clip > > > > What is the name? > > -- > > that sounds like paradox whirl. I guess that would make sense, but the move I'm describing as seen in Raw Shred: it's when the Torch hits it back to back in the phat moves and hein combos. It looks like a paradox mirage, but then he bails to something resembling an osis. -- --------------------------- @ Theron Troxel \_|_/ UNLFC President | o 00201887@bigred.unl.edu /_\_ http://www.unl.edu/crec/SC/Footbag \ ------------------------------------- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:15:07 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01089 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:15:06 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01085 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:15:05 GMT Received: from bag@multi35.netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1082) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01080 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:15:05 GMT Received: from multi35.netcomi.com (multi35.netcomi.com [204.58.155.235]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA02550 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:15:05 -0800 Received: (from bag@localhost) by multi35.netcomi.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) id MAA10205; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:15:57 -0600 Received: from bigred.unl.edu (00201887@bigred.unl.edu [129.93.1.7]) by multi35.netcomi.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA10198 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:15:54 -0600 Received: (from 00201887@localhost) by bigred.unl.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA31058; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:13:29 -0600 (CST) From: Theron A Troxel <00201887@bigred.unl.edu> Message-Id: <199801231713.LAA31058@bigred.unl.edu> Subject: Re: [freestyle] help Old-To: derric@dallasfootbag.org Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:13:27 -0600 (CST) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org In-Reply-To: <34C77D90.50E2@dallasfootbag.org> from "Derric Scalf" at Jan 22, 98 11:10:41 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Loop: forwarded by derric@dallasfootbag.org To: scalf@utdallas.edu Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > > //clip//same in//op clip > > > > What is the name? > > -- > > that sounds like paradox whirl. I guess that would make sense, but the move I'm describing as seen in Raw Shred: it's when the Torch hits it back to back in the phat moves and hein combos. It looks like a paradox mirage, but then he bails to something resembling an osis. -- --------------------------- @ Theron Troxel \_|_/ UNLFC President | o 00201887@bigred.unl.edu /_\_ http://www.unl.edu/crec/SC/Footbag \ ------------------------------------- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:17:45 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01114 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:17:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01110 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:17:44 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1107) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01105 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:17:43 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA02627 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:17:45 -0800 Received: from [207.79.78.21] ([207.79.78.21]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01102; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:17:36 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34C77D90.50E2@dallasfootbag.org> References: <199801231516.JAA19814@bigred.unl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:18:36 -0800 To: derric@dallasfootbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] help Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 9:10 AM -0800 1/22/98, Derric Scalf wrote: >that sounds like paradox whirl. Basically whirl set from oppostie >clipper. This move has been giving me hell since I hit it the first and >only time about 4 months ago. Anyone have any advice on it? Set slightly higher than you might have originally thought, and then WAIT for it to come down. There's a little pause/hop in paradox whirl -- set the bag only slightly to your whirl side, then, just after the set, but before the whirl motion, you pivot into the whirl position, wait a MILLISECOND, then hop as you perform a whirl. Be sure you don't reach way up to hit the whirl.. WAIT for the bag to make its way down. You do paradox whirl on the way down, but to get the right set you have to set it a little higher -- and of course the rule of thumb is: the higher the set, the longer you wait. (Unless of course you're setting high because the move is a HUUUUGE move, which this isn't :-). ) Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:17:48 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01131 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:17:47 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01127 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:17:46 GMT Received: from bag@multi35.netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1122) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01116 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:17:45 GMT Received: from multi35.netcomi.com (multi35.netcomi.com [204.58.155.235]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA02632 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:17:46 -0800 Received: (from bag@localhost) by multi35.netcomi.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) id MAA10273; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:18:48 -0600 Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by multi35.netcomi.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA10266 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:18:46 -0600 Received: from [207.79.78.21] ([207.79.78.21]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01102; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:17:36 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34C77D90.50E2@dallasfootbag.org> References: <199801231516.JAA19814@bigred.unl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:18:36 -0800 Old-To: derric@dallasfootbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] help Cc: freestyle@footbag.org X-Loop: forwarded by derric@dallasfootbag.org To: scalf@utdallas.edu Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 9:10 AM -0800 1/22/98, Derric Scalf wrote: >that sounds like paradox whirl. Basically whirl set from oppostie >clipper. This move has been giving me hell since I hit it the first and >only time about 4 months ago. Anyone have any advice on it? Set slightly higher than you might have originally thought, and then WAIT for it to come down. There's a little pause/hop in paradox whirl -- set the bag only slightly to your whirl side, then, just after the set, but before the whirl motion, you pivot into the whirl position, wait a MILLISECOND, then hop as you perform a whirl. Be sure you don't reach way up to hit the whirl.. WAIT for the bag to make its way down. You do paradox whirl on the way down, but to get the right set you have to set it a little higher -- and of course the rule of thumb is: the higher the set, the longer you wait. (Unless of course you're setting high because the move is a HUUUUGE move, which this isn't :-). ) Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:20:58 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01161 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:20:57 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01157 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:20:56 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1154) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01152 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:20:56 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA02691 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:20:57 -0800 Received: from [207.79.78.21] ([207.79.78.21]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01149; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:20:51 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199801231713.LAA31058@bigred.unl.edu> References: <34C77D90.50E2@dallasfootbag.org> from "Derric Scalf" at Jan 22, 98 11:10:41 am Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:21:48 -0800 To: Theron A Troxel <00201887@bigred.unl.edu> From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] help Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >I guess that would make sense, but the move I'm describing as seen in >Raw Shred: it's when the Torch hits it back to back in the phat moves and >hein combos. It looks like a paradox mirage, but then he bails to >something resembling an osis. Oh, you're talking about PARADOX TORQUE! It's not clip > same in dex > op dex at all! It's clip > same in dex [bod] [dex] > (spin away) [bod] op clip [xbd] [del] Leaving out the [] notation for add categorization, the main difference in this and your notation is the (spin away) part. Very important. :-) It's a sweet 5-adder. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:23:25 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01188 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:23:23 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01181 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:23:23 GMT Received: from bag@multi35.netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1178) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01176 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:23:22 GMT Received: from multi35.netcomi.com (multi35.netcomi.com [204.58.155.235]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA02756 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:23:23 -0800 Received: (from bag@localhost) by multi35.netcomi.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) id MAA10427; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:24:24 -0600 Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by multi35.netcomi.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA10420 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:24:23 -0600 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BD27F9.25CAA760@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:19:27 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein Old-To: "'derric@dallasfootbag.org'" Cc: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] paradox whirl help Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:19:26 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Loop: forwarded by derric@dallasfootbag.org To: scalf@utdallas.edu Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Paradox whirl is definitely a beast to master. Some swing tips that I think about: Thread the needle (quickly thread your dexterity leg up, over, and then down through the little window between the bag and your support leg). Pretend it's just a regular whirl. Watch vid for proper place to set the bag (I often set my paradox whirl too far to the outside, I think that you want to keep the set in pretty tight.) Keep your body OVER the bag when you catch it. Practice. I still haven't hit my offside paradox whirl - maybe another 30 reps today will help. I also REALLY want paradox whirl --> blur and ALMOST stuck it so many funking times on Wed. that I think I'm going to explode if I don't nail it today. Wish me luck. -Ethan -----Original Message----- From: Derric Scalf [SMTP:derric@dallasfootbag.org] Sent: Thursday, January 22, 1998 12:11 PM To: Theron A Troxel Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] help Theron A Troxel wrote: > > //clip//same in//op clip > > What is the name? > -- that sounds like paradox whirl. Basically whirl set from oppostie clipper. This move has been giving me hell since I hit it the first and only time about 4 months ago. Anyone have any advice on it? It keeps hitting my dexterity foot as I'm going around the bag. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:23:27 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01199 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:23:26 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01192 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:23:24 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1189) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01186 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:23:23 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA02750 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:23:20 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BD27F9.25CAA760@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:19:27 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: "'derric@dallasfootbag.org'" Cc: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] paradox whirl help Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:19:26 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Paradox whirl is definitely a beast to master. Some swing tips that I think about: Thread the needle (quickly thread your dexterity leg up, over, and then down through the little window between the bag and your support leg). Pretend it's just a regular whirl. Watch vid for proper place to set the bag (I often set my paradox whirl too far to the outside, I think that you want to keep the set in pretty tight.) Keep your body OVER the bag when you catch it. Practice. I still haven't hit my offside paradox whirl - maybe another 30 reps today will help. I also REALLY want paradox whirl --> blur and ALMOST stuck it so many funking times on Wed. that I think I'm going to explode if I don't nail it today. Wish me luck. -Ethan -----Original Message----- From: Derric Scalf [SMTP:derric@dallasfootbag.org] Sent: Thursday, January 22, 1998 12:11 PM To: Theron A Troxel Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] help Theron A Troxel wrote: > > //clip//same in//op clip > > What is the name? > -- that sounds like paradox whirl. Basically whirl set from oppostie clipper. This move has been giving me hell since I hit it the first and only time about 4 months ago. Anyone have any advice on it? It keeps hitting my dexterity foot as I'm going around the bag. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:30:27 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01244 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:30:21 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01240 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:30:21 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1237) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01235 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:30:20 GMT Received: from imo13.mx.aol.com (imo13.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.167]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA03015; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:30:21 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:28:31 EST To: brat@footbag.org, 00201887@bigred.unl.edu Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] help Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org hey all, I'd like to say the paradox torque is the biggest pain to learn to do, or at least it is for me, i can do it fine without the bag but that doesn't count. any advice for doing pardox torques?? other than pratice my parox drifters? thanks, Josh From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:44:07 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01383 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:44:01 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01379 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:44:00 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1376) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01374 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:44:00 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA03326 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:44:01 -0800 Received: from [207.79.78.21] ([207.79.78.21]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01371; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:43:42 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:45:14 -0800 To: Nageylum From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] help Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Josh C. asks: > I'd like to say the paradox torque is the biggest pain to learn to do, >or at least it is for me, i can do it fine without the bag but that doesn't >count. any advice for doing pardox torques?? other than pratice my parox >drifters? Paradox torque is the mother of all paradox moves. (Well, not really, because of course there are harder moves, but still, you get my point. :-)) It requires strength more than anything. So the more you do other paradox moves (i.e., paradox whirl, paradox mirage, paradox drifter) the better, because it's all about strength training. (But honestly, the balance for paradox-drifter is totally different..) If I were you, I'd practice the following combo: paradox-mirage >> toe Do that over and over again, even if you think you're really good at it. Then, about the third time into it, BAIL to your osis instead of the toe. :-) That's paradox torque. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 17:47:46 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01429 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:47:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01425 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:47:44 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1422) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01420 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 17:47:44 GMT Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.169]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA03469; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 09:47:45 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:47:23 EST To: brat@footbag.org Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] help Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org paradox-mirage >> toe this means just paradox mirages, or paradox mirage to a toe dealy thanks, Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 18:44:32 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01847 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 18:44:07 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01843 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 18:44:06 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1840) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA01838 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 18:44:05 GMT Received: from imo15.mx.aol.com (imo15.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.170]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA04579 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 10:44:06 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 13:43:50 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] shoes Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org hi all, i'm not sure how much this has to do with freestyle footbag, but I was just watching one of them footbag clips from footbag.org, well anyway i notice Tim Kelley, and his lavers were all black, now I thought they only came in white with green or blue soles. now did he color them or something, or can you buy black lavers?? Josh C. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 19:04:30 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02074 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:04:24 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02070 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:04:23 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2066) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02064 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:04:23 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA04967 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:04:25 -0800 Received: from [207.79.78.21] ([206.66.71.78]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02060; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:04:21 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:04:28 -0800 To: Nageylum From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] shoes Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 10:43 AM -0800 1/23/98, Nageylum wrote: > i'm not sure how much this has to do with freestyle footbag, It has *everything* to do with it! :-) >Tim Kelley, and his lavers were all black, now I thought they only came in >white with green or blue soles. now did he color them or something, or can >you buy black lavers?? The mesh material is ALWAYS white (though the more you use 'em, well, you know what happens). The soles are the only things that come in different colors... blue, green, and navy blue (look like black soles). Of course many many many players die their shoes or paint them or personalize them in one way or another. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 19:21:00 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02170 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:20:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02166 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:20:44 GMT Received: from damocles_schwert@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2163) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02161 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:20:44 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F64.hotmail.com [207.82.250.150]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA05401 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:20:45 -0800 Received: (qmail 2905 invoked by uid 0); 23 Jan 1998 19:20:42 -0000 Message-ID: <19980123192042.2904.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 149.175.3.50 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:20:42 PST X-Originating-IP: [149.175.3.50] From: "Andrew Feuerdrache" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] where to buy footbags Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:20:42 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >From "Susan Oliver" Subject: [freestyle] The slow sack you wrote... "Hi I wanted to know witch bag to start out with and what trick I should learn" Susan? My God we're not all white males here? Anyway if your already have kicking down I'd start with balance moves, clipper, sole and heel stalls. Work on your strength and balance try holding the bag for a while to get control. Also spinning kicks and mirage stalls are great for timing, but most importantly do what ever keeps you interest, play to have fun. Also... "There is a bag called the slow sack made by Mattel if you haven't seen it go to http://worldfootbag.com/catalog. I was just wondering if you aprove of it because I might buy it." If I may voice my opinion, for God's sake don't buy it! I started with a knitted bag and regreted it, as soon as I bought a paneled bag my game improved drastically, it's easier to start with one. Slow sacks are worse big and slow they are only good for very basic kicks and even then I think it is better to start the old fasioned way. I would suggest starting with an Adidas 32 panel they're not too pricey, not too hard to find, and a pretty good bag. You can find them through the WFA or Adidas or many sports stores. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 19:39:46 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02290 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:39:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02286 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:39:44 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2283) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02281 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:39:44 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA05948 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:39:46 -0800 Received: from [206.66.71.83] ([206.66.71.83]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02278; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:39:43 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19980123192042.2904.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 11:40:53 -0800 To: "Andrew Feuerdrache" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] where to buy footbags Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 11:20 AM -0800 1/23/98, Andrew Feuerdrache wrote: > Susan? My God we're not all white males here? Well, this gets into my pet peeve (#1032344). And it actually applies in to you, too, Andrew! Pet Peeve #1032344: "People don't correct set up the return address in their e-mail." There are many folks, "Susan" included, who are not who they appear. In that case, it was actually a kid (probably 14) whose name was "Tyler Stefaniuk". He was using his mother's account and didn't know how to change his return address; he also failed to use a signature (always add a signature to your e-mail). But, just as I predicted, within 2 days of joining the list, his mom (or someone) deactivated the account. So he's looong gone. (As list administrator, yes, I get really tired of this type of thing. I even wrote him when he joined a few days ago, asking if in fact he was a kid using his mother's account. He wrote back saying yes, and that his mom was fine with him using it. Two days later, and his account is gone. Why do I waste the time?!?!?!) As for you, Andrew, your last name is not Feuerdrache... it's McCargar. I wish folks would use their real names and set up their return addresses correctly so we can get to know each other and not get confused. > If I may voice my opinion, for God's sake don't buy it! I wholeheartedly agree with your comments. :-) Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 20:44:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02686 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 20:44:48 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02682 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 20:44:48 GMT Received: from zogg13@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2679) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA02677 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 20:44:47 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F10.hotmail.com [207.82.250.21]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA07520 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:44:50 -0800 Received: (qmail 10829 invoked by uid 0); 23 Jan 1998 20:44:49 -0000 Message-ID: <19980123204449.10826.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 206.245.153.32 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:44:49 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.245.153.32] From: "Stephen Miskiewicz" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] The slow sack Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 12:44:49 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > >There is a bag called the slow sack made by mattle if you haven't seen >it go to http://worldfootbag.com/catalog. I was just wondering if you >aprove of it because I might buy it. > > Hello, First things first how new are you to the sport? I buy most of my stuff from footMART. I have never use a slow sack before so I can't tell you what its like. It might help you learn the starting kicks, but I can't tell you for sure. I started with just a simple sipa sipa footbag. Its good for learning the kicks but not for stalling. For simple stalling go for a dirt or sandbag. Easy trick: flying clipper quite simple to learn and looks great. To do the the more complex tricks you have to learn the stalls. Hope this helps. _-Steve-_ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 21:09:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA02911 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 21:09:36 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA02907 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 21:09:35 GMT Received: from kilobit@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2904) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA02902 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 21:09:35 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (F79.hotmail.com [207.82.250.185]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA08129 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 13:09:38 -0800 Received: (qmail 7590 invoked by uid 0); 23 Jan 1998 21:09:37 -0000 Message-ID: <19980123210937.7589.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 208.196.105.222 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 13:09:37 PST X-Originating-IP: [208.196.105.222] From: "The 'Mazin Josh Penney" To: swingert@creighton.edu Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Paradon Torque... Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 13:09:37 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey, 'braska. > TOE > OP OUT [DEX] > SAME IN [DEX] > OP CLIP [DEL], > then I think you mean (back me up Steve) tapping torque--a Tuan Vu > speciality. Gotta try that. Also just thought that the sanme move to >same clip[del] would be tapp'n drifter - really worth tryin, too. But, if you meant: > TOE > OP OUT [DEX] > SAME OUT [DEX] > (BACK SPIN) [BOD] > OP CLIP > [XBD] [DEL], > then I think you mean a Paradon Clipper (??) or a double reverse > miraging torque (or, as Brian Mck. and I call it, a Double Aunt > Jemima). I'm not sure of an "official" name, though. :-) double flux. (flux= reverse miraging osis/backwards torque) JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 21:24:15 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03033 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 21:24:14 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA03029 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 21:24:13 GMT Received: from zogg13@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3026) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03024 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 21:24:12 GMT Received: from f140.hotmail.com (f140.hotmail.com [207.82.251.19]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA08379 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 13:24:15 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by f140.hotmail.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA21636 for Freestyle@footbag.org; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 13:24:15 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199801232124.NAA21636@f140.hotmail.com> Received: from 206.245.153.32 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 13:24:14 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.245.153.32] From: "Stephen Miskiewicz" To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Question on Balance Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 13:24:14 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi everyone, I hit most of my stalls but I sometimes run into this problem. After doing a small hop and stalling the bag I end up losing my balance and taking a second hop witch makes the bag drop to the ground. So my question is should i move my arms more, or bend my knees or do I just have the sence of balance of a water buffalo? _-Steve-_ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 23 23:19:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA03743 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 23:19:21 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA03739 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 23:19:20 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3736) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA03734 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 23:19:19 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA10602 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 15:19:23 -0800 Received: from [206.66.71.83] ([206.66.71.83]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA03731; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 23:19:16 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199801232124.NAA21636@f140.hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 15:20:19 -0800 To: "Stephen Miskiewicz" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Question on Balance Cc: Freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 1:24 PM -0800 1/23/98, Stephen Miskiewicz wrote: > I hit most of my stalls but I sometimes run into this problem. After >doing a small hop and stalling the bag I end up losing my balance and >taking a second hop witch makes the bag drop to the ground. So my >question is should i move my arms more, or bend my knees or do I just >have the sence of balance of a water buffalo? Ahhh, my son! You have touched on the *essence* of the "Magic Hop"! The reason we tell people to hop when they stall is exactly because of this -- if you can time the hop so that you land *exactly* when you catch the footbag, and then use the spring action of your legs to push back out into a set into the next move (or kick if you're just beginning), then you combine the hop you need for your balance with the same hop you need for the stall, cushioning, and push out! So, here's what I think you're doing wrong -- you're hopping TOO EARLY! Try waiting to hop so that you LAND on your hopping foot *exactly* as you stall the bag on your stalling foot! Then, don't stay on that foot; plan to push back out and push the bag straight up off your stalling foot so you can go to the next move. Another big piece of advice that I give many new players -- try to KEEP YOUR HEEL OFF THE GROUND. This is a good way to keep your bodyweight slightly forward.. Many players fall back slightly, and it is very hard to keep your balance when you do that. If you stay on the BALLS OF YOUR FEET as you hop and stall, you will find yourself much better off, balancewise. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 24 03:29:04 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA05522 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 03:28:49 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA05518 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 03:28:47 GMT Received: from jsbx@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5515) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA05513 for ; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 03:28:46 GMT Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com (imo12.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.166]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA14912 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 19:28:51 -0800 From: JSBX Message-ID: <473d1e88.34c95f4a@aol.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 22:26:00 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] The winter of my discontent Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello Kickers! I have been kicking since June (thanks Penney), and I am already on my second pair of lavers. As of now, the highest add move i can hit consistently is the Da Da Curve, but I am trying very hard to hit legbeaters and cross body rakes. Now the deal is, I live in New York, and I can only kick in long pants here, so I think it would be pointless to modify my lavers, because the weight difference would be negligible, especially because of my winter clothes. Does modifying your lavers truly have an effect on what kind of tricks you can hit, or does that only kick in once you reach a certain level? I'd like some advice as to whether or not I should modify my lavers at all, wait until spring, or operate now. Thanks, KeN SoMoLiNoS P.S.-for all those people trying to hit pogo paradox blurry symposium triage with a cherry on top, I salute you. Knowing that people aspire to such insane levels fuels my determination to improve and get down the basics, like double leg overs. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 24 07:24:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA06398 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 07:24:14 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA06394 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 07:24:13 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6391) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA06389 for ; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 07:24:12 GMT From: GimmieZo@aol.com Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com (imo11.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.165]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA17887 for ; Fri, 23 Jan 1998 23:24:19 -0800 Received: from GimmieZo@aol.com by imo11.mx.aol.com (IMOv12/Dec1997) id 2DTVa21758 for ; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 02:24:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5ff7aeb7.34c99714@aol.com> Date: Sat, 24 Jan 1998 02:24:02 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Facile Legend Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 86 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey, anyone out there have a facile legend? I lost my Juice Facile and i need to order another bag so i was thinking about a facile legend... Lemme know how it kicks if you have one From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 03:20:10 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA02630 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 03:18:23 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA02626 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 03:18:21 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2623) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA02621 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 03:18:21 GMT Received: from imo19.mx.aol.com (imo19.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.176]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA32418 for ; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 19:18:25 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: <75159f5b.34caaeb6@aol.com> Date: Sat, 24 Jan 1998 22:17:07 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] lavers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org hey stylers, I've always been under the idea most people who kick with lavers removed the canvas backing from the shoes. But recently I found many of the people i talk to leave the canvas in. Now this got me thinking if there are any advantages to leaving the canvas in. I know from the two weeks I left the canvas backing in, in my first pair, it just didn' t feel right kicking with it in. But anyway i'm writing to see if there is any advantages to keeping the canvas stuff in, also is it legal to compete with the canvas backing taken out?? Have footbag, can't travel Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 03:52:07 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA02716 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 03:49:36 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA02712 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 03:49:35 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2709) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA02707 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 03:49:35 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA00157 for ; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 19:49:40 -0800 Received: from [207.79.78.21] ([207.79.78.21]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA02704; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 03:49:29 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <75159f5b.34caaeb6@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 24 Jan 1998 19:50:58 -0800 To: Nageylum From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] lavers Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 7:17 PM -0800 1/24/98, Nageylum wrote: > I've always been under the idea most people who kick with lavers removed >the canvas backing from the shoes. But recently I found many of the people i >talk to leave the canvas in. Almost everyone removes the canvas from the instep; but not nearly so many remove it from the rest of the shoe. I don't recommend going beyond the instep unless you know what you're doing. The benefit is that, along with pulling out the instep and cutting the insole back to fit the contour of the sole, you make the inside surface relax and not stick out. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 04:30:35 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA02848 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 04:29:03 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA02844 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 04:29:01 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2841) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA02839 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 04:29:01 GMT From: Nageylum@aol.com Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com (imo11.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.165]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA00736; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 20:29:06 -0800 Received: from Nageylum@aol.com by imo11.mx.aol.com (IMOv12/Dec1997) id 2XMOa21759; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 23:25:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 24 Jan 1998 23:25:56 EST To: brat@footbag.org Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [freestyle] lavers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 52 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 98-01-24 23:18:35 EST, brat@footbag.org writes: > I don't recommend going beyond the > instep unless you know what you're doing. I've never really had a problem with the toe part, i've found all you need is a stitch remover and a pen shaft. Okay, now i don't feel as odd, but should the canvas of the out-step be left in???? Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 04:32:45 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA02872 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 04:31:29 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA02868 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 04:31:29 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2865) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA02863 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 04:31:28 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA00786 for ; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 20:31:34 -0800 Received: from [207.79.78.21] ([207.79.78.21]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA02860; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 04:31:25 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 24 Jan 1998 20:33:05 -0800 To: Nageylum@aol.com From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] lavers Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Josh C. wrote: > I've never really had a problem with the toe part, i've found all you need >is a stitch remover and a pen shaft. Okay, now i don't feel as odd, but >should the canvas of the out-step be left in???? The only part you really need to take out is the instep. The other parts don't do much for you, in my opinion. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 07:30:31 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA03200 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 07:29:12 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA03196 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 07:29:10 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3193) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA03191 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 07:29:10 GMT Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com (imo18.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.175]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA03168 for ; Sat, 24 Jan 1998 23:29:17 -0800 From: Gimmie Zo Message-ID: <2244e827.34cae9b9@aol.com> Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 02:28:40 EST To: StinKyKiwi@aol.com, Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Facile Legend Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 98-01-24 09:31:36 EST, you write: << Is there even such thing as a facile legend? Matt >> Yeah, i think that you can order them directly from flying clipper but im not sure, 1-800-Foot-fun Lates, Joey From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 14:10:22 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA04050 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 14:09:04 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA04046 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 14:09:02 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4043) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA04041 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 14:09:02 GMT Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com (imo18.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.175]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA08620 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 06:09:11 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 09:07:27 EST To: GimmieZo@aol.com, StinKyKiwi@aol.com, Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Facile Legend Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 98-01-25 02:38:11 EST, GimmieZo@aol.com writes: > order them directly from flying clipper but im not > sure, 1-800-Foot-fun is it cheaper to order directly from flying clipper for any of their bags? Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 16:11:03 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00330 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 16:09:12 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00326 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 16:09:10 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (323) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00321 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 16:09:09 GMT Received: from imo20.mx.aol.com (imo20.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.177]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA09591 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 08:09:10 -0800 From: Nageylum Message-ID: <1cdd87fc.34cb6395@aol.com> Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 11:08:51 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] wierd clip Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all kickers I was watching one of the footbag clips at footbag.org, the rick and tim one to be exact, and i noticed something funny, at then end of it (within the last 5-8 frames) it has a frame ontop of another one, and it's an older fellow holding a cup, and it says "nice one!!" now anyone else notice this??? and i was just wondering what it's saposed to mean. Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 17:07:03 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA00448 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 17:05:42 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA00444 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 17:05:41 GMT Received: from f0ne@concentric.net () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (441) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA00439 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 17:05:41 GMT Received: from uhura.concentric.net (uhura.concentric.net [206.173.119.93]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA10226 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 09:05:41 -0800 Received: from cliff.concentric.net (cliff [206.173.119.90]) by uhura.concentric.net (8.8.8/(98/01/20 5.9)) id MAA14141; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 12:05:40 -0500 (EST) [1-800-745-2747 The Concentric Network] Received: from fone (cnc003062.concentric.net [206.83.89.62]) by cliff.concentric.net (8.8.8) id MAA13292; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 12:05:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <34CB70BB.2A62@concentric.net> Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 11:04:59 -0600 From: Steve Wallace X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-GZone (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] just wondering Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ello all, I was just wondering about the rate at wich I have been learning, you know if I am going to slow. right now i can hit most of the delays (except sole, and outsides .... god i hate outsides.) I can do pendulum, and walkovers. I have gotten this all in about 3 months with a sipa bag. I have some lavers and a juice ordered. Well anyway tell me what you think and give me some advice =). Steve Wallace From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 17:39:08 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA00571 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 17:37:46 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA00567 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 17:37:46 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (564) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA00562 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 17:37:45 GMT Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com (imo17.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.174]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA10589 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 09:37:46 -0800 From: Gimmie Zo Message-ID: <6c746f1b.34cb783d@aol.com> Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 12:36:59 EST To: Nageylum@aol.com, StinKyKiwi@aol.com, Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Facile Legend Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 98-01-25 09:11:56 EST, Nageylum@aol.com writes: << is it cheaper to order directly from flying clipper for any of their bags >> I dunno, give em a call From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 19:02:05 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA00825 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:00:47 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA00821 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:00:46 GMT Received: from stinkykiwi@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (818) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA00816 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:00:46 GMT Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com (imo16.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.172]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA11936 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 11:00:47 -0800 From: StinKyKiwi Message-ID: <12d36d30.34cb8ad2@aol.com> Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:56:12 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Progress Report Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Footbaggers, I have been doing freestyle for about two months now, and I can hit most all dex. and legovers. I got all the delays except sole down.Judging on my progress in 2 months with a juice and Lavers, how do you think I am doing so far? am I a little ahead? Behind? or where I am supposed to be? What tricks should I move on to learn next? Thanks, Matt Avery From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 19:21:22 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA00886 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:20:07 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA00882 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:20:06 GMT Received: from gmarie@silcom.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (879) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA00877 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:20:06 GMT Received: from beach.silcom.com (beach.silcom.com [199.201.128.19]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA12191 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 11:20:07 -0800 Received: from dial (pm6-40.sba1.avtel.net [207.71.222.168]) by beach.silcom.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA05763 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 11:16:50 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 11:16:50 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199801251916.LAA05763@beach.silcom.com> X-Sender: gmarie@mail.silcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Gay Marie Subject: [freestyle] Legend ^Brandon Parker Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Can anyone give me a good profile on the Lengend, compared to the Juice.... Brandon parker From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 19:41:30 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA00939 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:40:14 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA00935 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:40:13 GMT Received: from ifogle@mail.coin.missouri.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (932) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA00930 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:40:13 GMT Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA12549 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 11:40:14 -0800 Received: from coinc0.coin.missouri.edu (coinc0 [198.209.253.6]) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA03566; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:39:47 -0600 (CST) Received: by coinc0.coin.missouri.edu (8.8.5) id NAA05249; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:39:45 -0600 (CST) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:39:44 -0600 (CST) From: Ida Bettis Fogle X-Sender: ifogle@coinc0 To: GimmieZo@aol.com cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Facile Legend In-Reply-To: <5ff7aeb7.34c99714@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Sat, 24 Jan 1998 GimmieZo@aol.com wrote: > Hey, anyone out there have a facile legend? I lost my Juice Facile and i need > to order another bag so i was thinking about a facile legend... Lemme know how > it kicks if you have one > I have one I've been using forever & it's great. I don't know if they all are. I'm working (well, barely since I hardly kick these days) on breaking in a second one. Ida Bettis Fogle; ifogle@mail.coin.missouri.edu From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 19:44:39 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA00956 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:43:24 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA00952 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:43:23 GMT Received: from ifogle@mail.coin.missouri.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (949) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA00947 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 19:43:23 GMT Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA12613 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 11:43:24 -0800 Received: from coinc0.coin.missouri.edu (coinc0 [198.209.253.6]) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA03870; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:42:57 -0600 (CST) Received: by coinc0.coin.missouri.edu (8.8.5) id NAA05585; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:42:56 -0600 (CST) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:42:56 -0600 (CST) From: Ida Bettis Fogle X-Sender: ifogle@coinc0 To: Andrew Feuerdrache cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] where to buy footbags In-Reply-To: <19980123192042.2904.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Fri, 23 Jan 1998, Andrew Feuerdrache wrote: > > > From "Susan Oliver" > Subject: [freestyle] The slow sack > > you wrote... > > "Hi I wanted to know witch bag to start out with and what trick I should > learn" > > Susan? My God we're not all white males here? No, we're not. Ida Bettis Fogle; ifogle@mail.coin.missouri.edu From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Jan 25 21:19:09 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA01269 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 21:17:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA01265 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 21:17:44 GMT Received: from gimmiezo@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1262) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA01260 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 21:17:44 GMT Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com (imo16.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.172]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA14339 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:17:46 -0800 From: Gimmie Zo Message-ID: <52bb70ac.34cbabab@aol.com> Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 16:16:25 EST To: gmarie@silcom.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Legend ^Brandon Parker Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 98-01-25 14:23:46 EST, gmarie@silcom.com writes: << Can anyone give me a good profile on the Lengend, compared to the Juice.... Brandon parker >> I really like the design of the legend because it isnt as boring as the juice, but im not sure if the legend comes in facile. If you want a synthetic suede bag then the facile is a really nice one, but so is the juice. I would recommend a facile bag for sure. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 02:01:12 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA02117 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 02:00:56 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA02113 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 02:00:55 GMT Received: from kilobit@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2110) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA02108 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 02:00:54 GMT Received: from f140.hotmail.com (f140.hotmail.net [207.82.251.19]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA18386 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 18:00:59 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by f140.hotmail.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA02314 for freestyle@footbag.org; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 18:00:58 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199801260200.SAA02314@f140.hotmail.com> Received: from 130.91.187.115 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 18:00:58 PST X-Originating-IP: [130.91.187.115] From: "The 'Mazin Josh Penney" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] lavers Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 18:00:58 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >advantages to keeping the canvas stuff in, Keeps your feet warmer, socks cleaner.(Thanks, S-nu-niliani) >also is it legal to compete with the canvas backing taken >out?? Yes. Now read the rules of Footbag Sports. Can we please discuss something besides info found in the FAQ of footbag worldwide? Where can I find the "any" key? JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 02:52:31 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA02302 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 02:52:31 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id CAA02298 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 02:52:29 GMT Received: from markdenton@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2295) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA02293 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 02:52:29 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f131.hotmail.net [207.82.251.10]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA19180 for ; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 18:52:34 -0800 Received: (qmail 15903 invoked by uid 0); 26 Jan 1998 02:52:33 -0000 Message-ID: <19980126025233.15902.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 209.47.115.182 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 25 Jan 1998 18:52:33 PST X-Originating-IP: [209.47.115.182] From: "Mark Denton" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Progress Report Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 18:52:33 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Matt, Good stuff. A problem I had when i started freestyling was I skipped some of the basics(like leg-overs, i still have to learn my left). In my opinion it's all personal. I have been at it for 5 months and I find that when learning new tricks I get in slumps. For example until a couple weeks ago I had been learning a couple new tricks a week, then all of a sudden my progress slowed. But in the last week I have learned to Symposium Whirl, Barfly, Double over down, paradon, and butterfly swirl. It's all personal but if you get discouraged don't stop, just work on the tricks you can do and when it's time you'll learn new stuff. Keep Kickin' Mark Denton ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 12:07:28 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id MAA04325 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 12:07:05 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id MAA04321 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 12:07:00 GMT Received: from eric@netcomi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4318) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA04316 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 12:06:56 GMT Received: from stick.netcomi.com (fit.netcomi.com [204.58.155.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA26741 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 04:07:03 -0800 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by stick.netcomi.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA00619 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 06:07:01 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: stick.netcomi.com: eric owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 06:07:00 -0600 (CST) From: Eric Burgess To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] what's this called? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org what's it called when you execute a move that lands on toe, but instead of catching it normally, you "trap" it there with the bottom of your other foot? i think peter irish does it in 96 shred on a blur and i've been able to hit a few that way myself...it's lots of fun, i just don't know the name for it. stepping and stomping would both be great names if they weren't already taken...oh well eric From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 14:21:53 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA04817 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 14:21:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA04813 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 14:21:43 GMT Received: from swingert@creighton.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4810) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA04808 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 14:21:43 GMT Received: from mailjay.creighton.edu (mailjay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.15]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA28262 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 06:21:51 -0800 Received: from bluejay.creighton.edu by mailjay.creighton.edu with SMTP (1.40.112.8/16.2) id AA015554510; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 08:21:50 -0600 Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 08:21:50 -0600 (CST) From: Sean Wingert Reply-To: Sean Wingert To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] "Nice One" on Shredded Wheat Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Nageylum asked about the Weird Video Clip... The reason for the older guy saying "Nice One!!" on the video clip of Tim on footbag.org is actually simple. The clip following Tim is of that guy who has a big smile on his face with a running caption saying "Nice One." You'll have to get the video (Shredded Wheat) to really get the effect, which I think, is rather humorous. Sean From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 16:17:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00690 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 16:16:17 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00686 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 16:16:16 GMT Received: from grandincredible@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (683) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00681 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 16:16:15 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f72.hotmail.net [207.82.250.158]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA30170 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 08:16:16 -0800 Received: (qmail 17287 invoked by uid 0); 26 Jan 1998 16:16:14 -0000 Message-ID: <19980126161614.17286.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 38.249.188.156 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 08:16:14 PST X-Originating-IP: [38.249.188.156] From: "Daniel Kramer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Legend ^Brandon Parker Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 08:16:14 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Can anyone give me a good profile on the Lengend, compared to the Juice.... > > Brandon parker OK, check this out. facile Juice = moderate to high level of dankness synthesuede Juice = not bad for beginners facile legend = moderately dank, but will take longer to break in synthesuede Legend = looks nice on your window sill In my next email, I will compare toe cheese and fromunda cheese. DanKramer ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 16:53:10 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00962 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 16:53:09 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00958 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 16:53:08 GMT Received: from grandincredible@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (955) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00953 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 16:53:07 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f66.hotmail.net [207.82.250.152]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA31539 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 08:53:08 -0800 Received: (qmail 18835 invoked by uid 0); 26 Jan 1998 16:53:07 -0000 Message-ID: <19980126165307.18834.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 38.249.188.156 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 08:53:06 PST X-Originating-IP: [38.249.188.156] From: "Daniel Kramer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: what's this called? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 08:53:06 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >what's it called when you execute a move that lands on toe, but >instead of catching it normally, you "trap" it there with the bottom >of your other foot? i think peter irish does it in 96 shred on a >blur and i've been able to hit a few that way myself...it's lots of >fun, i just don't know the name for it. stepping and stomping would >both be great names if they weren't already taken...oh well > >eric I was at my first Worlds in Montreal in 1996 checking out the net finals. In between matches, Josh Penney and I decide to get some food. As we approach the hot dog stand, I see this short, stocky guy chomping on a weiner. The man looks at me and says, "Hi, I'm John Stalberger." After a few moments of processing this statement, I reply, "Ohhhh. I love that move." Later on in the day, I learn that he not only has a move named after him (see eric's letter above), but also invented the footbag with that Mike Marshall guy. Oh well. Is it a Stalberger or a Stall-Burger? Who invented this move and who named it? DanK ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 17:01:52 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01027 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:01:50 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01023 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:01:50 GMT Received: from grandincredible@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1020) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01018 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:01:49 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f66.hotmail.net [207.82.250.152]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA31703 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:01:50 -0800 Received: (qmail 21746 invoked by uid 0); 26 Jan 1998 17:01:49 -0000 Message-ID: <19980126170149.21745.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 38.249.188.156 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:01:49 PST X-Originating-IP: [38.249.188.156] From: "Daniel Kramer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] you're one to talk Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:01:49 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >Yes. Now read the rules of Footbag Sports. Can we please discuss >something besides info found in the FAQ of footbag worldwide? Where >can I find the "any" key? > > >JP Ooooooooooh, Josh wants some REAL footbag discussion. I think Josh needs to go to the e-mail archives to check out some of his old posts. DK ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 17:32:44 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01230 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:32:27 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01226 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:32:27 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1223) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01221 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:32:26 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA32320 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:32:27 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.03.0014/4c.adoc) with ESMTP id pa147513 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 11:41:01 -0600 Subject: Re: [freestyle] you're one to talk Message-Id: <000000525922968681103@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 11:38:23 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: grandincredible@hotmail.com (Daniel Kramer), freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, Jan 26, 1998, 11:01:49 AM US CST Daniel Kramer wrote: >>Yes. Now read the rules of Footbag Sports. Can we please discuss >>something besides info found in the FAQ of footbag worldwide? Where >> >>JP > >Ooooooooooh, Josh wants some REAL footbag discussion. I think Josh needs >to go to the e-mail archives to check out some of his old posts. Yes, you need to quiet him before I get riled up and start stuffing your inboxes with inane freestyle babble that few besides I might care about. I'm not talking about rehashing the Great Paradox Debate, either. Be still my fingers! -- Derrick Fogle -- Heartland Eye Banks -- dfogle@mlerf.org -- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 17:34:54 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01283 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:34:53 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01279 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:34:52 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1276) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01274 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:34:52 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA32362 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:34:53 -0800 Received: from [207.79.78.21] ([207.79.78.21]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01271; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:34:49 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <000000525922968681103@mlerf.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:36:04 -0800 To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] you're one to talk Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 9:38 AM -0800 1/26/98, Derrick Fogle, MLERF wrote: >not talking about rehashing the Great Paradox Debate, either. Oohh, oooh.. Did someone say "paradox"?! Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 17:39:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01308 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:39:49 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01304 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:39:49 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1301) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01299 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:39:48 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA32485 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:39:49 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.03.0014/4c.adoc) with ESMTP id va147519 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 11:48:26 -0600 Subject: Re: [freestyle] you're one to talk Message-Id: <000000525972968681544@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 11:45:44 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, Jan 26, 1998, 11:36:04 AM US CST Steve Goldberg wrote: >Oohh, oooh.. Did someone say "paradox"?! No! Down Steve, DOWN! -- Derrick Fogle -- Heartland Eye Banks -- dfogle@mlerf.org -- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 19:22:26 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA01867 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 19:22:18 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA01863 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 19:22:18 GMT Received: from damocles_schwert@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1860) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA01858 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 19:22:17 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f138.hotmail.net [207.82.251.17]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA02357 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 11:22:18 -0800 Received: (qmail 2722 invoked by uid 0); 26 Jan 1998 19:22:14 -0000 Message-ID: <19980126192214.2721.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 149.175.14.150 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 11:22:13 PST X-Originating-IP: [149.175.14.150] From: "Andrew Feuerdrache" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] diversity of sports Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 11:22:13 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Sun, 25 Jan 1998 13:42:57 -0600 (CST) >> From "Susan Oliver" >> Subject: [freestyle] The slow sack >> >> you wrote... >> >> "Hi I wanted to know witch bag to start out with and what trick I should >> learn" >> >> Susan? My God we're not all white males here? > >No, we're not. > >Ida Bettis Fogle; ifogle@mail.coin.missouri.edu I was dreading what the response to that was going to be, but believe me I'm relieved your our there. This last worlds it was truly great to see people kicking who are not only male high school kids, I even saw you compete, not bad for a girl (oh come on I was just kidding). I also saw Sam Conlon compete and if your listening Sam I still dream to be as good as you. However, unfortunately, my personal experience with the sport in Portland, Oregon has been largely homogeneous (Kendal never comes out to play with us). I don't really understand why this sport doesn't appeal to more women, anybody have a theory? (as a last note to the overworked Steve Goldberg about incorect sender names, don't you like a little mistory in your life?) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Jan 26 23:11:00 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04112 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 23:10:33 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04108 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 23:10:31 GMT Received: from ethanesmay@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4105) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04103 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 23:10:30 GMT Received: from imo15.mx.aol.com (imo15.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.170]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA07740 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 1998 15:10:34 -0800 From: ETHANesmay Message-ID: Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 18:06:05 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] What one to use Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org what is the best hack to use i have a magic and want to up grade to some thing a little better is thir one that is better for some thing that has only played for about a year From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Jan 27 22:34:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03240 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 27 Jan 1998 22:33:15 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03236 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Tue, 27 Jan 1998 22:33:13 GMT Received: from zogg13@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3233) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03231 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 1998 22:33:13 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f121.hotmail.com [207.82.250.214]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA03534 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 1998 14:33:16 -0800 Received: (qmail 28450 invoked by uid 0); 27 Jan 1998 22:33:15 -0000 Message-ID: <19980127223315.28449.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 206.245.145.6 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 27 Jan 1998 14:33:15 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.245.145.6] From: "Stephen Miskiewicz" To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Question on Lavers and my shoes Content-Type: text/plain Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 14:33:15 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was thinking about getting a pair of Rod Lavers but before I do I need to know some things that aren't on The WFA FAQ. How long do they last? If I wear them everywhere how long of a life span are we talking about? On tying the shoes, anyone know of anywhere that they have pictures of what the shoes look like at the end of tying and some pics of someone making the modifications(I'm still not sure how to do those even after reading the faq)? Currently I have a pair of Simple shoes and they only have six holes on each side...... how many holes should I skip when tying them? Well thats all for now I hope you guys can answer these for me. _-Steve-_ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 00:57:40 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA04227 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 00:57:36 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA04223 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 00:57:35 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4220) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA04218 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 00:57:35 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA07089 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 1998 16:57:39 -0800 Received: from [206.66.71.88] ([207.79.78.21]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA04212; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 00:56:43 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19980127223315.28449.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 16:58:04 -0800 To: "Stephen Miskiewicz" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Question on Lavers and my shoes Cc: Freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 2:33 PM -0800 1/27/98, Stephen Miskiewicz wrote: > I was thinking about getting a pair of Rod Lavers but before I do I >need to know some things that aren't on The WFA FAQ. Please do not confuse www.footbag.org with the WFA. They are NOT RELATED. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 03:11:51 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA05229 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 03:11:49 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA05225 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 03:11:48 GMT Received: from hill9361@uidaho.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5222) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA05220 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 03:11:48 GMT Received: from raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (raven.csrv.uidaho.edu [129.101.192.43]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA10178 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 1998 19:11:52 -0800 Received: from localhost (hill9361@localhost) by raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id TAA29144; Tue, 27 Jan 1998 19:11:37 -0800 (PST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.csrv.uidaho.edu: hill9361 owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 19:11:36 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hillebrand X-Sender: hill9361@raven.csrv.uidaho.edu To: Stephen Miskiewicz cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Question on Lavers and my shoes In-Reply-To: <19980127223315.28449.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello there, I'm not a pro, yet :), but I have a good suggestion for serious players. I loved my lavers when I first got them, but after a year and a half, holes wore through the front of the soles. I fixed them with FreeSole, which also can be used to fix bags, but I also ordered a new pair of lavers. My new pair, of course, had brand new soles, which were a lot bigger and cumbersome. I hated kicking in them, so now I wear the new lavers around everywhere I go *except* when I kick footbag. I wear my repaird older lavers for kicking.....and I am trying to get my new lavers to a more broken-in state. So, in my opinion, it's ideal to have two pairs at all times. __________________________________________________________________________ Matt P. Hillebrand hill9361@uidaho.edu http://www.uidaho.edu/~hill9361 From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 06:24:57 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id GAA06018 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 06:24:49 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id GAA06014 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 06:24:47 GMT Received: from markdenton@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6011) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA06009 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 06:24:47 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f10.hotmail.com [207.82.250.21]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA13462 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 1998 22:24:53 -0800 Received: (qmail 16547 invoked by uid 0); 28 Jan 1998 06:24:52 -0000 Message-ID: <19980128062452.16546.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 209.47.115.82 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 27 Jan 1998 22:24:51 PST X-Originating-IP: [209.47.115.82] From: "Mark Denton" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Gone? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 22:24:51 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello Although this has nothing to do with freestyle I just had to know. I was told that Kenny Shults is quitting competition footbag. Can this be so? Mark Denton ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 06:42:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id GAA06243 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 06:42:45 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id GAA06236 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 06:42:44 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6233) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA06231 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 06:42:43 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA13996 for ; Tue, 27 Jan 1998 22:42:50 -0800 Received: from [206.66.71.88] ([207.79.78.21]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA06225; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 06:42:35 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19980128062452.16546.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 22:43:15 -0800 To: "Mark Denton" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Gone? Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 10:24 PM -0800 1/27/98, Mark Denton wrote: >Although this has nothing to do with freestyle I just had to know. >I was told that Kenny Shults is quitting competition footbag. Can this >be so? Kenny has only "retired" from singles net at this point. He doesn't always compete in every event, though, so it's unclear what events if any he will compete in this year. I mean, the guy is *ooolllldddd*. :-) Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 09:01:28 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id JAA07800 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 09:01:26 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id JAA07796 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 09:01:26 GMT Received: from schr4160@tao.sou.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7793) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA07791 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 09:01:26 GMT Received: from TAO.sou.edu (Tao.sou.edu [140.211.92.6]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA15867 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 01:01:33 -0800 Received: from 206.151.159.53 (ip50.sou.mind.net [206.151.159.53]) by TAO.sou.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA10566 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 01:05:01 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34CE85A2.3CB4@tao.sou.edu> Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 01:10:58 +0000 From: "schrodt, forest" X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] [footbag] SHoes ^Brandon Parker] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org on Jan. 25 >Gay Marie wrote: > Does anyone else use Birkinstocks to hack with, I would like to get >some Lavers but I dont have the flow right now, and can any one give me >a good profile on the Legend footbag. > > Thanx: Brandon parker Hi Brandon. I know quite a few people who shred with Berkinstocks. A friend of mine in Eugene OR. does some pretty nice moves with a pair of Berks. I would sugest that if you like kicking in sandals that you change from Berks to Teva sandals. They offer more suport and better all round stalling surfaces (especialy inside delays) than Berks do. I have been kicking in Teva's for quite some time with great success. I competed at Worlds this last year and got 4th place in intermediate. One of the newest BAP shredders, David Holton, rips it up in Teva's. What I really like about kicking in sandals is that I can feel the footbag when it is on my foot. I have been comparing Teva's to Laver's for quite some time now. I have had a few people try to convert me to a Laver kicker. The conclusion to my comparison is this. *Teva superior points: - superior inside delay surface (spoon) - can feel the footbag better than Laver's - inables some unusual moves ( tip of toe stall, inside delay>pull out[see Tuans shred video of worlds 97 w/David Holton]) - over all superior catching surfaces (yes even toe stalls. I can pull my toes up to make a spoon shape to catch the bag. Also I don't have the ridges that converted Lavers have that can hinder your toe setts, especialy pixie sett.) - air conditioning *Teva inferior points: - less consistant sets (the spoon shaped inside delay surface, while having excelent catchabilty, can sometimes interfere with the setting of the footbag.) - too cold in winter - people cannot reconize you as a footbagger. With Lavers people know right away that you play and will apraoch you. Let me know what you all think of my comparison. I would love to hear if anybody has anything to add. I personally have never kicked in lavers but have kicked in shoes like them. I liked the Tevas much more. Forest Schrodt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 14:34:18 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA09282 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 14:34:14 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA09278 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 14:34:12 GMT Received: from kilobit@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (9275) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA09273 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 14:34:12 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f17.hotmail.com [207.82.250.28]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA19752 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 06:34:21 -0800 Received: (qmail 29113 invoked by uid 0); 28 Jan 1998 14:34:10 -0000 Message-ID: <19980128143410.29112.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 209.109.225.100 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 06:34:10 PST X-Originating-IP: [209.109.225.100] From: "The 'Mazin Josh Penney" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] SHoes Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 06:34:10 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > *Teva inferior points: You left out the danger of ripping a toenail up, off your foot. Since Teva's are open-air, they offer your feet little protection from all sorts of nasty things... cold being one of the least (you could always play in socks). Let us not forget the enormous amount of dirt, sweat, bacteria (etc) accumulated by feet. I live in a dirty town, and playing in sandals of any kind is highly UNreccommended. For those of you playing on grassy fields, go for it; I've had my day in sandals, and a new day has dawned - The day of the Rod Laver. I haven't since kicked a stray rock, dog, or passerby resulting in personal injury. JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 18:48:38 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01317 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 18:48:06 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01313 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 18:48:04 GMT Received: from damocles_schwert@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1310) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA01308 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 18:48:04 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f65.hotmail.com [207.82.250.151]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA25091 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 10:48:05 -0800 Received: (qmail 25724 invoked by uid 0); 28 Jan 1998 18:48:03 -0000 Message-ID: <19980128184803.25723.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 149.175.3.45 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 10:48:03 PST X-Originating-IP: [149.175.3.45] From: "Andrew Feuerdrache" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] [footbag] SHoes ^Brandon Parker] Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 10:48:03 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Forest, you wrote- "What I really like about kicking in sandals is that I can feel the footbag when it is on my foot. I have been comparing Teva's to Laver's for quite some time now." Many pro players, Rick Reese comes to mind because he showed me, cut off much of the lining of their Laver's on the toes and instep so that they can feel of the bag better. They also cut off most of the sides of the "toe box" so the bag doesn't get caught. However, personally I don't think either modified Laver's or sandals are a good enough approach. Feet are rounded and sloped to one side, if you curl your toes to counter this your not getting a consistent surface for the bag to land on like shoes have. Laver's aren't much better, the sides of the toe box make an awkward barrier for releases. The problem is that Laver's weren't designed for footbag, it was just on accident that they are pretty good for it. By my reasoning if the WFA alone has over 40,000 members and if they each are buying a pair of shoes for kicking each year at $60 that's 2.4 million dollars a year, which may not be much to a big company like Adidas you'd think it's incentive enough for someone to design us a shoe. Also nice job comparing Tevas and Laver's. Andrew ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 20:53:52 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02311 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 20:53:48 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA02307 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 20:53:47 GMT Received: from zogg13@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2304) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA02302 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 20:53:46 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f96.hotmail.com [207.82.250.215]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA28904 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 12:53:48 -0800 Received: (qmail 27826 invoked by uid 0); 28 Jan 1998 20:53:47 -0000 Message-ID: <19980128205347.27825.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 206.245.145.54 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 12:53:47 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.245.145.54] From: "Steve Miskiewicz" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] a quick Thanks Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 15:53:47 EST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi everyone, I would just like to thank everyone who wrote to me about the Lavers. I would thank each of you personsally but so many people answered me. Well I think I'm going to get myself a pair of them (even if they aren't the best looking shoe out there). Thats it. I guess I'll got kick inside now(I would kick outside but I don't want a icy branch falling on my head). _-Steve-_ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 21:28:16 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA02672 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 21:28:09 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA02668 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 21:28:09 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2665) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA02663 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 21:28:09 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA29691 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 13:28:11 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BD2C09.2BE83D10@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 16:24:13 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] mind games Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 16:24:12 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org The bag gets tossed to a fellow circle shredder, he commences his dance, you follow his progression, noting technique, voicing encouragement, planning your own. Possible combinations shuffle for selection within your eager anticipation, a projected image of success whets your pallet and captivates your desire. The combination proves resolute in your mind's eye. Romanticized and glorified, silent and graceful, slicing the ethos with brilliant precision. The bag is finally tossed your way. Feel the comfort of it striking your insteps as you kick it, establishing rhythm and balance, gearing up for the zone. Fwhooomm, an extreme mixture of kinetic exertion and unconscious habit enraptures your being. Your pre-visualized combo flows out into actualized niceness. It catalyzes you into the unreflective effectiveness and personified beauty of the intangible freestyle bliss. You toss the bag like a delicate feather around and through your rampaging legs and body. Each clipper caressing sympathetically, each leg dexterity delivering automatically, moves happen the instant they cognitatively occur. Slicing, dicing, firing, erupting. NO! The bag falls, the zone is over, gravity wins, the sedate perspective of reality returns, a surge of continuing energy coarses up and out of you. You pass the bag... gasp for air... anticipate the next go around. Ethan From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 22:08:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03054 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:08:18 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03050 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:08:17 GMT Received: from mstrong@ix.netcom.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3047) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03045 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:08:17 GMT Received: from dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.6]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA30646 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 14:08:19 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id QAA07299 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 16:08:15 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx7-49.ix.netcom.com(207.94.122.177) by dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma007262; Wed Jan 28 16:07:40 1998 Message-ID: <001501bd2c38$bf1420c0$b17a5ecf@matt> From: "Matt Strong" To: Subject: [freestyle] longest tripless combo Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 16:04:45 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01BD2C06.7397DC40" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01BD2C06.7397DC40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I was wondering what the longest tripless combo is and who did it, and = I'm not talking about repeating the same move 20 or 30 times. I heard = from a friend who heard from Rippin that it was something like 26 and it = was Josh Casey, but I'm not sure about any of this. -Matt ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01BD2C06.7397DC40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I was wondering what the longest = tripless combo=20 is and who did it, and I'm not talking about repeating the same move 20 = or 30=20 times.  I heard from a friend who heard from Rippin that it was = something=20 like 26 and it was Josh Casey, but I'm not sure about any of = this.
 
-Matt
------=_NextPart_000_0012_01BD2C06.7397DC40-- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 22:14:18 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03148 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:14:18 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03144 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:14:17 GMT Received: from sunilj@dept.english.upenn.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3141) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03139 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:14:17 GMT Received: from dept.english.upenn.edu (DEPT.ENGLISH.UPENN.EDU [130.91.75.246]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA30787 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 14:14:19 -0800 Received: (from sunilj@localhost) by dept.english.upenn.edu (8.8.6/8.8.6) id RAA33720; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 17:14:04 -0500 From: sunilj@dept.english.upenn.edu (Sunil Jani) Message-Id: <199801282214.RAA33720@dept.english.upenn.edu> Subject: Re: [freestyle] longest tripless combo To: mstrong@ix.netcom.com (Matt Strong) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 17:14:03 -0500 (EST) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org In-Reply-To: <001501bd2c38$bf1420c0$b17a5ecf@matt> from "Matt Strong" at Jan 28, 98 04:04:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23-upenn3.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey All: Ryan Mulroney has done over 30 tripless. Not sure how many exactly, or if he has done more since then. Sunil From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 22:50:47 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03408 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:50:46 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03404 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:50:45 GMT Received: from schr4160@tao.sou.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3401) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03399 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:50:45 GMT Received: from TAO.sou.edu (Tao.sou.edu [140.211.92.6]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA31636 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 14:50:47 -0800 Received: from 206.151.159.36 (ip33.sou.mind.net [206.151.159.36]) by TAO.sou.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA03012 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 14:54:14 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34CF47F6.17D8@tao.sou.edu> Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 15:00:06 +0000 From: "schrodt, forest" X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle]shoes Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org The 'Mazin Josh Penney wrote: > > > *Teva inferior points: > > You left out the danger of ripping a toenail up, off your foot. Since > Teva's are open-air, they offer your feet little protection from all > sorts of nasty things... cold being one of the least (you could always > play in socks). Let us not forget the enormous amount of dirt, sweat, > bacteria (etc) accumulated by feet. I live in a dirty town, and playing > in sandals of any kind is highly UNreccommended. For those of you > playing on grassy fields, go for it; I've had my day in sandals, and a > new day has dawned - The day of the Rod Laver. I haven't since kicked a > stray rock, dog, or passerby resulting in personal injury. It sounds like Josh has been kicking some pretty bad areas, perhaps the gang ravaged inner gheto's. I do not have the need to kick in such unaccommodating footbag areas. I usually kick in the park, on sidewalks, in basketbal gyms, just about any other place that has a good even surface. I have to admit that Teva's do prevent me from kicking in certain areas like construction sites, toxic dumps, Edds Glass Recylcing storage area(though his lobby is a great place to shred), ect... I can honestly say that I have never been injured by the environment I was kicking in as a result of wearing Teva's. If you don't have the coordination to not jam your foot in the ground and rip a toenail off then maybe it is better for you not to kick in Tevas. I don't seem to have this problem. Josh, I think you may be in denile of the happily thriving bacteria you have growing in your Laver's. Unlike Laver's, Teva's can be easily cleaned (scrub them of in a sink after kicking). I know some truly horrible smelling Laver's. Some peoples Laver's I could not imagine putting my feet into every day lett allone, even allow in the house. The breathable canvas of Laver's seems to let the dirt in but not let the dirt out. A little known fact about Teva's is that you are actually less likely to sprain your ankle in them than with Laver's. While providing a small amount more cushoning, the thicker soles of Laver's have an abrupt edge that makes it much easier to role your ankle. Tevas have the same suport as Laver's but have a less abrupt edge helping to prevent career ending ankle injuries. I have only had one kind of injury that has occured as a result of wearing Teva's. I went through a short period, when I was learning how to do whirls and dinos, that I repeatedly slashed the back of my calves with my toe nail. I quickly realized that this was happening because I was not doing the motions incorectly. Since then I have never had that problem again. I would sugest to any sandal kickers out there who have this problem to simply cut your toenails short and wrap them in medical tape. The most important thing to keep in mind when this starts happening is, that it is happening because you are doing something wrong. Teva's are the shiznit! Forest Schrodt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Jan 28 23:48:01 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA03753 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 23:47:59 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA03749 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 23:47:56 GMT Received: from jsbx@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3746) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA03744 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 23:47:55 GMT Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.169]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA00158 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 15:47:58 -0800 From: JSBX Message-ID: <7ed6d4a2.34cfc34f@aol.com> Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 18:46:20 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] shoes Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) X-Mailer: Inet_Mail_Out (IMOv11) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Andrew (damocles) estimated the cost of lavers to be $60, and therefore came up with a pretty high estimate of the profits made off of us freestylers. This is probably pretty accurate, but you can get lavers cheaper from Charlie Johnson's tennis and squash shop online, The exact address is something like http://www.cjohnsontennisandsquash.com Still, it was a good point. K P.S-thanks for showing me this place Penney From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 00:25:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA04077 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 00:25:49 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id AAA04073 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 00:25:47 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4070) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA04068 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 00:25:47 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA01173 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 16:25:50 -0800 Received: from [207.79.78.21] ([206.66.71.91]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA04048; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 00:25:34 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19980128184803.25723.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 16:26:55 -0800 To: "Andrew Feuerdrache" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shoes Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 10:48 AM -0800 1/28/98, Andrew Feuerdrache wrote: >By my reasoning if the WFA alone has over 40,000 >members and if they each are buying a pair of shoes for kicking each >year at $60 that's 2.4 million dollars a year, which may not be much to >a big company like Adidas you'd think it's incentive enough for someone >to design us a shoe. Then your reasoning needs some seasoning: First of all, WFA has about 800 active members, i.e., people who actually subscribe to their magazine. Yes, they have over 40,000 lifetime members, but very few of them actually play footbag at the level of needing/wanting Lavers, and few of them actually get the magazine to know how to go about buying Lavers even if they wanted them. (Footbag.org actually exposes an order of magnitude more players to the sport than the WFA's paper magazine and membership list, by the way, so perhaps you just picked the wrong starting point.) Secondly, even at your ultra-liberal estimates, 2.4 million dollars does *not* a business make in the shoe industry! Adidas would laugh themselves back to Germany if we tried to tell them that footbag was actually a blip on their radar scopes relative to sales. Do you know how much Adidas sells a year?! Back when Le Coq was the best shoe around, I wrote them a letter begging them not to stop selling it. Man, oh man, was their response humbling. We are not in a position to negotiate for a better freestyle shoe. The Rod Laver is, as *all* of the top freestylers agree (okay, except for Teva Dave and Red Fred Husted), the best shoe for freestyle. It's a good thing. Don't fight it. Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 01:09:08 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA04359 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 01:08:54 GMT Received: (from bin@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA04355 for freestyle@eniac.yak.net; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 01:08:54 GMT Received: from ratm@pacbell.net () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4352) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA04350 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 01:08:53 GMT Received: from mail-gw.pacbell.net (mail-gw.pacbell.net [206.13.28.25]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA02031 for ; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 17:08:58 -0800 Received: from getlost (ppp-206-170-24-184.sntc01.pacbell.net [206.170.24.184]) by mail-gw.pacbell.net (8.8.8/8.7.1+antispam) with SMTP id RAA11986; Wed, 28 Jan 1998 17:08:49 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34CFD715.1667@pacbell.net> Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 17:10:45 -0800 From: Gary Grant Reply-To: ratm@pacbell.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-PBWG (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Stephen Miskiewicz CC: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Any clubs near West Chester,PA References: <19980119032427.4736.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Stephen Miskiewicz wrote: > > Thats close to where i'm from. Does anyone know of/ belong to any clubs > from that area. Any information would be helpful. Thanks. > _-Steve-_ > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com get of your mailing list From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 16:38:45 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA00841 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:37:59 GMT Received: from damocles_schwert@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (643) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00641 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:24:40 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f50.hotmail.com [207.82.250.61]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA15576 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:24:40 -0800 Received: (qmail 7545 invoked by uid 0); 29 Jan 1998 16:24:35 -0000 Message-ID: <19980129162435.7543.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 149.175.3.55 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:24:35 PST X-Originating-IP: [149.175.3.55] From: "Andrew Feuerdrache" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shoes Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:24:35 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Steve Goldberg wrote- "Secondly, even at your ultra-liberal estimates, 2.4 million dollars does *not* a business make in the shoe industry! Adidas would laugh themselves back to Germany if we tried to tell them that footbag was actually a blip on their radar scopes relative to sales. Do you know how much Adidas sells a year?!" My point wasn't that the big companies would be interested (it's always been my theory that footbag doesn't get much respect because there isn't enough money in it) but there are acually shoe companies for which we might make a blip. As an untaped market if we could convince somebody that we had enough "scerious players" I'd think that was enough incentive, and if nothing elce you can chalk it up to wishful thinking because I don't see it happening anytime soon either. Andrew McCargar- ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 16:55:33 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA01208 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:55:18 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (993) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00991 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:48:02 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA16316 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:48:03 -0800 Received: from [207.79.78.21] ([207.79.78.21]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA00988; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:48:00 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19980129162435.7543.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:49:36 -0800 To: "Andrew Feuerdrache" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shoes Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 8:24 AM -0800 1/29/98, Andrew McCargar wrote: > My point wasn't that the big companies would be interested (it's >always >been my theory that footbag doesn't get much respect because there isn't >enough money in it) but there are acually shoe companies for which we >might make a blip. Yes, I realized this after I sent my reply -- sorry for misunderstanding that point. But what I should have said was that I didn't think your estimates were anywhere near close to reality, and that even a small company couldn't survive on the revenues. Not that long ago, folks at WFA and other places tried to put together shoe deals. Some people had an idea to manufacture a shoe through a small shoe company that did custom shoe designs. Sounded like a fit. But it never became a reality. I bet there is a way to put something together, but I also bet it'd be a lot of work for whoever spearheaded it (the door is wide open if someone wants to walk through it) and it wouldn't pay off. I'm not jaded -- I have endless excitement and energy for promoting this sport and for moving us forward. But I know a waste of time when I see it! :-) The Lavers are good enough shoes, and yes this is all my personal opinion. Just watch the top players shred and ask yourself what exactly it is that we need to change. Now, to correct your estimate, I'll give my own. I think the actual Laver market for freestyle footbag, which is hard to measure because WFA won't make their prices low enough to ensure that all footbaggers order through them, is probably somewhere in the 300 pairs-a-year category -- translating to approximately $9000/year in revenue if you consider that Adidas' wholesale price is approx. $30/pair. I don't see how anyone will want to create a business venture where the total annual revenus would be under $10K/year. Yes, I think this number will go up. But it'd be a risk. The only reasonable solution would be to go with a company that does limited quantity custom manufacturing. However, the effort in designing a shoe (someone has to own the design and get paid for it, or do it for free!), putting together the deal, etc., far outweighs the benefits in the short term, and the price per shoe will probably be higher than $60. My point is that we should be happy and nervous at the same time that Adidas makes a shoe we can use: happy because they exist at all at a price point we can afford, and nervous because they could go away tomorrow and we'd be in a "heap of trouble". Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 18:13:01 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id SAA01797 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 18:12:39 GMT Received: from nageylum@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1594) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01592 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:46:09 GMT From: Nageylum@aol.com Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.169]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA17781; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 09:46:09 -0800 Received: from Nageylum@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (IMOv12/Dec1997) id ODLCa24555; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 12:45:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <333e5226.34d0c02c@aol.com> Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 12:45:14 EST To: brat@footbag.org, damocles_schwert@hotmail.com Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shoes Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 52 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 98-01-29 12:25:38 EST, brat@footbag.org writes: > My point is that we should be happy and nervous at the same time that > Adidas makes a shoe we can use: happy because they exist at all at a price > point we can afford, and nervous because they could go away tomorrow and > we'd be in a "heap of trouble". i think this brings up a good question, what would freestylers wear if the lavers were no longer sold??? I had a hell of a time finding a shoe that were good for kicking befor I saw the lavers, are there any other good freestyle kicking footwear, besides the tevas. Josh Childs From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 19:39:05 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02618 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:38:48 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (1830) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA01828 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 18:21:47 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA18620 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 10:21:48 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.03.0014/4c.adoc) with ESMTP id ea149946 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 12:30:37 -0600 Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shoes Message-Id: <000000531122968943268@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 12:27:48 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, Jan 29, 1998, 10:49:36 AM US CST Steve Goldberg wrote: >The Lavers are >good enough shoes, and yes this is all my personal opinion. Well, one of the last bastions of non-Laver (and non-Tiva) freestyling, I think, has finally fallen. My Lavers arrived yesterday. I will kick with them this evening. Mind you, I've tried Lavers before, but never quite the right size. I've always used the extremely high shock absorbtion shoes because of my pounding style, but alas I can no longer find any of them without the drainage channel on the instep. I'm hoping good padded insoles and better tecnique will negate my need for the max custion shoes. I don't expect to 'become instantly better' by putting them on; I've had nearly 17 years (I've been kicking footbags for almost half my life!) to "adjust" to the shoe design I use now. Its good to know that others cut away the sides so they don't interfere with things - I'll probably do the same since that is the other of my two big complaints against Lavers. -- Derrick Fogle -- Heartland Eye Banks -- dfogle@mlerf.org -- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 19:39:09 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02631 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:38:58 GMT Received: from enlightener@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2023) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA02021 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 18:44:00 GMT Received: from neuman.interaccess.com (neuman.interaccess.com [207.70.126.130]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA19153; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 10:44:01 -0800 Received: from [207.208.136.53] (d53.focal.interaccess.com [207.208.136.53]) by neuman.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id MAA07733; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 12:38:09 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 12:38:09 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Nageylum@aol.com, brat@footbag.org, damocles_schwert@hotmail.com From: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson at CopySetCenter) Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shoes Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Freestylers! At 12:45 PM 1/29/98, Nageylum@aol.com wrote: >i think this brings up a good question, what would freestylers wear if the >lavers were no longer sold??? I had a hell of a time finding a shoe that were >good for kicking befor I saw the lavers, are there any other good freestyle >kicking footwear, besides the tevas. If it was pending doom that we faced, we would hopefully have ample warning. I go through about a pair a year, and I will probably need about 30 more pairs. Hmm... that is not that significant of an investment... at $40 per pair, it is only $1,200... a small investment in your future comfort. You could only get about 9 pairs of Air Jordan High Tops for that. (about the cost of two flights to Vegas from Chicago at around the new year). See ya! Scott D. Enlightener From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 19:59:24 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id TAA02879 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:59:23 GMT Received: from mzelov@sun1.wetmore.amphi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2776) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02774 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:44:08 GMT Received: from sun1.wetmore.amphi.com (NS.AMPHI.COM [206.210.128.2]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA21063 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 11:44:08 -0800 Received: from ams-38317.amphi_jhs.amphi.com ([206.210.140.89]) by sun1.wetmore.amphi.com (4.1/1.37) id AA07738; Thu, 29 Jan 98 12:51:21-070 Message-Id: <34D0DC4C.1C3F@sun1.wetmore.amphi.com> Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 12:45:16 -0700 From: marc zelov Organization: amphi public schools X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] lavers Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >> "are there any other good freestyle < > kicking footwear, besides the tevas." < I think that the Converse "One Star" low cut is a prety decent freestyle shoe. I also have a pair of modified Lavers and yes, they are overall a superior freestyle shoe, but the Converse with some simple modifications are pretty nice. I have recently seen the converse in discount stores for $10.00. Even at their priciest retail cost they are about $25 bucks. They are suade on the outside and pretty thick, so there is a major difference between the suppleness of the "netting" that Addidas uses. I have been considering tearing into the canvas backing on my converse and seeing if the shoe becomes more supple and still holds up. The Converse are fairly square on both the inside and outside surfaces. Arguably more square then the Lavers. Anyways, I have been enjoying the postings as of late. Keep it up! Ciao Marc Zelov. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 22:40:32 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04301 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:40:22 GMT Received: from klein@proscape.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3072) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03070 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 20:24:23 GMT Received: from proxyserv.proscape.com (mail.proscape.com [205.147.246.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA22112 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 12:24:24 -0800 Received: by proxyserv.proscape.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) id <01BD2CC9.6D914ED0@proxyserv.proscape.com>; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 15:20:27 -0500 Message-ID: From: Ethan Klein To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] New Balance Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 15:20:26 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I swear by my Lavers, let my first establish that fact, BUT.... I have definitely been surprised and have yanked out some hein combos in my New Balance running shoes. I've been caught drilling double legovers and drifters in my office bathroom with corduroys and my NBs. They have a nice flat, cupped inside surface which facilitates almost - Laver-like clippers. The toes, however demand precise catches and don't provide the room for error that the Laver open toe lacing system hooks up. I would venture so far to say that if I limited my freestylin to only clippers (butterfly/osis) I wouldn't care if I used Lavers or my New Balance 1300 Classics!!! Ethan I also know that for years Peter Irish ripped SICK combos that I would LOVE to be able to nail now in Asics running shoes. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 22:40:36 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA04314 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:40:25 GMT Received: from mzelov@sun1.wetmore.amphi.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3848) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03846 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:06:36 GMT Received: from sun1.wetmore.amphi.com (NS.AMPHI.COM [206.210.128.2]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA24380 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 14:06:38 -0800 Received: from ams-38317.amphi_jhs.amphi.com ([206.210.140.89]) by sun1.wetmore.amphi.com (4.1/1.37) id AA10823; Thu, 29 Jan 98 15:13:51-070 Message-Id: <34D0FDB7.1B46@sun1.wetmore.amphi.com> Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 15:07:51 -0700 From: marc zelov Organization: amphi public schools X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] shoes Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Derrick wrote... > Its good to > know that others cut away the sides so they don't interfere with things - I'll > probably do the same since that is the other of my two big complaints against > Lavers. I'm trying to picture what he is talking about here. Is this referring to cutting away the first couple of "eye holes" where the initial shoe strings would run sans lacing technique. Cutting away the first one or two eyeholes opens up the face of the toe considerably but removes the "CUP" formation that the "sides" naturally form. I did not see this technique in the online modification info. Do many freestylers cut away the eyeholes? I did, but I have been feeling funny without the "CUP". I have not seen many serious players and am curious what the current standard is. Tanks... Marc Zelov http://www.footbag.org/newclubs/listclub/amphi From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 23:01:57 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04538 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 23:01:51 GMT Received: from f0ne@concentric.net () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4374) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA04372 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:45:43 GMT Received: from uhura.concentric.net (uhura.concentric.net [206.173.119.93]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA25461 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 14:45:45 -0800 Received: from marconi.concentric.net (marconi [206.173.119.71]) by uhura.concentric.net (8.8.8/(98/01/20 5.9)) id RAA20299; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:45:44 -0500 (EST) [1-800-745-2747 The Concentric Network] Received: from fone (cnc003085.concentric.net [206.83.89.85]) by marconi.concentric.net (8.8.8) id RAA17760; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:45:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <34D1064C.15D5@concentric.net> Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:44:28 -0600 From: Steve Wallace X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-GZone (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Lavers modifications Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org HEy all, I just got my Lavers in the mail today (along with my first juice =)) anyway I removed the inside canvas on the instep ... but i was wondering how many of you bother to remove the canvas int the toe... I can stall and everything just fine with it in at the moment ... i was just wondering if there was any other reason to take it out ... (like for harder moves that i havent learned yet? thanx Steve Wallace From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 23:01:59 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04551 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 23:01:55 GMT Received: from hill9361@uidaho.edu () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4464) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA04462 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:56:20 GMT Received: from raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (raven.csrv.uidaho.edu [129.101.192.43]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA25686 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 14:56:18 -0800 Received: from localhost (hill9361@localhost) by raven.csrv.uidaho.edu (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id OAA18504 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 14:56:16 -0800 (PST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.csrv.uidaho.edu: hill9361 owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 14:56:16 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Hillebrand X-Sender: hill9361@raven.csrv.uidaho.edu To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shoes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, Steve Goldberg wrote: > I don't see how anyone will want to > create a business venture where the total annual revenus would be under > $10K/year. Yes, I think this number will go up. But it'd be a risk. The > only reasonable solution would be to go with a company that does limited > quantity custom manufacturing. However, the effort in designing a shoe > (someone has to own the design and get paid for it, or do it for free!), I'd do it as long as I broke even (if I knew how). What if Adidas did discontinue the Rod Lavers? Man, would that suck.....especially if everyone's worried about how much/little money they would earn from it. __________________________________________________________________________ Matt P. Hillebrand hill9361@uidaho.edu http://www.uidaho.edu/~hill9361 From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Jan 29 23:13:04 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA04700 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 23:12:59 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (4631) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA04629 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 23:06:26 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA25968 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 15:06:29 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.03.0014/4c.adoc) with ESMTP id ma150136 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:15:29 -0600 Subject: Re: [freestyle] shoes Message-Id: <000000531522968960353@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:12:32 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.8 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, Jan 29, 1998, 4:07:51 PM US CST marc zelov wrote: >two eyeholes opens up the face of the toe considerably but removes the >"CUP" formation that the "sides" naturally form. I did not see this I don't think many players do it, but I heard Rippin does (message a few days ago) and I saw Jay Winingar's shoes with a less-than-two-eyelets modification. The thing is that since I've played for so many years without them, every time I've played with the sides, they have really thrown my game off. People that learn with those big crutches :) on each side of their toes don't have the problem I do. -- Derrick Fogle -- Heartland Eye Banks -- dfogle@mlerf.org -- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 30 01:15:42 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA05986 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 01:15:38 GMT Received: from cochrane@v-wave.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5607) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA05605 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 00:22:38 GMT Received: from mail.videotron.ab.ca (mail.videotron.ab.ca [206.75.216.210]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA27625 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:22:39 -0800 Received: from binc-1 ([24.108.13.197]) by mail.videotron.ab.ca (Netscape Mail Server v2.02) with SMTP id AAA29075 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:17:56 -0700 From: "Ben Cochrane" To: Subject: [freestyle] Shoes! Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:25:57 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd2d15$a3a059c0$c50d6c18@binc-1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Marc Zelov wrote: I think that the Converse "One Star" low cut is a prety decent freestyle shoe. I also have a pair of modified Lavers and yes, they are overall a superior freestyle shoe, but the Converse with some simple modifications are pretty nice. I have recently seen the converse in discount stores for $10.00. Even at their priciest retail cost they are about $25 bucks. They are suade on the outside and pretty thick, so there is a major difference between the suppleness of the "netting" that Addidas uses. I have been considering tearing into the canvas backing on my converse and seeing if the shoe becomes more supple and still holds up. I agree with this. I had lavers and didnt found that it made any difference for my game, I have one stars and I can hit most tricks better in those than i could hit in lavers, all you have to do is lave them like lavers and slice back the threads that hold the sides to the toe. If you really wanted to make them laver style, cut the toe piece out and sew in some nylon mesh, they are also a bit lighter than lavers too, in my opinion. FootBINC From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 30 01:52:49 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA06184 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 01:52:48 GMT Received: from brat@footbag.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6020) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA06018 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 01:18:57 GMT Received: from eniac.yak.net (eniac.Yak.NET [140.174.206.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA28897 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:19:01 -0800 Received: from [206.66.71.91] ([206.66.71.91]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA06015; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 01:18:51 GMT X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01bd2d15$a3a059c0$c50d6c18@binc-1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:20:06 -0800 To: "Ben Cochrane" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shoes! Cc: Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 4:25 PM -0800 1/29/98, Ben Cochrane wrote: >I had lavers and didnt found that it made any >difference for my game, I have one stars and I can hit most tricks >better in those than i could hit in laver Nothing personal, Ben, but what tricks are those?... Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 30 03:46:15 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA07042 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 03:46:13 GMT Received: from jsbx@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (6885) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA06883 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 03:24:39 GMT From: JSBX@aol.com Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com (imo17.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.174]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA31645 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:24:42 -0800 Received: from JSBX@aol.com by imo17.mx.aol.com (IMOv12/Dec1997) id OHJLa12129 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:24:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:24:27 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] tricks in non lavers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all. Recently some guy called Ben said he could do many tricks better in one stars than in lavers, and steve asked what tricks those might be. I understand the skepticism, but there are some shoes that make some tricks easier than lavers. What springs to mind are my airwalks, which have really thick heels. I can heelium and cross body heel stall much more easily with them than with my lavers. Soma From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 30 04:09:52 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id EAA07210 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 04:09:51 GMT Received: from jsbx@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (7131) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA07129 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 04:03:08 GMT From: JSBX@aol.com Received: from imo30.mail.aol.com (imo30.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.168]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA32358 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 20:03:12 -0800 Received: from JSBX@aol.com by imo30.mx.aol.com (IMOv12/Dec1997) id OILUa08050 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 23:00:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 23:00:39 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] URL Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Alright already! sheesh, so many peopl have complained to me about me giving the wrong address. The place to get cheap lavers is http://www.cjtennisandsquash.com I am almost positive, except my internet is not working so i cannot double check just yet. Now if you will, I have better things to do, like throw out my back trying to legbeater. K From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 30 17:53:42 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA01406 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 17:52:19 GMT Received: from grandincredible@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (601) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00599 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 15:48:05 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f55.hotmail.com [207.82.250.141]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA08898 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 07:48:05 -0800 Received: (qmail 27348 invoked by uid 0); 30 Jan 1998 15:48:03 -0000 Message-ID: <19980130154803.27347.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 38.249.188.156 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 07:48:02 PST X-Originating-IP: [38.249.188.156] From: "Daniel Kramer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Wha? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 07:48:02 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Forest wrote: > Josh, I think you may be in denile of the happily thriving >bacteria you have growing in your Laver's. I guess denile IS a river in Egypt. DK ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 30 22:55:17 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03367 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 22:55:16 GMT Received: from zogg13@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (2870) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA02868 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 21:31:34 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f149.hotmail.com [207.82.251.28]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA17976 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 13:31:37 -0800 Received: (qmail 2671 invoked by uid 0); 30 Jan 1998 21:31:35 -0000 Message-ID: <19980130213135.2670.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 206.245.153.37 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 13:31:35 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.245.153.37] From: "Steve Miskiewicz" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] new move? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 16:31:35 EST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was looking though the move list and I never came across this one even though I do it often. I call it a tempale stall. If you haven't guessed you stall the bag on your tempale(that soft part on the side of your head). The move is easy. The only weird part is when your looking at the bag sideways. All you got to do is make your head like a table top. Is this a move that just isn't listed or is it illegal or something? _-Steve-_ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Jan 30 23:14:23 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA03495 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 23:14:22 GMT Received: from dfogle@mlerf.org () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3419) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA03417 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 23:02:13 GMT Received: from trib1.trib.net (trib1.trib.net [12.10.112.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA19435 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 15:02:16 -0800 Received: from www.mlerf.org (www.mlerf.org [12.10.114.3]) by trib1.trib.net (NTMail 3.03.0014/4c.adoc) with ESMTP id ra150817 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 17:11:03 -0600 Subject: Re: [freestyle] new move? Message-Id: <000000533462969046506@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 17:08:26 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.9 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Fri, Jan 30, 1998, 3:31:35 PM US CST Steve Miskiewicz wrote: >guessed you stall the bag on your tempale(that soft part on the side of >your head). The move is easy. The only weird part is when your looking There's a certain someone that's probably been kicking as long as you've been alive whom we really don't want to encourage. That move has been purposefully omitted from the list. 8{) Actually, Its sort of generally accepted that the entire head, whether it be nose, temples, forehead, top of head, eye sockets, chin, ear, etc., is considered a single 'surface' for freestyle scoring. -- Derrick Fogle -- Heartland Eye Banks -- dfogle@mlerf.org -- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 31 01:40:46 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA04472 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 31 Jan 1998 01:40:38 GMT Received: from kilobit@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (3579) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA03577 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 23:24:09 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f102.hotmail.com [207.82.250.221]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA20003 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 15:24:12 -0800 Received: (qmail 14810 invoked by uid 0); 30 Jan 1998 23:24:11 -0000 Message-ID: <19980130232411.14809.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 209.109.225.112 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 15:24:10 PST X-Originating-IP: [209.109.225.112] From: "The 'Mazin Josh Penney" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] new move? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 15:24:10 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > I was looking though the move list and I never came across this one >even though I do it often. I call it a tempale stall. If you haven't >guessed you stall the bag on your tempale(that soft part on the side of >your head). >Is this a move that just isn't listed or is it illegal or >something? Is 'tempale' some kind of low-alcohol beer? My dear brother David was killed while attempting to stall a footbag on his temple at the world championships in 1974. There was a meeting of the grand poobah sultans of footbag, who then declared the temple stall illegal. Anyone attempting this move in public shall be, following the rule, "flogged and beaten senseless". You'll excuse me, for this brings up some painful memories and I have to go. JP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 31 03:46:47 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA05272 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 31 Jan 1998 03:46:34 GMT Received: from markdenton@hotmail.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5160) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA05158 for ; Sat, 31 Jan 1998 03:20:14 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f116.hotmail.com [207.82.251.46]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA24328 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 19:20:19 -0800 Received: (qmail 26325 invoked by uid 0); 31 Jan 1998 03:20:17 -0000 Message-ID: <19980131032017.26324.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 209.47.115.228 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 30 Jan 1998 19:20:16 PST X-Originating-IP: [209.47.115.228] From: "Mark Denton" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] lavers Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 19:20:16 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 4:25 PM -0800 1/29/98, Ben Cochrane wrote: >I had lavers and didnt found that it made any >difference for my game, I have one stars and I can hit most tricks >better in those than i could hit in laver >Nothing personal, Ben, but what tricks are those?... Steve Yes Ben do tell. Flying Clippers perhaps. Mark ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 31 05:39:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id FAA05734 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 31 Jan 1998 05:39:39 GMT Received: from allman144@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (5667) Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com (imo17.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.174]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA05665 for ; Sat, 31 Jan 1998 05:28:53 GMT From: Allman144@aol.com Received: from Allman144@aol.com by imo17.mx.aol.com (IMOv12/Dec1997) id BVZHa12122 for ; Sat, 31 Jan 1998 00:28:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3c22db92.34d2b693@aol.com> Date: Sat, 31 Jan 1998 00:28:49 EST To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #314 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Good shoes to kick with are Puma soccer shoes. I kicked with them for two years before I found out about Lavers! They are made out of.....wait.....i don't even know. But they are excellent. Just thought I'd throw in my two cents, that is what this mailing list is for, right?? Tony Glick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Jan 31 17:58:30 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA00451 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 31 Jan 1998 17:58:01 GMT Received: from jsbx@aol.com () via =-=-=-=-=-= for freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org (159) Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) (fnord) by eniac.yak.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00157 for ; Sat, 31 Jan 1998 15:28:05 GMT From: JSBX@aol.com Received: from imo24.mail.aol.com (imo24.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.152]) by Market.NET (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA00626 for ; Sat, 31 Jan 1998 07:28:05 -0800 Received: from JSBX@aol.com by imo24.mx.aol.com (IMOv12/Dec1997) id OELHa27669 for ; Sat, 31 Jan 1998 10:24:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <361ca7e3.34d34241@aol.com> Date: Sat, 31 Jan 1998 10:24:47 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Re: Temple stall Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all! I agree that the move probably isn't listed because it is just another kind of head stall, but the temple stall does have one notable use. I was at a tournament once, and this kid could temple stall, and then do an around the world with his head to another temple stall. Of course, most head stalls have some use or other. I like setting eclipses and pendulums from top of the head stalls. Soma