From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 2 18:50:18 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA18961 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 18:50:18 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA30796 for ; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 10:21:50 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F1T009013J4NY@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 11:04:16 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 11:04:16 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] Laver modifications In-reply-to: <363ACD7D.4B85@utdallas.edu> To: Derric Scalf Cc: matt dick , freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Sat, 31 Oct 1998, Derric Scalf wrote: > in the Lavers is pretty crappy. On footbag.org, they talk about > cutting the canvas (inside) layer away from the outer layer. I did this > only on one shoe. I ran out of time, so I didn't do the other one. I > haven't noticed any difference in the shoes except that the one that I > cut the canvas out of is starting to wear out now. I cut the canvas out of the insides and toes about 6 months ago and at the time I noticed a huge difference in sensitivity. I could feel the bag on my foot a lot better. Whether or not it made a big difference in my playing I can't exactly say, cause I still suck. BRAD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 2 19:39:22 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id TAA03348 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 19:39:22 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA31779 for ; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 11:12:45 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F1T00G016T811@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 12:15:08 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 12:15:07 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: [freestyle] ECHO...ECHO...Echo To: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey where'd everybody go? Did I miss something? Last week I was checking my e-mail and having 70 or so messages every two days. Doesn't anybody want to argue over paradox anymore, or maybe give a few new moves or combos they've hit. I'll start, I recently hit my weak side blur, tapping butterfly, paradox AtomSmasher (only once) and I attempted a tapping eclipse but no go yet. I have yet to link these moves and play out of them as I get very excited to have hit them at all, then stop. I'd like to promote the move list as well. Thanks Steve for adding the Video Demonstrations. While I may have known what some of the moves were, it ultimately helps to see some of them done by the pros and get to watch it in slow motion. I can't wait to go and skool flurries until I drop or rather land. Congratulations to Carol and Eric whom I don't know, but I like weddings anyway. Oh yeah, I have been paying attention to a lot of the harder moves and noticing that the reverse of them are usually equally or even harder moves. For instance, Flurry > Pixie Paradon. So I was really wondering if anyone has been hitting some of the harder moves forward/reverse, back to back. Like Barroque > Scorpian Tail. Just trying to drum up some conversation. BRAD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 3 08:40:04 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA29894 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 08:40:04 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.15]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA02029 for ; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 13:55:44 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id PAA01600 for ; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 15:55:15 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx44-50.ix.netcom.com(207.221.94.242) by dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma001533; Mon Nov 2 15:54:35 1998 Message-ID: <363E2CB8.3C40@utdallas.edu> Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 16:05:44 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] ECHO...ECHO...Echo References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org KAPLAN BRADLEY M wrote: > > Oh yeah, I have been paying attention to a lot of the harder moves > and noticing that the reverse of them are usually equally or even harder > moves. For instance, Flurry > Pixie Paradon. So I was really wondering > if anyone has been hitting some of the harder moves forward/reverse, back > to back. Like Barroque > Scorpian Tail. > Well. I'm definitely not hitting back to back 5's or anything, but here are some forward/reverse combos that I do like. Blur > legbeater > blur double over down > double pickup (is that what it's called?) merkon > pixie osis double legover > pixie butterfly torque > spinning butterfly > torque Although these are fun, I haven't done any of them weak side (except for th dbl legover > pixie butterfly). That is the bad thing about these combos. They only work one side. I just realized that if you throw in an extra double over down in what I wrote up there, you could get one pretty mean one-sided string by linking all of the moves together. If only I could do it weak side... Later. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 3 08:39:57 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA29886 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 08:39:57 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f241.hotmail.com [207.82.251.132]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA32594 for ; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 12:18:42 -0800 Received: (qmail 23643 invoked by uid 0); 2 Nov 1998 20:18:07 -0000 Message-ID: <19981102201807.23641.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 02 Nov 1998 12:18:07 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: freestyle@footbag.org, kaplanb@mscd.edu Subject: Re: [freestyle] ECHO...ECHO...Echo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 12:18:07 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > > Hey where'd everybody go? Did I miss something? Everyone is prolly at the wedding. maybe give a Thanks Steve for adding >the Video Demonstrations. While I may have known what some of the moves >were, it ultimately helps to see some of them done by the pros and get to >watch it in slow motion. > Congratulations to Carol and Eric whom I don't know Me neither, but congratulations > Oh yeah, I have been paying attention to a lot of the harder moves >and noticing that the reverse of them are usually equally or even harder >moves. Lots of people can hit blurriest, but I've only heard of two people who have hit flurriest. Back to work. Ken Somolinos nyf D ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 3 08:40:16 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA29914 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 08:40:16 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from m9.sprynet.com (m9.sprynet.com [165.121.2.209]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA05603 for ; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 17:48:45 -0800 Received: from newmicronpc (sfr-pci-pqr-vty126.as.wcom.net [209.154.140.126]) by m9.sprynet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA05444; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 17:48:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199811030148.RAA05444@m9.sprynet.com> Reply-To: From: " Jane Jones" To: "KAPLAN BRADLEY M" , Subject: Re: [freestyle] ECHO...ECHO...Echo Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 18:22:23 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org | Oh yeah, I have been paying attention to a lot of the harder moves | and noticing that the reverse of them are usually equally or even harder | moves. For instance, Flurry > Pixie Paradon. So I was really wondering | if anyone has been hitting some of the harder moves forward/reverse, back | to back. Like Barroque > Scorpian Tail. | | Just trying to drum up some conversation. | | BRAD hey hey hey... yeah, I was thinking about combos last night during one of our skool sessions... {finally pulled barfly for the first time...yahoooo!!!!! (small tangent...)} anyway, I'm not sure if this is what you're talking about as far as forward->reverse moves, but wouldn't barfly to barrage to paradon be cool. the barrage kind of rewinds the preceding move. probably aesthetically cool to look at. I bet it feels cool. I just gotta skool the barrage part before that combo shows up anywhere on my lavers... oh yeah, maybe people haven't been writing because Forest psyched us all out into thinking a bunch of stylers would be in Eugene 2 weekends ago. ;-) nah...just kidding...there was still some good freestyle even if the numbers were slightly smaller than expected. it was probably all of the halloween weekend jams going on. hey, at least people are finally out kicking rather than typing to this group all the time! :-) oh yeah, another one I was skooling that looks cool...stepping butterfly to whirl ...oh, nevermind, that's not really the same concept...it does look cool though...even if one dude I kick with thinks stepping butterflies look lame...I think they look pretty dope. any kind of a D'oh--switch direction type move looks pretty cool in my opinion. I guess peeking moves are kind of like that... adios, Jane From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 3 08:40:25 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA29927 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 08:40:25 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA32364 for ; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 11:59:31 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id NAA10329 for ; Mon, 2 Nov 1998 13:59:28 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [freestyle] ECHO...ECHO...Echo Message-Id: <000000195962992881502@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 13:58:22 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.9 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, Nov 2, 1998, 1:15:07 PM US CST KAPLAN BRADLEY M wrote: >moves. For instance, Flurry > Pixie Paradon. So I was really wondering >if anyone has been hitting some of the harder moves forward/reverse, back >to back. Like Barroque > Scorpian Tail. OK, try hitting what I call "Mirrored Paradox": a front-end paradox mirage to a drifter (clip > same out dex > op out dex > same clip). Sorry if I got the dex notations backward; I developed a notation system similar to Job's notation a long time ago and I always referenced the position of the bag to the body, not the position of the leg to the bag, and so I never can keep the dexerity elements straight anymore. It is the same thing as front-side paradox blur, except you end in a drifter instead. Just like butterfly and drifter are mirrors of each other, this move's second half is a mirror of its first half. And, by the way, I think the move should qualify for 2 paradox cudos if if qualifies for any. ______________________________________ Derrick Fogle - the "Computer Guy" Missouri Lions Eye Research Foundation Heartland Lions Eye Banks dfogle@mlerf.org - www.mlerf.org From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 3 16:12:32 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id QAA26925 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 16:12:32 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA12262 for ; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 06:47:53 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id IAA23644 for ; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 08:47:48 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [freestyle] ECHO...ECHO...Echo Message-Id: <000000198412992949196@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 08:46:35 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.9 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Tue, Nov 3, 1998, 3:01:58 AM US CST Derric Scalf wrote: >So, it is a paradox blurry drifter? Wow. I've never seen anyone hit >this although it seems possible for those who can do voodoos like cake. I'm not sure about that; does 'paradox blurry' imply that the paradox dex is the first dex? If so, that's right. I've never 'hit' it, but I 'touched' it once or twice. Again about that dex direction thing: I would call in an "O-I" dex because the bag starts on the outside of the leg and ends up on the inside of the leg. I know Steve will be annoyed because it looks like I'm trying to introduce a 'competing' notation, but I think the reference point is important because even in moves like swirls and twirls and upside-down moves, there's still an 'inside' and an 'outside' of the leg for the bag's position to be referenced to. I keep thinking that, in Job's notation, the leg is moving from inside to outside, so it would be called an 'out' dex. Could someone correct my thinking for me? ______________________________________ Derrick Fogle - the "Computer Guy" Missouri Lions Eye Research Foundation Heartland Lions Eye Banks dfogle@mlerf.org - www.mlerf.org From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 3 16:12:51 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id QAA26942 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 16:12:51 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.15]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA10408 for ; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 00:50:54 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id CAA15735; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 02:50:46 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx44-50.ix.netcom.com(207.221.94.242) by dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma015725; Tue Nov 3 02:50:43 1998 Message-ID: <363EC686.127A@utdallas.edu> Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 03:01:58 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Derrick Fogle, MLERF" CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] ECHO...ECHO...Echo References: <000000195962992881502@mlerf.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Derrick Fogle, MLERF wrote: > > OK, try hitting what I call "Mirrored Paradox": a front-end paradox mirage to > a drifter (clip > same out dex > op out dex > same clip). Sorry if I got the > dex notations backward; Yeah, I think the dex direction is wrong according to Job's notation. That is why the long hand helps too. > It is the same thing as front-side paradox > blur, except you end in a drifter instead. So, it is a paradox blurry drifter? Wow. I've never seen anyone hit this although it seems possible for those who can do voodoos like cake. Have you hit this? If so, maybe I should start using those crazy shoes of yours :) > And, by the way, I think the move should qualify for 2 paradox cudos if if > qualifies for any. > If there ever was a move that deserved two paradox adds, this would be the one. And to Ken... You mentioned something about a flurriest? What is that? I keep picturing a nemisis, but that can't be right. Is it a barraging butterfly? I think I saw Ahren hit (or at least try) that a few times at worlds. Mean stuff. Later all. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 4 06:57:58 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA13545 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 4 Nov 1998 06:57:58 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f158.hotmail.com [207.82.251.37]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA24104 for ; Tue, 3 Nov 1998 21:06:57 -0800 Received: (qmail 1451 invoked by uid 0); 4 Nov 1998 05:06:26 -0000 Message-ID: <19981104050626.1450.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 03 Nov 1998 21:06:26 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: dfogle@mlerf.org, scalf@utdallas.edu Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] flurriest MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 21:06:26 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi everyone! > >And to Ken... You mentioned something about a flurriest? What is >that? I keep picturing a nemisis, but that can't be right. Is it a >barraging butterfly? I think I saw Ahren hit (or at least try) that a >few times at worlds. Mean stuff. Flurriest is barraging butterfly. One dex shy of a nemesis. Adrian Dick told me that Tuan Vu and Stuart MacPherson have hit it. I keep thinking about how insane the sport is getting. At the begginning of the century, the concept of a 4 minute mile was ludicrous, but the times just kept getting better, and someone has run a 3:44 mile. Before Kenny Shults, i doubt anyone could have foreseen even a double around the world, much less the new weird moves that keep popping up like paratoxic, superfly, and blurry twirl. Ahren Gehrmann will hit blurriest swirl, people will go trippless, and when i am old and wheelchair bound, i will still be amazed by the innovative new moves of people who are pushing the sport to its boundaries. i Viva footbag! Ken "ceiling fan" Somolinos nyf D ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 5 03:10:12 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA18094 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 5 Nov 1998 03:10:12 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Owen Parrish Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.4]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA07451 for ; Wed, 4 Nov 1998 16:29:33 -0800 Received: from SuperOwen@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OYQLa17681 for ; Wed, 4 Nov 1998 19:28:03 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 4 Nov 1998 19:28:03 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Footbag as a Metaphor Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 226 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org You know, the other day I was writing some poetry (a hobby of mine), (this was the same day I hit my first mirage so i was real hyped) and I realized that footbag is a metaphor for life. And I wrote a poem about it, so hear it goes: bouncing up nd down sometimes sweet and smooth other times a bit chaotic breezing through seems impossible loos so hard, but it's really not if you've got the right tools mind and body fused together flowing like a river soaring as a bird does wish you could be there high above doing everything perfect you can't though it'll always find a way to drop roll off your toe or outta your mouth sometimes you do the wrong thing but when it's right it's graceful beaty makes ya say "Wow!" I can't believe that just happend didn't know I had it in me the world's whirling swirling around me when will I come down? never, I hope Just thought I'd throw that out there. Owen "Total Package" Parrish From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 5 04:09:40 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA02428 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 5 Nov 1998 04:09:40 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mailhost.cyberramp.net (root@mailhost.cyberramp.net [207.158.64.11]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA10191 for ; Wed, 4 Nov 1998 19:26:00 -0800 Received: from jrichter (dal-tsa14-23.cyberramp.net [207.158.83.215]) by mailhost.cyberramp.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1/ler-981006-1336) with SMTP id VAA17956; Wed, 4 Nov 1998 21:25:56 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <36411AFD.368F@cyberramp.net> Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1998 21:26:53 -0600 From: Joe Richter Reply-To: jrichter@cyberramp.net Organization: Me X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Owen Parrish CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Footbag as a Metaphor References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Owen, From the mouth of experience (which I suspect is a great deal more experienced than you), I have to say, "Great job!". If you feel that way after your first mirage, I shiver at the thought of the great lines you'll write (at least inside your head) as you tackle greater challenges. Keep up the good work. Good luck in all. Kicking that stupid, little bag will only get better and better... Regards, Joe Richter From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 7 21:03:58 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id VAA22749 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 7 Nov 1998 21:03:58 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from TAO.sou.edu (root@Tao.sou.edu [140.211.92.6]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA24498 for ; Thu, 5 Nov 1998 16:32:11 -0800 Received: from 206.151.159.16 (dyn-1-14.sou.mind.net [206.151.159.16]) by TAO.sou.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA15168 for ; Thu, 5 Nov 1998 16:33:52 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3641AB7E.7983@tao.sou.edu> Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 05:43:26 -0800 From: "schrodt, forest" X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] a few easy moves Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hiya stylers, I have a number of moves that I have come up with and know others have too. I have never seen anyone try them or hit them cleanly. I have either, hit but with no concistency, or not cleanly, or come very close, on all of them except blury blur and blury rip walk. paradox rip walk [5] (can anyone do blurry rip walk? [6]) pixie rip walk [5] Toe>same in>op in>same plant>op out>op xbody Do a smear but then plant the miraging second dex and go into a butterfly with the op leg doing the dex. I am still learning the notation so please correct me so I can get it right. I can concistently hit pixie dada curve but I have never hit pixie rip cleanly without "the"ing. paradox blur [5] (can anyone do blury blur? [6]) spinning blurr [4] gyro blur [4] gyro rip walk [5] spinning drifter [4] I would like to know who can hit these and if any of them have names. I have to admit that I did not have time to check the moves list to see if any are on it allready. Let me know what ya think. Forest "lovin it" Schrodt PS: Owen I like the poem. :) From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 7 21:04:01 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id VAA22910 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 7 Nov 1998 21:04:01 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f189.hotmail.com [207.82.251.78]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA14714 for ; Thu, 5 Nov 1998 02:57:18 -0800 Received: (qmail 9570 invoked by uid 0); 5 Nov 1998 10:56:48 -0000 Message-ID: <19981105105648.9569.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 141.84.137.142 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 05 Nov 1998 02:56:46 PST X-Originating-IP: [141.84.137.142] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Spooky New Arrival! and adds (again) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 02:56:46 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org After geting back from traveling I just finally got caught up with my E-mail. so. >Scott and Valeria Davidson are proud to announce the arrival of >our spooky little boy: >Alexander Cole Davidson >7 lbs, 4.5 oz. >19 1/2 inches long >Born: October 31, 1998... at 4:31 a.m. >I'm gonna go get some sleep now. Mega congrats to Scott, Valeria, and Carrol and Eric (hope I spelled everyones name right). And totally unrelated, I apolagize to everyone sick of hearing about adds but I had an idea. I have been trying to make a replacement for the add system, but people are amazingly resistant to change, so I had an idea to simpely "fix" the existing system. First asume the add system is a decent judge of difficulty, say 1 to 15% error (mine being the high estamate). Now sit down a panel of experienced players to asign a fair number to the common moves not correctly rated. So blur and ripwalk would stil be 4 and atomsmasher would become 4 or 5 or whatever is considered fair. Then when ever someone hitts a new move, we can use the add system to aproximate it¥s difficulty based on related moves. For example if the panel decides that atomsmasher should be 4 then an atomic double leg over would be 5, ie one more dex. Then when new moves become more familiar the panel can concider them to decide if they were rated fairly. Each year at worlds the panel could then consider a list of new moves and decide if they are familiar enough to judge. This seems to work, not much changes, and almost perfect relaiability, no "patching" the system. Did I miss anything? I would also sugest that instead of using the add system to distinguish unique moves, Job¥s notation be used instead. Unless I¥m mistaken the add system doesn¥t distinguish between steping osis and blender, where in Job¥s the diffeerence is obvious. But that¥s on another tangent. -Andrew ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 7 21:03:59 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id VAA22822 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 7 Nov 1998 21:03:59 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send105.yahoomail.com (send105.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.128]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA26732 for ; Thu, 5 Nov 1998 18:46:45 -0800 Message-ID: <19981106024832.20847.rocketmail@send105.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.191.52] by send105.yahoomail.com; Thu, 05 Nov 1998 18:48:32 PST Date: Thu, 5 Nov 1998 18:48:32 -0800 (PST) From: EZ Piltz Subject: [freestyle] X-MAS... I can't hear you!!! To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org What is up, you all? Who's hosting the X-Mas Jam this year?!!!! I might not be kicking by then, but I'd like to go anyways if possible; could at least do tons of taping. That's right, Mr. Intergalactic is laying off shred until his back is healed. He is now accepting charitable contributions to benefit the Intergalactic Rehabilitative Therapy Fund. 2216 Goss Cir. E. #2, Boulder, CO 80302. Come on, somebody, let's get the X-Mas Jam coordinated, and fast. Peace, Eli Zohar Boulder, CO _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 7 21:05:02 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id VAA28265 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 7 Nov 1998 21:05:02 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: SuperOwen@aol.com Received: from imo23.mx.aol.com (imo23.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.67]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA16182 for ; Sat, 7 Nov 1998 08:34:08 -0800 Received: from SuperOwen@aol.com by imo23.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OOJHa02329 for ; Sat, 7 Nov 1998 11:33:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2f61baeb.36447675@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1998 11:33:57 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Worlds Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 226 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Does anyone know at least what month Worlds is in this year? and maybe possible locations? Owen "Total Package" Parrish From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 7 21:05:19 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id VAA28271 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 7 Nov 1998 21:05:19 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from exchange.docutech.com (docutech.com [207.239.14.66]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA00277 for ; Fri, 6 Nov 1998 06:03:07 -0800 Received: by EXCHANGE with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id ; Fri, 6 Nov 1998 09:03:20 -0500 Message-ID: <2FE1EC1B4F2ED211B34C00104B2268D1020115@EXCHANGE> From: TJ Young To: freestyle@footbag.org Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 09:03:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org For anyone who knows Ethan Klien, he is getting back from Asia Nov. 13 or so. I would like to get a little welcome back shred planned for the end of Nov. We could do it in Philly, Princeton, or New York(whats up JP). If anyone has any suggestions for location (indoor) or is interested in participating, contact TJ at - "tjyoung@docutech.com". Where you at Sunil? From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 7 21:05:20 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id VAA28277 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 7 Nov 1998 21:05:20 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from webster.lcc.ctc.edu (lcc.ctc.edu [134.39.132.10]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA06412 for ; Fri, 6 Nov 1998 13:31:33 -0800 Received: from lab2.ctc.edu (134.39.132.50) by webster.lcc.ctc.edu (WORLDMAIL 1.3.166) for freestyle@footbag.org; 6 Nov 1998 13:34:21 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19981106133558.00695b7c@lcc.ctc.edu> X-Sender: gehrmanaj@lcc.ctc.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 06 Nov 1998 13:35:58 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ahren Gehrman Subject: [freestyle] ? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Whut up!? Hey? Where did everybody go? When I joined the list there were twenty messages in my box everyday. Now there is one a day. Y'all can't be that busy. Hmmmmmm? Is there nothing to talk about anymore? How about this? It seems like every time I kick with Rippin', I play better. I wondered why and finally figured it out. It's because the whole time he's giving me ideas for combos. What's better than one creative mind thinking of combos? Two creative minds thinking of combos. I think that there are enough people who know each others styles to give each other ideas. I haven't seen everybody on the list play but most of you have. Why not start thinking of other peoples styles and giving them ideas. Just an idea. Torch From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 7 21:05:27 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id VAA28283 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 7 Nov 1998 21:05:27 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from opus.vcn.bc.ca (marigold@opus.vcn.bc.ca [207.102.64.2]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA07765 for ; Fri, 6 Nov 1998 14:53:19 -0800 Received: from localhost by opus.vcn.bc.ca (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id OAA15663 for ; Fri, 6 Nov 1998 14:53:12 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1998 14:53:04 -0800 (PST) From: Verhoef Anne To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Superfly Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey everyone, I was skoolin last night and during a middle of a string, I thought I'd try superfly (symposium barfly) which I have never attempted before. I got good height on it and made it all the way around twice. The only reason I didn't hit it was because the bag missed by clipper foot by an inch when it landed. It really isn't that hard. It's like paradox symposium whirl only you have to jump higher and do 2 dex's. I tried it a bunch of times after that but kept on losing my balance in the air(you really have to stay up there a long time it seems). My first attempt was definitely the closest. But I notice when you try a move spontaneously without thinking about it before hand, you have a lot better chance of hitting it. I guess it's because of the pressure of the thought of hitting a hard move. Anyone else have experiences like this? Adrian V. -- marigold@vcn.bc.ca From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 09:08:53 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA03889 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 09:08:53 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Allman144@aol.com Received: from Allman144@aol.com by imo20.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id IWYIa03785 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 01:31:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4060996e.36453ad3@aol.com> Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1998 01:31:47 EST To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #509 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 72 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 11/7/98 11:14:56 PM, you wrote: <> Thats it???? :) Anthony Glick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 09:09:12 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA03905 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 09:09:12 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Allman144@aol.com Received: from Allman144@aol.com by imo17.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id IUPYa04133 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 01:31:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <68c15075.36453aaf@aol.com> Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1998 01:31:11 EST To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #509 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 72 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 11/7/98 11:14:56 PM, you wrote: <> Note: This next statement is not a joke. Anyone from the midwest want to come to Cleveland for a little mini X-mas jam? Don't worry, I won't be offended if get a barrage of "no!". It is worth a try though. Anthony Glick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 09:09:20 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA03911 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 09:09:20 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from pippin.imagiware.com (josh@pippin.imagiware.com [206.215.211.9]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA25885 for ; Sat, 7 Nov 1998 21:17:54 -0800 Received: from localhost (josh@localhost) by pippin.imagiware.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA29719 for ; Sat, 7 Nov 1998 23:17:43 -0600 Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1998 23:17:42 -0600 (CST) From: Josh Casey To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] put it in Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey everyone, Just a quick question/comment? It seems to me that its time to give the paradox to spinning moves that currently dont have them. For example a spinning mirage is clearly a paradox move, same with spinning drifter, the motion is exactly the same as in a regular paradox drifter except with a spin added in. The same would go for spinning torqe which should CLEARLY get a paradox add. The best part is that there is no vagueness as to which moves should recieve the paradox. Any thoughts on this? Has this allready been clarified? It seems clear cut to me and an obvious change needing to be made. I wonder what you all think. I seem to remember this coming up briefly and Eric Wulff saying "I've been saying that all along!" Later, Josh Casey From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 18:03:15 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA17676 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 18:03:15 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from newmicronpc (sfr-qbu-pqq-vty148.as.wcom.net [209.154.103.148]) by m9.sprynet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA29713 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 09:25:14 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199811081725.JAA29713@m9.sprynet.com> Reply-To: From: " Jane Jones" To: Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #509 Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1998 08:58:18 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hmmm... : In a message dated 11/7/98 11:14:56 PM, you wrote: : : <> : my understanding of superfly is that it is a symoposium barfly. sooo...it's not actually like a paradox symposium whirl only with two dexterities, is it? don't you have to clipper set the bag as if your going into your barfly move, but then step down to symposium with that same setting foot before it does its double out-in dexterities? I guess it could be like a paradox symposium double over down. It all sounds difficult to me. Yahoo to all of you that can get your foot under it. Adios, Jane From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 20:16:43 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id UAA27006 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 20:16:43 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from direcpc.com ([206.71.114.112]) by postoffice2.direcpc.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-45425U50000L50000S0) with ESMTP id AAA21751; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 14:50:06 -0500 Message-ID: <35A5C731.AB7AFCDB@direcpc.com> Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 02:48:02 -0500 From: Matt Avery Organization: 4th Dimension Interactive X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: iguana04@SPRYNET.com CC: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #509 References: <199811081725.JAA29713@m9.sprynet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Pdx Symposium whirl with 2 dexterities? Lets get real here...anyone that can hit that baby is hein! Wouldnt that be a pdx symp whirr? Matt Jane Jones wrote: > Hmmm... > > : In a message dated 11/7/98 11:14:56 PM, you wrote: > : > : < : to jump higher and do 2 dex's.>> > : > > my understanding of superfly is that it is a symoposium barfly. > sooo...it's not actually like a paradox symposium whirl only with two > dexterities, is it? > > don't you have to clipper set the bag as if your going into your barfly > move, but then step down to symposium with that same setting foot before it > does its double out-in dexterities? > I guess it could be like a paradox symposium double over down. > > It all sounds difficult to me. Yahoo to all of you that can get your foot > under it. > > Adios, > Jane From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 20:17:11 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id UAA27020 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 20:17:11 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from localhost by opus.vcn.bc.ca (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id LAA04381; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 11:37:53 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1998 11:37:47 -0800 (PST) From: Verhoef Anne To: Jane Jones cc: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #509 In-Reply-To: <199811081725.JAA29713@m9.sprynet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Sun, 8 Nov 1998, Jane Jones wrote: > my understanding of superfly is that it is a symoposium barfly. > sooo...it's not actually like a paradox symposium whirl only with two > dexterities, is it? I just meant that the motion is basically the same only except you are going around the bag the other way with two dex's. Both moves feel really similar. That's all I'm saying. Adrian V. -- marigold@vcn.bc.ca From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 21:31:38 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id VAA11380 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 21:31:38 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f69.hotmail.com [207.82.251.209]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA01157 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 12:47:45 -0800 Received: (qmail 18178 invoked by uid 0); 8 Nov 1998 19:47:12 -0000 Message-ID: <19981108194712.18177.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 08 Nov 1998 11:47:12 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: freestyle@footbag.org, josh@pippin.imagiware.com Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 08 Nov 1998 11:47:12 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all. Josh Casey wrote" > >It seems to me that its time to give the paradox to spinning moves that >currently dont have them. For example a spinning mirage is clearly >a paradox move, same with spinning drifter, the motion is exactly the >same as in a regular paradox drifter except with a spin added in. >The same would go for spinning torqe which should CLEARLY get a >paradox add. The best part is that there is no vagueness as to which moves >should recieve the paradox. I'd only clarify this by saying spinning moves set from a clipper. You can set a spin move from an outstep, so that a move is not gyro, but then the pdx add isn't justified. Ceiling Fan nyfD ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 21:46:18 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id VAA19897 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 21:46:18 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA01993 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 13:25:19 -0800 Received: from [206.66.71.193] (dhcptest1 [206.66.71.160]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA09941; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 13:24:43 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1998 13:25:51 -0800 To: Josh Casey From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 11:17 PM -0600 11/7/98, Josh Casey wrote: > It seems clear cut to me and an obvious change needing to be made. > I wonder what you all think. I seem to remember this coming up briefly > and Eric Wulff saying "I've been saying that all along!" So have I. Marius is paradox, for example -- there is no doubt about it. I think most folks finally agree on this point. Eric's definition was right on -- "A spin simply moves the paradox dex to the other side of the body." Then, "KeN Somolinos" replied: > I'd only clarify this by saying spinning moves set from a clipper. You > can set a spin move from an outstep, so that a move is not gyro, but > then the pdx add isn't justified KeN, you're on crack. :-) The set doesn't matter. If you spin into a move, and then have to put the breaks on, then twist the other way to get your leg to go around the bag, you've done a paradox move. All other things being equal, of course. Again, "A spin simply moves the paradox dex to the other side of the body." It doesn't matter which foot you set the spin with, if, once you complete the spin, you do a move that would be otherwise paradox if you hadn't spun and set on the other side of the body, it's paradox. (Whew.) Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 22:27:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id WAA28445 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 22:27:50 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f270.hotmail.com [207.82.251.161]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA02818 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 14:06:28 -0800 Received: (qmail 609 invoked by uid 0); 8 Nov 1998 22:05:57 -0000 Message-ID: <19981108220557.608.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 08 Nov 1998 14:05:57 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: josh@pippin.imagiware.com, brat@footbag.org Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 08 Nov 1998 14:05:57 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all >Then, "KeN Somolinos" replied: >> I'd only clarify this by saying spinning moves set from a clipper. You >> can set a spin move from an outstep, so that a move is not gyro, but >> then the pdx add isn't justified > >KeN, you're on crack. :-) The set doesn't matter. If you spin into a move, >and then have to put the breaks on, then twist the other way to get your >leg to go around the bag, you've done a paradox move. All other things >being equal, of course. Again, "A spin simply moves the paradox dex to the >other side of the body." It doesn't matter which foot you set the spin >with, if, once you complete the spin, you do a move that would be otherwise >paradox if you hadn't spun and set on the other side of the body, it's >paradox. (Whew.) I understand that. What i was saying, is that if you do a clipper set, spin away from the bag and dex with the leg you set with, it is gyro. If you set on the outstep of one of your legs, spin away from the bag and dex with the other leg, it is spinning but not pdx. Some spinning moves are pdx, but depending where you set from, something that would be gyro (if the set were disregarded) is simply spinning. Marius should get a pdx cause you pdx after a spin. A mobius set from a right toe instead of a left clipper should not. I'm not on crack, i'm just nitpicking. I understand, and have understood since before Josh Casey's posting, the concept of a paradox after a spin. I'm a ceiling fan, i understand the concepts of spinning. Ken CF Somolinos nyfD ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 22:30:39 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id WAA28472 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 22:30:39 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA02892 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 14:09:32 -0800 Received: from [206.66.71.193] (dhcptest1 [206.66.71.160]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA17302; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 14:09:27 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19981108220557.608.qmail@hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1998 14:10:36 -0800 To: "KeN Somolinos" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 2:05 PM -0800 11/8/98, KeN Somolinos wrote: > If you set on the outstep of one of your legs, spin away from the bag > and dex with the other leg, it is spinning but not pdx. Right -- I disagree with you on this point. Hence, you must be on crack. :-) Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 22:35:27 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id WAA04186 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 22:35:27 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: (qmail 1967 invoked by uid 0); 8 Nov 1998 22:10:39 -0000 Message-ID: <19981108221039.1966.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 08 Nov 1998 14:10:38 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org, iguana04@SPRYNET.com Subject: [freestyle] superfly clarifications MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 08 Nov 1998 14:10:38 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey hey Jane says: >my understanding of superfly is that it is a symoposium barfly. Correct >sooo...it's not actually like a paradox symposium whirl only with two >dexterities, is it? I think he was saying it feels like one, at least the set, plant, jump high part. If he meant it feels like a PS whirl with an extra dex, then it would be PS whirr. That's a frightening thought. >I guess it could be like a paradox symposium double over down. > pdx double over down doesn't exist. Bye. KeN nyfD ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 22:38:22 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id WAA04211 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 22:38:22 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f227.hotmail.com [207.82.251.118]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA03071 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 14:16:49 -0800 Received: (qmail 15951 invoked by uid 0); 8 Nov 1998 22:16:18 -0000 Message-ID: <19981108221618.15950.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 08 Nov 1998 14:16:17 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: brat@footbag.org, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 08 Nov 1998 14:16:17 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Steve > >At 2:05 PM -0800 11/8/98, KeN Somolinos wrote: >> If you set on the outstep of one of your legs, spin away from the bag >> and dex with the other leg, it is spinning but not pdx. > >Right -- I disagree with you on this point. Hence, you must be on crack. :-) Let me give an example. If i set a gyro mirage off a left foot clipper, i don't get a pdx add, right? now, if i set the same move off of a right outstep, then the move is coming from the same side of the body, but the dex leg is different than the set leg, so it isn't gyro, but there is a spin. Hence, it is spinning mirage, but gets no pdx. If i were to do a left foot clipper, spin, and then mirage with my right leg, then that would be a spinning pdx mirage and deserve a pdx add. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 22:52:29 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id WAA04301 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 22:52:29 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA03140 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 14:27:02 -0800 Received: from [206.66.71.193] (dhcptest1 [206.66.71.160]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA19979; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 14:26:36 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19981108221618.15950.qmail@hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1998 14:24:02 -0800 To: "KeN Somolinos" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 2:16 PM -0800 11/8/98, KeN Somolinos wrote: > Let me give an example. If i set a gyro mirage off a left foot clipper, > i don't get a pdx add, right? now, if i set the same move off of a > right outstep, then the move is coming from the same side of the body, > but the dex leg is different than the set leg, so it isn't gyro, but > there is a spin. Hence, it is spinning mirage, but gets no pdx. In neither of these cases are you talking about a paradox move, so why are you bringing this example up? The point is that the set doesn't matter, so whether you spin into a mirage from an outside or the opposite-foot clipper, you're doing the same move. Paradoxness doesn't have to do with which foot does the set, per se (though people describe it in those terms for lots of reasons). It has to do with which *side of your body* the dexterity happens on. (See Jeff Gran's dissertation on paradox last month.) > If i > were to do a left foot clipper, spin, and then mirage with my right leg, > then that would be a spinning pdx mirage and deserve a pdx add. Right! Then what are you saying? That if you set the same move from a RIGHT OUTSIDE set that it *wouldn't* be paradox? If so, again, and this is what I was referring to two messages ago, I disagree with you. Back to square one. :-) Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 8 23:11:29 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id XAA12851 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 23:11:29 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send1e.yahoomail.com (send1e.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA03308 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 14:48:22 -0800 Message-ID: <19981108224450.2104.rocketmail@send1e.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.194.25] by send1e; Sun, 08 Nov 1998 14:44:50 PST Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1998 14:44:50 -0800 (PST) From: EZ Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey! Don't forget "Atomic" and "Nuclear" sets. They also put the bag on the opposite side from the 2nd dex. Tricks like atom smasher, atomic whirl, atomic drifter, etc. would well-deservingly benefit from redefining "paradox". And anyone who says otherwise is on crack. ;-) Eli Zohar Boulder, CO _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 01:16:45 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id BAA14305 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 01:16:45 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f57.hotmail.com [207.82.251.69]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA04491 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 16:41:59 -0800 Received: (qmail 3957 invoked by uid 0); 9 Nov 1998 00:41:28 -0000 Message-ID: <19981109004128.3956.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 08 Nov 1998 16:41:28 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: footbug@hotmail.com, brat@footbag.org Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 08 Nov 1998 16:41:28 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey again. >> were to do a left foot clipper, spin, and then mirage with my right leg, >> then that would be a spinning pdx mirage and deserve a pdx add. > >Right! Then what are you saying? What I am saying is there is a difference between gyro, spinning, and spinning paradox. Since in the definition of gyro, there is the part about dexing with the set leg, you can set off a diff leg (which supposedly doesn't matter, but IS part of the definition of gyro)and spin without it being a gyro move. In these cases there is no pdx. In the cases where you set spin, then twist back, such as marius, it is spinning pdx. Let's look at some variations here. 1. Gyro mirage. clip>spin away>same in>opp toe This is gyro since the dex leg is also the set leg. No pdx justified. 2. Spinning mirage. set from right toe, or maybe right outstep>spin>left leg in to out dex>right toe This is the same move as the first. The fact that the set leg is different than the dex leg makes is spinning, but there is no pdx add. 3. Spinning pdx mirage. clip>spin away>opp in>opp toe Not gyro since the dex leg is diff than the set leg, and there is a def pdx justified. It's like a pdx mirage after a spin. You could also do the same move off a diff set like right outstep>spin away>left in dex>right toe Same move cause the set doesn't matter and there is no gyro stuff to worry about. So all I was saying is that gyro, spinning, and spinning pdx are all different, even if the diff between gyro and spinning is minor. I agree that the difference between gyro and spinning pdx is a big one. That's why I'm not on crack. KeN nyf'D ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 01:53:31 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id BAA22809 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 01:53:31 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA05151 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 17:27:03 -0800 Received: from [206.66.71.160] (dhcptest1 [206.66.71.160]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA04925; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 17:26:46 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19981109004128.3956.qmail@hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1998 17:26:07 -0800 To: "KeN Somolinos" From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 4:41 PM -0800 11/8/98, KeN Somolinos wrote: > What I am saying is there is a difference between gyro, spinning, and > spinning paradox. No duh. :-) > Since in the definition of gyro, there is the part about dexing with the > set leg, you can set off a diff leg (which supposedly doesn't matter, > but IS part of the definition of gyro)and spin without it being a gyro > move. That's just a question of terminology, not of difficulty. Terms like "gyro" are just used to simplify describing certain types of moves that are similar, so that they can be combined with other move names to easily describe the moves. These are similar to describing added difficulty, but they are *not the same*. So whether or not gyro moves can be set off anything but clippers is a completely orthogonal issue to difficulty assessment (such as whether or not a move merits the "paradox" add). > In these cases there is no pdx. In the cases where you set spin, > then twist back, such as marius, it is spinning pdx. Let's look at some > variations here. I don't think we disagree on most of those points; I think I'm just saying your message is potentially confusing to people who don't get the difference. So, instead of picking these nits with you, let me put forth what I think are the basic issues here, and if you still disagree, you can argue those points more directly: (1) "spinning " means "spin (away) into ". (2) "gyro " means "spinning , where the first dexterity in is done with the setting foot". (The implication is the setting foot is a clipper, but it's possible it could be a cross-body sole, a dragon, or even a toe for certain wierd moves like fairy-set and pixie-set spinning moves. But let's not go down that last rathole yet because in my mind it has no bearing on paradoxness.) (3) "paradox" means paradox. If a move has a paradox in it, and no other word describing the move (such as "blurry") already indicates the paradox concept (where the add is present, but the word "paradox" is not in the name), then you add the word "paradox" to the name, else it would be redundant otherwise. By definition, "gyro" moves (spinning moves where the first dexterity is done with the setting leg) cannot be paradox. So you'll never see a move termed "gyro paradox ". But (non-gyro) "spinning" moves could very well be paradox, so you might see "spinning paradox" when (a) a spinning move involves a dexterity, (b) the dexterity is done on the far side of the body (relative to the dex leg) after completion of the spin, and (c) the move is otherwise just a spinning version of a paradox move. > 1. Gyro mirage. clip>spin away>same in>opp toe > This is gyro since the dex leg is also the set leg. No pdx justified. No gyro moves can ever be paradox. > 2. Spinning mirage. set from right toe, or maybe right > outstep>spin>left leg in to out dex>right toe > This is the same move as the first. The fact that the set leg is > different than the dex leg makes is spinning, but there is no pdx add. Yes, this is definitely a spinning mirage. It's exactly the same move as gyro mirage, but it's one of those clear cases where it's not gyro because it doesn't fit the pattern of gyro moves. But this difference doesn't really bear on whether or not it could have a paradox in it. > 3. Spinning pdx mirage. clip>spin away>opp in>opp toe Not gyro since > the dex leg is diff than the set leg, and there is a def pdx justified. > It's like a pdx mirage after a spin. Right, again, we still don't differ on this. But for the second time, you've listed 3 out of 4 of the combinations -- leaving off what I think is the most important one, and the one that I thought you were referring to in your first posting: toe or outside-set spinning paradox. I claim they exist, even though most people think you need a clipper set for paradox. I assumed, since there was nothing else to make of your previous comments, that you were arguing this type of move *wouldn't* be paradox. But so far you still haven't address this point. That's the only interpretation I could come up with for your first posting on this thread: " You can set a spin move from an outstep, so that a move is not gyro, but then the pdx add isn't justified." I'm saying if you think spinning moves set from a toe or outside can't be paradox, you're on crack. :-) Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 02:53:24 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id CAA07091 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 02:53:24 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f181.hotmail.com [207.82.251.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA05583 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 17:51:50 -0800 Received: (qmail 5406 invoked by uid 0); 9 Nov 1998 01:51:16 -0000 Message-ID: <19981109015116.5405.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 08 Nov 1998 17:51:16 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: footbug@hotmail.com, brat@footbag.org Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 08 Nov 1998 17:51:16 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi >I'm saying if you think spinning moves >set from a toe or outside can't be paradox, you're on crack. :-) > > Steve > I know they can, but it depends on which toe or which outstep. I think our initial disagreement was that you assumed i was talking about the other outstep, which indeed justifies a pdx. Clipper was an example, nothing more. I understand pdx. KeN "ive never done drugs" somolinos ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 05:07:40 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id FAA16990 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 05:07:40 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (hejira.hunter.cuny.edu [146.95.128.97]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA09003 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 20:36:24 -0800 Received: (from jpenney@localhost) by hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id XAA04926; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 23:43:28 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1998 23:43:27 -0500 (EST) From: Deliciously Saucy Josh Penney To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in In-Reply-To: <19981109015116.5405.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Sun, 8 Nov 1998, KeN Somolinos wrote: > I understand pdx. > KeN "ive never done drugs" somolinos Hey, all! I have no desire to get into this debate, tho it *is* one of the silliest. Normally I couldn't resist but I have been real busy as of late. I just wanted to set the records straight. When I met Ceiling Fan, he was gettin the mojo working with Marion Barry. The kid smokes crack. Constantly. Come out of de nile, kid. It's too cold to go swimming, anyway. from Icy cold NYC, JP From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 05:52:20 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id FAA25631 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 05:52:20 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f226.hotmail.com [207.82.251.117]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA09549 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 21:28:39 -0800 Received: (qmail 20070 invoked by uid 0); 9 Nov 1998 05:28:08 -0000 Message-ID: <19981109052808.20069.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 08 Nov 1998 21:28:08 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: freestyle@footbag.org, jpenney@hejira.hunter.cuny.edu Subject: Re: [freestyle] put it in MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 08 Nov 1998 21:28:08 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all When I met Ceiling >Fan, he was gettin the mojo working with Marion Barry. The kid smokes >crack. Constantly. Oh shut up Josh. You're the one who got me to start going to Washington Square park every weekend, so I think it's easy enough to figure out who got me started. Ken "ceiling fan" Somolinos nyfd ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 06:26:01 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA01458 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 06:26:01 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA09919 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 22:03:04 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id AAA10215 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 00:02:31 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx43-24.ix.netcom.com(207.221.94.152) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma010098; Mon Nov 9 00:01:56 1998 Message-ID: <3646883C.392A@utdallas.edu> Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 00:14:20 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] paradox spinning Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ok... time for clarification... If the set is cross body (clipper, dragon) AND the first dex is with the set leg, this is gyro. No paradox. If the set is cross body AND the first dex is with the non-set leg, this is spinning. This gets a paradox. If the set is NOT cross body (outside, toe) AND the first dex is with the set leg, this is spinning? This also gets a paradox? If the set is NOT cross body AND the first dex is with the non setting leg, this is gyro? Not paradox? All of this assumes a quick back spin after the set and in to out dexes for the paradox. Is all of this right, or am I missing something? Let me know. Later. -Derric Dallas Footbag Club From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 06:54:09 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA10138 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 06:54:09 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA10200 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 22:33:14 -0800 Received: from [206.66.71.160] (dhcptest1 [206.66.71.160]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA04002; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 22:32:09 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3646883C.392A@utdallas.edu> Date: Sun, 8 Nov 1998 22:33:14 -0800 To: scalf@utdallas.edu From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] paradox spinning Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 12:14 AM -0600 11/9/98, Derric Scalf wrote: > Ok... time for clarification... Or perhaps further confusion? :-) > If the set is cross body AND the first dex is with the non-set leg, this > is spinning. This gets a paradox. This is an oversimplification and therefore false. Paradox moves are only paradox if they are paradox. Spinning or not. You can't say a move "gets a paradox" just because the set is cross body and the first dex is the non-set leg. That's absurd. > If the set is NOT cross body (outside, toe) AND the first dex is with > the set leg, this is spinning? This also gets a paradox? Grrrr. Apparently my last message wasn't clear. > If the set is NOT cross body AND the first dex is with the non setting > leg, this is gyro? Not paradox? I can see where you might have gotten this from, but I don't think I ever said quite that. I said there are several sets that could be gyro (e.g., dragon or cross-body sole), but they're all cross-body. The term gyro does not describe the technical components of a trick but rather the "style" of trick -- spinning away from a cross-body set and then immediately doing a dex [in or out] with the setting foot at the end of the spin is a "gyro" move. If the set is not cross body, it's not gyro. But it's the SAME MOVE but it has a different name (spinning instead of gyro). Just like the reason infinity and butterfly are the same move. The name can describe more than just the technical components of the move. Does any of this make any sense yet? :-) So, to summarize (again): - gyro (or gyrating) is just a name for moves that are set cross-body, and that involve a spin (away), and where the first dexterity is performed (in or out) with the setting foot; it turns out, for obvious reasons if you know your freestyle concepts, gyro moves just happen to never be paradox moves (it's not like there's a rule that gyro moves are somehow exempted from paradox adds -- they simply can't be paradox because of how they're constructed); - spinning is an ambiguous term that could apply to any number of situations; in-spinning clearly means spinning into the set, and spinning usually means spinning away, but is really ambiguous (could mean gyro, spinning away, inspinning, etc.); so it's always important to qualify the word "spinning" to articulate the specific style of spin involved; you can't make blanket statements that spinning moves are or aren't always paradox -- it really depends on the move, not on the set or which type of spin it is (except gyro moves, which, as I think everyone agrees, simply aren't paradox); - paradox moves are almost impossible to define in a single sentence, so I won't try here; but when a paradox move is done out of a spin, it is a spinning paradox move; the normal tests for whether or not something is paradox are modified so that the side of the body that does the paradox dexterity in a spinning move is the opposite side from that of the non-spinning version of the equivalent move -- which foot does the set no longer matters, because the bag has long left your foot and you've spun around! What matters is where the bag ends up relative to your body before you begin the dexterity in question. If it's on the far side of the dexterity leg, it's a paradox move; these moves are called "spinning paradox", though many of them have their own names. That's it for now. Hopefully this is the same information I put in the previous message, but I retyped it from scratch to be sure in case my previous message was somehow less clear than this one. :-) Steve From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 15:14:16 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id PAA24292 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 15:14:16 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Chase Foster Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com (imo12.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.2]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA10472 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 22:58:56 -0800 Received: from Calvin4hob@aol.com by imo12.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OWCQa19214 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 01:58:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1998 01:58:19 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] dragon?drills? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 224 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Since I am new to freestyle footbag since this August. I can do up to only 3-add moves like butterfly and mirage ect. so I was wondering about what is an dragon, because I don't understand how you can do an outside del. xbdy. Also Eli told me a good tip on drills to try all moves with both weak and strong sides. And I was wondering if you could help with any other drills or tips. Thanks. Chase From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 15:30:59 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id PAA24346 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 15:30:59 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f295.hotmail.com [207.82.251.186]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id FAA13126 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 05:27:54 -0800 Received: (qmail 11098 invoked by uid 0); 9 Nov 1998 13:27:19 -0000 Message-ID: <19981109132719.11097.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 141.84.137.129 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 09 Nov 1998 05:27:18 PST X-Originating-IP: [141.84.137.129] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] paradox spinning MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 05:27:18 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Steve wrote: >Paradox moves are only paradox if they are paradox. Spinning or not. >You can't say a move "gets a paradox" just because the set is cross >body and the first dex is the non-set leg. That's absurd. Well perhaps you need to clarify somemore, because this sounds like you are trying to contrive the add system to make up for accuracy gaps. The set is important to the definition. Paradox applies to moves set from a clipper followed (usually) by a same dex, plus a few straggler moves thrown in for fun, or perhaps bad definition. Trying to make this already all purpose add apply to other moves is abusing the system. In this case some spinning moves are related to their non spinning paradox counterparts, but they are difficult for a different reason. The difference between drifter and paradox drifter has to do with the "window" in which the dex is being performed. The difference between vortex and spinning drifter has more to do with changing momentum, which is something else. Still if you want to define what makes spinning drifter and like moves difficult, Scott suggested a "special" add, well I suggest we just rename the paradox add the "contrived" add and that it simply be added to moves that aren¥t fairly rated by the add system. Not only would fewer moves that deserve it be left out but we wouldn¥t have to pretend to define what the hell it is. e.g. as Steve put so well: >- paradox moves are almost impossible to define in a single sentence, Heh heh, well exactly ;) -Andrew ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 15:31:02 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id PAA24356 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 15:31:02 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: NikeekiN@aol.com Received: from imo22.mx.aol.com (imo22.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.66]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA10652 for ; Sun, 8 Nov 1998 23:26:48 -0800 Received: from NikeekiN@aol.com by imo22.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OTGAa03976 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 02:26:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <61a0db57.36469915@aol.com> Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1998 02:26:13 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Symposium Mirage Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Casablanca - Windows sub 214 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was wondering if anyone had any tips on Symposium Mirage's. Thanks. Nick A. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 15:31:09 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id PAA24374 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 15:31:09 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA12129 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 01:29:05 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id DAA19242 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 03:29:00 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx43-24.ix.netcom.com(207.221.94.152) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma019237; Mon Nov 9 03:28:45 1998 Message-ID: <3646B8B8.22AD@utdallas.edu> Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 03:41:12 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] other things Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all. One good thing to come from all of this spinning paradox talk is that it got me to start thinking... I was thinking about all of the different ways you can do a gyro set - which as Steve was kind enough to point out is a clipper set to a quick back spin followed by a quick dex of the set foot - end of story. Well, I starting thinking about a back to front swirl dex being about the same as a gyro set - the only difference is that it is done before the spin and with the lower leg instead of the upper leg. Has anyone played around with a hybrid of these two styles? It seems that if you could get the dex with the lower leg as you are spinning (by "swirling into the spin"), you would have more time to do stuff after the set. I'm going to try this tomorrow. Hopefully, the dex won't be 'the'. Is this how the big apple sauce is done? Thinking of gyro sets from different xbody positions, I started thinking about twirls from xbody toe. I'm too tired to try now, but having hit swirl from xbody toe, it seems possible. Scott D, Have you tried or hit or played into and out of triplessly yet? A twirl is a front to back swirl dex bail to op osis, right? What is it called if you swirl the other way? I have no grand visions of even trying this any time soon, but it seems that people who can hit ripstien should be able to pull off this move - reverse twirl? I love this sport. If anyone has tried any of the above things, let me know how they worked. Later. -Derric DFC From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 16:25:51 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id QAA08742 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 16:25:51 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA14730 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 08:03:41 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA13482 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 10:03:28 -0600 (CST) Subject: [freestyle] Change to Job's Notation (PROPOSAL) Message-Id: <000000227452993472138@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 10:02:18 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.9 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org (Freestyle Listserve) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Being terminally confused about the dexterity directions and such in Job's notation, I want to propose a very minor change in the notation: Instead of dexes being referred to as "in" or "out", I would like the WHOLE DEX described instead: "in" = "I-O" or "IO" to describe the "In to Out" leg motion "out" = "O-I" or "OI" to describe the "Out to In" leg motion Note that the dash is optional - it helps visually, but is technically superfluous. This could also make it easier to describe swirl and twirl dexes where the notation isn't really "in" or "out" but "front" or "back". "F-B" or "FB" = "front to back" dex "B-F" or "BF" = "back to front" dex This would help me (at least) tremendously when looking at the notation to visualize the action that is occuring. ______________________________________ Derrick Fogle the fossil that developed a similar notation system before this list ever existed and can't seem to learn this new trick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 20:23:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id UAA11797 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:23:37 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA17756 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 11:43:07 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id NAA23337; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 13:43:03 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx43-24.ix.netcom.com(207.221.94.152) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma023150; Mon Nov 9 13:42:19 1998 Message-ID: <3647488D.3402@utdallas.edu> Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 13:54:53 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: NikeekiN@aol.com CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Symposium Mirage References: <61a0db57.36469915@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org NikeekiN@aol.com wrote: > > I was wondering if anyone had any tips on Symposium Mirage's. > Thanks. > >From a right toe set, set the bag a little above waist high directly in front of your left leg. (don't put your right foot on the ground) wait until the bag reaches its peak. As soon as the bag starts coming down, hop off of your left leg. You don't need to jump very high. Instead, try to just jump sideways OVER the bag. The dex is really small. Catch the bag on your right toe. The hardest part for me was that I was always trying to circle the bag in the air. You don't need to do that. If you jump over the bag, that is good enough. Set, wait a second, then jump. That pause helps you get your balance. Hope this helps. -Derric Dallas Footbag Club From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 20:24:05 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id UAA11810 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:24:05 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA17903 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 11:50:45 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id NAA24764; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 13:50:11 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx43-24.ix.netcom.com(207.221.94.152) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma024494; Mon Nov 9 13:48:38 1998 Message-ID: <36474A08.3732@utdallas.edu> Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 14:01:12 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Chase Foster CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] dragon?drills? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Chase Foster wrote: > > I was wondering about what is an > dragon, because I don't understand how you can do an outside del. xbdy. Dragon is a good way to hurt yourself. Do an outside delay and then wrap it around behind you until it is in a xbody position. There are a few people that can easily bend that way, but I'm not one of them. It takes a lot of ankle flexibility and it can tweak your knee if you aren't careful. Since you are hitting butterfly, try a butterfly dragon stall. Go just like you would for the butterfly, but catch the bag on a dragon instead of clipper. Right there, you have just discovered a flaw in the current add system. That is only 3 adds... just like a normal butterfly. Oh well. It is a move that'll make people wince when you hit it. Isn't that all that really matters? Perhaps Eli can give us some hellish dragon moves to try? -Derric DFC From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 9 20:25:35 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id UAA11829 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:25:35 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f55.hotmail.com [207.82.251.67]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA17641 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 11:38:27 -0800 Received: (qmail 922 invoked by uid 0); 9 Nov 1998 19:37:52 -0000 Message-ID: <19981109193752.921.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 09 Nov 1998 11:37:52 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: freestyle@footbag.org, scalf@utdallas.edu Subject: Re: [freestyle] other things MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 11:37:52 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey kickers! >A twirl is a front to back swirl dex bail to op osis, right? I don't think direction matters >What is it >called if you swirl the other way? I think it's also just twirl. On raw shred when Kenny Shults hits blurry twirl he goes back to front. >I love this sport. Hey! Me too. Ceiling Fan nyfd ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 01:21:08 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id BAA31954 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 01:21:08 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from pippin.imagiware.com (josh@pippin.imagiware.com [206.215.211.9]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA19697 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 13:44:01 -0800 Received: from localhost (josh@localhost) by pippin.imagiware.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA04724 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 15:43:51 -0600 Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1998 15:43:49 -0600 (CST) From: Josh Casey To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] kennys move Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On raw shred Kenny hit Blurry whirling Swirl not blurry twirl. josh From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 01:23:10 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id BAA31968 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 01:23:10 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from webster.lcc.ctc.edu (lcc.ctc.edu [134.39.132.10]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA20543 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 14:27:17 -0800 Received: from lab2.ctc.edu (134.39.132.58) by webster.lcc.ctc.edu (WORLDMAIL 1.3.166) for freestyle@footbag.org; 9 Nov 1998 14:30:18 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19981109143151.006963e0@lcc.ctc.edu> X-Sender: gehrmanaj@lcc.ctc.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 14:31:51 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ahren Gehrman Subject: Re: [freestyle] ? In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.1.32.19981106133558.00695b7c@lcc.ctc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Whut up? Brad said... >> ideas for combos. What's better than one creative mind thinking of combos? > I posted this last week and was wondering if you or anyone else has >hit scorpian tail to barroque or vice versa? Yeah, I've hit both. I almost hit baroke to superfly the other day too. Just missed the superfly. On another note. As far as the parodox thing goes, all I have to say is that you should listen to Steve. I've had previous conversations with him about it and he knows what he's talking about. That's all Torch From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 01:23:40 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id BAA31983 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 01:23:40 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send104.yahoomail.com (send104.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.122]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA21910 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 15:37:40 -0800 Message-ID: <19981109233742.9949.rocketmail@send104.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.192.85] by send104.yahoomail.com; Mon, 09 Nov 1998 15:37:42 PST Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1998 15:37:42 -0800 (PST) From: EZ Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] dragon?drills?ideas? To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Chase, D, and all. > > dragon, because I don't understand how you can do an outside del. xbdy. > Dragon is a good way to hurt yourself C'mon don't be a wimp! ;-D You just need to understand the mechanics of the "dragon". Derric is kinda' right, so Chase in CO, wait until I see you and I'll show you this wierd stall and how to do it. > Perhaps Eli can give us some hellish dragon moves to try? Gee... I'm somewhat flattered. Let me dig into the "weird dragon move" vault.... ok here are a few I've hit ending in dragon: whirling swirl, symposium whirl, symposium whirling swirl (on Sean's 98 UQAM, although I don't think it was worthy of video by itself), drifter, pdox drifter, ducking butterfly, spinning butterfly, ripwalk, torque, pdox torque, and I think that's it. Daryl Genz and Jon Schneider hit some wicked dragon moves, too. I have to go to work right now, so maybe I'll post the stuff they've hit later. Later, Zohar Boulder, CO _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 01:23:42 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id BAA31995 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 01:23:42 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA20419 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 14:18:09 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F2600701E2HPH@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 15:20:41 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 15:20:40 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] Worlds In-reply-to: <2f61baeb.36447675@aol.com> To: SuperOwen@aol.com Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Sat, 7 Nov 1998 SuperOwen@aol.com wrote: > Does anyone know at least what month Worlds is in this year? and maybe > possible locations? Worlds is in Chicago in '99 and according to a post by Scott Davidson the actual date and site are not yet set. One site would make it in June, the other site would make it in July. BRAD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 01:23:43 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id BAA31996 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 01:23:43 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA20319 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 14:13:31 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F2600701DUCBJ@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 15:15:48 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 15:15:47 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] ? In-reply-to: <3.0.1.32.19981106133558.00695b7c@lcc.ctc.edu> To: Ahren Gehrman Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > ideas for combos. What's better than one creative mind thinking of combos? I posted this last week and was wondering if you or anyone else has hit scorpian tail to barroque or vice versa? BRAD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 03:51:04 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA09287 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 03:51:04 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f177.hotmail.com [207.82.251.63]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA24767 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 18:41:31 -0800 Received: (qmail 29657 invoked by uid 0); 10 Nov 1998 02:41:00 -0000 Message-ID: <19981110024100.29656.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 09 Nov 1998 18:41:00 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: Calvin4hob@aol.com, scalf@utdallas.edu Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] dragon?drills? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 18:41:00 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey everyone. > Do an outside delay and then >wrap it around behind you until it is in a xbody position. Or you can just catch in x-body with your outside without any wrapping. > Perhaps Eli can give us >some hellish dragon moves to try? I've hit stepping butter dragon and legbeater ending in dragon. Has anyone blurried out of a dragon? I've done it once as a fluke. Ken "CF" somolinos nyfd ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 03:51:05 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA09293 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 03:51:05 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Ariel Santesteban Received: from tracker.excite.com (tracker-rwcmta.excite.com [198.3.99.217]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA23551 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 17:33:15 -0800 Received: from batty.excite.com ([199.172.152.107]) by tracker.excite.com (InterMail v04.00.02.01 201-227-103) with ESMTP id <19981110023230.JJZD292.tracker@batty.excite.com> for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 18:32:30 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] dragon?drills?ideas? Message-Id: <910661559.4658.715@mailexcite.com> Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 17:32:39 PST X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 127.0.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, 9 Nov 1998 15:37:42 -0800 (PST), EZ Piltz wrote: > symposium whirling swirl (on Sean's > 98 UQAM, although I don't think it was worthy of video by itself), I totally disagree. It is one of the most awesome tricks I have ever seen! Since not many people have ever seen this done, I am glad this trick has made it to video. If you want a challenge, go ahead and include this trick in some hella long guiltless string, but the difficulty in setting from dragon makes it that much more difficult. Can't wait for the videos... Ariel Santesteban _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private e-mail at http://mail.excite.com/ From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 03:51:07 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA09298 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 03:51:07 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (hejira.hunter.cuny.edu [146.95.128.97]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA23126 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 17:05:26 -0800 Received: (from jpenney@localhost) by hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id UAA20977; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:12:30 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:12:30 -0500 (EST) From: Deliciously Saucy Josh Penney To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Symposium Mirage In-Reply-To: <3647488D.3402@utdallas.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, 9 Nov 1998, Derric Scalf wrote: > NikeekiN@aol.com wrote: > > I was wondering if anyone had any tips on Symposium Mirage's. I always thought the most subtle but important aspect of this move was 'throwing down'. Right after I've set the bag I relax my setting leg, and lower that foot close to the ground. As I'm doing this I hop just a little- the momentum helps the actual mirage jump, and it helps regain your balance. Even if you look like a spaz. JP Where Ken smokes da rock From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 03:51:01 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA09273 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 03:51:01 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f190.hotmail.com [207.82.251.79]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA24823 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 18:47:13 -0800 Received: (qmail 18408 invoked by uid 0); 10 Nov 1998 02:46:42 -0000 Message-ID: <19981110024642.18407.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 09 Nov 1998 18:46:41 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] blurry twirl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 18:46:41 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi. A lot of people have refuted me and said that Kenny doesn't hit blurry twirl on raw shred. Everyone tells me he hits blurry whirling swirl. I know he hits blurry whirling swirl, he does it in a gym and goes into a spinning osis. But I am pretty sure he hits blurry twirl underneath the shade of a tree in someone's driveway and peter irish freaks out. I don't have the video with me here at Brown, so could someone please check? I recall watching it in slo mo. I'm pretty sure it's on there. Ken CF Somolinos nyfd ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 03:51:03 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA09281 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 03:51:03 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f83.hotmail.com [207.82.250.189]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA24737 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 18:37:57 -0800 Received: (qmail 15509 invoked by uid 0); 10 Nov 1998 02:37:26 -0000 Message-ID: <19981110023726.15508.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 09 Nov 1998 18:37:26 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] other things MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 18:37:26 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hiya! > >Kenny does a blurry twirl on Raw Shred? Hell yeah. > Have you seen the new '98 UQAM with Scott D doing spinning twirl >and peeking (gyro) twirl? Nope. I don't even have tv at college. I subsist on the videos on the website. > Where >about on Raw Shred is that blurry twirl? As i recall, Kenny is kicking in the shade of a tree in somebody's driveway. He starts off his run with it, and when he finally drops, Pete Irish picks up the bag, looks at the camera, points at Kenny and says something. On a similar note, I'd just like to say I strongly advocate footbag videos with the original sound. I learn many moves by listening to the sound people's feet make while they do it. There is a distinct rhythm to blurry whirl, and hearing it helps me know when to put my feet down and how quickly. Also, on 96 shred or some montreal tape, I would have missed many a trick had there been music. Lots of times people hit a fast move, and somebody in the background says something like "nice!" which cues me to rewind and watch in slo mo. I thought that Tuan Vu hit a blur in one video, but because somebody said something, I rewound and watched a really fast pogo paradox barrage. Everybody keep pushing yourself and the sport. Ken "ceiling fan" Somolinos nyfd ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 04:31:33 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA17968 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 04:31:33 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Calvin4hob@aol.com Received: from imo25.mx.aol.com (imo25.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.69]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA25814 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:05:31 -0800 Received: from Calvin4hob@aol.com by imo25.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OSXPa02317 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 23:04:49 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1998 23:04:49 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] dragon Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 224 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey, Thanks for all the help, I know how to do it,right now I can go from an outside stall and wrap it around into a xbdy position but every time I try and bring it up my foot goes verticle. Can anybody help me out with this.thanks Chase From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 04:31:45 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA17981 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 04:31:45 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA25621 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 19:47:14 -0800 Received: (from jriely@localhost) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id VAA07127; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 21:47:10 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1998 21:47:10 -0600 (CST) From: "Jeremiah J. Riely" X-Sender: jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu To: KeN Somolinos cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] other things In-Reply-To: <19981110023726.15508.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > > Where > >about on Raw Shred is that blurry twirl? > As i recall, Kenny is kicking in the shade of a tree in somebody's > driveway. He starts off his run with it, and when he finally drops, > Pete Irish picks up the bag, looks at the camera, points at Kenny and > says something. I think that he actually hits a bliserting whirl, not a blurry twirl. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 04:56:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA26621 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 04:56:56 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA26004 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:27:44 -0800 Received: from omen (p169-tnt-ak-1.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.111.169]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA09317 for ; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 17:27:30 +1300 Message-ID: <001e01be0c62$b7a7ac20$07050505@omen> From: "omen" To: Subject: Re: [freestyle] dragon Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1998 17:29:32 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Thanks for all the help, I know how to do it,right now I can go from an > outside stall and wrap it around into a xbdy position but every time I > try and bring it up my foot goes verticle. Can anybody help me out with >this.thanks stand on the foot in question and repeatedly bash it with a sledgehammer until it no longer sticks up vertically either that or stretch first followed by lots of dragon practice practice practice, flexibility comes in time __________________________________________________ Damian Coventry reply to dc504894@ait.ac.nz or lordomen@ihug.co.nz From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 05:02:11 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id FAA26733 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 05:02:11 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA58 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:29:50 -0800 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:30:10 -0800 Message-ID: <01BE0C1F.BF73A820.ewulff@jsishipping.com> From: Eric Wulff To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Your on Crack if... Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:30:09 -0800 Organization: JSI Shipping X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I've been checkin out my digest lately and Josh Casey brought up an issue which I did post something on a couple of months ago... the paradox concept within spin moves. Than Steve jumped in and very clearly explained the paradox concept several times. I copied what I wrote previously again below. Before you all read, if you care, I must also put forth my opinion regarding a couple of "people being on crack" comments from the most recent discussion on this topic. If Steve Goldberg says, "your on crack", I suggest you take a deep breath, relax and thouroughly think through what might have inspired such a comment from this man. More often than not, if Steve says, "your on crack", than "your on crack". Again, take your time, think it through. As it wazzz a couple 'O' months ago... Why and how did whoever, back in the day, figure that a spin negates the paradox concept? This has never ceased to annoy me. ***A spin simply moves the paradox dex to the other side of the body.*** For example, if you were to set a spinning paradox mirage from a left foot clipper than the paradox dex comes from the right mirage instead of the left as it would without a spin. With this concept in mind, think about the spinning(gyro?) mirage vs. a spinning paradox mirage. How about the dragonflyer? How about a Mobius vs. a spinning paradox torque? I believe that a majority would agree that these coupled tricks have different levels of difficulty. This could be easily accounted for and recognized by the add system if the paradox concept was included in moves with spins. Lets not even get into what a gyro really is! Thanx Again Ironman From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 05:04:03 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id FAA32758 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 05:04:03 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send1b.yahoomail.com (send1b.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.23]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA26114 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:35:07 -0800 Message-ID: <19981110043437.22908.rocketmail@send1b.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.184.182] by send1b; Mon, 09 Nov 1998 20:34:37 PST Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1998 20:34:37 -0800 (PST) From: EZ Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] other things To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ok, freestylers, I have discovered there are more people on crack than just "Ceiling Fan": > > Have you seen the new '98 UQAM with Scott D doing spinning twirl > > and peeking (gyro) twirl? Scott does neither of those moves. Some unnamed crack smoker is confusing these with 'Pdox Twirl' and 'Peeking Duck'. Zohar "wall spectator" Piltz Boulder, CO _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 05:31:47 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id FAA02560 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 05:31:47 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send1d.yahoomail.com (send1d.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.48]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA26350 for ; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 21:08:01 -0800 Message-ID: <19981110050705.21473.rocketmail@send1d.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.191.50] by send1d; Mon, 09 Nov 1998 21:07:05 PST Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1998 21:07:05 -0800 (PST) From: EZ Piltz Subject: [freestyle] soundtracklessness To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Aloha, Shredmeisters. > On a similar note, I'd just like to say I strongly > advocate footbag videos with the original sound. I learn many moves by listening to the sound people's feet make while they do it. Whuduyu know, I actually agree with the "fan of ceilings" on an issue. Next year Dave "Highlander" Holton and I are putting together a SuperShred Tape with a partial soundtrack. Whenever audibly possible, we'll leave it natural, but a cool soundtrack will take the place of annoying background noise. I'm working on the soundtrack right now, and I promise to make it diverse and interesting. In addition to "ceiling fan"'s enjoyment of slo-mo cueing words, I like hearing people's conversations, especially when having been there. THis does not include the camera person's conversations- the volume is overpowering. I would have liked to hear what was going on at World's on several occasions which I couldn't do with Sean's tape. When Ryan hit superfly > whirlwind the crowd of 20 or 30 people erupted; that would have been cool to hear again. Nonetheless, everyone should get Sean's miraculous vids. And watch out for my and Dave's video next year- "Sultans of Shred"... any suggestions for a cool title? the ideals of Zohar Boulder, CO _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 10 06:02:31 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA11178 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 06:02:31 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Bryan Fournier Received: from imo13.mx.aol.com (imo13.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA26702; Mon, 9 Nov 1998 21:34:41 -0800 Received: from ShReDStEiN@aol.com by imo13.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id RJDUa13872; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 00:25:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <55835267.3647ce57@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1998 00:25:43 EST To: footbug@hotmail.com, owner-freestyle@footbag.org, Freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [freestyle] blurry twirl Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Kenny does hit blurry whirling swirl on Raw Shred...thats his signature move...I don't know where people came up with this blurry twirl stuff... although that is a cool move... Scott could tell us all about it most likely... God bless ~Bryan From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 11 02:51:34 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id CAA09507 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 11 Nov 1998 02:51:34 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from webster.lcc.ctc.edu (lcc.ctc.edu [134.39.132.10]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA06920 for ; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 14:11:04 -0800 Received: from lab1_144.ctc.edu (134.39.132.12) by webster.lcc.ctc.edu (WORLDMAIL 1.3.166) for freestyle@footbag.org; 10 Nov 1998 14:14:05 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19981110141541.006a15a0@lcc.ctc.edu> X-Sender: gehrmanaj@lcc.ctc.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1998 14:15:41 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ahren Gehrman Subject: Re: [freestyle] blurry twirl In-Reply-To: <19981110024642.18407.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Whut up? Ken said... But I am pretty sure he hits blurry twirl underneath the >shade of a tree in someone's driveway and peter irish freaks out. Wrong. That shady spot was at Western Regionals in 96. Kenny hit what is called a blistering whirl. It's a whirling gyro whirl in case you didn't already know. I remember it because I was watching but I wasn't on camera. Torch From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 11 06:53:23 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA12470 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 11 Nov 1998 06:53:23 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from softhome.net (qmailr@charleston.SoftHome.net [204.144.231.41]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA11748 for ; Tue, 10 Nov 1998 19:39:22 -0800 Received: (qmail 6393 invoked by uid 417); 11 Nov 1998 02:52:39 -0000 Received: from pm499-45.dialip.mich.net (HELO x95levuwmich) (198.108.169.192) by smtp.softhome.net with SMTP; 11 Nov 1998 02:52:39 -0000 Message-ID: <000d01be0d1b$b6c9a920$c0a96cc6@x95levuwmich.edu> Reply-To: "cuong nguy" From: "cuong nguy" To: Subject: [freestyle] Freestyle shoes? What to get? Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1998 21:33:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000A_01BE0CF1.CC26D060" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BE0CF1.CC26D060 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable First things first Lavers are not available to me.. Second I cant mail order.... So now that thats done.. what shoes should I get? Any style/brand suggestions? thank you ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BE0CF1.CC26D060 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
First things first Lavers are not available to=20 me..
Second I cant mail order....
So now that thats done.. what shoes should I = get?
Any style/brand suggestions? thank=20 you
------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BE0CF1.CC26D060-- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 12 04:12:49 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA10089 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 04:12:49 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f121.hotmail.com [207.82.250.214]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA27064 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 1998 19:01:28 -0800 Received: (qmail 12440 invoked by uid 0); 12 Nov 1998 03:00:57 -0000 Message-ID: <19981112030057.12439.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 206.97.249.115 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 11 Nov 1998 19:00:57 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.97.249.115] From: "joey robichaux" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] blurry twirl MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 19:00:57 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org hey all, with all this talk on twirls and blistering whirls i was wondering what exactly are these. it would be a help if anyone could write these out in jobs notation for me. thanx. shred on ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 12 04:12:59 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA10098 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 04:12:59 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Calvin4hob@aol.com Received: from imo26.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA27271 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 1998 19:14:57 -0800 Received: from Calvin4hob@aol.com by imo26.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id ONWWa04822 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 1998 22:13:27 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: <911d3ac8.364a5257@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 22:13:27 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [freestyle] Freestyle shoes? What to get? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 224 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 11/11/98 12:00:20 AM Mountain Standard Time, Koonuy@softhome.net writes: > First things first Lavers are not available to me.. > Second I cant mail order.... > So now that thats done.. what shoes should I get? > Any style/brand suggestions? thank you You could try teva sport sandals. they have nice inside pockets. you can buy them anywhere. Hope that helps. Chase From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 12 05:00:00 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id FAA19698 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 05:00:00 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.11]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA28399 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 1998 20:35:18 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id WAA15745; Wed, 11 Nov 1998 22:35:01 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx8-06.ix.netcom.com(207.94.123.70) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma015717; Wed Nov 11 22:34:43 1998 Message-ID: <364A681F.67BB@utdallas.edu> Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 22:46:23 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: joey robichaux CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] blurry twirl References: <19981112030057.12439.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org joey robichaux wrote: > > with all this talk on twirls and blistering whirls i was wondering what > exactly are these. it would be a help if anyone could write these out in > jobs notation for me. thanx. > > shred on > Blistering whirl is a whirl on both sides - a whirling gyro whirl. It goes a little something like this: clip > op IN [dex] > back spin [bod] > op IN [dex] > op clip [del][xbdy] I'm not to hip on Job's notation when it comes to twirls, but I'll try. Blurry twirl is a hellish move: clip > op IN [dex] > same swirl (from front to back) [pdx][dex] > back spin [bod] > op clip [del][xbdy] Think of it like a big blurry set followed by a swirl with the same foot on the other side of your body. But, instead of catching it right after the swirl, you bail to opposite osis. Blistering whirl is a well deserving 5 add move, and blurry twirl earns each of those six adds. Hope this helps. I really would like to see a blurry twirl some time. As for the blistering whirl, I've seen Rippin and Kenny both hit it on tape. Later all. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 12 06:26:22 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA14396 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 06:26:22 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mail1.doit.wisc.edu (mail1.doit.wisc.edu [144.92.9.40]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA28908 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 1998 21:56:13 -0800 Received: from [144.92.211.57] by mail1.doit.wisc.edu id XAA36008 (8.8.6/50); Wed, 11 Nov 1998 23:56:11 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19981111235616.006b59f0@students.wisc.edu> X-Sender: mklewand@students.wisc.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 23:56:16 -0600 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Matthew Kain Lewandowski Subject: [freestyle] spinning paradox osis dyno swirl monkey flip thing Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I have a move that I am wondering what it might be. It has been done by my fearless swirling Midwest Master Swirlster - Matt Roman. Bear with me because this is a tuffy to explain. What he does is start with a right foot clipper he then spins into a right foot osis. Simple, eh? An osis right? However after he has done the osis spin, he does a front/back swirl dex. It is not a corkscrew, nor is it any type of a dyno set from the other leg. The main difference is that the osis is completed (the entire spin is done) and THEN the swirl dex is done. Is this just a swirling osis? Because it is set from the same clipper as the osis, it also looks extra cool. Lets see in jobs we would have: clip > spin (in) > (same) swirl (front/back) > (same) clip del Dope stuff. Anyone know what it is? Matthew Kain - Madison Foundation of Footbag Freestyle From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 12 08:59:48 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA25677 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 08:59:48 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA30653 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 00:36:06 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F2A00M01W0ETZ@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 01:38:39 -0700 (MST) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 01:38:38 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] dragon In-reply-to: To: Calvin4hob@aol.com Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, 9 Nov 1998 Calvin4hob@aol.com wrote: > try and bring it up my foot goes verticle. Can anybody help me out with While trying this I've found that the power for the set comes from the knee not necessarily the entire body. Try holding your foot without the bag in a dragon position and just practice seeing how it moves up and down without letting it go vertical. BRAD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 12 16:54:35 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id QAA31035 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 16:54:35 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.11]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA30822 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 01:08:06 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id DAA06413 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 03:08:05 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx8-06.ix.netcom.com(207.94.123.70) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma006411; Thu Nov 12 03:08:02 1998 Message-ID: <364AA832.4EB4@utdallas.edu> Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 03:19:46 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] consecutive records Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I know this came up a while back, but I don't remember hearing any real answers on the subject. What are the records for these moves? consecutive torques? (I've seen GF Smoothie do 12 on some tape) ripwalks? (surely it's over 20, right?) how about stepping butterflies? stepping osises? spinning butterflies? spinning osises? paradox whirls? Any other 4's that are easy to link? If you know any of these records, or think you know, post it to the list. I'm sure others are interrested in this too. Even if you don't know, put up your personal bests or whatever. Hope this gets something started.... -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 03:06:02 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA14733 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 03:06:02 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f82.hotmail.com [207.82.250.188]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA06585 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 13:53:21 -0800 Received: (qmail 3257 invoked by uid 0); 12 Nov 1998 21:52:49 -0000 Message-ID: <19981112215249.3256.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 206.28.246.79 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 13:52:48 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.28.246.79] From: "Evan Buhr" To: freestyle@footbag.org, scalf@utdallas.edu, freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] symathy to me MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 13:52:48 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I have just recently hooked up with this group and i love listening to you all talk about the killer moves you can hit. It is funny because you guys are like..wanna see my Blurry Whirl, Paradox, Rip Walk, Scorpion Tail combo... and at my school i say to my freinds...Heeyyy....wanna see my jester...pretty sorry huh? Anyways i have noticed that the basis for about all of these killer moves is the clipper stall...and that is my weakness...i couldn't hit one if i had a Freestyle Sand Hack...and tips on the clipper stall??? - Reflective Insanity ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 03:06:02 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA14734 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 03:06:02 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.11]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA07199 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 14:52:28 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id QAA01356; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 16:52:16 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx8-06.ix.netcom.com(207.94.123.70) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma001215; Thu Nov 12 16:51:32 1998 Message-ID: <364B6940.34BD@utdallas.edu> Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 17:03:28 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org, freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Clipper help (was: symathy to me) References: <19981112215249.3256.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Evan Buhr wrote: > at my school i say to my > freinds...Heeyyy....wanna see my jester...pretty sorry huh? Nope. Not at all. A 'flying clipper' (the real name for a Jester) was the first move I ever hit. It is a good place to start. > Anyways i have noticed that the basis for about all of these killer > moves is the clipper stall...and that is my weakness...i couldn't hit > one if i had a Freestyle Sand Hack...and tips on the clipper stall??? > Good clipper stalls on BOTH sides are key to most moves. I wrote a buttload of stuff on how to hit clippers a while back. Instead of writing it all out again, just go to the list archives that Steve maintains for us. You can go to list.footbag.org and search for clippers, or you can go straight to my old message at http://list.footbag.org/majordomo/letter/freestyle?id=%3C360E7F7C.5247%40utdallas.edu%3E also, try this one http://list.footbag.org/majordomo/letter/freestyle?id=%3C360E827C.10B3%40utdallas.edu%3E Get those clipper stalls down and you'll be hooked on the sport. Hope this helps. If not, let me know. -Derric Scalf Dallas Footbag Club From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 03:06:07 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA14742 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 03:06:07 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: HuioticOne@aol.com Received: from imo27.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.71]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA04054 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 10:24:31 -0800 Received: from HuioticOne@aol.com by imo27.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id ONDZa02243 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 13:23:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3cbbdc9a.364b279b@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 13:23:23 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Dragon? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 167 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was skimming through the Online List of Moves, and I came across a delay called a "dragon." My question is this: How exactly do you pull off and xbody outside delay? I've been involved in footbag four years, and I can't even imagine what that would look like. I know this is probably a simple question, but I'd appreciate anyone who could shed some light on this. Thanks and God bless. Love in Christ, Josh Kinney From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 03:06:35 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA14783 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 03:06:35 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: (qmail 3257 invoked by uid 0); 12 Nov 1998 21:52:49 -0000 Message-ID: <19981112215249.3256.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 206.28.246.79 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 13:52:48 PST X-Originating-IP: [206.28.246.79] From: "Evan Buhr" To: freestyle@footbag.org, scalf@utdallas.edu, freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] symathy to me MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 13:52:48 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I have just recently hooked up with this group and i love listening to you all talk about the killer moves you can hit. It is funny because you guys are like..wanna see my Blurry Whirl, Paradox, Rip Walk, Scorpion Tail combo... and at my school i say to my freinds...Heeyyy....wanna see my jester...pretty sorry huh? Anyways i have noticed that the basis for about all of these killer moves is the clipper stall...and that is my weakness...i couldn't hit one if i had a Freestyle Sand Hack...and tips on the clipper stall??? - Reflective Insanity ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 03:06:35 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA14784 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 03:06:35 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mcfs.whowhere.com (mcfs.whowhere.com [209.1.236.44]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA03428 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 09:37:50 -0800 Received: from Unknown/Local ([?.?.?.?]) by theglobe.com; Thu Nov 12 09:37:35 1998 To: freestyle@footbag.org Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 09:37:35 -0700 From: "Ian Dubman" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: off X-Expiredinmiddle: true X-Mailer: MailCity Service Subject: Re: [freestyle] consecutive records X-Sender-Ip: 128.206.120.81 Organization: E-Mail @ The Globe (http://www.globe-mail.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org --Paradox whirls=> 17 Hu-Mungis, I beleive. At least I have him hitting this on tape--whether or not it is still a record, who knows?? As for all the other 4 add linked, I have not a clue... Ian ------------------------------- On Thu, 12 Nov 1998 03:19:46 Derric Scalf wrote: > >What are the records for these moves? >paradox whirls? "Free web-based email available now at http://www.theglobe.com" From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 03:07:49 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA14806 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 03:07:49 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: SuperOwen@aol.com Received: from imo21.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.65]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA08651 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 16:41:56 -0800 Received: from SuperOwen@aol.com by imo21.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OMVBa23883 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 19:40:53 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: <195e2e4c.364b8015@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 19:40:53 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Butterfly Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 226 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I need some help on my butterfly. The way I'm doing it now is I'll set from a toe stall about waist high then just kinda jump over the bag. I can't seem to hit the clipper though. It always just hits my foot. Any advice? Owen "Total Package" Parrish From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 03:08:19 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA14823 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 03:08:19 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from smtp1.ihug.co.nz (root@tk1.ihug.co.nz [203.29.160.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA10575 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 18:38:27 -0800 Received: from omen (p154-tnt-ak-1.akl.ihug.co.nz [206.18.111.154]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA32483; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 15:38:10 +1300 Message-ID: <001301be0eae$f6be0820$07050505@omen> From: "omen" To: , Subject: Re: [freestyle] consecutive records Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 15:40:22 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >If you know any of these records, or think you know, post it to the >list. I'm sure others are interrested in this too. Even if you don't >know, put up your personal bests or whatever. Hope this gets something >started.... I hit 5 consecutive double switches :), ok they're only 3 adds but come on... http://www.footbag.org/gallery/showset/worlds97-vid4 take a look, Damian Coventry's omen' I think Steve Goldilox called it... __________________________________________________ Damian Coventry reply to dc504894@ait.ac.nz or lordomen@ihug.co.nz From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 06:56:55 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA09298 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 06:56:55 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from jrichter (dal-tsa6-32.cyberramp.net [207.158.82.224]) by mailhost.cyberramp.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1/ler-981006-1336) with SMTP id VAA21466; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 21:43:50 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <364BAB5E.202D@cyberramp.net> Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 21:45:34 -0600 From: Joe Richter Reply-To: jrichter@cyberramp.net Organization: Me X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: evanbuhr@hotmail.com CC: scalf@utdallas.edu, freestyle@footbag.org, freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Clipper help (was: symathy to me) References: <19981112215249.3256.qmail@hotmail.com> <364B6940.34BD@utdallas.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Derric Scalf replied to Evan Buhr: > > Evan Buhr wrote: >> at my school i say to my >> freinds...Heeyyy....wanna see my jester...pretty sorry huh? > Derric wrote: > Nope. Not at all. A 'flying clipper' (the real name for a Jester) was > the first move I ever hit. It is a good place to start. I (Joe Richter) say: Cool. As Derric can attest - I still can't do a Flying Clipper. Despite the examples of Derric and others - I'll just keep trying to do the best I can. "Do what you can, when you can..." Evan continued... >> Anyways i have noticed that the basis for about all of these killer >> moves is the clipper stall...and that is my weakness...i couldn't hit >> one if i had a Freestyle Sand Hack...and tips on the clipper stall??? >> ...and Derric replied: > Good clipper stalls on BOTH sides are key to most moves. I wrote a > buttload of stuff on how to hit clippers a while back... > > -Derric Scalf > Dallas Footbag Club ...and I (Joe Richter) finish: Go Evan! If you listen to the gentle advice of "D", you can't go wrong. Have fun learning new moves, and remember - You're not competing against the members of this newsgroup, you're competing against yourself and the enemy -> GRAVITY (that last one always beats up on me!). Have fun, Joe Richter From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 06:57:04 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA09304 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 06:57:04 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mailhost.cyberramp.net (root@mailhost.cyberramp.net [207.158.64.11]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA11834 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 19:56:34 -0800 Received: from jrichter (dal-tsa6-32.cyberramp.net [207.158.82.224]) by mailhost.cyberramp.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1/ler-981006-1336) with SMTP id VAA28981; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 21:56:31 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <364BAE58.11D2@cyberramp.net> Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 21:58:16 -0600 From: Joe Richter Reply-To: jrichter@cyberramp.net Organization: Me X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: SuperOwen@aol.com CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Butterfly References: <195e2e4c.364b8015@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Owen, Since this old dude already posted once tonight - Don't know your age, or body type, but my personal experience is that the key for hitting the clipper stall (or butterfly; same thing) is strong and flexible hamstrings. Of course, you are also going to have to work on the muscle-memory thing (dropping the foot is so un-natural). I'm working on it - I just have no consistancy. I'm doing inside-stalls (with 1lb ankle weights), then simple drops to clipper stall (still with the ankle weights) to work on the muscle-memory this winter. I'll probably still suck next Spring, but I'll keep trying. Maybe the rest of the gurus on the list will provide better tips - they have a differnt perspective (been there, done that - versus still trying). If you don't want to set off the toe, that's simple - Inside kick sets until you're sick of them (and they're so consistent you never think twice about it). Have fun bagging, Joe "The already pissed off at mild Texas winters" Richter SuperOwen@aol.com wrote: > > I need some help on my butterfly. The way I'm doing it now is I'll > set from a toe stall about waist high then just kinda jump over the bag. > I can't seem to hit the clipper though. It always just hits my foot. > Any advice? > > Owen "Total Package" Parrish From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 17:30:47 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA24571 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 17:30:47 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA13677 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 23:48:20 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F2C00901OGV11@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 00:50:56 -0700 (MST) Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 00:50:55 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] Freestyle shoes? What to get? In-reply-to: <911d3ac8.364a5257@aol.com> To: Calvin4hob@aol.com Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > > First things first Lavers are not available to me.. > > Second I cant mail order.... > > So now that thats done.. what shoes should I get? > > Any style/brand suggestions? thank you > > You could try teva sport sandals. they have nice inside pockets. you can buy > them anywhere. Hope that helps. There are also some styles of Nike and Vans that others have modified and come to like. BRAD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 17:31:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA24597 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 17:31:37 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA13739 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 00:00:38 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F2C00201P1E63@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 01:03:14 -0700 (MST) Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 01:03:14 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] Butterfly In-reply-to: <195e2e4c.364b8015@aol.com> To: SuperOwen@aol.com Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > I need some help on my butterfly. The way I'm doing it now is I'll set from a > toe stall about waist high then just kinda jump over the bag. I can't seem to > hit the clipper though. It always just hits my foot. Any advice? I'm not sure how you hit your regular clippers, but they should involve catching the bag with a downward motion of your foot, just as most any stall should. It's the same with butterflies. If the bag is hitting your foot then bouncing off that means it's not getting the cushion it needs to stay there. Remember to bring your catch foot down and up again to set the next trick. Also make sure your foot is angled properly to make a flat enough surface to land on. Good luck! BRAD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 17:31:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA24612 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 17:31:50 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.11]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA18409 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 08:34:53 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id KAA03736; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 10:34:02 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx8-06.ix.netcom.com(207.94.123.70) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma003708; Fri Nov 13 10:33:36 1998 Message-ID: <364C6239.3DE1@utdallas.edu> Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 10:45:45 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: SuperOwen@aol.com CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Butterfly References: <195e2e4c.364b8015@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org SuperOwen@aol.com wrote: > > I need some help on my butterfly. The way I'm doing it now is I'll set from a > toe stall about waist high then just kinda jump over the bag. I can't seem to > hit the clipper though. It always just hits my foot. Any advice? > Joe gave the best advice for a butterfly. Think only about the clipper. The dex on a butterfly is really small. You don't even circle the bag. It is a half of a dex at best. So, to do a butterfly, set right in front of you about waist high. Jump over the bag and catch on a clipper delay. If you can do clippers, you can do butterflies. If you are having trouble catching the bag, go back to practicing clippers. You know the routine... curl your toes, bend the knee of your support leg, practice, practice, practice. If you think of a butterfly as nothing more than a clipper, you will hit it. No problem. Hope this helps. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 17:32:08 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA24637 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 17:32:08 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f129.hotmail.com [207.82.251.8]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id EAA15827 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 04:36:46 -0800 Received: (qmail 21335 invoked by uid 0); 13 Nov 1998 12:36:15 -0000 Message-ID: <19981113123615.21334.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 141.84.137.142 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 04:36:14 PST X-Originating-IP: [141.84.137.142] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Butterfly MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 04:36:14 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Owen "Total Package" Parrish wrote: >I need some help on my butterfly. The way I'm doing it now is I'll >set from a toe stall about waist high then just kinda jump over the >bag. I can't seem to hit the clipper though. It always just hits my >foot. Any advice? I don¥t know how much I can add to Derric¥s previous and well writen advice, but this was a move that drove me nuts so here goes. I¥ll use toe set as an example. Set about waist high, or a little under, plant the seting leg and wait until the bag has peeked out to begin the dex. When you beginn the dex just raise the dex leg up to the level of the bag, as soon as your knee is about level with the bag hop up and off your plant leg, rotating the dex leg over the top of the bag and simultaniously bringing the catching foot into cliper position. To get into cliper position, just after hoping off of the plant leg atomatically turn your ancle in and if you keep it in the same place your dex leg should rotate over it, puting you in cliper position. Remember both motions are done at the same time, and for a while both legs are off the ground. You should now be in position to catch the bag as you come back down. To help timeing when first lirning butterfly, it helps to rotate your body towards the bag, making it feel kind of like you¥re falling into the move. For the catch its self try to time the jump so that you come down with the bag, and don¥t have to cusion the bag with your cliper leg, which is good advice for clipper stals as well. If you have trouble just getting your clipper foot into cliper position, when I was starting, to teach my leg how to do clippers I would put my foot in crosbody position, and then rotate my ancle until I could pull it up level. Doing that you can really feel the muscles being used, and visually spot what the position looks like. Then try jumping into butterfly or cliper with out the bag and pause in the clipper position to make sure your leg is in position. While doing the moves visualize the motions. Good luck. -Andrew ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 17:32:19 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA24651 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 17:32:19 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (hejira.hunter.cuny.edu [146.95.128.97]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA18594 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 08:44:15 -0800 Received: (from jpenney@localhost) by hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id LAA13652; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 11:51:13 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 11:51:13 -0500 (EST) From: Deliciously Saucy Josh Penney To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Butterfly In-Reply-To: <364BAE58.11D2@cyberramp.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org on clippers- On Thu, 12 Nov 1998, Joe Richter wrote: > muscle-memory thing (dropping the foot is so un-natural). I'm working on > it - I just have no consistancy. I think it's more of a combination of facing the clipper- having your shoulders open to the bag holding the delay foot relatively still and doing most of the work with the supporting leg- you really have to hop onto it to get the timing, and a feel for how far you should sink into it. on butterfly- remember, if you're setting with the intended delay foot, you should plant it *immediately* after the set to regain your balance. also, try to set a little lower- I don't think it needs to be higher than your knee. > Joe "The already pissed off at mild Texas winters" Richter ... JP ICNYFD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 17:32:35 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA24665 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 17:32:35 GMT Resent-From: owner-freestyle X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from homer.tomahawktech.com (cpu1550.adsl.bellglobal.com [206.47.27.31]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA17958 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 08:08:40 -0800 Received: from pc0966.software.mitel.com (Administrators@localhost) by homer.tomahawktech.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA00286 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 11:10:14 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 11:10:10 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199811131610.LAA00286@homer.tomahawktech.com> From: "Dave Reid" To: Subject: RE: [freestyle] consecutive records Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 11:09:17 -0500 Message-ID: <000101be0f1f$f725b940$c136c786@pc0966.software.mitel.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > -----Original Message----- > On Thu, 12 Nov 1998 03:19:46 Derric Scalf wrote: > >What are the records for these moves? I remember the discussion from earlier this year fondly. These are the results that were posted at that time. I think Scott D. was mentioning hitting 5 Blurry Whirls a couple of months back though. Barflies: 9 (Hu-mungis) Paradox Drifters: ? (It's in the 5-10 region by Hu-mungis) Ripwalks: 23 (Genzu) Blenders: 7 (Rippin) Blurry Whirls: 3 (Torch) (5 by Scott D. ?) Paradox Whirls: 17 (Hu-mungis) Drifters: 34 (Hu-mungis) Whirls: 39 (Regulator) Paradox Symposium Whirls: 3 (Rippin) Paradox Blenders: 3 (Hu-mungis) Osis: 186 (Kosmo) Double ATW: 18 (Rippin) Double Switchovers: 5 (Damian!) Dave PS. I came *this close* (finger and thumb held up) to hitting a double legover last night! Peter Irish, lookout! :) From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 18:44:59 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA17759 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 18:44:59 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send105.yahoomail.com (send105.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.128]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA20684 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 10:19:23 -0800 Message-ID: <19981113182141.4867.rocketmail@send105.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.191.61] by send105.yahoomail.com; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 10:21:41 PST Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 10:21:41 -0800 (PST) From: EZ Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] Butterfly/clipper advice To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org about clippers: > Maybe the rest of the gurus on the list will provide > better tips - they have a differnt perspective (been there, done that I'm not sure if the masterful Derric includes this advice in his "How to Hit a Clipper- Vol.1", but here it goes: Place the bag, or something similar in shape and size but heavier, on your foot, and just work the *motion* of a clipper catch and set. Just focus on maintaining your balance, and pay attention to how your whole body moves: your support leg does just as much work as your catch foot. I advise to stay away from the ankle weights until you own the clipper. Right now you should be concerned with the motion, not the muscle-memory; both will come with practice. Oh, and practice BOTH SIDES! THink about getting 'Tricks of the Trade'. -Eli Zohar _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 18:50:35 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA17812 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 18:50:35 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.11]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA20833 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 10:26:09 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id MAA18527; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 12:25:22 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx8-55.ix.netcom.com(207.94.123.119) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma018498; Fri Nov 13 12:24:51 1998 Message-ID: <364C7C4D.7244@utdallas.edu> Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 12:37:01 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dave Reid CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] consecutive records References: <000101be0f1f$f725b940$c136c786@pc0966.software.mitel.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Dave Reid wrote: > Paradox Drifters: ? (It's in the 5-10 region by Hu-mungis) I have seen Eli hit 7 or 8 on Rye Shred. That might not be the record, but it is worth mentioning... He also links 2 atom smashers. I haven't seen many people do that before. Has anyone linked 3? While we are on the subject of atom smasher, help me! I can't seem to hit this move. I try to do it by setting the same way I would for a legbeater. The set is there, but that second mirage seems to be where I lose it. If it ever hits my foot, I seem to be leaning back and scooping the bag. I've slow-mo'ed Sean, Eli, Tuan, Ahren, Sunil, and Noah to no avail. I can't seem to see what I'm doing wrong. Any tips would be appreciated. Later. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 19:14:59 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id TAA26361 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 19:14:59 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mail-oak-3.pilot.net (mail-oak-3.pilot.net [198.232.147.18]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA21564 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 10:43:43 -0800 Received: from sparky.fibre.com (sparky.fibre.com [206.189.10.11]) by mail-oak-3.pilot.net with ESMTP id KAA21987 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 10:38:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from zzz1wbmail1.fibre.com (zzz1wbmail1.fibre.com [10.1.4.31]) by sparky.fibre.com with ESMTP id KAA02287 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 10:56:46 -0800 (PST) Received: by zzz1wbmail1.fibre.com with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 10:45:04 -0800 Message-ID: <5FCA68163A73D1119D3600A0C98D7DE301A0414C@zzz1wbmail1.fibre.com> From: Noah Shipley To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: RE: [freestyle] consecutive records Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 10:45:03 -0800 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org 5 Double-Switchovers is it? Geez...they're not real tough -----Original Message----- From: Dave Reid [mailto:reiddm@magma.ca] Sent: Friday, November 13, 1998 8:09 AM To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: RE: [freestyle] consecutive records > -----Original Message----- > On Thu, 12 Nov 1998 03:19:46 Derric Scalf wrote: > >What are the records for these moves? I remember the discussion from earlier this year fondly. These are the results that were posted at that time. I think Scott D. was mentioning hitting 5 Blurry Whirls a couple of months back though. Barflies: 9 (Hu-mungis) Paradox Drifters: ? (It's in the 5-10 region by Hu-mungis) Ripwalks: 23 (Genzu) Blenders: 7 (Rippin) Blurry Whirls: 3 (Torch) (5 by Scott D. ?) Paradox Whirls: 17 (Hu-mungis) Drifters: 34 (Hu-mungis) Whirls: 39 (Regulator) Paradox Symposium Whirls: 3 (Rippin) Paradox Blenders: 3 (Hu-mungis) Osis: 186 (Kosmo) Double ATW: 18 (Rippin) Double Switchovers: 5 (Damian!) Dave PS. I came *this close* (finger and thumb held up) to hitting a double legover last night! Peter Irish, lookout! :) From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 21:15:16 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id VAA27994 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 21:15:16 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.11]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA25797 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 12:51:41 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id OAA06963 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 14:51:01 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx8-55.ix.netcom.com(207.94.123.119) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma006909; Fri Nov 13 14:50:24 1998 Message-ID: <364C9E63.6407@utdallas.edu> Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 15:02:36 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] consecutive records References: <5FCA68163A73D1119D3600A0C98D7DE301A0414C@zzz1wbmail1.fibre.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Noah Shipley wrote: > > 5 Double-Switchovers is it? Geez...they're not real tough What everyone is talking about is the toe > op out > same out > same toe, right? I've never hit this move. I think that if I could hit this, I could start hitting paradons - maybe even barflies. So, if they aren't that hard, how should I do them? Thanks in advance for the advice. -Derric DFC From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 13 21:45:28 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id VAA03808 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 21:45:28 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mail-oak-3.pilot.net (mail-oak-3.pilot.net [198.232.147.18]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA26186 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 13:13:23 -0800 Received: from sparky.fibre.com (sparky.fibre.com [206.189.10.11]) by mail-oak-3.pilot.net with ESMTP id NAA22019 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 13:07:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from zzz1wbmail1.fibre.com (zzz1wbmail1.fibre.com [10.1.4.31]) by sparky.fibre.com with ESMTP id NAA04500 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 13:28:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by zzz1wbmail1.fibre.com with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 13:16:18 -0800 Message-ID: <5FCA68163A73D1119D3600A0C98D7DE301A0414F@zzz1wbmail1.fibre.com> From: Noah Shipley To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: RE: [freestyle] consecutive records Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 13:16:17 -0800 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Start from a toe set. For this example, a right toe stall. Jump off the left foot without letting go with the right toe. Immediately set with your right toe and land your right foot for support while beggining a dex with the left leg. Try to set the stall close to your left side. The dexs really are not very fast, just tight. This happens to be my favorite move... -----Original Message----- From: Derric Scalf [mailto:scalf@utdallas.edu] Sent: Friday, November 13, 1998 1:03 PM To: 'freestyle@footbag.org' Subject: Re: [freestyle] consecutive records Noah Shipley wrote: > > 5 Double-Switchovers is it? Geez...they're not real tough What everyone is talking about is the toe > op out > same out > same toe, right? I've never hit this move. I think that if I could hit this, I could start hitting paradons - maybe even barflies. So, if they aren't that hard, how should I do them? Thanks in advance for the advice. -Derric DFC From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 03:50:39 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA08482 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:50:39 GMT Resent-From: owner-freestyle X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from homer.tomahawktech.com (cpu1550.adsl.bellglobal.com [206.47.27.31]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA26962 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 14:02:05 -0800 Received: from pc0966.software.mitel.com (Administrators@localhost) by homer.tomahawktech.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA00159 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 17:03:56 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 17:03:55 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199811132203.RAA00159@homer.tomahawktech.com> From: "Dave Reid" To: Subject: RE: [freestyle] consecutive records Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 17:03:03 -0500 Message-ID: <000b01be0f51$63082b80$c136c786@pc0966.software.mitel.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 In-Reply-To: <5FCA68163A73D1119D3600A0C98D7DE301A0414C@zzz1wbmail1.fibre.com> Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > -----Original Message----- > 5 Double-Switchovers is it? Geez...they're not real tough I just thought Damian deserved credit, since nobody else claimed to have done more. He is on video, after all, and it looks cool. :) Dave PS. Who holds the record for most consecutive drops? From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 03:51:05 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA08495 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:51:05 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: NikeekiN@aol.com Received: from imo29.mx.aol.com (imo29.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.73]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA28055 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 15:02:16 -0800 Received: from NikeekiN@aol.com by imo29.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.1) id OXDRa09167 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 18:01:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 18:01:02 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Juice and Facile Juice Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Casablanca - Windows sub 214 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey, I was wondering if there is really a big diffference between these two. I am going to buy or the other really soon. Which one will last me longer. Is the facile one worth the extra 10 bucks. Thanks a lot Oh yeah, what music do you all like to listen to while kickin'. I like to listen to the beastie boys and limp bizkit. later nick A. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 03:51:08 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA08508 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:51:08 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send102.yahoomail.com (send102.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.90]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA27505 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 14:30:32 -0800 Message-ID: <19981113223250.9304.rocketmail@send102.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.186.222] by send102.yahoomail.com; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 14:32:50 PST Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 14:32:50 -0800 (PST) From: EZ Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] drifters/ atomsmasher help To: scalf@utdallas.edu, freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > > Paradox Drifters: ? (It's in the 5-10 region by Hu-mungis) > I have seen Eli hit 7 or 8 on Rye Shred. That might not be the record, but it is worth mentioning. Rumor has it at 9 by Munger. My best is 8. Funny story about that day. I was in the zone and went for my personal pdox drifter record. At about 6 or 7, someone, who will go unnamed for his own protection, started screaming right in my ear, "OH MY GOD, YEAH, OH MY GOD, YOU'RE GOING TO BREAK THE RECORD!!!" So naturally my concentration snapped, and in turn, my temper. Whew, glad to get that off my chest. Maybe I can forgive you now, Jonathan Schneider... oooh, I mean "unnamed person". :) > While we are on the subject of atom smasher, help me! Ok, quickness is the key. When you do the first dex your hips go one way, then suddenly you must (wait this can't be right) swivel the other way and do a mirage with the other leg?!! The motion of your hips and legs should be continuous, not "one direction at a time" style. Also, pay attention to where your first dex leg and foot goes after the 1st dex. From this point forward, when I say "foot" I am referring to the 1st dex leg foot. Youre foot shouldn't plant until your hip motion has already started going back the other way. This will put your foot approximately where it started on the ground. If you are doing it like legbeater, then youre foot lands too close to the opposite leg, not leaving enough room to crank the other way. Do you get me, D? Hope it helps. Eli Zohar on local news: "Special Olympics t-ball stand pitches perfect game" _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 03:51:29 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA08521 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:51:29 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hil-102-160 (hil-102-160.Reshall.Berkeley.EDU [169.229.102.160]) by uclink4.berkeley.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA23577 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 16:53:55 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <001601be0f69$0bda6f40$a066e5a9@hil-102-160.reshall.berkeley.edu> Reply-To: "Regulator" From: "Ryan Mulroney" To: Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #515 Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 16:52:25 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org For the record I have hit 4 paradox symposium whirls, 7 symposium whirls and 5 blurry whirls. I've got some other lame records like symp mirage (17) and smear (26) but no more fours or fives. Adios, regulator From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 03:51:48 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA08534 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:51:48 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f237.hotmail.com [207.82.251.128]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA31022 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 19:05:05 -0800 Received: (qmail 27147 invoked by uid 0); 14 Nov 1998 03:04:34 -0000 Message-ID: <19981114030434.27146.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 19:04:34 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: freestyle@footbag.org, scalf@utdallas.edu Subject: Re: [freestyle] consecutive records MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 19:04:34 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey everybody! Derric wrote: >What everyone is talking about is the toe > op out > same out > same >toe, right? > >I've never hit this move. I think that if I could hit this, I could >start hitting paradons - maybe even barflies. So, if they aren't that >hard, how should I do them? Can you double around the world? The way i started hitting double out to in dexes with the same leg was by doing the motion without the bag wherever i was. Waiting in line, at a bus stop, while talking to people, etc until my leg became really familiar with the motion. I think of double switch over and paradon the way i think of a switch over. Have the bag on your left toe, and then jump off your right leg. The momentum gained from your jump will be imparted to your left foot, and the bag will pop up off your left foot, as your right foot is already going over it. From ther, just drop your right foot for a switch over, do an around the world for the double switch over, or just a butterfly for the paradon. Experiment with all the double dex variants, if you get one down, it'll prolly help you with the others. I learned to paradon first, then double over down, then double atw, then double switch over. Still working on the other ones, but the point is, toy around with all of them til you find one that you find easiest, then branch out from there. Hope this helped. Ken "ceiling fan" somolinos nyfd "There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want." -Calvin and Hobbes ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 03:51:57 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA08547 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:51:57 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Pro2222@aol.com Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com (imo11.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA30580 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 18:32:43 -0800 Received: from Pro2222@aol.com by imo11.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OLYFa10441 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 21:31:30 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 21:31:30 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [freestyle] Freestyle shoes? What to get? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 226 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org my friend and i tried out something like that w/ a pair of old skate shoes. they were NSS's, w/ a piece of leather that goes in the middle of the toe but have mesh underneath. we hacked until you can only see mesh up to the middle of your foot. cut the laces back like lavers, cut more suede stuff, about 4 inches of padding, cut off half the insole, toes need to go, now he has ultra soft toed shoes w/ mesh only on the toe and a real bucket. almost good. there a lot of good es's that have mesh. hack them till they're lite. also, question, the inside of my lavres are round bastards, can't do inside stalls let alone clips. tips???? tried stretching ankles.......... also, the sand is rapidly coming through the suede on my dirtbag...... thinking about just stretching a seem and putting more in, but then it would come out easier....... help.................. -colin From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 03:53:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA08570 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:53:41 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Matt Cross Received: from imo19.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.9]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA10284 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 18:18:14 -0800 Received: from Problems1@aol.com by imo19.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OSFa004682 for ; Thu, 12 Nov 1998 21:17:11 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: <195f2b09.364b96a7@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 21:17:11 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] ISO other kickers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 79 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I'm a teenager living in the central NY area looking for other people to toss up the old hack with. I'm pretty good for my age, my best runs consist of a chain of... (excuse terminology) an inside stall to a legover clipper stall, legover to an inside stall to pendulum to a cross body inside stall thrown up into a flying clipper. anyways, if you live in the central NY area, and you're into some good freestyle hack, write back. Matt "Dirty Lavers" Cross From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 09:28:09 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA04005 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 09:28:09 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (hejira.hunter.cuny.edu [146.95.128.97]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA32133 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 20:43:39 -0800 Received: (from jpenney@localhost) by hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id XAA10016; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 23:50:47 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 23:50:46 -0500 (EST) From: Deliciously Saucy Josh Penney To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Juice and Facile Juice In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Fri, 13 Nov 1998 NikeekiN@aol.com wrote: > Hey, > > I was wondering if there is really a big diffference between these two. I am > going to buy or the other really soon. Which one will last me longer. Is the > facile one worth the extra 10 bucks. Yes there is. the cheap one will last much longer, but it is not as good. It is defffinitely worth it. > Oh yeah, what music do you all like to listen to while kickin'. I have several hours of crickets mating on tape, mixed in with the screams of human agony as young interns are forced to perform experiments on animals, while students recieve their final grades, and Pat Sajak singing the theme song to 'MASH' with Alex Trebeck, played backwards. Usually does the job. Otherwise it's the new Willie Nelson and Obituary compilation album for me. JP From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 09:28:10 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA04011 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 09:28:10 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (hejira.hunter.cuny.edu [146.95.128.97]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA31993 for ; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 20:25:03 -0800 Received: (from jpenney@localhost) by hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id XAA09764; Fri, 13 Nov 1998 23:32:10 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 23:32:09 -0500 (EST) From: Deliciously Saucy Josh Penney To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: RE: [freestyle] consecutive records In-Reply-To: <000b01be0f51$63082b80$c136c786@pc0966.software.mitel.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > PS. Who holds the record for most consecutive drops? That would be me. Let's go to the video tape. JP ps- my consec record on symposium reverse mirages is 6, but I'll push it tomorrow. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 19:24:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id TAA10296 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 19:24:37 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA01925 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 01:37:51 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id DAA17120 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:37:50 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx6-31.ix.netcom.com(207.94.122.95) by dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma017112; Sat Nov 14 03:37:45 1998 Message-ID: <00a001be0fb1$339b5b00$5f7a5ecf@matt> From: "Matt Strong" To: Subject: [freestyle] X-Mas Jam Date: Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:28:54 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_009D_01BE0F7E.E7FD84C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_009D_01BE0F7E.E7FD84C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I know this has been asked before, but where will the x-mas jam be this = year? I've got some vacation time, and I would love to go kick = somewhere. -Matt Dallas Footbag Club ------=_NextPart_000_009D_01BE0F7E.E7FD84C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I know this has been asked before, = but where=20 will the x-mas jam be this year?  I've got some vacation time, and = I would=20 love to go kick somewhere.
 
-Matt
Dallas Footbag = Club
------=_NextPart_000_009D_01BE0F7E.E7FD84C0-- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 19:24:34 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id TAA10290 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 19:24:34 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from postoffice2.direcpc.com (mail.direcpc.com [198.77.116.30]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA05476 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 11:00:00 -0800 Received: from direcpc.com ([206.71.114.112]) by postoffice2.direcpc.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-45425U50000L50000S0) with ESMTP id AAA11746 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 14:00:22 -0500 Message-ID: <35ADA48C.FDD5F034@direcpc.com> Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 01:58:20 -0500 From: Matt Avery Organization: 4th Dimension Interactive X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] despirate for shoes Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey guys, My cousin is 11, and started hitting mirages and around the worlds on both sides within a couple weeks. I saw the potential, so I decided to feed the fire. The crazy thing is that he's been doing it with tennis shoes that almost make stalling impostible. I wasnted to buy him some lavers today, but just found out he's got size 4 shoes! Lavers dont come in less then 7, so Im looking for the next best shoe besides tevas. Anyone got a suggestion? Thanks Mystik Matt From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 19:24:29 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id TAA10284 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 19:24:29 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA01895 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 01:32:55 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id DAA08912; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:32:48 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx5-56.ix.netcom.com(207.94.121.184) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma008735; Sat Nov 14 03:31:34 1998 Message-ID: <364D50DA.5B12@utdallas.edu> Date: Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:43:54 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: NikeekiN@aol.com CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Juice and Facile Juice References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org NikeekiN@aol.com wrote: > > Hey, > > I was wondering if there is really a big diffference between these two. I am > going to buy or the other really soon. Which one will last me longer. Is the > facile one worth the extra 10 bucks. > > Big difference. If you are looking for something that will last a long time, grab a rock out of your backyard. Long lasting bags are FAR from the best. A good facile bag will last you about a year. A bad facile bag will last you about a month. Either way, you will be able to hit moves with a facile bag. A non facile bag will last for about 5 - 10 years. And it will suck for each of those long years. Without having a good bag, you will get frustrated because moves seem harder than they are. Get a good bag and watch your game improve. -Derric From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 19:24:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id TAA10323 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 19:24:50 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA01878 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 01:27:58 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id DAA08251; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:27:52 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx5-56.ix.netcom.com(207.94.121.184) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma008079; Sat Nov 14 03:26:58 1998 Message-ID: <364D4FC5.4DAE@utdallas.edu> Date: Sat, 14 Nov 1998 03:39:17 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Pro2222@aol.com CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Freestyle shoes? What to get? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Pro2222@aol.com wrote: > > also, question, the inside of my lavres are round bastards, can't do inside > stalls let alone clips. tips???? tried stretching ankles.......... > Try stretching more. Lavers are about as flat as they come. Try to catch the bag a bit toward the front of your shoe - kind of on the side of the ball of your foot. That surface gets flat even if the rest of your foot isn't. Ideally, you want clippers like Brian Kamakenzie - flatter than humanly possible. Until you get there by stretching, try stalling just a TINY bit more to the front of the shoe. > also, the sand is rapidly coming through the suede on my dirtbag...... > thinking about just stretching a seem and putting more in, but then it would > come out easier....... help.................. > Sorry. No help for the dirtbag. I went through my dirt filled Juice days. They are grat bags once they get broken in a little. Once they break in too much though, you are screwed. I was to the point where I had to fill my bag after each day of kicking. I have a lot more stuff to practice in this sport than filling a bag. My advice is to get a good facile bag - Juice, Carol, whateevr. Break it in and love it. I'll never leave beads again. -Derric From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sat Nov 14 19:25:04 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id TAA10338 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 19:25:04 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f294.hotmail.com [207.82.251.185]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA02011 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 02:06:41 -0800 Received: (qmail 7043 invoked by uid 0); 14 Nov 1998 10:05:50 -0000 Message-ID: <19981114100550.7042.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 141.84.137.142 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 02:05:50 PST X-Originating-IP: [141.84.137.142] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: RE: [freestyle] consecutive records MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sat, 14 Nov 1998 02:05:50 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >PS. Who holds the record for most consecutive drops? I think I got that record at Worlds 97¥. -Andrew P.S. for the record I¥ve managed to string over 20 blurry whirls together a few times, unfortunatly no one ever seems to be there to see it. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 15 09:48:40 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA28223 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 09:48:40 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f242.hotmail.com [207.82.251.133]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA10422 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 15:04:15 -0800 Received: (qmail 11345 invoked by uid 0); 14 Nov 1998 23:03:44 -0000 Message-ID: <19981114230344.11344.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 15:03:44 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: Pro2222@aol.com, scalf@utdallas.edu Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Freestyle shoes? What to get? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sat, 14 Nov 1998 15:03:44 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all. Ideally, you want clippers like Brian Kamakenzie - >flatter than humanly possible. Until you get there by stretching, Yeah, what the hell is wrong with that boy's ankles? Can you really get to that point through stretching? It isn't genetic or something, or did he get some kind of operation? ceiling fan nyfd ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 15 09:48:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA28217 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 09:48:37 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from smtp0.atl.mindspring.net (smtp0.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.128.40]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA10087 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 14:44:29 -0800 Received: from smegma (user-38ld8bm.dialup.mindspring.com [209.86.161.118]) by smtp0.atl.mindspring.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA27320 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 17:44:26 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19981114174233.007cd3e0@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: ecrvich@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sat, 14 Nov 1998 17:42:33 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] Freestyle shoes? What to get? In-Reply-To: <364D4FC5.4DAE@utdallas.edu> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >> also, question, the inside of my lavres are round bastards, can't do inside > >Try stretching more. Lavers are about as flat as they come. Try to Depends on your foot. Those of us with wide feet have to deal with the "round bastards" mentioned above. Quite the opposite of flat. There is only a very small sweet spot for clipper stalls for us, and it takes a long and frustrating time to master that spot (after 3 years, I don't think about it much anymore, but those first 6 months were quite annoying). If they were available in wide sizes, Lavers might be the ideal freestyle shoe. I can't offer alternatives, as I've never even tried anything else (all other aspects of the shoe are great). Maybe I'll finally get off my lazy bum and find something better when my current pair bite the big one. Grumble, EMC -- Ernest "Scratch" Crvich Durham, NC, USA http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Have footbag, will shred From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 15 09:48:46 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA28229 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 09:48:46 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Allman144@aol.com Received: from Allman144@aol.com by imo18.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id IQHMa29185 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 19:56:11 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 14 Nov 1998 19:56:11 EST To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Juice and Facile Juice Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 190 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ah, as for music goes....Allman Brothers, Joe Satriani, Allman Brothers, and Joe Satriani. I really like kicking to the music on Raw Shred....not. Also, go for the facile!!! I always get them as Christmas presents! Just hit mom or dad up for one! Anthony Glick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 15 09:49:08 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA28247 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 09:49:08 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from iuakk.fi (qmailr@lux2.iuakk.fi [194.89.13.6]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA11038 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 15:30:01 -0800 Received: (qmail 5252 invoked from network); 14 Nov 1998 23:29:51 -0000 Received: from x2-56k.ppp.27.iuakk.fi (HELO kone1) (194.89.12.93) by lux2.iuakk.fi with SMTP; 14 Nov 1998 23:29:51 -0000 Message-ID: <001e01bd672b$b021c620$010000c4@kone1> From: "Juha Linnanen" To: "Freestyle" Subject: Re: [freestyle] despirate for shoes Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 01:29:55 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >I wasnted to buy him some lavers today, but just found out he's got >size 4 shoes! Lavers dont come in less then 7, so Im looking for the >next best shoe besides tevas. Actually, my little brother's (12 year old) foot is size 5 and he have also Rod Lavers size 5. But I think that is smallest size what they produce, so it doesn't help your friend (not yet atleast) :) - Juha Linnanen From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 15 09:49:11 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA28269 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 09:49:11 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA17507 for ; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 01:21:16 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F2G00801I3S0D@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 02:23:53 -0700 (MST) Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1998 02:23:52 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: RE: [freestyle] consecutive records In-reply-to: <19981114100550.7042.qmail@hotmail.com> To: Andrew McCargar Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by eniac.yak.net id JAA28180 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Sat, 14 Nov 1998, Andrew McCargar wrote: > > P.S. for the record I*ve managed to string over 20 blurry whirls > together a few times, unfortunatly no one ever seems to be there to see > it. Yeah, well yesterday I hit 4 Nemesis' in a row and my dogs saw it all. Congratulations to us, BRAD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 15 09:49:17 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA28282 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 09:49:17 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from inetsrv.callplus.co.nz (mail.callplus.co.nz [202.27.103.146]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA12696 for ; Sat, 14 Nov 1998 17:59:41 -0800 Received: by mail.callplus.co.nz with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 14:57:51 +1300 Message-ID: <11FA7FAAAED1D01194C700203573F13C228A2D@mail.callplus.co.nz> From: Adrian Dick To: scalf@utdallas.edu, Dave Reid Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: RE: [freestyle] consecutive records Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1998 14:57:50 +1300 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all, I have linked 6 Atom Smashers... Tips? uhh.. do the first dex as quick and high as you can (lift your knee quite high), then its just a simple mirage at the end. > -----Original Message----- > From: Derric Scalf [SMTP:scalf@utdallas.edu] > Sent: Saturday, November 14, 1998 7:37 AM > To: Dave Reid > Cc: freestyle@footbag.org > Subject: Re: [freestyle] consecutive records > > Dave Reid wrote: > > > Paradox Drifters: ? (It's in the 5-10 region by Hu-mungis) > > > I have seen Eli hit 7 or 8 on Rye Shred. That might not be the > record, > but it is worth mentioning... He also links 2 atom smashers. I > haven't > seen many people do that before. Has anyone linked 3? > > While we are on the subject of atom smasher, help me! I can't seem to > hit this move. I try to do it by setting the same way I would for a > legbeater. The set is there, but that second mirage seems to be where > I > lose it. If it ever hits my foot, I seem to be leaning back and > scooping the bag. I've slow-mo'ed Sean, Eli, Tuan, Ahren, Sunil, and > Noah to no avail. I can't seem to see what I'm doing wrong. Any tips > would be appreciated. Later. > > -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 15 19:05:34 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id TAA26032 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 19:05:34 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA17740 for ; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 01:58:46 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F2G00701HO8XX@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 02:14:33 -0700 (MST) Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1998 02:14:32 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] Juice and Facile Juice In-reply-to: <364D50DA.5B12@utdallas.edu> To: Derric Scalf Cc: NikeekiN@aol.com, freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Sat, 14 Nov 1998, Derric Scalf wrote: > A good facile bag will last you about a year. A bad facile > bag will last you about a month. Either way, you will be able to hit > moves with a facile bag. A non facile bag will last for about 5 - 10 > years. And it will suck for each of those long years. Without having a > good bag, you will get frustrated because moves seem harder than they > are. Get a good bag and watch your game improve. You know, I think you should get paid to say stuff like this. It's bold, it's thoughtful, provocative, AND true. Advertisings in your blood boy!!! BRAD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 15 19:05:29 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id TAA26026 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 19:05:29 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: ShReDStEiN@aol.com Received: from imo15.mx.aol.com (imo15.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.5]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA20024; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 08:16:59 -0800 Received: from ShReDStEiN@aol.com by imo15.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id GYMHa02539; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 11:15:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <112baed5.364efe2a@aol.com> Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1998 11:15:38 EST To: jpenney@hejira.hunter.cuny.edu, freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: [freestyle] Juice and Facile Juice Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 11/14/98 1:08:53 AM, jpenney@hejira.hunter.cuny.edu wrote: <> Hahaheheheh LOL!! Thats some good stuff... ~Bryan From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 16 07:59:12 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id HAA09709 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 07:59:12 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from ultra.multiweb.net (ultra.multiweb.net [193.172.8.20]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA24359 for ; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 12:24:30 -0800 Received: from pentium-ii (loce-multiweb0172.multiweb.nl [195.114.242.173]) by ultra.multiweb.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA25797 for ; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 21:24:56 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <005701be10d6$3b425040$6e5afea9@pentium-ii> Reply-To: "Iwen" From: "Iwen" To: "Freestyle mailing list" Subject: [freestyle] Where to buy Facile Juice in SF Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1998 21:26:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0054_01BE10DE.9C606620" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0054_01BE10DE.9C606620 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I live in holland and its impossible for me to order online. My father goes to San Fransisco and Chicago this Chritsmas holiday. Does anybody know where to buy Facile Juice bags and/or Lavers in = Chicago or San fransisco??? ------=_NextPart_000_0054_01BE10DE.9C606620 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I live in holland and its impossible for me to order = online.
My father goes to San Fransisco and Chicago this = Chritsmas=20 holiday.
Does anybody know where to buy Facile Juice bags = and/or Lavers=20 in Chicago or San fransisco???
------=_NextPart_000_0054_01BE10DE.9C606620-- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 16 07:59:39 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id HAA09726 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 07:59:39 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mcfs.whowhere.com (mcfs.whowhere.com [209.1.236.44]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA27086 for ; Sun, 15 Nov 1998 16:21:48 -0800 Received: from Unknown/Local ([?.?.?.?]) by theglobe.com; Sun Nov 15 16:21:11 1998 To: freestyle@footbag.org Date: Sun, 15 Nov 1998 16:21:11 -0700 From: "Ian Dubman" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: off X-Mailer: MailCity Service Subject: [freestyle] Blurriest consecs. X-Sender-Ip: 128.206.120.81 Organization: E-Mail @ The Globe (http://www.globe-mail.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org This is for you BAP'ers(or just straight hein shredders). Have any of you guys linked more than two, or even two for that matter, blurriests consecutively. This is strictly curiosity, and knowing the prowess of some of you boys, I figured that some one has hit three or four. Ahren, I heard you hit: blurry Whirl, blurry whirl, blurriest, blurriest--is this true?? I beleive it was Leonard G. or Red Fred (one of those Columbianites) who told me, can't remember. Thanx all y'all Later, Ian "Free web-based email available now at http://www.theglobe.com" From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 16 16:58:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id QAA32099 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 16:58:50 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Calvin4hob@aol.com Received: from imo28.mx.aol.com (imo28.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.72]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA02749 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 05:38:39 -0800 Received: from Calvin4hob@aol.com by imo28.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OEEFa03081 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 08:37:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1998 08:37:40 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Help on butterfly swirls Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 224 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org could anyone help me out with butterfly swirls, any tips or suggestions would be very helpful. Thanks. -Chase Foster From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 17 03:12:36 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA15718 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 03:12:36 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f21.hotmail.com [207.82.251.201]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA15352 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 18:00:53 -0800 Received: (qmail 11317 invoked by uid 0); 17 Nov 1998 02:00:19 -0000 Message-ID: <19981117020019.11316.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 18:00:19 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: freestyle@footbag.org Cc: Pro2222@aol.com, scalf@utdallas.edu Subject: [freestyle] apology MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1998 18:00:19 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello everybody. >On Sat, 14 Nov 1998,I wrote: >> Yeah, what the hell is wrong with that boy's ankles? Can you really get >> to that point through stretching? It isn't genetic or something, or did >> he get some kind of operation? in reference to Brian McKenzie's flexibility. Since then I found out from a couple people that Brian McKenzie's flexibility comes from a medical condition (which I don't want to name, since I don't know him and it's not my place to reveal anything). First off, let me just say that my original posting was meant as a statement of awe at his flexibility. In light of the information I now have, I see it was a pretty embarassing faux pas. I honestly meant no harm, and the truth is at the time I didn't think the rhetorical device I used to express my admiration would be so out of place, since people have asked me (usually when I end something in a dragon) if I have performed surgery on myself, am made of cartilage, or am related to Gumby. I've usually taken comments like these at face value and recognized the underlying sentiment of admiration, so I didn't consider the possibility that clippers like his might have had their origin in something other than years of stretching and practice. I honestly meant nothing insulting by my comment, and I want to apologize to him, his friends, and anyone else I offended with my unthoughtful posting. While my original posting was an expression of admiration, I just want to say that I respect the guy all the more for not letting anything stop him from being such a hard core shredder. Again, I apologize for offending anyone with my insensitivity. Ken "you know you're flexible when you can stick your foot in your mouth" Somolinos ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 17 03:12:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA15724 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 03:12:56 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA12713 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 15:52:47 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F2J00J01H4DFL@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 16:55:25 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1998 16:55:25 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] Freestyle shoes? What to get? In-reply-to: <19981114230344.11344.qmail@hotmail.com> To: KeN Somolinos Cc: Pro2222@aol.com, scalf@utdallas.edu, freestyle@footbag.org Reply-to: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Sat, 14 Nov 1998, KeN Somolinos wrote: > Yeah, what the hell is wrong with that boy's ankles? Can you really get > to that point through stretching? It isn't genetic or something, or did > he get some kind of operation? I've heard two stories about Kyles ankles. 1) he's missing bone fragments so his ankles just do that 2) he has scoleosis and it naturally pointed his feet inward and made that flex that much easier Again this is only what I've heard. BRAD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 17 03:13:02 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA15735 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 03:13:02 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from webster.lcc.ctc.edu (lcc.ctc.edu [134.39.132.10]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA09278 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 12:56:30 -0800 Received: from lab6_176.ctc.edu (134.39.132.74) by webster.lcc.ctc.edu (WORLDMAIL 1.3.166) for freestyle@footbag.org; 16 Nov 1998 12:59:30 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19981116130103.007b08b0@lcc.ctc.edu> X-Sender: gehrmanaj@lcc.ctc.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1998 13:01:03 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ahren Gehrman Subject: Re: [freestyle] Blurriest consecs. In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Whuuuut up shredders? Ian asked... >Ahren, I heard you hit: blurry Whirl, blurry whirl, blurriest, blurriest--is >this true?? Yep. I hit it last year just before worlds. As of recently I hit three barraging torques in a row too. Yesterday I hit mobius to barraging torque. It's not a consecutive record but I just thought I'd share it. Torch From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 17 03:13:06 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA15762 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 03:13:06 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f11.hotmail.com [207.82.250.22]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA10218 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 13:43:34 -0800 Received: (qmail 29446 invoked by uid 0); 16 Nov 1998 21:42:50 -0000 Message-ID: <19981116214250.29445.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 207.250.75.206 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 13:42:50 PST X-Originating-IP: [207.250.75.206] From: "Otso Konttinen" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] groups... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1998 13:42:50 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi! I'm Ode from Finland and beeing exchange student in West Allis, Milwaukee Wisconsin. I like to know if there are any footbags groups over here? I have played now for 4 months. Thanks Ode ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 17 03:13:06 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id DAA15763 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 03:13:06 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: NikeekiN@aol.com Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com (imo12.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.2]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA11269 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 14:39:36 -0800 Received: from NikeekiN@aol.com by imo12.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OCGa019215 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 17:39:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1998 17:39:01 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] What is this move called? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Casablanca - Windows sub 214 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey, I have a question on a move that i just hit. Its the first time i hit move that ended in a clipper:). Anyway, here it is Toe>same out>op clip Thanks a lot. Nick A. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 17 06:55:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA10402 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 06:55:50 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from postoffice2.direcpc.com (mail.direcpc.com [198.77.116.30]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA01495 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 21:34:03 -0800 Received: from direcpc.com ([206.71.114.112]) by postoffice2.direcpc.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-45425U50000L50000S0) with ESMTP id AAA18552 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 23:34:12 -0500 Message-ID: <35B0CE07.AEB4D2E5@direcpc.com> Date: Sat, 18 Jul 1998 11:32:08 -0500 From: Matt Avery Organization: 4th Dimension Interactive X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] What is this move called? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Its called a butterfly bro...you'll need those:) Matt a NikeekiN@aol.com wrote: > Hey, > > I have a question on a move that i just hit. Its the first time i hit move > that ended in a clipper:). Anyway, here it is > Toe>same out>op clip > > Thanks a lot. > Nick A. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 17 06:55:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA10403 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 06:55:50 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mail1.doit.wisc.edu (mail1.doit.wisc.edu [144.92.9.40]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA02478 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 23:07:44 -0800 Received: from [144.92.180.99] by mail1.doit.wisc.edu id AAA97838 (8.8.6/50); Tue, 17 Nov 1998 00:07:29 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19981117000538.0071cf2c@students.wisc.edu> X-Sender: mklewand@students.wisc.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1998 00:05:38 -0600 To: "Otso Konttinen" , freestyle@footbag.org From: Matthew Kain Lewandowski Subject: Re: [freestyle] groups... In-Reply-To: <19981116214250.29445.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Well, if you can, stop by Madison. It's about an hour from West Allis. We have a good core of kickers here (about 6 or 7 die hards). If you (and the reason that this is being posted) nor anyone is in the area, play with us!!!! We can find somewhere to escape the cold (even though it can be hard) So all you warm footed, sunshinin', ocean loving, Cali boys are welcome here in Madison, WI if you ever get the chance. Matthew Kain Madison foundation of footbag freestyle email me Ode if you want to set something up At 01:42 PM 11/16/98 PST, Otso Konttinen wrote: >Hi! >I'm Ode from Finland and beeing exchange student in West Allis, >Milwaukee Wisconsin. I like to know if there are any footbags groups >over here? >I have played now for 4 months. >Thanks >Ode > > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 17 06:55:51 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA10409 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 06:55:51 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from smtp2.atl.mindspring.net (smtp2.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.128.42]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA02033 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 22:18:20 -0800 Received: from mindspring.com (user-38ld1qp.dialup.mindspring.com [209.86.135.89]) by smtp2.atl.mindspring.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA25187; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 00:18:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3650F99A.797DDC73@mindspring.com> Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1998 00:20:44 -0400 From: ryan X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 (Macintosh; U; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: NikeekiN@aol.com CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] What is this move called? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org NikeekiN@aol.com wrote: > Toe>same out>op clip Butterfly set from the same toe. ryan nyfD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 17 06:55:58 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA10437 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 06:55:58 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mail.colba.net (root@mail.colba.net [207.107.221.4]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA01626 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 21:39:40 -0800 Received: from colba.net (bhd1-s44.mtl.colba.net [207.107.152.54]) by mail.colba.net (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA00717 for ; Mon, 16 Nov 1998 23:40:59 -0500 Message-ID: <3650FD81.EB7FFD4C@colba.net> Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1998 23:37:21 -0500 From: Danny X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5b2 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] What is this move called? References: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------C3B62644A994A50631F818B6" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org --------------C3B62644A994A50631F818B6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NikeekiN@aol.com wrote: > Hey, > > I have a question on a move that i just hit. Its the first time i hit move > that ended in a clipper:). Anyway, here it is > Toe>same out>op clip > > Thanks a lot. > Nick A. This is a Butterfly. or it have a different name if you do the dex with the set leg. If so, I don't know is name... Danny --------------C3B62644A994A50631F818B6 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit  

NikeekiN@aol.com wrote:

Hey,

I have a question on a move that i just hit. Its the first time i hit move
that ended in a clipper:).  Anyway, here it is
Toe>same out>op clip

Thanks a lot.
Nick A.

This is a Butterfly.
or it have a different name if you do the dex with the set leg. If so, I don't know is name...

Danny --------------C3B62644A994A50631F818B6-- From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 17 20:51:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id UAA20356 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 20:51:56 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: NikeekiN@aol.com Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.4]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA12491 for ; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 13:23:48 -0800 Received: from NikeekiN@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OQRAa17681 for ; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 15:23:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1998 15:23:02 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Paradox Mirage Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 58 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey, I have been working on a paradox mirage for quite a while, but just no luck. After the dex, I dont have enough time to lift my support leg up end on a a toe stall. The way you do the dex doesnt matter does it? If it doesnt then what way is easier. I have been doing it out to in. And the last question, is this move on tricks of the trade. Thanks a lot. Nick A. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 17 22:01:22 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id WAA04881 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 22:01:22 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from MIT.EDU (PACIFIC-CARRIER-ANNEX.MIT.EDU [18.69.0.28]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA08162 for ; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 09:02:35 -0800 Received: from CATHEDRAL-SEVEN.MIT.EDU by MIT.EDU with SMTP id AA11021; Tue, 17 Nov 98 11:02:35 EST Received: by cathedral-seven.mit.edu (8.8.7/4.7) id LAA15009; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 11:02:34 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199811171602.LAA15009@cathedral-seven.mit.edu> To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Yoda/Miraging Butterfly Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1998 11:02:34 EST From: Andrew Hires Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org After my recent success with Smear and pixie butterfly, I am convinced that Yoda is a very feasible trick just waiting for me to hit it. However, I cannot do a miraging butterfly (toe > OP in > OP out > clip). What is the motion like? Do I plant the first dex leg after the mirage, then hop to a butterfly stall? I have a very hard time cranking the mirage, then planting and hopping off it to a stall in the little time I have after the mirage. Do I do it all in one motion, setting, doing both dexterities, and stalling as I land on the setting foot? The bag is dropping below my foot before I can get it steady and flat for stalling. I'm sure that once I master miraging butterfly, Yoda will be my first 5-add move. Thanks Andrew From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 18 09:14:06 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA04492 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:14:06 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from camel7.mindspring.com (camel7.mindspring.com [207.69.200.57]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA16598 for ; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 17:30:46 -0800 Received: from mindspring.com (user-38ld07j.dialup.mindspring.com [209.86.128.243]) by camel7.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA19485; Tue, 17 Nov 1998 19:30:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <365207B6.F4684FE@mindspring.com> Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1998 19:33:12 -0400 From: Ryan Masuga X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 (Macintosh; U; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: NikeekiN@aol.com CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Paradox Mirage References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org If the dex is from out to in, it's a Paradox Reverse Mirage. In to out being just Paradox Mirage. I sort of hop while I'm dexing so that towards the end of the move, both my legs are coming down simultaneously. That also helps my dex leg clear the bag while it's near the top of it's arc. My friends tell me that Pdx Rev Mirage is more difficult, but I almost seem to hit that easier than the other way. I'm also one of those people who finds it easier to hit Blizzard than Blur. Whatever works for you. ryan nyfD NikeekiN@aol.com wrote: > Hey, > > I have been working on a paradox mirage for quite a while, but just no luck. > After the dex, I dont have enough time to lift my support leg up end on a a > toe stall. The way you do the dex doesnt matter does it? If it doesnt then > what way is easier. I have been doing it out to in. And the last question, > is this move on tricks of the trade. > > Thanks a lot. > Nick A. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 18 16:29:00 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id QAA25674 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:29:00 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f231.hotmail.com [207.82.251.122]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id EAA24432 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 04:33:47 -0800 Received: (qmail 4178 invoked by uid 0); 18 Nov 1998 11:33:16 -0000 Message-ID: <19981118113316.4177.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 141.84.137.143 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 03:33:16 PST X-Originating-IP: [141.84.137.143] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] The upper limit MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 03:33:16 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi everyone, Many years back I was talking to a friend about possible moves and we came to the question, what is the limit of what is phisicaly possible? Moves like quadruple around the world and nemesis are kind of pushing it, but also what about the posibilities of playing totaly quadless, ie nothing below 5 adds. I¥m hoping not to start another adds debate I¥m just currious to hear, if anyone thinks this can be done. -Andrew (who can go quadless for about one move at a time) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 18 17:04:38 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA10091 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 17:04:38 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from opus.vcn.bc.ca (marigold@opus.vcn.bc.ca [207.102.64.2]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA27249 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:39:54 -0800 Received: from localhost by opus.vcn.bc.ca (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id IAA16756; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:39:23 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 08:39:22 -0800 (PST) From: Verhoef Anne To: Andrew McCargar cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] The upper limit In-Reply-To: <19981118113316.4177.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by eniac.yak.net id RAA01648 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Wed, 18 Nov 1998, Andrew McCargar wrote: > Many years back I was talking to a friend about possible moves and we > came to the question, what is the limit of what is phisicaly possible? > Moves like quadruple around the world and nemesis are kind of pushing > it, but also what about the posibilities of playing totaly quadless, ie > nothing below 5 adds. I*m hoping not to start another adds debate I*m > just currious to hear, if anyone thinks this can be done. It's just a matter of time. I remember back in 93 when players would link together 4 or so tripless moves and everyone thought it was amazing. Now people are tripless but linking together up to 5 5add moves in a row. I bet in a little over 5 years, people will be attemping quadless shred. What a cool concept! See ya, Adrian V. -- marigold@vcn.bc.ca From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 18 17:15:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA10206 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 17:15:56 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA27525 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:48:05 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA26301 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 10:48:03 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [freestyle] The upper limit Message-Id: <000000262442994252407@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 10:46:46 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.9 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by eniac.yak.net id RAA10122 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Wed, Nov 18, 1998, 5:33:16 AM US CST Andrew McCargar wrote: >Many years back I was talking to a friend about possible moves and we >came to the question, what is the limit of what is phisicaly possible? >Moves like quadruple around the world and nemesis are kind of pushing According to my calculations, there should be approximately 12,000 unique moves possible in footbag play. This, of course, includes everything from the simple toe kick to the nemesis. ______________________________________ Derrick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 18 17:39:43 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA18759 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 17:39:43 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send104.yahoomail.com (send104.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.122]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA28386 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 10:15:49 -0800 Message-ID: <19981118171630.1427.rocketmail@send104.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.184.181] by send104.yahoomail.com; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:16:30 PST Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 09:16:30 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] Yoda/miraging butterfly To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Andrew, > However, I cannot do a (Yoda) miraging butterfly (toe > OP in > OP out > clip). What is the motion like? Do I plant the first dex leg after the mirage, then hop to a butterfly stall I've never actually seen anyone do this, but if you don't plant the first dex leg and do both dexes (in the air) at once, then its a toe dada curve- much easier. So try the harder way. do the first dex reverse and its a legbeater. do it from clipper and its a ripwalk. EXPERIMENT!!! > I'm sure that once I master miraging butterfly, Yoda will be my first 5-add move. If I'm not mistaken, Yoda is 4 adds. (dex)(dex)(xbody)(delay). Who named that trick?I'd never heard of it until 2 nights ago. Zohar Boulder _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 18 18:16:05 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA27326 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 18:16:05 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: "Dave Reid" To: Subject: RE: [freestyle] The upper limit Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 12:47:49 -0500 Message-ID: <000201be131b$8f1deb60$c136c786@pc0966.software.mitel.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > -----Original Message----- > people are tripless but linking together up to 5 5add moves in a row. I > bet in a little over 5 years, people will be attemping quadless shred. > What a cool concept! Sounds like NOW would be a good time to get into the replacement knee and hip business. :) Evil Doctor Dave From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 18 18:28:18 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA27407 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 18:28:18 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA29268 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 11:05:42 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id MAA09348 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 12:05:41 -0600 (CST) Subject: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur Message-Id: <000000262772994257065@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 12:04:25 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.9 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org (Freestyle Listserve) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Who out there can hit that move? clip > same I-O > Op I-O > Op Toe Does it have a special name? If not I would have to call it a 'double paradox'. For those of you that can, have you tried tacking a drifter on the end, instead of a toe delay? That would be a 'mirrored paradox'. ______________________________________ Derrick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 04:41:53 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA10673 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 04:41:53 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send102.yahoomail.com (send102.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.90]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA30328 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 12:23:35 -0800 Message-ID: <19981118192607.17915.rocketmail@send102.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.191.144] by send102.yahoomail.com; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 11:26:07 PST Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 11:26:07 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] The upper limit To: Andrew McCargar , freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Quadless, huh? I've always thought "Quantum" would be a good term for this. In reality, I don't think this will ever be truly achievable. You might see some people able to do 10 5's in a row someday, but there just aren't enough 5's out there for someone to claim quadless. Just imagine: you'd have to turn blurs into blurrage or fog or blurry drifter, legbeaters into fusion or atomic whirl, ripwalks into blurriest or blurry whirl, spinning butterfly into scorpion tail or spinning butterfly swirl/whirling swirl, ducking butterfly into ducking barfly/pdox whirl, etc.etc.etc. Not only that but you'd have to pull them into more 5's, EVERYTIME YOU GET THE BAG! As for MY quantum combo of the future: blurry drifter, pdox legbeater, blurry whirl, blurrier, blurriest, mobius, pdox torque, barroque, pdox symp whirl, symp whirling swirl, blurry whirl, scorpion tail, gyro symposium whirl, whirlwind, pdox symp whirl, double blender, stepping blender, pdox torque, ripwarrior, ducking barfly, ducking pdox whirl, symp whirling swirl, big apple, blurrage, fusion, big apple sauce, heart attack. Zohar ---Andrew McCargar wrote: > > Hi everyone, > > Many years back I was talking to a friend about possible moves and we > came to the question, what is the limit of what is phisicaly possible? > Moves like quadruple around the world and nemesis are kind of pushing > it, but also what about the posibilities of playing totaly quadless, ie > nothing below 5 adds. I*m hoping not to start another adds debate I*m > just currious to hear, if anyone thinks this can be done. > > -Andrew (who can go quadless for about one move at a time) > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 04:42:36 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA10688 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 04:42:36 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA30438 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 12:35:36 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id NAA01727; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 13:35:20 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx11-16.ix.netcom.com(207.94.124.144) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma001666; Wed Nov 18 13:34:35 1998 Message-ID: <3653247F.1AA1@utdallas.edu> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 13:48:15 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Derrick Fogle, MLERF" CC: Freestyle Listserve Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur References: <000000262772994257065@mlerf.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Derrick Fogle, MLERF wrote: > > Who out there can hit that move? > > clip > same I-O > Op I-O > Op Toe > > Does it have a special name? If not I would have to call it a 'double > paradox'. > That is a voodoo. Well, actually, I think a voodoo is symposium (paradox symp blur). If you do this without it being symp, you start kicking yourself. I can't do this move, but quite a few people can. Noah, Tuan, Sunil?... About the paradox blurry drifter, theat is pretty hellish. I've never seen or heard of anyone doing that before. Anyone? -Derric DFC From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 04:42:39 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA10701 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 04:42:39 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send105.yahoomail.com (send105.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.128]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA30486 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 12:37:07 -0800 Message-ID: <19981118193946.6026.rocketmail@send105.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.191.144] by send105.yahoomail.com; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 11:39:46 PST Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 11:39:46 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur To: "Derrick Fogle, MLERF" , freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > clip > same I-O > Op I-O > Op Toe Pdox Blur. I think it should get 2 pdox adds, if we actually redefine paradox. > Does it have a special name? If not I would have to call it a 'double > paradox'. That could get really confusing. > For those of you that can, have you tried tacking a drifter on the end, instead of a toe delay? That would be a 'mirrored paradox'. I can't, but if you played Pdox Blurry Drifter in rewind it would be a "Nuclear Reverse Drifter". In case anyone doesn't know, nuclear is a pdox rev mirage set followed by a mirage, ie. pdox atomsmasher, pdox atomic whirl. "Atomic" is the same thing but from toe. Zohar _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 04:43:35 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA10718 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 04:43:35 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA30559 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 12:44:13 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id NAA26418 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 13:44:12 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur Message-Id: <000000263292994262974@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 13:42:53 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.9 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Wed, Nov 18, 1998, 1:39:46 PM US CST Zohar Piltz wrote: >Pdox Blur. I think it should get 2 pdox adds, if we actually redefine >paradox. If thats what everybody calls it, I don't want to try to go changing it. That's just what I coined for it because I, too, think it should get 2 paradox adds, hence 'double paradox'. ______________________________________ Derrick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 04:45:09 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA10749 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 04:45:09 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Damon Mathews Received: from imo13.mx.aol.com (imo13.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA03290 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 18:30:56 -0800 Received: from PRODIDFB@aol.com by imo13.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OZPCa26411 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 20:29:52 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 20:29:52 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >Who out there can hit that move? >clip > same I-O > Op I-O > Op Toe I can, and I do it symposium. >Does it have a special name? If not I would have to call it a 'double >paradox'. The name for the trick is paradox blur. 4adds The trick I do is paradox symposium blur. The last dex is symposium. 5adds >For those of you that can, have you tried tacking a drifter on the end, >instead of a toe delay? That would be a 'mirrored paradox'. My roommate can hit a fairy drifter(4 adds) and nuclear drifter(5 adds) I have quicktime clips of symposium toe blur(4adds). later, Masters of Charlotte Shred, Damon "The Dominator" From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 04:45:11 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA10762 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 04:45:11 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mail.socket.net (mail.socket.net [216.106.1.7] (may be forged)) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA02076 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:55:01 -0800 Received: from jeremiah ([208.19.241.93]) by mail.socket.net ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 16:47:21 -600 Message-ID: <000401be134f$5ae42d80$5df113d0@jeremiah> From: "Jeremiah Riely" To: "Eli Piltz" , Subject: Re: [freestyle] Yoda/miraging butterfly Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 17:58:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >> I'm sure that once I master miraging butterfly, Yoda will be my >first 5-add move. > >If I'm not mistaken, Yoda is 4 adds. (dex)(dex)(xbody)(delay). >Who named that trick?I'd never heard of it until 2 nights ago. Yoda is a pixie miraging butterfly (or pixie toe set rip-walk) TOE > SAME IN [DEX] > OP IN [DEX] > OP OUT [DEX] > OP CLIP [XBD] [DEL] 5 adds. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 04:45:38 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA10778 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 04:45:38 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (hejira.hunter.cuny.edu [146.95.128.97]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA05744 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 21:18:42 -0800 Received: (from jpenney@localhost) by hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id XAA12574; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 23:25:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 23:25:52 -0500 (EST) From: Deliciously Saucy Josh Penney To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur In-Reply-To: <000000262772994257065@mlerf.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > clip > same I-O > Op I-O > Op Toe > Does it have a special name? If not I would have to call it a 'double > paradox'. They call that one 'paradox blur'. I would think Voodoo would be easier, simply on the basis of windows. That was not a plug. JP From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 04:45:40 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id EAA10791 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 04:45:40 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from pigeon.vut.edu.au (pigeon.vut.edu.AU [140.159.30.12]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA02798 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 17:52:28 -0800 Received: from village.vut.edu.au (erskine@[140.159.18.250]) by pigeon.vut.edu.au (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA09688; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 11:57:49 +1100 (EST) Received: from localhost (erskine@localhost) by village.vut.edu.au (8.9.0/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA25924; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 11:57:45 +1100 Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1998 11:57:45 +1100 (EST) From: ERSKINE Brendan Reply-To: ERSKINE Brendan To: Eli Piltz cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Yoda/miraging butterfly In-Reply-To: <19981118171630.1427.rocketmail@send104.yahoomail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I've seen Sunil Jani hit yoda a few times when he was over in Australia. Come to think of it i'm quite certain that he also named it. I'm also sure that many other people could also hit it if asked. Another question has pixie symposium eggbeater been hit before? Brendan Erskine From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 09:38:11 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA30625 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 09:38:11 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send103.yahoomail.com (send103.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.92]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA06445 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 21:56:13 -0800 Message-ID: <19981119045712.29819.rocketmail@send103.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.186.12] by send103.yahoomail.com; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 20:57:12 PST Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 20:57:12 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] Nuclear Drifter?!! To: Damon Mathews , freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Dominator! > My roommate can hit a fairy drifter(4 adds) and nuclear drifter(5 adds) Are you sure about the Nuclear Drifter??? Or is that a Pdox Reverse Drifter??? notation here: nuclear drifter: clip > same o-i > opp i-o > same clip. like doing a pdox atom smasher but to clipper of 2nd dex leg. pdox rev drifter: clip > same o-i > same clip. like doing a pdox legbeater but without the 2nd dex. If he has in fact hit Nuclear Drifter, then I am extremely impressed. I've come sooooo close to Nuclear Torque, but no seal yet. Have hit Nuclear Whirl (Nuclear War). Not that you asked. Zohar Boulder, CO _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 09:38:20 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA30635 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 09:38:20 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send1e.yahoomail.com (send1e.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA06513 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 22:07:33 -0800 Message-ID: <19981119050352.1692.rocketmail@send1e.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.186.12] by send1e; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 21:03:52 PST Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 21:03:52 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur To: "Derrick Fogle, MLERF" , freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Derrick and all, about pdox blur: >> "double paradox" > That's just what I coined for it because I, too, think it should get 2 paradox > adds, hence 'double paradox'. The reason why it could become confusing is because many tricks have 2 pdox adds in them, although the current definition doesn't play that game. With a rewritten def., you'd get 2 pdoxes for pdox blur, pdox blurry drifter/whirl/torque, pdox atomsmasher, pdox atomic whirl/drifter/torque, spinning pdox blur, blurry blur, etc.... Agree?... Disagree?.... Zohar Boulder, CO _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 09:38:40 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA30652 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 09:38:40 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mailhost.cyberramp.net (root@mailhost.cyberramp.net [207.158.64.11]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA06586 for ; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 22:13:57 -0800 Received: from jrichter (dal-tsa14-55.cyberramp.net [207.158.83.247]) by mailhost.cyberramp.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1/ler-981118-0955) with SMTP id XAA17864; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 23:13:50 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3653A99A.624F@cyberramp.net> Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 23:16:10 -0600 From: Joe Richter Reply-To: jrichter@cyberramp.net Organization: Me X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Eli Piltz CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] The upper limit References: <19981118192607.17915.rocketmail@send102.yahoomail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org All, There you go. Just a few years ago, this sport went crazy with a few people able to perform the IMPOSSIBLE - They could actually hit 'three-add' moves, and do it repeatedly. Incredible. So, I crank up the tired old bones for one last shot at immortality; I'll one day be able to knock out three-adds like the rest of 'em. And what happens? The wild bastards go out and continue to get better and better! I don't know what the upper limit is. I know I'll never approach it. I just think that it's great that I'll be able to sit back and chew my gums in a few years and watch people doing moves that just seem impossible to all of us now; Just like the things that Eli and others do today - Impossible. I just love footbagging. Have fun baggin', Joe Richter Eli Piltz wrote: > > Quadless, huh? I've always thought "Quantum" would be a good term for > this. In reality, I don't think this will ever be truly achievable. > You might see some people able to do 10 5's in a row someday, but > there just aren't enough 5's out there for someone to claim quadless. <<<>>> From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 09:38:42 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id JAA30660 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 09:38:42 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f268.hotmail.com [207.82.251.159]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA08780 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 00:46:05 -0800 Received: (qmail 27176 invoked by uid 0); 19 Nov 1998 07:45:34 -0000 Message-ID: <19981119074534.27175.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 18 Nov 1998 23:45:34 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: freestyle@footbag.org, PRODIDFB@aol.com Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1998 23:45:34 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all. Derric said: >>Who out there can hit that move? >>clip > same I-O > Op I-O > Op Toe To which Damon replied: >I can, and I do it symposium. Pdx blur is a good deal harder than ps blur. Just cause you can do ps blur doesn't mean you can do pdx blur. I know this is the case for me. If you can do it both ways, than lots of power to you. KeN "ceiling fan" somolinos nyfD ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 20:25:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id UAA13548 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 20:25:41 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (hejira.hunter.cuny.edu [146.95.128.97]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA15280 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 12:20:56 -0800 Received: (from jpenney@localhost) by hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id OAA08706; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 14:28:03 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1998 14:28:03 -0500 (EST) From: Deliciously Saucy Josh Penney To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur In-Reply-To: <19981119050352.1692.rocketmail@send1e.yahoomail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > The reason why it could become confusing is because many tricks have 2 > pdox adds in them, although the current definition doesn't play that > game. With a rewritten def., you'd get 2 pdoxes for pdox blur, pdox > blurry drifter/whirl/torque, pdox atomsmasher, pdox atomic > whirl/drifter/torque, spinning pdox blur, blurry blur, etc.... ..what? I can see what you're saying for pblur, b|c windows are so crazy there, but bdrifter? Come on. patomsmasher? Even *I* have hit that one. JP From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 22:08:38 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id WAA15224 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 22:08:38 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA17668 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 14:43:49 -0800 Received: (from jriely@localhost) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id PAA19902; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 15:43:36 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1998 15:43:36 -0600 (CST) From: "Jeremiah J. Riely" X-Sender: jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu To: Deliciously Saucy Josh Penney cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > > game. With a rewritten def., you'd get 2 pdoxes for pdox blur, pdox > > blurry drifter/whirl/torque, pdox atomsmasher, pdox atomic > > whirl/drifter/torque, spinning pdox blur, blurry blur, etc.... > > ..what? I can see what you're saying for pblur, b|c windows are so crazy > there, but bdrifter? Come on. patomsmasher? Even *I* have hit that one. I think he means paradox blurry drifter CLIP > SAME IN-OUT > OP IN-OUT > SAME CLIP. Same thing for the whirl and torque. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 22:12:35 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id WAA15260 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 22:12:35 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send1e.yahoomail.com (send1e.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA17862 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 14:47:48 -0800 Message-ID: <19981119214357.26006.rocketmail@send1e.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.194.238] by send1e; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 13:43:56 PST Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1998 13:43:56 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Piltz Subject: re: [freestyle] dbl pdox clarification To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > > game. With a rewritten def., you'd get 2 pdoxes for pdox blur, pdox > > blurry drifter/whirl/torque, pdox atomsmasher, pdox atomic > > whirl/drifter/torque, spinning pdox blur, blurry blur, etc.... > > > ..what? I can see what you're saying for pblur, b|c windows are socrazy > there, but bdrifter? Come on. patomsmasher? Even *I* have hit that one. Derrick suggested that PDOX blurry drifter should have 2 pdoxs. If you look again, you'll see that I wrote "pdox blurry drifter". You remember that "leg in the way of the other leg" thing from a while back? Someone suggested a way to resolve it, rather than create a new add category, just put atomsmasher and the like inside the pdox add, because the rev mirage puts the bag on the other side of the body, which is basically what makes a pdox mirage "pdox". And to quote Steve Goldberg, "anytime you have to 'put on the brakes' to do the dex, like in a spinning mirage, it's pdox." There's no reason why doing a blur "pdox" should cancel the pdox within a blur. So what I was saying, if the redefining of pdox includes atomsmasher, then doing it pdox would not "cancel" the pdox within an atomsmasher. I know this is debatable, so on with the discussions. Pdox atom smasher, as far as I'm concerned, is a 5 add. Josh, just because you've hit it, doesn't mean it's easy. Need I remind you that I watched you hit blurry torque among other craziness? EZ _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 23:23:29 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id XAA32370 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 23:23:29 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA18839 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 15:42:19 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA08248 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 16:42:18 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [freestyle] dbl pdox clarification Message-Id: <000000267602994360060@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1998 16:41:00 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.9 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, Nov 19, 1998, 3:43:56 PM US CST Eli Piltz wrote: >which is basically what makes a pdox mirage "pdox". And to quote >Steve Goldberg, "anytime you have to 'put on the brakes' to do the >dex, like in a spinning mirage, it's pdox." There's no reason why >doing a blur "pdox" should cancel the pdox within a blur. So what I Remeber all the stuff about how paradox is a body add because of the back-and- forth hip swivel that needs to be done to accomplish it? The reason I think it deserves two paradox adds is because doing the first dex paradox requires the paradox swivel, but it leaves your body in the same state as if it were set from the other side, meaning you have to do yet another hip swivel to achieve the second dex. If the first is paradox, so is the second. Of course, the corollary to this argument is whether a back spinning mirage ...Clip > Spin (away) > Op In-Out > Op Toe... is paradox or not. I tend to think it doesn't, because by the time you're done spinning around, any hip swivel has long since been washed away by the larger body rotation. I've seen people do the move as a quick spin away, then literally stop and stand on both feet for a moment, and then do the mirage. That, in my book, ain't paradox. If you look at the back-spinning/reverse spinning torque, though, you get something simiar to paradox but it involves a much, much larger rotation than just swivel. It is spin > dex > reverse spin > clipper (osis). I can see that moves that put a whole 'nother reverse spin after the back spin could qualify not only for two body spinning adds, but the paradox add as well. It all depends on how much weight you put into the 'spin momentum reversal' being the crux of paradox. My brain is starting to hurt. I think its leaking beads. ______________________________________ Derrick Fogle From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 19 23:23:59 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id XAA32388 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 23:23:59 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA18504 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 15:20:13 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA05314 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 16:20:12 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur Message-Id: <000000267532994358734@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1998 16:18:53 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.9 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, Nov 19, 1998, 3:43:36 PM US CST Jeremiah J. Riely wrote: >I think he means paradox blurry drifter >CLIP > SAME IN-OUT > OP IN-OUT > SAME CLIP. That's exactly what I meant for the "mirrored paradox" because the move is a perfect mirror of itself forward and backward. Yes, you've seen me making a fool of myself trying it... ______________________________________ Derrick Fogle From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 23 08:02:23 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA01843 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 08:02:23 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send103.yahoomail.com (send103.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.92]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA24103 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 21:08:34 -0800 Message-ID: <19981120040937.19302.rocketmail@send103.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.250.164.215] by send103.yahoomail.com; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 20:09:37 PST Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1998 20:09:37 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Zohar Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blurry Drifter-Mirrored? To: "Derrick Fogle, MLERF" , freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org You all, > That's exactly what I meant for the "mirrored paradox" because the move is a > perfect mirror of itself forward and backward. I still disagree. I think pdox blurry drifter rewound is nuclear reverse drifter. If you want a truly "mirrored" trick, think about Nuclear Drifter. clip>same oi>opp io>same clip. Hey this is cool!, if you take away the "> arrows", then read the notation backwards, you will know if the trick is truly mirrored to itself. Okay, let's try pdox blurry drifter for example. clip>same io>opp io>same clip. See? The direction of the dexterities are switched. Ran in reverse its: clip>same oi>opp oi>same clip. Yep a nuclear rev drifter. EZ _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 23 08:02:08 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA01819 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 08:02:08 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (hejira.hunter.cuny.edu [146.95.128.97]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA19421 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 16:09:05 -0800 Received: (from jpenney@localhost) by hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id SAA25372; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 18:16:07 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1998 18:16:07 -0500 (EST) From: Deliciously Saucy Josh Penney To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blur In-Reply-To: <000000267532994358734@mlerf.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Right, right. I wasn't reading carefully enough. Sorry. JP From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 23 08:02:16 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA01825 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 08:02:16 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA22204 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 19:02:03 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F2P00M016Z87W@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 19:01:56 -0700 (MST) Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1998 19:01:56 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] Blurriest consecs. In-reply-to: <3.0.1.32.19981116130103.007b08b0@lcc.ctc.edu> To: Ahren Gehrman Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, 16 Nov 1998, Ahren Gehrman wrote: > barraging torques in a row too. Yesterday I hit mobius to barraging > torque. It's not a consecutive record but I just thought I'd share it. Is a barraging torque the same as Baroque? Brad From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 23 08:02:19 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA01831 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 08:02:19 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA30235 for ; Fri, 20 Nov 1998 08:41:21 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id JAA20652 for ; Fri, 20 Nov 1998 09:41:19 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [freestyle] Front-End Paradox Blurry Drifter-Mirrored? Message-Id: <000000269012994421200@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1998 09:39:59 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 2.9.9 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, Nov 19, 1998, 10:09:37 PM US CST Zohar Piltz wrote: >I still disagree. I think pdox blurry drifter rewound is nuclear >reverse drifter. To me, "Rewound" and "Mirrored" are different things. It sounds like you consider them to be the same. M I R clip > same io (opp) io > same clip R O R This is the mirrored aspect of this move; if you start at the mirror and read either way, it is exactly the same. If you physically put a mirror in your crotch between your legs and did a mirage dexterity, in the mirror it would look like your other leg doing a mirage dexterity, not a reverse mirage. Ripwalks are also 'mirror' moves. There's also the distinction of whether the term is being applied to elements within the same move, or to compare two different moves. I think you're using 'rewind' to draw comparisons between two moves instead of elements within the same move itself. A 'rewound' move within itself would be something like a tapping move: R E W toe > opp oi (same) io > opp clip I N D Nuclear Revere Drifter is itself a mirrored move, I think: M I R clip > same oi (opp) oi > same clip R O R And the comparison between Pdx Blurry Drifter and Nuclear Reverse Drifter shows them to be rewound moves: M I R clip > same io (opp) io > same clip R O R * * * * * * * R E W I N D * * * * * * * M I R clip > same oi (opp) oi > same clip R O R Or.. R E W clip same io opp io same clip (---) clip same oi opp oi same clip I N D So actually, we're both right. We're just using the terms in slightly different ways. There are actually three variants of pairing: Matched, Mirrored, and Rewound. Moves themselves can have the elements within them, or whole moves can have the elements, or whole sets of moves can have the elements. That's one of the great challenges in footbag - to weave together different iterations of matched, mirrored, and rewound moves and sets. The geometry and symmetry of motion that can be achieved through exploring these little toys is tremendous. Go to it! ______________________________________ Derrick Fogle From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 23 08:02:22 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA01838 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 08:02:22 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send102.yahoomail.com (send102.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.90]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA23914 for ; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 20:55:20 -0800 Message-ID: <19981120035757.11965.rocketmail@send102.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.250.164.215] by send102.yahoomail.com; Thu, 19 Nov 1998 19:57:57 PST Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1998 19:57:57 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Zohar Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] dbl pdox clarification To: "Derrick Fogle, MLERF" , freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org For all you non-believers, Derrick's words: > Remeber all the stuff about how paradox is a body add because of the back-and- > forth hip swivel that needs to be done to accomplish it? The reason I think it > deserves two paradox adds is because doing the first dex paradox requires the > paradox swivel, but it leaves your body in the same state as if it were set > from the other side, meaning you have to do yet another hip swivel to achieve > the second dex. If the first is paradox, so is the second. Gee, this sounds completely identical to PARADOX ATOM SMASHER. Regular atomsmasher has the hip swivel, too. EZ _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 23 08:05:18 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA10349 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 08:05:18 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f136.hotmail.com [207.82.251.15]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA17482 for ; Sat, 21 Nov 1998 12:33:36 -0800 Received: (qmail 13002 invoked by uid 0); 21 Nov 1998 20:33:05 -0000 Message-ID: <19981121203305.13001.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 199.60.118.210 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 21 Nov 1998 12:33:04 PST X-Originating-IP: [199.60.118.210] From: "Allan Haggett" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] 8 adds? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 12:33:04 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org symposium butterfly twirl - 7 adds? Do you get a cross-body add on the swirl? So - left clipper(no plant while)-- bail to left osis. (body)dex(x-body)dex(body)x-body(del)? or (body)dex(dex)body(x-body)del? 6 or 7 kids, you tell me. Do I even have that terminology right? A swirl bailing to an osis is a twirl, No? Sorry about the notation. Also could someone clarify the 'Nuclear' set for me? Allan Haggett Victoria, B.C. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 23 08:05:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA10362 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 08:05:50 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from webster.lcc.ctc.edu (lcc.ctc.edu [134.39.132.10]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA02266 for ; Fri, 20 Nov 1998 12:51:36 -0800 Received: from lab3.ctc.edu (134.39.132.88) by webster.lcc.ctc.edu (WORLDMAIL 1.3.166) for freestyle@footbag.org; 20 Nov 1998 12:54:40 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19981120125551.006a61e0@lcc.ctc.edu> X-Sender: gehrmanaj@lcc.ctc.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1998 12:55:51 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ahren Gehrman Subject: Re: [freestyle] Blurriest consecs. In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.1.32.19981116130103.007b08b0@lcc.ctc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Yo! > Is a barraging torque the same as Baroque? yes Torch From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 23 20:37:22 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id UAA27616 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 20:37:22 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mcfs.whowhere.com (mcfs.whowhere.com [209.1.236.44]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA12839 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 12:12:47 -0800 Received: from Unknown/Local ([?.?.?.?]) by theglobe.com; Mon Nov 23 12:10:37 1998 To: freestyle@footbag.org Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 12:10:37 -0700 From: "Ian Dubman" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: off X-Mailer: MailCity Service Subject: Re: [freestyle] 8 adds? X-Sender-Ip: 128.206.120.62 Organization: E-Mail @ The Globe (http://www.globe-mail.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Also could someone clarify the 'Nuclear' >set for me? Nuclear is a paradox reverse mirage followed by a opposite leg dex, right Eli?? Used in the same context as a blurry set. So you could have a blurry whirl or if you are totally hein a nuclear whirl. Notation?? Yeah right!! I don't know it and am not attempting it. OK here is an attempt: Blurry whirl: xbody>opp dex[i-o]>opp dex[i-o]opp x-bod>delay Nuclear whirl: xbod>same dex[o-i]>opp dex[i-o]>opp x-bod>delay Anyone, feel free to enliighten me on my mistakes with the notation. That was my first time using it and I have not a clue as to what the hell I am doing. Late y'all Ian "Free web-based email available now at http://www.theglobe.com" From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 23 23:02:33 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id XAA29400 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 23:02:33 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: NikeekiN@aol.com Received: from imo13.mx.aol.com (imo13.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA14760 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 14:20:54 -0800 Received: from NikeekiN@aol.com by imo13.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OOGUa28568 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 17:17:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <32c6f9f5.3659defb@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 17:17:31 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Move name Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 230 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey, What's up footbagger's? Okay, here is my question. I set it up form a right toe stall. Same leg out to in. Same osis. Is this right Toe>Same Out>(back)Spin>Same clip Thanks a lot Nick A. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 23 23:02:57 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id XAA29415 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 23:02:57 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA13213 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 12:39:57 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #D3122) with SMTP id <0F2W003016LKIG@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 13:36:56 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 13:36:56 -0700 (MST) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] dbl pdox clarification In-reply-to: <19981120035757.11965.rocketmail@send102.yahoomail.com> To: Eli Zohar Piltz Cc: "Derrick Fogle, MLERF" , freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, 19 Nov 1998, Eli Zohar Piltz wrote: > > from the other side, meaning you have to do yet another hip swivel > to achieve > > the second dex. If the first is paradox, so is the second. > > Gee, this sounds completely identical to PARADOX ATOM SMASHER. > Regular atomsmasher has the hip swivel, too. So would you get a double paradox for the paradox atom smasher, and a single paradox for a regular atom smasher? BRAD From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 24 00:12:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id AAA22592 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 00:12:50 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA16317 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 15:44:54 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id RAA11278; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 17:43:56 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx47-18.ix.netcom.com(198.211.44.210) by dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma011125; Mon Nov 23 17:43:10 1998 Message-ID: <3659F6A3.3F8C@utdallas.edu> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 17:58:27 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: NikeekiN@aol.com CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Move name References: <32c6f9f5.3659defb@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org NikeekiN@aol.com wrote: > > Hey, > What's up footbagger's? Okay, here is my question. > I set it up form a right toe stall. Same leg out to in. Same osis. > Is this right Toe>Same Out>(back)Spin>Same clip > Thanks a lot > Nick A. That is a fairy same side osis. Any time you do a toe set to a quick 'same OUT dex' it is fairy. Pixie means a toe set to a quick 'same IN dex'. I've also heard people call fairy a 'reverse pixie'. About the fairy same side osis... You can do it 'crispy' where you throw up a fairy set, plant your foot, and then turn into the osis. That way, no one can cheat you out of that add for the dexterity. If you do it this way, it is four adds. Or, you can do it 'slurred' where you don't plant the set foot after the fairy set. If you do this, the dexterity isn't really there, so it would be three adds. This move is actually a corkscrew if I'm not mistaken. Kindof like a refraction, but not really... Try this. Set the same move from left toe. If you use your upper leg (thigh) for the dex, you are hitting corkscrew - 3 adds. If you wait until the last second, and then throw the lower part of your leg around the bag while you are spinning into the osis, that is a toe set dyno - 4 adds. I've been playing around with that fairy set and that reverse whirl motion lately. Fun stuff. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 24 01:01:46 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id BAA31204 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 01:01:46 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA230 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 16:20:42 -0800 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 16:21:19 -0800 Message-ID: <01BE16FD.4D3E0640.ewulff@jsishipping.com> From: Eric Wulff To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] flyers Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 16:21:17 -0800 Organization: JSI Shipping X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi you-all I felt like posting a personal record of my own. Perhaps it is a footbag record. If an official count has never been taken on consecutive flyers let one begin here. 30 contact quiltless.. FLYERS.. Sunday afternoon in the park.. Update next Sunday... I-man From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 24 08:13:30 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA28827 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 08:13:30 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send101.yahoomail.com (send101.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.87]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA20630 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 19:18:41 -0800 Message-ID: <19981124031752.29313.rocketmail@send101.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.186.177] by send101.yahoomail.com; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 19:17:52 PST Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 19:17:52 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Zohar Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] 8 adds? To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Nuclear is a paradox reverse mirage followed by a opposite leg dex, right Eli?? You betcha! > > Blurry whirl: > xbody>opp dex[i-o]>opp dex[i-o]opp x-bod>delay > > Nuclear whirl: > xbod>same dex[o-i]>opp dex[i-o]>opp x-bod>delay > You get an A+, Ian. No errors. Now try the notation for 'Nuclear diving barroque' to truly test your skills. Eli _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 24 08:13:46 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA28833 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 08:13:46 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send105.yahoomail.com (send105.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.128]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA20892 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 19:31:36 -0800 Message-ID: <19981124033435.13358.rocketmail@send105.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.186.177] by send105.yahoomail.com; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 19:34:35 PST Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 19:34:35 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Zohar Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] Mirrored?/ pdox whirl record To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ok, I was mistaken. I was classifying "mirrored" and "rewound" as one. So is blurry whirl a mirror of itself? If so, that means just about any clipper to clipper trick is a mirror: drifter, pdox whirl, ducking butterfly, barfly, ps whirl, etc. I've always refered to that as back-2-back and nothing more. I'm a "rewound" fan. Btw, about that pdox whirl record: I want you all (who can) to look at 96 Shred and pay close attention to Paul's pdox whirls. If I'm not mistaken, number 12 or 13 is "tha". Sorry for nitpicking, but I say if it's a record it's gotta be clean. Eli _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 24 08:13:56 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id IAA28843 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 08:13:56 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA429 for ; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 19:28:44 -0800 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Mon, 23 Nov 1998 19:29:19 -0800 Message-ID: <01BE1717.91103E00.ewulff@jsishipping.com> From: Eric Wulff To: "'freestyle'" Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 19:29:15 -0800 Organization: JSI Shipping X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Uhh.. hehehe I wrote >30 contact quiltless.. FLYERS.. Sunday afternoon in the park.. You can imagine how cold I was.. or perhaps you can't... Uh.. yeh! From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Tue Nov 24 10:08:08 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id KAA30158 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 10:08:08 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f244.hotmail.com [207.82.251.135]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA24384 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 00:28:11 -0800 Received: (qmail 28563 invoked by uid 0); 24 Nov 1998 08:27:38 -0000 Message-ID: <19981124082738.28562.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.217.213 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 00:27:38 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.217.213] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: freestyle@footbag.org, ezshredz@yahoo.com Subject: Re: [freestyle] 8 adds? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1998 00:27:38 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all. > >Now try the notation for 'Nuclear diving barroque' to truly test your >skills. Now try hitting "nuclear diving barroque" and end up in the hospital Ceiling Fan nyfD ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 07:22:54 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id HAA28783 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 07:22:54 GMT Resent-From: owner-freestyle X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from pc0966.software.mitel.com (Administrators@localhost) by homer.tomahawktech.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA00241 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 09:27:03 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1998 09:27:03 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199811241427.JAA00241@homer.tomahawktech.com> From: "Dave Reid" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: RE: [freestyle] flyers Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1998 09:26:44 -0500 Message-ID: <000201be17b6$76225200$c136c786@pc0966.software.mitel.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 In-reply-to: <01BE1717.91103E00.ewulff@jsishipping.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > -----Original Message----- > Uhh.. hehehe I wrote > > >30 contact quiltless.. FLYERS.. Sunday afternoon in the park.. > > You can imagine how cold I was.. I've heard that quiltless flyers are a real crowd pleaser. ;) I've been keeping an unofficial consec record list, just for fun. If anyone else wants to claim the records they think they own, I'll add you to the list and post it back here every couple of months. Push the limits! Dave From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 07:22:55 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id HAA28789 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 07:22:55 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from smtp11.bellglobal.com (smtp11.bellglobal.com [204.101.251.53]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA30563 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 11:15:14 -0800 Received: from sympatico.ca (ppp9943.qc.bellglobal.com [206.172.154.96]) by smtp11.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA11552 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 14:15:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <365B05D6.8B28308E@sympatico.ca> Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1998 14:15:34 -0500 From: S/G Duchesne Reply-To: sg.duchesne@sympatico.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [fr] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle Subject: [freestyle] whirl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all, I want some tip about whirls because I'm not able to do it constantly like my butterflies. Also, I write to say that I've hit my first whirling swirl a week ago and I've just hit my first whirl an hour ago (only on my best side). And I want to say that Rod Lavers are so great. I'm kicking about a year and a half and I've got my first pair of Lavers and I'm doing very great now. I saw my basic move improve a lot and I'm doing some new move since that like tap, ripwalk, parkwalk, stepping butterfly, swirl, whirling swirl, torque. And about the whirls, I want to know where the dex should be done and do you jump to do de dex? shredder from montral (excuse for some english mistake) SÈbastien Duchesne From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 07:23:03 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id HAA28809 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 07:23:03 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from webster.lcc.ctc.edu (lcc.ctc.edu [134.39.132.10]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA01050 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 14:32:45 -0800 Received: from lab2.ctc.edu (134.39.132.47) by webster.lcc.ctc.edu (WORLDMAIL 1.3.166) for freestyle@footbag.org; 24 Nov 1998 14:35:54 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19981124143726.006977f0@lcc.ctc.edu> X-Sender: gehrmanaj@lcc.ctc.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1998 14:37:26 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ahren Gehrman Subject: [freestyle] shults/parodox Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Whut up? Hey. I talked to Kenny Shutls the other day and he said that parodox is just a joke. He said that they made it up to confuse everybody. He said he was sorry though. Torch From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 07:23:14 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id HAA28822 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 07:23:14 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Anthony Glick Received: from Allman144@aol.com by imo18.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id IOHNa17740; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 01:20:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <737ea071.365ba1c7@aol.com> Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 01:20:55 EST To: owner-freestyle-digest@majordomo.footbag.org, freestyle-digest@majordomo.footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Quiltless flyers? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 72 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org First of all...Eric...that is pretty sweet that you hit thirty quiltless flyers. You have my upmost respect. But what is a quitless flyer? Isn't a quiltless combo all five add moves? How do you do a quiltless flyer? I don't know if I am wrong, but I probaby am, so don't raise your voice (type in caps). Sincerely, Anthony Glick From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 07:23:24 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id HAA28837 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 07:23:24 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA26540 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 06:27:26 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id IAA13103 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 08:27:24 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [freestyle] Mirrored?/ pdox whirl record Message-Id: <000000282312994762439@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1998 08:27:19 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 3.0.1 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, Nov 23, 1998, 9:34:35 PM US CST Eli Zohar Piltz wrote: >one. So is blurry whirl a mirror of itself? Hmm... clip op io op io op clip ...Yes. >If so, that means just about any clipper to clipper trick is a mirror: >drifter, pdox whirl, ducking butterfly, barfly, ps whirl, etc. Nope, Nope, Nope, Nope, and Nope. They don't have two matching dexterity elements. But Butterfly/Drifter are a pair, Pdx Whirl/Rev Drifter are a pair, Barfly/Dbl Drifter are a pair; you could make 'mates' to the others as well, but they end up being kinda goofy. I think there's some overlap between mirrored and rewound, but I'm having trouble pinning it down. Being a big fan of rewound, what would the 'rewound' of a paradox mirage be? A toe-set reverse drifter? ______________________________________ Derrick Fogle From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 07:23:26 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id HAA28854 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 07:23:26 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from [204.148.145.11] (d11.focal11.interaccess.com [204.148.145.11]) by postal.interaccess.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA12064; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 08:29:12 -0600 (CST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19981121203305.13001.qmail@hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1998 08:36:33 -0500 To: "Allan Haggett" , freestyle@footbag.org From: "Scott Davidson" Subject: Re: [freestyle] 8 adds? Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Allan & 'stylers! At 12:33 PM -0800 11/21/98, Allan Haggett wrote: >symposium butterfly twirl - 7 adds? Do you get a cross-body add on the >swirl? So - left clipper(no plant while)--front> bail to left osis. (body)dex(x-body)dex(body)x-body(del)? or >(body)dex(dex)body(x-body)del? 6 or 7 kids, you tell me. Do I even >have that terminology right? A swirl bailing to an osis is a twirl, >No? Sorry about the notation. I don't know about the notation, but symp. butterfly twirl seems interesting. I think butterfly twirl would be the first move to conquer though. It would be seven adds with symposium, 6 without... heinous either way. Are you hitting it? See ya! Scott Davidson. Enlightener From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 07:23:26 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id HAA28853 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 07:23:26 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: NikeekiN@aol.com Received: from imo29.mx.aol.com (imo29.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.73]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA01315 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 15:13:34 -0800 Received: from NikeekiN@aol.com by imo29.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.1) id ODOBa25965 for ; Tue, 24 Nov 1998 18:12:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1998 18:12:47 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] What next? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 230 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Whats up footbaggers? I've been shreddin' since july this year. I think I am stuck. What should I try next? Moves i do pretty good. ATW DATW Leg Over Pixie Fairy Mirage Symp Mirage Butterfly Symp Butterfly Osis I have also hit Ripwalk a few times Can anyone give me a few moves to try that would be on my level? Thanks Nick A. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 17:26:51 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA10384 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 17:26:51 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f To: freestyle@majordomo.footbag.org Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 08:19:26 -0700 From: "Vince Bradley" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: off X-Mailer: MailCity Service Subject: [freestyle] Re: Freestyle Digest V1 #523 X-Sender-Ip: 128.8.82.129 Organization: imaginemail (http://www.imaginemail.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org 30 guiltless flyers from I-Man? Anti-Gravity Man! weren't cold when you were done, i betcha. thats pretty hardcore... 'crastinator Free, fast e-mail accessible anytime, anywhere http://www.imaginemail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 17:26:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA10378 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 17:26:37 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f267.hotmail.com [207.82.251.158]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id DAA09400 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 03:44:31 -0800 Received: (qmail 9032 invoked by uid 0); 25 Nov 1998 11:44:09 -0000 Message-ID: <19981125114409.9031.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 141.84.137.143 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 03:44:09 PST X-Originating-IP: [141.84.137.143] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] My web page. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 03:44:09 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi everyone, I¥m compiling a list of move tutorials on my web page at http://members.xoom.com/NemesisDS/index.htm . Most of the write ups are taken from the discussion group archives, and the author is credited except when I¥ve edited the contents. Right now there is only really a token showing, but it will be growing slowly durring the next cupple of weeks. The site its self is still under construction, but I think it turned out pretty darn spiffy for my first attempt to build a web page. I welcome everyones comments. -Andrew ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 17:39:03 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA18898 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 17:39:03 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from camel14.mindspring.com (camel14.mindspring.com [207.69.200.64]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA12806 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 09:10:29 -0800 Received: from smegma (user-38lda3u.dialup.mindspring.com [209.86.168.126]) by camel14.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA07883 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 12:10:27 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19981125120033.007cd860@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: ecrvich@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 12:00:33 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: [freestyle] Triadon? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org What moniker, if any, has been bestowed upon a Paradon with one more dex? Alas, I haven't executed this yet, but plan to someday (if I can fit it into my calendar). Surely others have already done so, yes? toe > op o-i > same o-i > same o-i > op clip Wistfully thinking wishfully, Ernesto -- Ernest "Scratch" Crvich Durham, NC, USA http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Have footbag, will shred From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 18:05:14 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA27500 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 18:05:14 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from camel8.mindspring.com (camel8.mindspring.com [207.69.200.58]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA13069 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 09:32:43 -0800 Received: from smegma (user-38lda3u.dialup.mindspring.com [209.86.168.126]) by camel8.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA15734 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 12:32:32 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19981125122922.007cf1d0@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: ecrvich@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 12:29:22 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] 8 adds? In-Reply-To: References: <19981121203305.13001.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 08:36 AM 11/24/98 -0500, Scott Davidson wrote: >interesting. I think butterfly twirl would be the first move to conquer >though. It would be seven adds with symposium, 6 without... heinous either Where does Butterfly Twirl get its 6th add? I count 5, but maybe I'm missing something. One for the butterfly dex, one for the swirling dex, one for the spin, and two for the xbody catch. toe > op o-i > op f-b > (back)spin > op clip -- Ernest "Scratch" Crvich Durham, NC, USA http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Have footbag, will shred From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 18:05:40 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA27514 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 18:05:40 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from camel8.mindspring.com (camel8.mindspring.com [207.69.200.58]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA13053 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 09:32:28 -0800 Received: from smegma (user-38lda3u.dialup.mindspring.com [209.86.168.126]) by camel8.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA02144 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 12:32:17 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19981125121757.007d1300@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: ecrvich@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 12:17:57 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: RE: [freestyle] consec records In-Reply-To: <000201be17b6$76225200$c136c786@pc0966.software.mitel.com> References: <01BE1717.91103E00.ewulff@jsishipping.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 09:26 AM 11/24/98 -0500, Dave Reid wrote: >I've been keeping an unofficial consec record list, just for fun. If anyone >else wants to claim the records they think they own, I'll add you to the >list and post it back here every couple of months. Will you be tallying consecutive named combos as well, or only single moves? I've hit 3-and-a-half Fiestas, and might consider going for the Bronze if this is noteworthy. It is one of my personal favorites. I'm even toying with the idea of a comic book series about a superhero dubbed "Fiesta Boy", who uses the Paradon/Barrage movements to confuse/hypnotize his enemies (finishing them off with a cold-cock from a pinata stick). -- Ernest "Scratch" Crvich Durham, NC, USA http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Have footbag, will shred From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Wed Nov 25 18:32:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA27653 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 18:32:50 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Matt Cross Received: from imo25.mx.aol.com (imo25.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.69]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA12470; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 08:58:32 -0800 Received: from Problems1@aol.com by imo25.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OUYHa17358; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 11:57:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 11:57:57 EST To: NikeekiN@aol.com, owner-freestyle@footbag.org, freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: [freestyle] Environment Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 79 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I read mail about these guys who've been kicking a for a few months now, and can hit ripwalks! Amazing, i say. I'm only 16, and I've been casually kicking for about 4 years, got serious last year. what is it that makes it possible for these people to get this good this quick, is it environment, natural skill, extreme amounts of practice, or a combination? /\/\/-\~|~|~ Matt Cross From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 26 18:49:11 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA20162 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 18:49:11 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send106.yahoomail.com (send106.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.43]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA14872 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 11:33:13 -0800 Message-ID: <19981125193313.22122.rocketmail@send106.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.193.154] by send106.yahoomail.com; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 11:33:13 PST Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 11:33:13 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Zohar Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] Environment To: Matt Cross , freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Matt, Your question is not easy to answer. I guess it's a combination of what you mentioned, plus some other things. If you have someone really good mentoring you, you will become better faster. A big impact can be your overall awareness of your body. If you sit with yourself (meditate) you can learn to really feel the life force run through your body, which will lead to better coordination, balance, circulation, and so many other positive attributes toward your game. Perhaps these guys you mention have actually been playing for longer than they claim. But my guess is they are trying hard tricks a bit prematurely, they might not have the basic 3s down well. They may be "Jaywalking"- when you kind of scamper over a low set. Or I may be totally wrong, and they are gifted. Remember it's not a race with others, it's a race with oneself. Keep skoolin at your own pace, Eli ---Matt Cross wrote: > > I read mail about these guys who've been kicking a for a few months now, and > can hit ripwalks! Amazing, i say. I'm only 16, and I've been casually > kicking for about 4 years, got serious last year. what is it that makes it > possible for these people to get this good this quick, is it environment, > natural skill, extreme amounts of practice, or a combination? > > /\/\/-\~|~|~ > Matt Cross > _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 26 18:49:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA20174 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 18:49:41 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send101.yahoomail.com (send101.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.87]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA14566 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 11:17:55 -0800 Message-ID: <19981125191700.8154.rocketmail@send101.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.193.154] by send101.yahoomail.com; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 11:17:00 PST Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 11:17:00 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Zohar Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] What next? To: NikeekiN@aol.com, freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Can you do everything EQUALLY on both sides? How about double legover, whirl, pixie butterfly; there are so many tricks that you can start learning now. I'd say it's good to learn blur sets early, just do 10 or so on each side each time you skool. Maybe I started the harder tricks too soon, but I enjoyed seeing difficult tricks like ripwalk/blur/legbeater all develop into the fluid, controlled tricks they are today. So aim high, but certainly keep those basics improving on both sides. That pdox mirage, butterfly, osis drill will be the most important one to master. So try long strings of those in all sorts of combinations. THe better you get w/ those, the sooner you'll move on to BIG tricks. Hope this helps, Eli ---NikeekiN@aol.com wrote: > > Whats up footbaggers? > I've been shreddin' since july this year. > I think I am stuck. What should I try next? > Moves i do pretty good. > ATW DATW Leg Over Pixie Fairy Mirage Symp Mirage Butterfly Symp Butterfly Osis > I have also hit Ripwalk a few times > Can anyone give me a few moves to try that would be on my level? > Thanks > Nick A. > _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 26 18:49:40 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA20169 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 18:49:40 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send106.yahoomail.com (send106.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.43]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA15096 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 11:50:22 -0800 Message-ID: <19981125195021.1113.rocketmail@send106.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.193.154] by send106.yahoomail.com; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 11:50:21 PST Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 11:50:21 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Zohar Piltz Subject: [freestyle] New Year's and Spring Jam To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Folks, Since no New Year's jams have been announced, I'll make a proposition. Anyone want to come shred with the Colorado Posse? By then we'll have five BAPs in CO (Daryl Genzu, Rippin', Shred Red, Me, Dave Highlander Holton), and LOTS of good non-BAPs to draw you folks. So if anyone's within driving distance, I recommend you get your but to Boulder! Just in case you actually like to party, Boulder will have a lot to offer in that category as well. C'mon, New Years is 35 days away!, so you have plenty of time to make plans. Hope to hear from you. You can email me, or call at 303-443-1240. Anyone know how to get in touch with Frank Gutowski???!! Also, we're thinking of hosting a HUGE JAM in February or March- probably a prize $$$ event. We don't want to overlap Scott's event in March so we're leaving the dates open until we hear from him. If you are interested, please tell me. Good time for skiing also. In addition, any footbagger is welcome in Boulder anytime. Come one, come all. Let me hear you! Eli _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 26 18:49:42 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA20180 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 18:49:42 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f From: Owen Parrish Received: from imo23.mx.aol.com (imo23.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.67]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA15624 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 12:27:29 -0800 Received: from SuperOwen@aol.com by imo23.mx.aol.com (IMOv16.10) id OMYYa03138 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 15:26:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 15:26:54 EST To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [freestyle] flyers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 226 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was curious what quiltless was? Is it like tripless, guiltless, and tiltless? Owen "Total Package" Parrish From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 26 18:52:02 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA20228 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 18:52:02 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from icarus.idirect.com (icarus.idirect.com [207.136.80.7]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA19886 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 17:03:15 -0800 Received: from terminus.idirect.com (terminus.idirect.com [207.136.80.70]) by icarus.idirect.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id UAA01808 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 20:03:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from newgrimnet-7.idirect.com (newgrimnet-7.idirect.com [207.136.100.7]) by terminus.idirect.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with SMTP id UAA29608 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 20:03:11 -0500 (EST) Received: by newgrimnet-7.idirect.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BE18AE.678506E0@newgrimnet-7.idirect.com>; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 20:01:35 -0600 Message-ID: <01BE18AE.678506E0@newgrimnet-7.idirect.com> From: Rob Howe To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] Eclipse Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 20:01:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by eniac.yak.net id BAA16399 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Sup, Can someone explain the mechanics and timing of an Eclipse? I saw someone hit it on Rye Shred and tried to copy but alas it didn't work. Do I stall then jump or jump then stall or what? -Rob From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 26 18:52:24 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA20242 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 18:52:24 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA392 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 18:26:12 -0800 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 18:26:40 -0800 Message-ID: <01BE18A1.24DE43E0.ewulff@jsishipping.com> From: Eric Wulff To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] he ain't sorry Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 18:26:38 -0800 Organization: JSI Shipping X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Torch said... >Hey. I talked to Kenny Shutls the other day and he said that parodox is >just a joke. He said that they made it up to confuse everybody. He said >he was sorry though. I say... He he heeeee! He ain't sorry. He's lov'n it! Ironman From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 26 18:52:28 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA20255 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 18:52:28 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from vcn.bc.ca (marigold@opus.vcn.bc.ca [207.102.64.2]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA22482 for ; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 20:48:30 -0800 Received: from localhost by vcn.bc.ca (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id UAA20655; Wed, 25 Nov 1998 20:48:12 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 20:47:52 -0800 (PST) From: Verhoef Anne To: Ernest Crvich cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Triadon? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.19981125120033.007cd860@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Wed, 25 Nov 1998, Ernest Crvich wrote: > > What moniker, if any, has been bestowed upon a Paradon with one moredex? > Alas, I haven't executed this yet, but plan to someday (if I can fit it > into my calendar). Surely others have already done so, yes? > > toe > op o-i > same o-i > same o-i > op clip I was just going to ask that quesion. For me, I think it would be easier to do a barfly with a triple dex. The reason for this is because the leg that does the dex is also the one that sets it. On some of my barflies, I have a lot of spare time at the end of the move (my clipper foot is just waiting for the bag to come down). My biggest concern is that the third dex would be "the". It would be extremely hard to pull without having some rust on the blades. I'll try it tomorrow! See ya, Adrian V. -- marigold@vcn.bc.ca From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 26 18:52:32 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA20268 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 18:52:32 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA28380 for ; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 08:46:53 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id KAA21457; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 10:46:45 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx47-30.ix.netcom.com(198.211.44.222) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma021443; Thu Nov 26 10:46:40 1998 Message-ID: <365D89AE.1E3B@utdallas.edu> Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 11:02:38 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ernest Crvich CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] twirling type of move References: <19981121203305.13001.qmail@hotmail.com> <3.0.6.32.19981125122922.007cf1d0@pop.mindspring.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org This message is for all of you crazies out there that can hit twirl - mainly Scott D. Have you ever hit a swirling dyno? Or even worse, a swirling blender? I've seen Scott do his swirling whirl on Skool Daze (I think), so it seems very possible. Just curious because that would be one mean move. Later. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 26 18:52:37 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA20281 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 18:52:37 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.13]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA28276; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 08:38:28 -0800 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id KAA20807; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 10:38:04 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal-tx47-30.ix.netcom.com(198.211.44.222) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma020789; Thu Nov 26 10:37:53 1998 Message-ID: <365D8794.1E9C@utdallas.edu> Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 10:53:40 -0600 From: Derric Scalf Reply-To: scalf@utdallas.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Matt Cross CC: NikeekiN@aol.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Environment References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Matt Cross wrote: > > I read mail about these guys who've been kicking a for a few months now, and > can hit ripwalks! what is it that makes it > possible for these people to get this good this quick, is it environment, > natural skill, extreme amounts of practice, or a combination? > yes, yes, yes, and yes. You have to be around people that push and encourage you. Also, you need to have the shred tapes to see what is possible. And, you need to go to tournaments to kick with different people. At every tournament, you learn a lot of stuff that you practice on until the next tournament. As far as the natural skill... you can't help but see how quickly Ryan M went from an intermediate level to one of the top shredders - just one year. And, as with anything you do, the more you practice the better you'll be. Starting out young isn't a bad thing either. Later. -D From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Thu Nov 26 18:52:50 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA20299 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 18:52:50 GMT Resent-From: owner-freestyle X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from homer.tomahawktech.com ([206.191.48.232]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA28342 for ; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 08:44:01 -0800 Received: from pc0966.software.mitel.com (Administrators@localhost) by homer.tomahawktech.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA00079 for ; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 11:45:52 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 11:45:51 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199811261645.LAA00079@homer.tomahawktech.com> From: "Dave Reid" To: Subject: RE: [freestyle] Environment Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 11:45:37 -0500 Message-ID: <000301be195c$320f4620$c136c786@pc0966.software.mitel.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > -----Original Message----- > I read mail about these guys who've been kicking a for a few > months now, and > can hit ripwalks! Amazing, i say. I'm only 16, and I've been casually > kicking for about 4 years, got serious last year. what is it > that makes it > possible for these people to get this good this quick, is it environment, > natural skill, extreme amounts of practice, or a combination? Don't worry, you weren't the only one shocked by this. I've been kicking off and on for probably 5 years, but only really discovered this year that there were cool tricks I could do. I practice a few times (well sometimes only once) a week and I can consistently only do mirage (in or out, both feet), legover, clipper (left foot is bad), ATW. I spend most of my practice time trying to string these moves together and get better at them (especially left foot clipper :( ). I am really amazed at someone that can do double ATW, ripwalk, and various pixie/fairy/symposium moves in that short a time. I think the answer is VERY extreme amounts of practice and probably some competitive friends. The point I'm really trying to make is that you shouldn't really worry about the progress other people make. Just try to be better than you were last month, and you will always be happy. Dave From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 27 07:44:03 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id HAA12733 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 27 Nov 1998 07:44:03 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f62.hotmail.com [207.82.251.196]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA03300 for ; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 19:54:44 -0800 Received: (qmail 26337 invoked by uid 0); 27 Nov 1998 03:54:13 -0000 Message-ID: <19981127035413.26336.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 142.104.1.165 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 19:54:13 PST X-Originating-IP: [142.104.1.165] From: "Allan Haggett" To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 19:54:13 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org O.K., 7 adds w/ symposium, but ya didn't answer my question! Is the twirl, a swirl bailing to op. osis a twirl? Upon further investigation on the moves list it would appear to be called a reverse blender. Could you give me the notation on a twirl please. Allan H. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 27 07:44:29 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id HAA12746 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 27 Nov 1998 07:44:29 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f267.hotmail.com [207.82.251.158]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA04088 for ; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 22:15:00 -0800 Received: (qmail 2372 invoked by uid 0); 27 Nov 1998 06:14:29 -0000 Message-ID: <19981127061429.2371.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 209.138.0.229 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 26 Nov 1998 22:14:28 PST X-Originating-IP: [209.138.0.229] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] a bit of everything MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 22:14:28 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Happy Thanksgiving everyone! It's good to be back home where I can eat buttered baked yams and watch my beloved footbag videos. My internet connection here is really slow, so rather than write responses to various posts, I'll put everything here. Somebody mentioned Scott D hitting swirling whirl. I've heard that Rippin' Rick Reese has hit swirling whirling swirl. Is this just a rumor? Ahren Gehrmann said that Kenny Shults made up the pdx concept to confuse people. That's simultaneously the funniest and meanest thing I've ever heard. Since I've got the opportunity to watch my footbag videos again, a couple comments. First, as Eli Piltz pointed out, the 13th pdx whirl in Paul Munger's 17 pdx whirl record looks fluffy, if not maybe tha. Also, a while ago i posted that I thought Kenny Shults hit blurry twirl on Raw Shred, and people quickly pointed out that it was a blistering whirl. After watching it, I know why i thought it was a blurry twirl, it's because the dex on the gyro whirl is so fast, and he delays with the opposite clipper, so I thought that part was a twirl. But as Sunil Jani pointed out to me, a blurry twirl would occur in front of the body, not behind. I've been kicking since June 28th of 97, and I can hit blurriest and ps whirl, and am guiltless now. Somebody asked how some people progressed so fast, and I just have to tell them that kicking with Josh "BMP" Penney is the way to do it. Under his overflowing encouragement, even the worst kickers are sure to flourish. Thanks Josh. Butterfly twirl is 5 adds by my count. And speaking of add counts, I have a problem with the add values of da da curve and symposium blur. Da da curve may be easier than every five add move, most fours, and the occasional three, but it should receive five adds. Adds aren't difficulty related, they just tell you what elements are included in a move. Da da curve has two dexes, a delay, a xbd, and a symposium add. As for symposium blur, the blurry variety deserves the 5 adds it gets, but the jumping one should be four. Face it, the move has no pdx element whatsoever. Voodoo deserves its pdx add, but not the jumping symp blur. That's about all I can think of for now. I wish you all a happy thanksgiving, I for one am very glad to have been introduced to a passtime which is so social, healthy, challenging, and most of all fun. Ken "ceiling fan" Somolinos nyfD ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 27 17:52:59 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id RAA19080 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 27 Nov 1998 17:52:59 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (hejira.hunter.cuny.edu [146.95.128.97]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA08554 for ; Fri, 27 Nov 1998 08:27:59 -0800 Received: from sara (nyc-ny64-49.ix.netcom.com [209.109.224.177]) by hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id LAA22100 for ; Fri, 27 Nov 1998 11:35:15 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19981127112618.0082bc70@hejira.hunter.cuny.edu> X-Sender: jpenney@hejira.hunter.cuny.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 27 Nov 1998 11:26:18 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Deliciously Saucy Josh Penney Subject: Re: [freestyle] a bit of everything In-Reply-To: <19981127061429.2371.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org A guy who *was* my friend once said: >Somebody asked how some people progressed >so fast, and I just have to tell them that kicking with Josh "BMP" >Penney is the way to do it. Under his overflowing encouragement, even >the worst kickers are sure to flourish. Thanks Josh. Thanks a *lot* dude. Now everyone and their mom is gonna come to the square to make me feel bad about the way I play. Well, let me give some warning- don't. Ken's kidding, I'm really overweight, lazy and obnoxious. I have to go skool my right toe stall now, but he got where he is by skooling until his lavers literally fell off- then he superglued them back on and kept playing. Or was that SRV? >Da da curve has two dexes, a delay, a >xbd, and a symposium add. What, no body add? there isn't jumping/spinning/twisting involved? Jumpin' Jesus on a pogo stick- it's a flying ripwalk. Unless it were so obvious that you've done a miraging, symposium butterfly. Maybe there shoiuld be some kind of rule that prohibits the adding of adds where adds need not be added. Unfortunately, Ken is somewhat correct- If one were to perform dada but sneak the 2nd leg around in the other direction - presto - blurry paradox symposium whirl. >As for symposium blur, the blurry variety >deserves the 5 adds it gets, but the jumping one should be four. Face >it, the move has no pdx element whatsoever. Voodoo deserves its pdx >add, but not the jumping symp blur. And this is easier than your dada curve? If you're trying to illustrate the add system's shortcomings, your ship arrived too late to save the drowning witch. The point to working within the system is to make fundamental agreements. So jump on the bandwagon, invent a new system already, form your own mailing list and stop the harping. If you're not part of the solution, you're fuel for comedy. Would someone please provide some? From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 27 18:05:44 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id SAA27565 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 27 Nov 1998 18:05:44 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from send101.yahoomail.com (send101.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.87]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA09259 for ; Fri, 27 Nov 1998 09:41:05 -0800 Message-ID: <19981127174009.28090.rocketmail@send101.yahoomail.com> Received: from [208.254.191.92] by send101.yahoomail.com; Fri, 27 Nov 1998 09:40:09 PST Date: Fri, 27 Nov 1998 09:40:09 -0800 (PST) From: Eli Zohar Piltz Subject: Re: [freestyle] a bit of everything To: KeN Somolinos , freestyle@footbag.org, Derric Scalf MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey you all, ---KeN Somolinos wrote: > Somebody mentioned Scott D hitting swirling whirl. I've heard that > Rippin' Rick Reese has hit swirling whirling swirl. Is this just a > rumor? Not a rumor. For a little clarification, Scott hits 'reverse swirling symposium whirl', and no offense, Scotty, but one or two on the video were tha on the whirl; the others clean though. Rippin' hit 'swirling symposium whirling swirl'!!!- a mere 6 add, symposium, triple dex move- OUCH! And about what Derric wrote about swirling/twirling blender: Ever heard of 'burly swirl'? It's another Rippin' trick- swirling blender- hella wicked! Anyone else hit 'burly swirl'? Later, Eli Monster _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Fri Nov 27 19:14:40 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id TAA11861 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 27 Nov 1998 19:14:40 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (hejira.hunter.cuny.edu [146.95.128.97]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA09715 for ; Fri, 27 Nov 1998 10:33:30 -0800 Received: from sara (nyc-ny67-39.ix.netcom.com [209.109.225.167]) by hejira.hunter.cuny.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id NAA23266 for ; Fri, 27 Nov 1998 13:40:45 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19981127133156.0082d3f0@hejira.hunter.cuny.edu> X-Sender: jpenney@hejira.hunter.cuny.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 27 Nov 1998 13:31:56 -0500 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Deliciously Saucy Josh Penney Subject: [freestyle] Re: twirl problem In-Reply-To: <19981127035413.26336.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 07:54 PM 11/26/98 PST, you wrote: ?Is the twirl, a swirl bailing to op. osis a twirl? Yes. ?Upon further investigation ?on the moves list it would appear to be called a reverse blender. No. a reverse blender is a swirling osis- the swirl and osis are performed on the same foot. Twirl bails to the other. ?Could you give me the notation on a twirl please. Sorry Allan. I only speak Jive. Cutty said slip lay the bone rebound sucka said what I said I was gonna say I was sayin- bail osis. I hope this clears things up. JP From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 29 02:32:13 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id CAA14703 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 29 Nov 1998 02:32:13 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from ra.nilenet.com (root@ra.nilenet.com [204.227.31.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA23990 for ; Sat, 28 Nov 1998 16:17:32 -0800 Received: from unknown (slip23.den.nilenet.net [206.247.98.23]) by ra.nilenet.com (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) with SMTP id RAA15729 for ; Sat, 28 Nov 1998 17:15:12 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: Priority: Normal X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Daryl Genz" Subject: Fw: [freestyle] consecutive records Date: Sat, 28 Nov 98 17:45:35 PST Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; X-MAPIextension=".TXT" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by eniac.yak.net id AAA21883 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org As far as I know, I hold the following records: Lets talk way cool now, TWO ADD moves, Juggiling (switching approx every 25 catches): 182 Three Add, Juggling (3 bags): 19 catches Double Around the World: 16 (Rippin has not hit 18) Tarrage: 6 (maybe 8?, barefoot) Four Add, My current Ripwalk record is on Raw Shred (though I'm sure there's probably three or four people who could beat that now (incluiding myself)). Five Add, Paradox Torque: 3 Paradox Legbeater: 5 > > > -----Original Message----- > > > On Thu, 12 Nov 1998 03:19:46 Derric Scalf wrote: > > > >What are the records for these moves? > > > > I remember the discussion from earlier this year fondly. > > > > These are the results that were posted at that time. I think Scott D. was > > mentioning hitting 5 Blurry Whirls a couple of months back though. > > > > Barflies: 9 (Hu-mungis) > > Paradox Drifters: ? (It's in the 5-10 region by Hu-mungis) > > Ripwalks: 23 (Genzu) > > Blenders: 7 (Rippin) > > Blurry Whirls: 3 (Torch) (5 by Scott D. ?) > > Paradox Whirls: 17 (Hu-mungis) > > Drifters: 34 (Hu-mungis) > > Whirls: 39 (Regulator) > > Paradox Symposium Whirls: 3 (Rippin) > > Paradox Blenders: 3 (Hu-mungis) > > Osis: 186 (Kosmo) > > Double ATW: 18 (Rippin) > > Double Switchovers: 5 (Damian!) > > > > > > Dave > > > > PS. I came *this close* (finger and thumb held up) to hitting a double > > legover last night! Peter Irish, lookout! :) > > > From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 29 02:32:12 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id CAA14697 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 29 Nov 1998 02:32:12 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from ra.nilenet.com (root@ra.nilenet.com [204.227.31.1]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA23811 for ; Sat, 28 Nov 1998 15:50:24 -0800 Received: from unknown (slip23.den.nilenet.net [206.247.98.23]) by ra.nilenet.com (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) with SMTP id QAA14914 for ; Sat, 28 Nov 1998 16:48:02 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <365D8685.5148DDFA@nilenet.com> References: Conversation <365D8685.5148DDFA@nilenet.com> with last message <365D8685.5148DDFA@nilenet.com> Priority: Normal X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Daryl Genz" Subject: [freestyle] '98 Heart of Vegas Jam Date: Sat, 28 Nov 98 17:17:52 PST Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; X-MAPIextension=".TXT" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by eniac.yak.net id AAA13409 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello Fellow Shredders, This is the official announcement for ... The 1998 Heart of Vegas Freestyle Jam - February 19, 20, 21 (Fri, Sat., Sun.) - Las Vegas, Nevada - Exact Jam location TBA, but get your plane ticket(s) TODAY! - Host hotel will be (next to?) the Jam location. - No competition - No prize money - TONS OF SHREDDING!!!!! - ALL freestyle (and net? (at least any net players interested enough in freestly to subscribe to the freestyle list)) players and all ability levels welcome - Come shred with some of the top players: Planning on attending so far: Rippin' Rick Reese Richard Abshire Eli Piltz David Holton Eric Windsor Cameron (Kennedy ?) Jonathan Schneider? Myself (Daryl Genz) And ... YOU. - (Did I mention TONS OF SHREDDING?) You've got no excuses now. We (the organizers) intend to make this event THE main non-competive event of the year (if not at least the season). With the tradgic loss of the Heart of Freestyle Tournament, one of the best freestyle oriented tournaments, there are very few opportunituies to get out and shred with different (ie, not hometown) players this time of the year. The date has been pushed foreward from last year (held at New Year's) in order to avoid the high costs associated with holiday travel (so you can't use that one for an excuse). Plan on arriving relatively early Friday evening, because we definitly won't be waiting until Saturday to kick. (Some players may even be arriving Thrusday night?). Then plan on getting up bright and early (2-3pm) (That's pretty early for freestylers) for the Saturday and Sunday Shred Sessions (SSSS). Let me stress one last time that the time to get your plane tickets is NOW! Dont't wait! The exact jam loacation has yet to be determined, though the Stratosphere worked out pretty well last year, and we may choose to use the same hotel again. Note that there is also a nice (and much less expensive) hotel directly across the street from the Stratosphere. I will post more information as soon as it becomes available. Please let me know if you are planning on attending (so I can use it to entice yet more people into shredding w/us). Hope to see you there, Genzu From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Sun Nov 29 06:04:41 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id GAA16798 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 29 Nov 1998 06:04:41 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from mail1.doit.wisc.edu (mail1.doit.wisc.edu [144.92.9.40]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA24978; Sat, 28 Nov 1998 19:09:50 -0800 Received: from [144.92.209.209] by mail1.doit.wisc.edu id VAA44510 (8.8.6/50); Sat, 28 Nov 1998 21:09:37 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19981128210815.006b8c78@students.wisc.edu> X-Sender: mklewand@students.wisc.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Sat, 28 Nov 1998 21:08:15 -0600 To: "Daryl Genz" , freestyle@footbag.org From: Matthew Kain Lewandowski Subject: Re: Fw: [freestyle] consecutive records In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org tarrage? Huh? Sorry JP, but what is this one? Matthew Kain At 05:45 PM 11/28/98 PST, Daryl Genz wrote: > >As far as I know, I hold the following records: > >Lets talk way cool now, TWO ADD moves, >Juggiling (switching approx every 25 catches): 182 > >Three Add, >Juggling (3 bags): 19 catches >Double Around the World: 16 (Rippin has not hit 18) >Tarrage: 6 (maybe 8?, barefoot) > >Four Add, >My current Ripwalk record is on Raw Shred (though I'm sure there's probably >three or four people who could beat that now (incluiding myself)). > >Five Add, >Paradox Torque: 3 >Paradox Legbeater: 5 > > >> > > -----Original Message----- >> > > On Thu, 12 Nov 1998 03:19:46 Derric Scalf wrote: >> > > >What are the records for these moves? >> > >> > I remember the discussion from earlier this year fondly. >> > >> > These are the results that were posted at that time. I think Scott D. was >> > mentioning hitting 5 Blurry Whirls a couple of months back though. >> > >> > Barflies: 9 (Hu-mungis) >> > Paradox Drifters: ? (It's in the 5-10 region by Hu-mungis) >> > Ripwalks: 23 (Genzu) >> > Blenders: 7 (Rippin) >> > Blurry Whirls: 3 (Torch) (5 by Scott D. ?) >> > Paradox Whirls: 17 (Hu-mungis) >> > Drifters: 34 (Hu-mungis) >> > Whirls: 39 (Regulator) >> > Paradox Symposium Whirls: 3 (Rippin) >> > Paradox Blenders: 3 (Hu-mungis) >> > Osis: 186 (Kosmo) >> > Double ATW: 18 (Rippin) >> > Double Switchovers: 5 (Damian!) >> > >> > >> > Dave >> > >> > PS. I came *this close* (finger and thumb held up) to hitting a double >> > legover last night! Peter Irish, lookout! :) >> > >> > From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 30 01:22:32 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id BAA12587 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 30 Nov 1998 01:22:32 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) with ESMTP id BAA12583 for ; Mon, 30 Nov 1998 01:22:31 GMT Received: from hotmail.com (f175.hotmail.com [207.82.251.61]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA03353 for ; Sun, 29 Nov 1998 17:01:41 -0800 Received: (qmail 12494 invoked by uid 0); 30 Nov 1998 01:01:11 -0000 Message-ID: <19981130010111.12493.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 152.163.207.63 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 29 Nov 1998 17:01:10 PST X-Originating-IP: [152.163.207.63] From: "Ethan Klein" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] East Coast Holiday Jimmy Jam! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 29 Nov 1998 17:01:10 PST Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Footbag heads! Just starting to get back in the freestyle groove after a 3 month SE Asian hiatus. The addiction has sucked me back down - domineering my personal spectrum of priorities once again. The break has catalyzed a fresher, more resolute pursuit of "'dem Nasty-ass" combos and moves. Symposium blender?? almost hit it today - will skool it again tomorrow. Anyway.... The point of this post is in regard to the East Coast Holiday Jimmy-Jam. Vince and Neil and D.C. posse - has the post-office pavilion been procured? Can it be? Because... if need be we could relocate the jam to the Philadelphia (Phly-adelphia) area. The saturday and Sunday after X-mas are the 26th and 27th. I realize that Peter I's attendence is probably dependent on a D.C.-area local, but... It would be sweet to have a confirmed time and place for the jam. NYFD, Brown heads, D.C. crew, Philly boyz, Steve G., S-nil, - give me feedback and we'll get it goin ON!!!!!! I (Ethan) can be reached at ethan_klein@hotmail.com or here at philgogolf@aol.com Peace - Ethan Played Takraw all over South East Asia - shredding could take off over there. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 30 19:37:20 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id TAA00627 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 30 Nov 1998 19:37:20 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) with ESMTP id TAA00623 for ; Mon, 30 Nov 1998 19:37:18 GMT Received: from mcfeely.interaccess.com (mcfeely.interaccess.com [207.70.126.131]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA14016 for ; Mon, 30 Nov 1998 11:16:36 -0800 Received: from [204.148.145.152] (d152.focal11.interaccess.com [204.148.145.152]) by mcfeely.interaccess.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id NAA02446; Mon, 30 Nov 1998 13:16:16 -0600 (CST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19981127035413.26336.qmail@hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 30 Nov 1998 13:24:02 -0500 To: "Allan Haggett" , freestyle@footbag.org From: "Enlightener (Scott Davidson)" Subject: [freestyle] Re: Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Allan! At 7:54 PM -0800 11/26/98, Allan Haggett wrote: >but ya didn't answer my question! Is the >twirl, a swirl bailing to op. osis a twirl? Yep. >Upon further investigation >on the moves list it would appear to be called a reverse blender. Could >you give me the notation on a twirl please. Notation doesn't allow for the description of dexterities that go up-down, front-back... just i-o, so I can't do it. my best guess would be clip > same f-b u-d > op osis or clipper set > same foot front-back up-down > op osis Good luck. See ya! Scott. From owner-freestyle@eniac.yak.net Mon Nov 30 20:14:19 1998 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) id UAA09154 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 30 Nov 1998 20:14:19 GMT X-Authentication-Warning: eniac.yak.net: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle using -f Received: from Market.NET (Market.NET [140.174.206.2]) by eniac.yak.net (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) with ESMTP id UAA09150 for ; Mon, 30 Nov 1998 20:14:17 GMT Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA14634 for ; Mon, 30 Nov 1998 11:53:33 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id NAA05897 for ; Mon, 30 Nov 1998 13:53:28 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: Message-Id: <000000306392995300401@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Mon, 30 Nov 1998 13:53:21 -0600 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 3.0.1 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, Nov 30, 1998, 12:24:02 PM US CST Enlightener (Scott Davidson) wrote: >clipper set > same foot front-back up-down > op osis I think the "f-b" designation should be enough to fully describe the move. Consider the fact that the bag starts out on top of your foot (gravity works that way): the dexterity is necessarily going to happen going over the bag. The only question is whether the dexterity is done front-to-back (f-b) like the twirl, or back-to-front (b-f) like a 'normal' swirl. PS: Thanks everyone for using the i-o and f-b notation modifications. It certainly has helped me. ______________________________________ Derrick Fogle