From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 01:28:08 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA06036 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 01:28:08 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com (imo17.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.7]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA14413 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 17:44:09 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo17.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zCZSa25313 (4158) for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 20:41:56 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 20:41:40 EDT Subject: [freestyle] Back to business. Move help To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey guys, My toe is feeling alot better. Good enough to freestyle. Today I got the chance to freestyle since my toe wasn't hurting so much. I did my shredding in tevas and found out awesome they are..Anyways, the reason why i posted is cause I hit a move and have some quesion on it. I believe it is a pixie ducking mirage:toe>same in[dex]>duck(i'm not sure if i'm ducking or diving)>op in[dex]>op toe[del]. Eg: I set from a right toe, pixie it then bring my head from the left to the right going under bag on its way up, then as the bag makes in descent, i swing me head back to the left over it and execute a right mirage. I'm not sure if this move is diving or ducking. Either way, how many adds would it be and is there a cool name for it? Thanks, Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 01:31:53 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA06051 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 01:31:53 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.rdc1.md.home.com (imail@ha1.rdc1.md.home.com [24.2.2.66]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA11091 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 16:30:39 -0700 Received: from CJ264376A ([24.10.226.187]) by mail.rdc1.md.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <19990930233034.PAIZ29344.mail.rdc1.md.home.com@CJ264376A> for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 16:30:34 -0700 Message-ID: <000801bf0b9c$83b45320$bbe20a18@alex1.va.home.com> From: "Jim McCoppin" To: Subject: [freestyle] TRIPLE Around the World?!?!? Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 19:35:43 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by list.footbag.org id BAB06051 I know Tuan hit that (with no shoes) and i think rippin hit it as well.... Jim McCoppin From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 01:31:55 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA06059 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 01:31:55 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from homer.tomahawktech.com ([206.191.48.232]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA13717 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 17:22:40 -0700 Received: from dave (Administrators@localhost) by homer.tomahawktech.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA00278 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 20:23:37 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Message-ID: <003301bf0ba3$6233cd00$60fdfea9@dave> From: "Dave Reid" To: Subject: Re: [freestyle] Video Move Clips Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 20:24:17 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org -----Original Message----- >> When the move list underwent a major overhaul last year, >>there were 15 video clips added for demonstration purposes. I also >>remeber somebody saying that there were another 30 or so but that >>they took too long to edit and they would be posted later. > >Somebody? > >Who could it be? :-) I think his initials are SG. Just like you, Steve! >>Is there some technical hurdle which needs to be overcome? > >Time. Einstein would be in full agreement with you that time is simply a technical hurdle. If you were moving at speeds near the speed of light, I wonder how many dexterities you could squeeze into one move? Would your feet and body be going around the bag, or would the bag be going around you? >P.S. Get ready.. Get set.. Man I hate hype! I have been checking footbag.org every day since you posted that! ...must... ...take... ...downers... Dave From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 03:25:05 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA06223 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 03:25:05 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo29.mx.aol.com (imo29.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.73]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA16333 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 18:26:58 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo29.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zDCEa24736 (4116) for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 21:26:25 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4f328136.252567c1@aol.com> Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 21:26:25 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] TRIPLE Around the World?!?!? To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I myself can get extremely close to hitting this move...so I know its possible Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 03:51:30 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA06367 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 03:51:30 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Aaron de Glanville Received: from smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (smtp10.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.200.246]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA19035 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 19:57:39 -0700 Received: from aaron (user-33qtg7u.dialup.mindspring.com [199.174.192.254]) by smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA17635 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 21:28:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990930182724.006ffe2c@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: aadegl@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 18:27:24 -0700 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] move names (stupid and otherwise) In-Reply-To: <37EAD8E1.6E076525@dallasfootbag.org> References: <19990924004752.64288.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Yo~ I'm hours away from hitting this, and fervently hoping that it hasn't been done (if you haven't yet, John S, give me at least a 24-hour head start =) ): inside>back-to-frontdex>same swirl Kind of a pixieswirl--two dexes with one leg--but done from an inside as if "swirling" in front of the body before doing the cross-body swirl, parallel. I call it the "Amber Wolles". ;) Or maybe "slinky"? (two coils) In this case, of course, adding a twirl to the end (inside>back-to-front>same rvs swirl>op osis) would make it a "twinkie". So maybe I'd better keep thinking. Any thoughts? Props to the rampant heinousness of recent gloats, aa From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 03:52:31 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA06377 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 03:52:31 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Aaron de Glanville Received: from smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (smtp10.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.200.246]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA19038 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 19:57:40 -0700 Received: from aaron (user-33qtg7u.dialup.mindspring.com [199.174.192.254]) by smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA17414 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 21:28:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990930180412.00756f98@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: aadegl@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 18:04:12 -0700 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Revolution In-Reply-To: <199909290228.UAA01797@ucsub.Colorado.EDU> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > apparently, the >name he had intended for the move is SPIKE HAMMER. >... now, personally, i prefer SPY CAMERA, but i know >that Dave doesn't, and although I think it would be funny if despite >his wishes, that move went down in footbag history as spy camera ... LOL!! =D Greetings, freestyle family~ Just wanted to post a quick review/endorsement of Revolution shred bags. Thanks to Derric's post a while back, my interest was piqued, and I contacted Paul "Sandman" Mestas, a super-friendly and enthusiastic dude (not to mention excellent salesman) who gave me a fantastic deal on 3 beautiful bags (20, 30, and 40 panels). Now, while I've still yet to kick with a bag to surpass the 'Carol' (or the "Wede Sack" [sorry Carol ;) ] ), the Revolution was a stoke, arriving in broken-in-brand-new condition, and promising excellent durability and sand retention. The bags were a little on the large and loose side for me, but Paul was quick to offer custom designing options. Extra props for the gorgeous 30-panel "Sandstar", one of the most artistic panelling designs I've seen since the "Twisted". All in all, a must for anyone whose freestyle game meets the occasional strong breeze... His # again is (303) 487-0326 or pager (303) 540-2614 Thanks again Paul! And now back to our regularly scheduled listserv... =) aa (Aaron de Glanville "uncut" -- SF) From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 03:52:34 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA06387 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 03:52:34 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web803.mail.yahoo.com (web803.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.63]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA19078 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 19:59:21 -0700 Message-ID: <19991001030018.27619.rocketmail@web803.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.248.158.123] by web803.mail.yahoo.com; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 20:00:18 PDT Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 20:00:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Jamez Risden Subject: [freestyle] The adds system To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Once upon a time I was just mindin' my own buisiness, thinking about shreddin,(as usual...just ask adam mrosko)when suddenly i thought.......why not ditch the cross-body add? That would make the adds system soooo much more accurate in jugding the difficulty of a trick. Think about it. Wouldent you say that an egg beater and ripwalk are about the same in difficulty? Now they would have the same add value. How bout' mirage vs. butterfly? They would also have the same add value. The only weakspot i can find in this idea is the legbeater. That move would only get three adds,but the adds would be worth more(kinda like deflation-with money) I really cant see why this wouldent work but im just a 17 year old punk rookie that doesent know sh*t. OH OH YEAH! I can almost hit hop over swirls now. Tomorrows gonna be my day so expect to hear from me again soon. Think about what i said about the lame ass cross-body add and responed to it. I want to hear what all you top notch pros think about it. Later, Jamez Risden ===== From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 04:14:52 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA06652 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 04:14:52 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from admin.cgocable.net (admin.cgocable.net [24.226.1.21]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA20065 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 20:27:06 -0700 Received: from [24.226.9.44] (cgowave-9-44.cgocable.net [24.226.9.44]) by admin.cgocable.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA03267 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 23:27:15 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199910010327.XAA03267@admin.cgocable.net> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express for Macintosh - 4.01 (295) Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 23:38:56 -0400 Subject: Re: [freestyle] move names (stupid and otherwise) From: "Neil Bearse" To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >I call it the "Amber Wolles". ;) Now youre catchin on! :) All of you just have to promise to invite me to your weddings when my lines get you a good catch... :P is it possible to get some pics of these handmade bags online? These Revolutions sound PHAT to me.... Adios Neil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 04:36:22 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA06719 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 04:36:22 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo22.mx.aol.com (imo22.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.66]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA20817 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 20:40:32 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zKAKa19901 (4461) for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 23:39:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 23:39:58 EDT Subject: [freestyle] competition anxiety To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey guys, As most of you'll know, Tx States is coming up right around the corner. I've made the decision to compete under the novice category. I've been kikcing since this summer and can hit some good stuff consistantly like smears, eggmixers(pixie legovers), double ATW, double leg-overs, and all the basics...EXCEPT CLIPPERS. I can hit em on the right side like 3 out of 5 tries and hit clipper set moves like mirage, buttfly and paradox mirage but none of this weakside. Should I be preparing a routine or should I be trying to get that strong side clipper down solid, OR concentrate mainly on the weakside. I'm in a state of confusion mainly because I have no clue about the criteria expected in novice competitions. Any help would be appreciated. P.S. I hit some new moves last week while teaching my cousin the basics. These include:hop-over swirl, ducking mirage/butterfly/gimpy ATW, weakside double overdown and atomsmasher(this move was only hit once out of total luck) Another thing to add...my cousin..dude is this guy learning fast!!! After several months, he mastered weakside ATW, legover, mirage, stomping mirage, and it took him only one day to learn how to hit eggmixer and symposium mirage! He'll be coming with me to Tx States. Thanks again..sorry about this long ass boring message. Thanks Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 05:50:14 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA06868 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 05:50:14 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Matthew Cross Received: from imo13.mx.aol.com (imo13.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA23916 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:05:11 -0700 Received: from MatthewL329@aol.com by imo13.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zEGSa15800 (3943) for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 21:30:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <52cb6857.252568a8@aol.com> Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 21:30:16 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] TRIPLE Around the World?!?!? To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL for Macintosh sub 56 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I met a guy at woodstock who told me he hit it once, but he had to jump to do it, and it was accidental. I realize the possibility of him lying is immense here, no need to point it out. I just thought it might contribute. Matthew Cross From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 06:21:08 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA06952 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 06:21:08 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-1.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.119]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA24710 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:28:44 -0700 Received: from postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.91]) by mailsorter-105-1.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with ESMTP id WAA03532; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:28:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from production@localhost) by postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/po.gso.24Feb98) id WAA04480; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:28:43 -0700 (PDT) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhUAsHQmmGrNrRHElT+Nq7JsyCu86fkCFDzgZPQgY6e5su0W6Vu+Yu64JncA From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 01:28:43 -0400 (EDT) To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Jaywalk Message-ID: <28336-37F4468B-5975@postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net> Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey everybody! So.... a few days back Steve was too nice to say who Jaywalk is named after. But, since he was my partner for 9 years, and one of the best team freestylers ever, I CAN say: Jaywalk == Jay Modenhauer Take care, GF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 06:28:10 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA06993 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 06:28:10 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.118]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA25193 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:42:45 -0700 Received: from postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.91]) by mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with ESMTP id WAA22010; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:42:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from production@localhost) by postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/po.gso.24Feb98) id WAA05147; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:42:45 -0700 (PDT) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQQjxQE8Nqz86/TXkjY3A6xdzYCdgIUPvW4S4lODkyFbCeHzzrp71JWXCc= From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 01:42:45 -0400 (EDT) To: sunilj@dept.english.upenn.edu (Sunil Jani) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] PUSHING THE ENVELOPE... Message-ID: <28330-37F449D5-10927@postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: Sunil Jani 's message of Wed, 29 Sep 1999 18:32:17 -0400 (EDT) Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Good stuff, Tsunami. Let's hear some more! Anybody else? Greg From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 06:29:22 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA07015 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 06:29:22 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA25213 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:44:12 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991001054408.BXCJ17351.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:44:08 -0700 Message-ID: <37F44D06.89262B92@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 00:56:22 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Windsen Pan CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] competition anxiety References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Windsen Pan wrote: > > Hey guys, > As most of you'll know, Tx States is coming up right around the corner. > I've made the decision to compete under the novice category. I've been > kikcing since this summer and can hit some good stuff consistantly like > smears, eggmixers(pixie legovers), double ATW, double leg-overs, and all the > basics...EXCEPT CLIPPERS. I can hit em on the right side like 3 out of 5 > tries and hit clipper set moves like mirage, buttfly and paradox mirage but > none of this weakside. Should I be preparing a routine or should I be trying > to get that strong side clipper down solid, OR concentrate mainly on the > weakside. I'm in a state of confusion mainly because I have no clue about the > criteria expected in novice competitions. Any help would be appreciated. > In a routine, it is important to remember that you aren't shredding. You are performing. With that said, the main thing to remember is to keep the bag off of the ground. Big tricks are cool, but drops are bad. Stick with what you know and try to make it look good. By the way, go intermediate. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 06:52:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA07134 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 06:52:38 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA25245 for ; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:45:57 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991001054556.BXKC17351.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Thu, 30 Sep 1999 22:45:56 -0700 Message-ID: <37F44D73.F9FB03D8@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 00:58:11 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Neil Bearse" CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] move names (stupid and otherwise) References: <199910010327.XAA03267@admin.cgocable.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org "Neil Bearse" wrote > is it possible to get some pics of these handmade bags online? These > Revolutions sound PHAT to me.... Yep. You can buy most footbags from http://www.worldfootbag.com There are pictures. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 08:27:16 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA07232 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 08:27:16 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from Market.NET (market.net [140.174.206.2]) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA07229 for ; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 08:27:15 -0700 Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA02040 for ; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 00:44:15 -0700 Received: from [205.180.137.119] (dhcp-205-180-137-119.atext.com [205.180.137.119]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA22183 for ; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 00:43:42 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199909302130.RAA52676@m56-129-30.mit.edu> References: <199909302130.RAA52676@m56-129-30.mit.edu> Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 00:43:51 -0700 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Video Move Clips Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 5:30 PM -0400 9/30/99, Samuel Andrew Hires wrote: >Will they [more freestyle move list video clips] ever be posted? You know, this brings up a some stuff I've wanted to raise with the general list for a while... I truly love being able to contribute the insane amounts of time, money, and service I give to the website and the sport. (The website alone costs me literally $100 a month out of my pocket, and that's a conservative estimate, and beside the point. :-)) I want others to feel that it's okay to contribute, too. I know some people do, but most of you guys just kick back and talk--and sometimes even complain (not that your last post was a compalint, but I get my fair share of complaints *every day* via my website and webmaster e-mail address). I mean, who's to say I am the only person who can film BAP players hitting moves, scan them into a computer, edit the video down for the online move list, make thumbnails of them, and upload them? It's a very time-consuming task (about 30 minutes of work per clip, all told), and on top of all the other time-consuming tasks I don't have time for, it's kind of insane. (So if you think about it, the 15 clips I already uploaded took me a total of 7-8 hours.) By the same token, I don't usually have time to service 20 players writing me and asking what format and what the requirements are, and to juggle all the responses and deal with it. (Especially since there are so many other footbag things on my list that happen on a daily basis. And of course I *do* have an insane day job which keeps me busy all the time.) So I rarely make a public plea for help, because it ends up either generating vacuous responses (no offense intended), or getting me into more work than if I just did it myself. But things are getting better. Some people have stepped up and offered to help with particular functions. Brian Kimball is taking over the subscription portion of this e-mail list. (He'll manage new member requests, of which I get about 15 a day on some days. He started today, actually, so that's good news for me.) And Derric Scalf has been wonderful by taking over the move list (editing the list itself, and getting bugs fixed, adding new moves, etc.). He is also someone I rely on to help with any function that requires a knowledge of the community (thanks, Derric). And others have volunteered to help out if I can just tell them what I want. (You know who you are, and I thank you for your offer, and will take you up soon.) Well, what I want is to better automate my site so I'm not even required to be in the loop to create and add new content to the site, except where approval is required. That is my dream and I *am* approaching it. But I'm not quite there yet. A lot of you have had long dialogs with me and been trained on using some of my automated functions, and that's great. But I am still on the critical path to most of that stuff, which is bad for everyone. I am working towards even better automation. I'm about to launch the new website, with a *lot* of help from Eric Cote in Montreal, that will include the concept of "registered users". Registered users will be able to contribute little things at first, like comments/hints/tips on the move list, and event and club listings, but over time I'll add better support for the photo and video galleries and for adding things like video clips to the move list. The balance is an issue of editorial control. I still want to be the "editor" of my website. It's still very important to me that the site be of the utmost in quality, both in the content I produce, and in the contributed content (for its accuracy and quality). To that end, I've been building a team of qualified people I trust to help me so that the entire editorial burden is not just on me. So, things like approving club listings, event listings, postings to the e-mail list, and updates to the move list, are all functions I can (and will) hand off to other people. Some things, like photo galleries, really don't need to be editorially controlled. But the video clip that demonstrates a freestyle move *must* be controlled, so that people can rely on their accuracy. (What if some kid uploads a video of himself doing torque and puts that on the clipper page?). I forged this entire online community from very humble beginnings. Most of the people seeing this e-mail learned what they know as a direct or indirect consequence of my sometimes anal-retentive quest for quality and desire for ubiquitous access to information about what was the Black Art of freestyle (and footbag in general). When I started the website (with Jim Curtis) back in '93-'94 (and yes, it was one of the first wave of sites on the internet), freestyle was a secret discipline. Not by design, but by the bad luck that nobody in the media felt like covering it. Kenny made a video in '91-92 (Tricks of the Trade), but beyond that, there wasn't much of a way for people to truly learn freestyle. In fact, you had to know somebody to get any information at all. The WFA had an 800 number, and a catalog, and a magazine, but it was all paper, in print, and you had to wait for it to come in the mail. And of course you had to find them to begin with. I guess the only way for most of us was to buy a Hacky Sack brand footbag and open up the insert and find their phone number and call them. Six weeks later, we had a bundle of black and white papers with still photos in them, and mostly information about events and the net game. And of course a catalog (very important) and a single video mixed among all the others, that actually showed how to play freestyle. And of course there was California Games. That year ('93) was the year the Big Add Posse was formed. At that point, there were probably 10 people on the planet who could hit Blur. Believe it or not. No joke. I was lucky enough to know Dennis Jones. He was the man (and he still is, and he still reads this list periodically so I have to say that :-)). Dennis helped me truly understand all the secrets of this newish Black Art -- the names of the harder moves, the concepts, etc. At that point, there was really no way to find out. There was no list of moves aside from a very antiquated and error-prone list in the IFAB rulebook (again, a bundle of black and white paper you had to work really hard to come across; now just go to my online version, which I put up in '94, at http://ifab.footbag.org/). But if you didn't have a Dennis Jones of your own, you just couldn't find out this stuff. Sure, people had made videos by then, mostly of Rippin' Rick Reese, but they were trading them through very rough and obscure channels. You had to know someone to even know that there was a video, or even a sport for that matter. It was not looking like this little tiny game, that only a few people really mastered, was going to mature and spread. I had a deep fear that it would all die off, and that Rippin' and company would go to their graves as the only people to ever do that with their feet. I decided I'd make it my goal to spread information (especially video) of this sport through whatever means I could. I didn't want it to die. I tried for a year or two to promote it in the mass media, but got hit really hard with the difficulty of that path (I don't even want to go into it right now; it was pretty depressing, as WFA can attest). Then, in late '93, I put up a video of Rippin' Rick Reese on the internet. It was the very first footbag video ever to be committed to MPEG format, and was certainly the first footbag video on the internet. I not only scanned it and edited it and uploaded it, but I filmed it, created the domain name, borrowed a friend's computer and T1 line, installed the ftp server, and spent hours uploading the file at 28kbps. That single act is what I believe changed this sport forever. I know it's self aggrandizing, but I still think it's true. That moment began what has consistently shown itself to be exponential growth of the freestyle footbag sport and subculture. (It wasn't just my goal to show the tricks, but to bring the aesthetic, the personalities, and the culture around the sport to those who decided to pursue the sport.) Much to my surprise, within weeks, people started writing me to ask questions about the video. I had no idea there were already that many people surfing over gopher/ftp/mosaic. Within months, it was becoming very obvious to me that the web was the perfect medium for our sport's growth. I invested a lot more time in it. I shifted focus away from some of my other footbag projects (as if I really had or have the time to begin with, but what's passion if not a way to spend the time you don't have?). Concurrently, three things started to happen: (1) footbag players around the world started finding out about the interesting discussions taking place on the e-mail lists Jim Curtis and I maintained--they actually started *getting online* (buying computers, modems, getting AOL or other service providers) for the first time ever *just* to participate in the footbag discussions; (2) the media started actually taking an interest -- the website was covered on PBS, in several print publications, in newspapers, and on the nationally syndicated TV show CNET in its first season; and (3) new players started sprouting up in pockets all over the world. One place that took me by complete surprise was New Zealand. I guess they're such a small island that they get really bored easily. :-) So they were not surprisingly one of the first non-American countries (next to Finland, for similar but different reasons) to have internet access. Adrian Dick wrote me about that Rippin' video, that he found by surfing over ftp soon after I uploaded it. He asked me so many questions that, by the time we were done, he had begun his own move list. He started asking others, joined the e-mail discussion, traded video with Mighty Mike Niday, and before long was not only one of the best freestylers in New Zealand (okay, admittedly not hard :-)), but the co-author of the official Move List that I ended up putting on footbag.org (after much editing :-)). His helpers were Damian Coventry and Stu Macferson. The three of them are now insanely good freestylers -- among the top in the world, no doubt. (I actually went all the way to New Zealand to visit them one year, and aside from their bad accents and frequent guilts, they blew me away because they had learned everything they knew from video and the internet. Who knew they were trend-setters and this would be the wave of the future.) Of course, of the few people to actually read this far, I'm confident Adrian will give me shit for this paragraph. :-) That list was one of the tools that transformed the sport. To this day, though, it causes as many problems as it solves. Text is just not a good way to describe this sport. Sure, Ben Job came up with a good way to type the moves in (nothing spectacular, but mostly functional). By the time I got to the '95 Worlds (okay, I didn't have to go anywhere since I produced it here in Menlo Park and San Francisco, with lots of help), the myth (er, legend) of the BAP had spread like wildfire, and kids were showing up hitting insane combos that only a few years before were reserved for the Old Masters (who themselves still hadn't hit 28 by that point). Arriving in San Francisco for his first Worlds that year was (a very young) Ryan Mulroney. His friend Shesha Marvin (who found footbag through the internet the first year my site was up, and befriended me electronically) brought Ryan with him, since they'd both been pouring over the move list and were really into this thing. Realizing text wasn't the best way to teach the sport online, I endeavored to add video. It was always a complicated task. I figured out that if I just recorded individual freestyle tricks, I could keep the file sizes small enough that people would actually download them. I took the move list (which Adrian so nicely made into a database, so I just had to import it) and wrote a dynamic web application around it. I added the ability to attach video clips to the moves, and made it so it was very easy to edit it online. This changed everything. Then, it was possible to easily extend the list, edit it, keep it up to date, add video clips, and really begin to help people *learn* the sport online. Of course, this in conjunction with a very well populated (and reasonably up to date) club list, event list, and mailing list, so people could get "hooked in" to the footbag network (in the non-technical sense). So I spent those hours building it, and still do, but there aren't enough hours in a day. I am still working on my dream. Stand by. And feel free to help. Steve From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 09:05:20 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA07287 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 09:05:20 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA02812 for ; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 01:14:36 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-31 #39336) with SMTP id <0FIX00F01085FO@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 02:14:30 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 02:14:29 -0600 (MDT) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] Symposium Butterflies are weak because... In-reply-to: <199909302144.RAA53950@m56-129-30.mit.edu> To: Samuel Andrew Hires Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, 30 Sep 1999, Samuel Andrew Hires wrote: > Does anybody agree with this? > Symposium butterflies are weak/should not exist I disagree. They are sometimes weak because the dex is not always strong and definable as it should be if you want symposium and not refraction. Now I know you wrote about a full dex being mandatory to have the symposium involved and I disagree with that as well. I've said before I think we need half adds for exactly this problem with backside symposium sets (and other questionables). In my opinion the dex counts...period. Otherwise you need to take away the stepping dexs or pixie dexs because they are not full either. The problem actually exists with the symposium part of the move, not the dex. The dex is the same as it's always been, but how you set and balance or hop around changes which is what symposiums are about, not planting while hopping over the bag. So that's what I think anyway and it makes me sleep better at night as I drifter off in to my half-sleep combos. Later, BRAD From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 18:35:03 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA07813 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 18:35:03 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web804.mail.yahoo.com (web804.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.64]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA22215 for ; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 10:48:09 -0700 Message-ID: <19991001174935.20348.rocketmail@web804.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.216.156.133] by web804.mail.yahoo.com; Fri, 01 Oct 1999 10:49:35 PDT Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 10:49:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Jamez Risden Subject: [freestyle] gods To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Wouldent it be really neat to have profiles of all the top freestylers on the internet like Peter Irish, Scott Davidson, Ryan Mulroney and all the others. I would really like to know more about these people because they are like celebs to me. Im serious! They are my gods! Jamez Risden From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 22:27:15 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA08033 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 22:27:15 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA28691 for ; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 13:35:01 -0700 Received: (from jriely@localhost) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA25607; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 15:34:50 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 15:34:50 -0500 (CDT) From: "Jeremiah J. Riely" X-Sender: jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu To: KAPLAN BRADLEY M cc: Samuel Andrew Hires , freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Symposium Butterflies are weak because... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Fri, 1 Oct 1999, KAPLAN BRADLEY M wrote: > On Thu, 30 Sep 1999, Samuel Andrew Hires wrote: > > Does anybody agree with this? > > Symposium butterflies are weak/should not exist > sets (and other questionables). In my opinion the dex counts...period. > Otherwise you need to take away the stepping dexs or pixie dexs because > they are not full either. The problem actually exists with the symposium > part of the move, not the dex. The dex is the same as it's always been, I think you misunderstood Samuel. He said for the *Symposium* add to count the dex has to be full. Half dexes would still be treated exactly the same, except when symposium. You would not have to do anything with stepping dex or pixie dexs, but this would make a pogo set not have the symposium add and make dada not have the symposium add. I agree with this completely. Changing the definition of symposium could make sympsoium butterflys only worth 3 adds and dadas worth 4 and pogo sets worth 1. Later From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 1 22:27:50 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA08038 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 22:27:50 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo-d02.mx.aol.com (imo-d02.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA30657 for ; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 14:38:10 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zQZY0iT_gy (4465) for ; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 17:36:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <888f09ab.25268343@aol.com> Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 17:36:03 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] competition anxiety To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org This is to all you guys who responded to my urgent cries..hehe. Should I really compete intermediate? I personally think that I would get killed. I"ve never competed before and this would be my first time at a tourney. And besides, that weakside double over down, Ken, was total luck. I've only hit it like twice..I can barely hit clippers(like 3 out of 5 tries). But thanks for all your help. Hey Derric, if i do compete intermidiate, do i have to sign up before the tourney starts coz there's a cost? How do i sign up? Hey Ariel, you going to TX states? I would love to get hooked up with the net game. Cya guys there! Thanks Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 2 00:53:32 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA08154 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 00:53:32 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Bryan Fournier Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com (imo-d03.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.35]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA04744; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 16:46:42 -0700 Received: from ShReDStEiN@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zELLUzuXL_ (4248); Fri, 1 Oct 1999 19:46:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <2d432eb3.2526a1be@aol.com> Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 19:46:06 EDT Subject: Re: Re: [freestyle] Video Move Clips To: brat@footbag.org, freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0.1 for Mac sub 82 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 9/30/99 11:45:48 PM, brat@footbag.org wrote: <> THis was the first "freestyle" I ever saw...back in late '96 as I was skooling legovers and ATW's I saw the caption saying something like "Rippin bustin out four-add combos like cake"... right then and there I was hooked... ~Bryan F. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 2 03:13:51 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA08269 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 03:13:51 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-1.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.119]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA10832 for ; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 19:14:34 -0700 Received: from postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.91]) by mailsorter-105-1.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with ESMTP id TAA02866; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 19:14:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from production@localhost) by postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-d/mt.gso.26Feb98) id TAA14485; Fri, 1 Oct 1999 19:14:28 -0700 (PDT) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhQGn+WiIE79Kkc70yiEt4XurEXGaAIVAL82Bi7ITnm6ZmIioTlUoMa6H8L2 From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1999 22:14:27 -0400 (EDT) To: jriely@mail.coin.missouri.edu (Jeremiah J. Riely) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Symposium Butterflies are weak because... Message-ID: <8077-37F56A83-4366@postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Jeremiah J. Riely" 's message of Fri, 1 Oct 1999 15:34:50 -0500 (CDT) Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > and pogo sets worth 1. I thought pogo IS worth 1. GF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 2 21:30:22 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA09471 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:30:22 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA16951 for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 13:44:46 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991002204445.XLPR17351.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org> for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 13:44:45 -0700 Message-ID: <37F66E70.7FC2E50E@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 15:43:28 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] move list - again Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello all. Ok. I've got some move names that I want cleared up. Some are suggestions that I like... and some I don't. Either way, I don't like the idea of having the final say on what is named what. So, I'm doing it the democratic way. We're going to have a vote. I won't put any of these moves up until at least one person responds to let me know that a proposed move name has been seconded. Cool? Here goes. I'll do this in two chunks so that there won't be soooo many. Pandora: Gyro IN legover clip > (back) spin > same in > same toe Paralax: Gyro OUT legover clip > (back) spin > same OUT > same toe Parabola: spinning IN legover clip > (back) spin > op in > same toe *** note that a merkon is a spinning OUT legover *** Juggernaut: Fairy symposium eggbeater TOE > SAME OUT > (no plant while) OP OUT > OP OUT > SAME TOE Tappage: I suppose this would be pronounced like mirage. Tapping double mirage TOE > OP OUT (plant) > SAME IN > SAME IN > OP TOE Predator: Atomic double leg over TOE > OP OUT > OP IN > OP OUT > SAME TOE Smearage: Again, rhymes with mirage Pixie double mirage TOE > SAME IN > OP IN > SAME IN > OP TOE Trochus: pronunciation anyone? Atomic symp reverse mirage : backside symp omelette TOE > OP OUT > (no plant while) OP OUT > OP TOE Witchdoctor: Atomic symp mirage : backside symp atom smasher TOE > OP OUT > (no plant while) > OP IN > OP TOE Also a frontide trochus and frontide witchdoctor (first dex symposium instead of the second) SPITFIRE: a swirl to dragon, that is, clip > same back-to-front swirl > same dragon (cross-body outside stall) SNAP DRAGON: reverse swirl to dragon clip (or dragon) > same front (swirl) > same dragon DRAG: osis caught on dragon clip > (back) spin > op dragon. SNAP DRAGON: a butterfly stall ending in a dragon toe or clip > op out > op dragon DRAGSTER: a drifter caught on a dragon clip > op in > same dragon If you've read this far, please take the time to provide feedback. I would appreciate it if you would send feedback to the entire list - not just to me. That way, everyone will be on top of what is called what. If I don't get an approval on the move name - or no new suggestions - I will continue to ask about that move in subsequent postings. Thanks. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 2 22:01:04 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA09526 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 22:01:04 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Tony Glick Received: from Allman144@aol.com by imo20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zOCVa08846 (3975) for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 17:13:58 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <18c99f71.2527cf96@aol.com> Date: Sat, 2 Oct 1999 17:13:58 EDT Subject: [freestyle] Re: Winden and intermediate To: freestyle@list.footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Windsen wrote: << And besides, that weakside double over down, Ken, was total luck >> The fact that you have the ability to execute that move means you should compete intermediate. If you compete novice, the novice players might jump you after the tournament. Tony Glick From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 2 23:53:54 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA09850 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 23:53:54 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo20.mx.aol.com (imo20.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.10]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA21240 for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 16:08:06 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zRXMa21483 (4190) for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 19:07:25 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <26f067a1.2527ea2d@aol.com> Date: Sat, 2 Oct 1999 19:07:25 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: Winden and intermediate To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ok. I think I'm gonna compete intermediate, even though I know I"m gonna get crushed. But that's fine coz i'm just going for the experience..mainly the shred circles. Cya there Thanks again Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 00:24:01 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA09931 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 00:24:01 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA22147 for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 16:36:32 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-31 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJ000I011KV0Z@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 17:36:31 -0600 (MDT) Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 17:36:31 -0600 (MDT) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] Symposium Butterflies are weak because... In-reply-to: To: "Jeremiah J. Riely" Cc: Samuel Andrew Hires , freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Fri, 1 Oct 1999, Jeremiah J. Riely wrote: > I think you misunderstood Samuel. He said for the *Symposium* add to count > the dex has to be full. Half dexes would still be treated exactly the > same, except when symposium. You would not have to do anything with > stepping dex or pixie dexs, but this would make a pogo set not have the > symposium add and make dada not have the symposium add. I agree with this > completely. Changing the definition of symposium could make sympsoium > butterflys only worth 3 adds and dadas worth 4 and pogo sets worth 1. Actually I didn't misunderstand it at all. I just disagree with making full dexes a necessity for symposiums. I think doing that would (or should) require making it a general rule for all kinds of moves that begin with stepping or pixie or pogo or shooting. As I said I find no fault in dexes (unless thay are not cleanly distinguishable) when it comes to symposium moves. I'm saying that it needs reevaluating, but not from the dex perspective, rather from the set perspective. I've said before that add system relies too heavily on whole points and needs half points or quarter points, as well as new categories to cover the gap. This may mean re-doing every single trick in add value, but the finished product will be closer to proper judgement. By the way, someone mentioned getting rid of the xbody add altogether and I disagree with that and think it should be lessened to a half add. These are just my thoughts and I think they are good ones which may need some hammering out. And to anyone who replies, this is for judging tourament style only. I still think adds have no place in friendly shred circles because they are too excluding. Thanks for reading my little bitch session, I love you all (platonically), BRAD From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 03:41:08 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA10086 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 03:41:08 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web805.mail.yahoo.com (web805.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.65]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA27078 for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 19:43:14 -0700 Message-ID: <19991003024538.20039.rocketmail@web805.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.216.156.187] by web805.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 02 Oct 1999 19:45:38 PDT Date: Sat, 2 Oct 1999 19:45:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Jamez Risden Subject: [freestyle] my new moves To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all, Over the last three days I have learned how to hit ripwalks, stepping butterflys, and double dex mirages. Now that i can hit ripwalks i cant see how i hit a mirage first...or even a paradon. Ripwalk is the easiest move i have ever learnd. And for the people talkin' trash about the "weak" symposium butterfly, If you dont like a move, then dont do it. Its easy as that. Somone mentioned that it shouldent exist, but it does so there....get over it. Jamez Risden P.S. My dog chewed up my lavers :( P.S.S. My dog is dead now :) ===== From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 07:56:48 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA10901 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 07:56:48 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f32.hotmail.com [216.32.181.32]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA29172 for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:02:59 -0700 Received: (qmail 43608 invoked by uid 0); 3 Oct 1999 04:02:13 -0000 Message-ID: <19991003040213.43607.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 207.167.113.172 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 02 Oct 1999 21:02:12 PDT X-Originating-IP: [207.167.113.172] From: "Ryan B." To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] move list - again Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 21:02:12 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >If you've read this far, please take the time to provide feedback. Well I don't think my opinion matters very much, but since you asked for it... Move names that I am indifferent about: Pandora Paralax Juggernaut Tappage Smearage Trochus SPITFIRE DRAG DRAGSTER Move names that sound cool: Predator Snap Dragon Witchdoctor Names I don't care for: Parabola - Sorry, I just think it's weird to name a move after the graph of an algebraic equation :-) One more thing, in the original message, SNAP DRAGON was described as: >a butterfly stall ending in a dragon >toe or clip > op out > op dragon I believe Jon Schneider named that move "Firefly." "Snap Dragon" refers to another move. Well there you go, my 2 cents. - Ryan Britt From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 07:57:14 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA10911 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 07:57:14 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web119.yahoomail.com (web119.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.120]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA29097 for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:00:55 -0700 Message-ID: <19991003040129.2923.rocketmail@web119.yahoomail.com> Received: from [204.137.66.106] by web119.yahoomail.com; Sat, 02 Oct 1999 21:01:29 PDT Date: Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:01:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Aaron Johnson Subject: [freestyle] Needing some assistance! To: Footbag MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Guys and Gals: I just opened my new Sipa Sipa from the box and starting kicking around. To tell you the trueth, I don't have a clue what I am doing. So, what I need from you friendly people is some assistance. I would like to know how you started training; what skills you think are more important to learn first and resources you used to get educated in Freestyle, (example: videos and/or books). I went to Barnes and Noble, but didn't find any books :( Videos would be a very cool thing! Any assistance would be greatly appreciated from any and all participants. Thanks!! Aaron "?" Johnson (It looks most everybody on the list-serve has a cool middle name.) Later From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 08:00:53 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA10936 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 08:00:53 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA29684 for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:25:39 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991003042538.BYMZ17351.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org> for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:25:38 -0700 Message-ID: <37F6DA7B.71F64C49@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 23:24:27 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] a place for everything and everything in its place. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Blame it on the chemistry major in me, or just blame it on my anal retentive nature - I NEED to break each freestyle move down into its basic components. These are all of my proposed "families" of moves. You might be wondering why this is important. Let me tell you. Steve G. has put up a great search feature on the moves list. When you search for blurry, it finds all blurry moves. Pretty simple, right. Well, if a move is called blizzard, we have trouble. Blizzrd is blurry, but blurry isn't in the name. So, most moves fit into a family so that they do pop up on a search. Say you have just discovered that you can do an atomic set. Well, search for atomic and find out about the possible moves - legbeater, atom smasher, etc. So, we all agree that this is a good idea :) Here are my proposed standards. These are all done in the interest of making it EASY to classify moves. blurry: clip > op in > op stepping: clip > op in > same pixie: toe > same in > fairy: toe > same out > nuclear: clip > same out > atomic: toe > op out > op tapping: toe > op out > same gyro: clip > (back) spin > same spinning: clip > (back) spin > op shooting: clip > op in > op out > furious: clip > op in > same in > ****** By the way, these names are to be set in stone soon. If you object to any of them, let the whole list (freestyle@footbag.org) know. Here are my concerns. Any set description that ends with a '>' means that it doesn't matter which leg does the next dex. So, when you say "shooting butterfly", is that too ambiguous? Which side do you assume the butterfly is on? What about "pixie whirl"? Is that pixie same side or pixie op side? Does anyone care to come up with distinct family names for "shooting/furious same side", "pixie/fairy same side", or "nuclear same side"? Or, should I put them up on the move list with the long names - pixie same side whirl, etc.? ****** And, here are some components that I'm not really sure about - I'm assuming that the difference between duck and dive have to do with how the bag goes around your head with regard to the SET. Or, does it have more to do with the entire move (set and stuff done after the head dex)? Here are my proposed definitions. Let me know what you think. ducking: the bag goes over your head on the same side as the set. eg. A right toe or left foot clipper set > bag goes up the right side of your head and comes down on the left side. diving: opposite of ducking. The bag goes from a right side set (left clip or right toe) up the left side of your head and comes down on the right side. With these definitions, it is possible to get confused. What is a ducking butterfly? According to these definitions, you set and do a duck, but the butterfly can be on either side. So, do we need two more names for these type of moves? ducking same side, ducking op side, diving same side and diving op side. Hmmm... this could get complicated. Any ideas? -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 08:02:12 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA10956 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 08:02:12 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA29749 for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:30:08 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991003043007.BZLN17351.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org> for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:30:07 -0700 Message-ID: <37F6DB88.B8BB2472@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 23:28:56 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] and some more moves Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org And some more moves... this will be the last batch for a while. Thanks for the feedback from the first list. I really would like it if you would send feedback to the entire freestyle list, though. Otherwise, I just have to summarize it and post it myself. So, expect a post from me on that pretty soon. DORK: a torque caught on a dragon clip > op in > (back) spin > op dragon DRAGONSTEIN: a ripstein to dragon, clip > same back > same back > same dragon Silo: Atomic Torque toe > op out > op in > (back) spin > op clip Kiwi: Atomic Drifter toe > op out > op in > same clip Assassin: Pixie Diving Mirage TOE > SAME IN > (dive) > OP IN > OP TOE Guillotine: Fairy Diving Mirage TOE > SAME OUT > (dive) > OP IN > OP TOE Skull Smasher: Atomic Ducking Mirage TOE > OP OUT > (?duck/?dive) > OP IN > OP TOE From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 08:02:15 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA10967 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 08:02:15 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web601.yahoomail.com (web2003.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.68.203]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA30527 for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:54:54 -0700 Message-ID: <19991003045457.21130.rocketmail@web601.yahoomail.com> Received: from [38.31.5.79] by web2003.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 02 Oct 1999 21:54:57 PDT Date: Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:54:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Eli Piltz Subject: [freestyle] Re: Stupid move names To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Tony Glick wrote: don't want to say it was a Poisonous Toad. Move names with "atomic" are cool. I think we need rethink some of them. Yes!!! I'm stoked 'atomic' is accepted as a highly esteemed move name adjective. I personally think we need more silly, funny names like 'poisonous toad', 'royale w/ chz', 'schmoe', etc. Thank goodness we aren't all still in high school and concerned with what some "hot girl" we've never met, nor will ever meet again thinks about move names. We wouldn't have any fun with move names. Btw, Australia sure likes to suck all the cool names out of the pool. I got dibs on 'Guilotine'- blurry ducking drifter: no I'm not hitting it, but I still got dibs. Later, Eli From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 08:02:34 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA10977 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 08:02:34 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA30543 for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:55:31 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991003045530.CERM17351.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org> for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 21:55:30 -0700 Message-ID: <37F6E17B.A8671066@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 23:54:19 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] other naming conventions Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ok. I forgot to add something in that last list of sets and stuff. If a move contains spin element AFTER a dex element, the type of spin will be determined by where the bag is immediately before the spin. Make sense? Examples will help: fairy gyro mirage: After a right foot fairy set, the bag is on the right side of the body. So, a gyro mirage from this point would be a back spin (counterclockwise in this case) and a mirage with the left leg doing the dex and the right foot catching the bag. Cool? atomic gyro mirage: After a left leg atomic dex, the bag is on the left side of the body. So, a gyro mirage from this point would be a back spin (clockwise in this case) and a mirage with the right leg ending on a left toe delay. I know that people say gyro is when the set leg does the dex after the spin, but I say that does not always apply if a dex is done before the spin. Also, spin, gyro and inspin should be determined by the side of the body the set comes from. So, a right toe would be equivalent to a left foot clipper. If you set from a right toe and spin back (counterclockwise in this case), this would be spinning/gyro. But, if you set from a right toe and spin front (clockwise in this case), this would be inspinning. Note that an atomic gyro mirage does not involve a front spin - the spin was started after the bag was on the left side of the body making it a back spin. To do an atomic front spin (or inspin), you would do an atomic set followed by a hellish twist of the body to go the other direction (imagine a right toe > left leg out dex > counterclockwise spin > left leg in dex > right toe). Any problems with these definitions? Let the whole list know. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 08:02:57 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA10992 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 08:02:57 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from postman.bayarea.net (postman.bayarea.net [205.219.84.13]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA30764 for ; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 22:07:49 -0700 Received: from footbag.org (bfk.bayarea.net [209.128.69.40]) by postman.bayarea.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA23531; Sat, 2 Oct 1999 22:07:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bfk@footbag.org) Message-ID: <37F6E49C.5E52A281@footbag.org> Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 22:07:40 -0700 From: Brian Kimball X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jamez Risden CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] gods References: <19991001174935.20348.rocketmail@web804.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Jamez Risden wrote: > P.S. My dog chewed up my lavers :( > P.S.S. My dog is dead now :) Wow, you must be 1 3l33t3 D00d, "Jamez". brian (will steve moderate me into oblivion? he probably should...) From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 08:06:51 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA11049 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 08:06:51 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from Market.NET (market.net [140.174.206.2]) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA11046 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 08:06:50 -0700 Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA01522 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 00:23:43 -0700 Received: from [205.180.137.119] (dhcp-205-180-137-119.atext.com [205.180.137.119]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA12606 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 00:23:11 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19991003040129.2923.rocketmail@web119.yahoomail.com> References: <19991003040129.2923.rocketmail@web119.yahoomail.com> Date: Sun, 3 Oct 1999 00:23:24 -0700 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Needing some assistance! Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 9:01 PM -0700 10/2/99, Aaron Johnson wrote: > I just opened my new Sipa Sipa from the box and >starting kicking around. First mistake. >To tell you the trueth, I >don't have a clue what I am doing. It shows if you're using a Sipa. :-) >So, what I need >from you friendly people is some assistance. Actually, that's why I built the website. There's a FAQ (frequently-asked questions) that has the answer to exactly your question. http://www.footbag.org/faq/ In a few days we'll be relaunching the site with even more information, but for now, what's there is pretty useful. A list of things to do to get proficient in freestyle. Read the "freestyle" section of the FAQ. You have to scroll down a bit. >I went to Barnes and Noble, but >didn't find any books :( http://www.footbag.org/ is better than any book. :-) >Videos would be a very cool >thing! http://www.footbag.org/freestyle/ has videos. More to come. Steve From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 20:47:32 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA11834 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 20:47:32 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA16414 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 08:43:36 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991003154335.FXBT17351.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 08:43:35 -0700 Message-ID: <37F77969.49F9FADC@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 10:42:33 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Aaron Johnson CC: Footbag Subject: Re: [freestyle] Needing some assistance! References: <19991003040129.2923.rocketmail@web119.yahoomail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Aaron Johnson wrote: > > Hey Guys and Gals: > I just opened my new Sipa Sipa from the box and > starting kicking around. To tell you the trueth, I > don't have a clue what I am doing. So, what I need > from you friendly people is some assistance. I would > like to know how you started training; what skills you > think are more important to learn first and resources > you used to get educated in Freestyle, (example: > videos and/or books). Well, the first thing you need is a decent footbag. Sorry, but a Sipa just won't cut it. You need a bag made of facile or other SOFT material. Go to the WFA's page at http://www.worldfootbag.com and get a Juice, Stork, or a Revolution bag. Also, while you are on their site, get the instructional video Tricks of the Trade. It is a great tool for players at all levels. And, last but certainly not least, you need to get the Adidas Rod Laver tennis shoe. These shoes are very flat and very lightweight. Shorts are a must - no pants. After you get the right stuff, you need to practice all of your basic kicks - on both sides. Start with insides. Then do your outsides and your toes. Let me know when you can hit 50 in a row *alternating sides on every kick* and I'll give you some hints on the stalls. You need the kicks first. Good luck and welcome to the sport. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 3 20:48:39 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA11848 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 20:48:39 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Matt Cross Received: from imo19.mx.aol.com (imo19.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.9]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA16753 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 08:56:12 -0700 Received: from MatthewL329@aol.com by imo19.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zJDQa29898 (4215) for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 11:55:32 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <8e424f71.2528d673@aol.com> Date: Sun, 3 Oct 1999 11:55:31 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Needing some assistance! To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" X-Mailer: AOL for Macintosh sub 56 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by list.footbag.org id QAA11391 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Dear AJ, << I just opened my new Sipa Sipa from the box and starting kicking around >> First mistake. Sipas are worse than the more common guatÈ bags. Throw it out, order a juice or somethin. At this point, if I were you, I'd check the club listing on www.footbag.org and find some kickers in your area, or just start kicking ALOT at your school with some friends. and use both your legs the same, some of us (like me) are kinda behind the game because our strong side is many months ahead of our weak side, and it can take alot of remedial kicking to fix this problem. Just practice hard, and avoid games like "3-hack smack", I personally think they're against the general "feel" of the sport. Good luck, I think I speak for everyone on the list when I say you have our support when you need it. Matthew "Stupid" (ha ha, steve) Cross From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 01:46:48 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA12293 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 01:46:48 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f87.hotmail.com [216.32.181.87]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA28135 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 15:38:28 -0700 Received: (qmail 79436 invoked by uid 0); 3 Oct 1999 22:37:56 -0000 Message-ID: <19991003223756.79435.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 216.44.107.135 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 03 Oct 1999 15:37:56 PDT X-Originating-IP: [216.44.107.135] From: "Stan Sagalovskiy" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] which footbag? Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 18:37:56 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi, i've been 'hacking' on and off for a year or so. just kicking around with friends, playin kill, stuff like that. no real skills. i bought a hack a while ago (i guess it's a sipasipa kind), took out have the stuffing and more or less broke it in. i've been trying to improve, can kinda stall and all-around-the-world. but the bag really sucks. i was wondering what kinda bag i should get for practicing, and where? i live in nyc, so i'm sure there're stores around here, i just don't know any. so if anyone knows a nice store in new york and can advise on a bag (under $15) i'd appreciate it. (or if you can point out which is a good bag out of the ones they have at http://worldfootbag.com/catman/showgroup/footbags that would be great!) thanks a lot! Stan. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 01:46:57 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA12303 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 01:46:57 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.4]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA32399 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 18:00:02 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zPXBa18968 (4002) for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 20:59:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <7bd3ed83.252955ee@aol.com> Date: Sun, 3 Oct 1999 20:59:26 EDT Subject: [freestyle] Some more moves To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey guys, Today I got into some heavy shredding and hit some new moves. The first thing I did wasn't a new move but I thought it was cool: I linked 2 consecutive smogs together. Anyways, the move i hit was:toe >same in[dex]>op out[dex]>same out[dex]>same toe [del]. I'm thinking pixie double switchover? any cool name for it? And the second one:toe>same in[dex]>duck/dive(not sure what i did)>op in[dex]>op toe[dex]. Looks like a pixie ducking/diving mirage. Let me know If you've heard of any of these? oooh yea one more thing...what would be the time for kicking in intermediate competition? Thanks Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 02:03:10 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA12415 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 02:03:10 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Adam Mrosko Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com (imo16.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.6]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA00350 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 18:11:32 -0700 Received: from ZZombie2@aol.com by imo16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zWXDa26655 (4309) for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 21:10:56 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <75e5b9b2.252958a0@aol.com> Date: Sun, 3 Oct 1999 21:10:56 EDT Subject: [freestyle] few questions To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi baggers I got a few questions where can I buy a carol bag and how much are they? I heard they were the best so I wanted to try one out. Also I always wanted to know, how much money do freestylers get for winning a tournament? Do they make enough to live, or do they have to get another job? Just a few questions. Adam Mrosko From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 02:59:23 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA12481 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 02:59:23 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from homer.tomahawktech.com (tomahawktech.com [206.191.48.232]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA02060 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 18:58:22 -0700 Received: from dave (Administrators@localhost) by homer.tomahawktech.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA00393 for ; Sun, 03 Oct 1999 22:00:25 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Message-ID: <000701bf0e0c$3841dc60$60fdfea9@dave> From: "Dave Reid" To: Subject: Re: [freestyle] Some more moves Date: Sun, 3 Oct 1999 22:00:21 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Windsen Pan wrote: >consecutive smogs together. Anyways, the move i hit was:toe >same in[dex]>op >out[dex]>same out[dex]>same toe [del]. I'm thinking pixie double switchover? >any cool name for it? Holy smokes! I'm thinking that you've got the pixie set down pretty incredibly good. Are you wearing modified Lavers? I find that my toe buckets like to catch my attempts at pixies and send them flying. Gimme some tips!!! Please. Dave From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 03:26:09 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA12549 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 03:26:09 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo23.mx.aol.com (imo23.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA03222 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 19:27:37 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zAPCa04663 (4002) for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 22:26:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <35fadfa7.25296a6a@aol.com> Date: Sun, 3 Oct 1999 22:26:50 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Some more moves To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Yea, I've realized that in that 1 and a half minutes, there is a lot of time. And shredding is not the thing to do coz you'll collapse from lack of breathe..hehe. Anyways, I'm from San Antonio, Tx. Are you coming to TX states ken? THanks Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 03:26:58 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA12559 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 03:26:58 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo20.mx.aol.com (imo20.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.10]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA03700 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 19:39:34 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zYETa21483 (4002) for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 22:38:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <849c6c2.25296d41@aol.com> Date: Sun, 3 Oct 1999 22:38:57 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Some more moves To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Dave, I've noticed that lavers catch my pixie set as well. But i can still do them in while wearing them. I mainly freestyle in tevas or in barefeet. I can give ya as much advice on pixies as I can. These are my fav sets and i've gotten them down solid. Are you coming to Tx states? if yes, i can show ya there. If not, I'll give ya some help. First of all, and most important of all, DONT RUSH. Do this first: just lift your foot with the bag on it slowly and steady. You'll notice that at a certain point, the bag will just lift of your foot. This is where you want to execute your dex. When the bag leaves your foot, circle the it in one smooth motion. Do this several times and just let the bag drop after the dex(try to keep the bag moving straight up and down with your weight over it). If you do it correctly, you will notice that you have LOTS of time from when the dex is done to when the bag hits the ground for doing dexs and other tricks. Keep practicing this motion over and over until you get it down good. Once you master the set, all pixie set moves will come easy. Just remember these 3 things: 1. Dont rush!! Lift the bag slowly during the set(you want to set at about waist level) 2. Dont rush the dex either. you want the whole thing to be one solid and smooth motion. 3. keep your weight over the bag. while you do this, try to make the bag go straigh up and down. Hope this helps. Its a lil long. Keep working at it. Pixies are awesome moves! Windsen Pan P.S. are you coming to tx states? From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 03:38:46 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA12628 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 03:38:46 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo-d01.mx.aol.com (imo-d01.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.33]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA04101 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 19:52:05 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo-d01.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zHGUu41JR_ (4002) for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 22:51:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.f782f02a.25297027@aol.com> Date: Sun, 3 Oct 1999 22:51:19 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Some more moves To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org PIXIE PARADON SWIRL!!! whoa!! i can do pixie, i can do swirll..but a paradon in the middle!???..what would be jobs for that? Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 03:39:06 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA12638 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 03:39:06 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from goose.prod.itd.earthlink.net (goose.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.120.18]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA04087 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 19:52:00 -0700 Received: from Sam (dialup-209.245.72.76.LosAngeles1.Level3.net [209.245.72.76]) by goose.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA06906 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 19:51:55 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <004101bf0e13$573f58c0$4c48f5d1@Sam> Reply-To: "Sam Colclough" From: "Sam Colclough" To: Subject: [freestyle] cokewalk Date: Sun, 3 Oct 1999 19:51:09 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey shredders, I have been trying relentlessly to do all these big add moves and the only one that's coming easy is a paradox dragonfly. Does this move have a name? If not I propose the name Cokewalk.. named after me :c) Sam Colclough. (Coke - Lo) Anyway, if there's already a name for it please tell me. I think the notation is.. clip > (no plant while) same in dex > OP inside kick (since my notation sucks) its basically a clipper set and then the setting leg swings around without planting and does a dragonfly. the setting leg being the leg that does a dexterity. so its a clipper paradox jumping leg in to out crazy kick.. is that something cool? please? eheh what about an around the world osis? Thanks for your time Sam Colclough From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 04:24:47 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA12937 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 04:24:47 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-104.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-104.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.94]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA04946 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 20:15:18 -0700 Received: from mailsorter-105-1.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.119]) by mailsorter-104.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-d/ms.graham.14Aug97) with ESMTP id TAA21887 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 19:41:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.91]) by mailsorter-105-1.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with ESMTP id TAA28942; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 19:37:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from production@localhost) by postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-d/mt.gso.26Feb98) id TAA09335; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 19:37:48 -0700 (PDT) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhUAlMGI6MvYX5QYlSB6dXz6GgXcxSwCFH9kaXNu1AZ0pvczKNEq69XHznQi From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Sun, 3 Oct 1999 22:37:48 -0400 (EDT) To: derric@dallasfootbag.org (Derric Scalf) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] and some more moves Message-ID: <8078-37F812FC-12488@postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: Derric Scalf 's message of Sat, 02 Oct 1999 23:28:56 -0500 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org The only one I don't like is: DORK. GF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 05:11:01 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA12992 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 05:11:01 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f269.hotmail.com [216.32.180.227]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA06550 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 21:15:34 -0700 Received: (qmail 35709 invoked by uid 0); 4 Oct 1999 04:15:03 -0000 Message-ID: <19991004041503.35708.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 216.44.107.75 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 03 Oct 1999 21:15:03 PDT X-Originating-IP: [216.44.107.75] From: "Stan Sagalovskiy" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] which footbag? Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 00:15:03 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org thanks guys! wash sq is growing dead towards the winter.. it's getting cold. but i'll make sure to look around in the spring. i'm at nyu, so i'm always there anyhow. right now i usually find only a handful of people playing. and hey.. if i could stall a sipasipa.. i think that's skill. =) l8rz Stan. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 05:51:03 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA13060 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 05:51:03 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from nccn6.nccn.net (IDENT:root@nccn6.nccn.net [209.79.220.19]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA07987 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 22:01:31 -0700 Received: from left (tc2-156.nccn.net [209.79.221.156]) by nccn6.nccn.net (8.9.3//8.9.3/*tdw* 99.09.29-) with SMTP id WAA18058 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 22:06:45 -0700 Message-ID: <000e01bf0e25$3ab9d7e0$9cdd4fd1@left> From: "Lon Smith" To: "footbag" Subject: [freestyle] Symposium Butterfly's are weak because Date: Sun, 3 Oct 1999 21:55:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3115.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I have to say that all Brad has said on the list is cool. And I espeially agree that the problem is that there should only be the one single hop to complete the dex to make a move symposium. EXCEPT for some moves like Symposium mirage, an Pixie,,,,BUT for the butterfly I think that would be a GREAT improvement to the definition of SYMPOSIUM. Tahnks Brad What were you calling that moves I So very much complemented you on. That ATomic Twirl or Tapping Gyro REV whirl. What is the name? Best Move EVER PERIOD!!!!!!!!!!!!! P.S. (This Message was sent by ShredOnLawnLON) From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 07:59:39 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA13134 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 07:59:39 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web804.mail.yahoo.com (web804.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.64]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA11253 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 00:00:34 -0700 Message-ID: <19991004070353.871.rocketmail@web804.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.40.56.245] by web804.mail.yahoo.com; Mon, 04 Oct 1999 00:03:53 PDT Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 00:03:53 -0700 (PDT) From: ermo naarits Subject: [freestyle] hop over To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Please tell me the easiest way to do hop over ERM From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 18:01:18 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA13999 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 18:01:18 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from saba.wwa.com (saba.wwa.com [198.49.174.36]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id GAA25639 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 06:27:34 -0700 Received: from [209.107.90.78] (209-107-90-078.chicago.verio.net [209.107.90.78]) by saba.wwa.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA29289; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 08:26:58 -0500 (CDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <8078-37F812FC-12488@postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net> References: Derric Scalf 's message of Sat, 02 Oct 1999 23:28:56 -0500 Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 08:38:11 -0600 To: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson), derric@dallasfootbag.org (Derric Scalf) From: Scott Davidson Subject: Re: [freestyle] and some more moves Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi All! At 10:37 PM -0400 10/3/99, Greg Nelson wrote: >The only one I don't like is: DORK. I have been doing that now for a while, and that is exactly what I have been calling it, except I spell it, "DORQUE" Has anyone noticed that when you do a Dorque without stepping the dex/catch leg down, that it feels more like a drifter. So when I do them, I think of the stepping version as the Dorque and the drifter version as the "DRAGSTER", even though they are technically identical by the current system. I don't even want to clutter my mind with Jobs notation on these dragon moves. That's a whole other thing. See ya! Scott Davidson. Enlightener From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 18:01:23 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA14009 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 18:01:23 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f58.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.58]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA26052 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 06:40:59 -0700 Received: (qmail 22234 invoked by uid 0); 4 Oct 1999 13:40:25 -0000 Message-ID: <19991004134025.22233.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.206.120.240 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 04 Oct 1999 06:40:22 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.206.120.240] From: "Ian Dubman" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: RE: [freestyle] some more moves Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 08:40:22 CDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >From: Derric Scalf >Hello all. >Cool? Yes, it is a bit chilly here in Missouri. But, that is beside the point. I will give my opinions. I don't believe any of the names are horrific. I think Pandora is the baddest name on there--whomever came up with that, two thumbs up. Basically, I choose to second all but Predator, Dork, and Juggernaut(though, this is a very nice move). A pronounciation of Trochus would be nice also. Later, Ian D. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 18:01:01 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA13994 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 18:01:01 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from saba.wwa.com (saba.wwa.com [198.49.174.36]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id GAA25126 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 06:11:27 -0700 Received: from [209.107.90.78] (209-107-90-078.chicago.verio.net [209.107.90.78]) by saba.wwa.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id IAA23790; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 08:11:05 -0500 (CDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19991003040129.2923.rocketmail@web119.yahoomail.com> Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 08:24:50 -0600 To: Aaron Johnson , Footbag From: Scott Davidson Subject: Re: [freestyle] Needing some assistance! Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Aaron and all! >So, what I need >from you friendly people is some assistance. I would >like to know how you started training; what skills you >think are more important to learn first and resources >you used to get educated in Freestyle, Kick 1,000 kicks a day... minimum. Get the "Tricks of the Trade" Video by Kenny Shults. - WFA sells it, and they can be found within http://worldfootbag.com/ Keep kicking! See ya! Enlightener, Scott Davidson From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 18:01:21 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA14004 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 18:01:21 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from inetsrv.callplus.co.nz (mail.callplus.co.nz [202.27.103.146]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA17294 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 02:32:42 -0700 Received: by INETSRV with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 16:43:58 +1300 Message-ID: <8186832B88B9D211959E002035F378233AE5B2@INETSRV> From: Adrian Dick To: "'GFSmoothie@webtv.net'" , derric@dallasfootbag.org Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: RE: [freestyle] and some more moves Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 16:43:56 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Nobody likes a Dork. -----Original Message----- The only one I don't like is: DORK. GF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 18:02:12 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA14034 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 18:02:12 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f92.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.92]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA26099 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 06:44:10 -0700 Received: (qmail 81883 invoked by uid 0); 4 Oct 1999 13:43:36 -0000 Message-ID: <19991004134336.81882.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.206.120.240 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 04 Oct 1999 06:43:36 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.206.120.240] From: "Ian Dubman" To: derric@dallasfootbag.org, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] a place for everything and everything in its place. Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 08:43:36 CDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Um, what about toe > op in > ??? Ian D. MUFF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 18:02:19 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA14044 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 18:02:19 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (smtp10.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.200.246]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id GAA26170 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 06:45:28 -0700 Received: from smegma (user-2ivf1il.dialup.mindspring.com [165.247.134.85]) by smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA11811 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 23:45:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19991003234504.0082d210@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: ecrvich@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 23:45:04 -0400 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: [freestyle] A new way?! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Just as Alex DeLarge was skeptical about change in his droogan ranks, so am I with regards to my footwear. But I have made a change nonetheless. I have given up on 4 years of enduring the "shoe of choice" (the Adidas Rod Laver, or ARL for short) for the following reasons: * too heavy (due to that nasty sole material) * inside contour is mediocre at best, especially for wide feet * poor cushioning (hence the need for Spenco insoles) In my opinion, the only thing *really* going for the Laver is the toe design. After seeing shredmaster Jason Cook (ex-Charlottean, now-San Diegoan) making me look like an absolute chump (I was havin' a bad day, really!) in his New Balance something-or-others, I decided to finally seek out a better alternative. As I am not comfortable with sandals (i.e., Tevas), I looked to typical running/walking/tennis shoes. The first catch of the day is the Reebok Classic (the vinyl/suede mix, not the leather ones). Here's the breakdown: Advantages: * very lightweight * nice shock absorption (no need for Spencos IMHO) * KILLER inside contour (more below) * cheap (<=$30) Disadvantages: * poor toe contour (challenging, yes, that's it...) * possibly quick to wear out (unknown as of yet) Yes, that wonderful inside shape is like a siren call. The sole is flared out along the inside surface, creating a wedge shape that probably comes close to the Teva's lure. You must chop out a portion of the insole that pushes against the fabric (the only mod I perform), but this is nothing new for longtime Laver users. My clipper stalls and sets have improved virtually overnight. But I must admit that toe stalls are sketchy...the design provides no help whatsoever and actually hinders things a bit by being slightly rounded. In summary, this is not the unholy grail, but it is, for my tootsies, a far better shoe overall than the ARL. As I find other usable alternatives, I will be sure to inform the masses...I encourage others to do the same. -- Ernest "Scratch" Crvich http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Geek Code v3.1: GCS d- s+:-- a- C++ W++ N++ w+ M- V-- t+ e++ h+ Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 4 18:02:21 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA14052 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 18:02:21 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (smtp10.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.200.246]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id GAA26174 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 06:45:30 -0700 Received: from smegma (user-2ivf1il.dialup.mindspring.com [165.247.134.85]) by smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA29258 for ; Sun, 3 Oct 1999 23:45:05 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19991003231505.00811940@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: ecrvich@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 23:15:05 -0400 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] Some more moves In-Reply-To: <7bd3ed83.252955ee@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 08:59 PM 10/3/99 EDT, Windsen Pan wrote: > Today I got into some heavy shredding and hit some new moves. The first >thing I did wasn't a new move but I thought it was cool: I linked 2 >consecutive smogs together. Based on the length of time this guy has reportedly been doing freestyle (six months or so), my response to this posting is as follows: I quit. -- Ernest "Scratch" Crvich http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Geek Code v3.1: GCS d- s+:-- a- C++ W++ N++ w+ M- V-- t+ e++ h+ Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:01:45 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA14923 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:01:45 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f232.hotmail.com [216.32.181.232]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA06360 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 12:32:26 -0700 Received: (qmail 84029 invoked by uid 0); 4 Oct 1999 19:31:41 -0000 Message-ID: <19991004193141.84028.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 198.168.49.221 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 04 Oct 1999 12:31:41 PDT X-Originating-IP: [198.168.49.221] From: "Mickey Mayer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Needing some assistance! Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 15:31:41 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Aaron Johnson wrote... > I just opened my new Sipa Sipa from the box and >starting kicking around. To tell you the trueth, I >don't have a clue what I am doing. So, what I need >from you friendly people is some assistance. I would >like to know how you started training; what skills you >think are more important to learn first and resources >you used to get educated in Freestyle, (example: >videos and/or books). I went to Barnes and Noble, but >didn't find any books :( Videos would be a very cool >thing! > Any assistance would be greatly appreciated from any >and all participants. All I can tell you man, is if you have absolutely no experience in kickin' the damn thing then that's what you NEED to practice FIRST. Doing tricks may seem cool but everyone starts off by kickin' first then after months or years (depends how long you practice a day, if you're a fast learner, etc.) of knowing how to control THEN you start to pull off some tricks. Drills: Know how to control the bag. Keep it close to you. Of course you don't want to be a hog but again, just learn to control. Going crazy and kickin' the bag to heaven and back may be fun and games but try to stay serious and FOCUSED. Many pros have told me that concentration is the most important thing is footbag. For a basic drill, kick the bag with the inside part of your shoe. I don't know about other pros but this is the part of the shoe that I use the most. Kick with insides, then switch to toes, then outsides. Whatever surface you use, remember that you want the bag to pop straight up so keep the surface of your foot flat (parallel to ground). Once and only after you know how to control, should you move onto stalls. And remember don't get upset if you don't become good right away. Freestyle is a game that takes hours and hours of practice. Keep kickin' Mickey "The Mouse" Mayer From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:01:40 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA14918 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:01:40 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Matthew Cross Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA07531 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 13:04:40 -0700 Received: from MatthewL329@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zAFHFQSVF_ (3941) for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 16:02:34 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3c1af03a.252a61da@aol.com> Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 16:02:34 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] A new way?! To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL for Macintosh sub 56 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 10/4/99 1:26:06 PM, ecrvich@mindspring.com writes: << Just as Alex DeLarge was skeptical about change in his droogan ranks >> What is that, a clockwork orange reference? try not to confuse the non-movie / book buffs (not that I think they're ignorant, they just wouldn't be up on subtle references like that). Wait, and now the title of your letter makes sense, another CWO reference. Anyways... I like lavers. I've tried other things; I used to be a teva boy, but lavers are for me. if you find somethin that's really better, let us all know... Matthew Cross From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:01:50 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA14928 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:01:50 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f119.hotmail.com [216.32.181.119]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA07209 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 12:58:07 -0700 Received: (qmail 78374 invoked by uid 0); 4 Oct 1999 19:57:32 -0000 Message-ID: <19991004195732.78373.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 198.168.49.221 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 04 Oct 1999 12:57:32 PDT X-Originating-IP: [198.168.49.221] From: "Mickey Mayer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] move list - again Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 15:57:32 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Derric and all, I like most of those names but why are there TWO "Snapdragons"? >SNAP DRAGON: >reverse swirl to dragon >clip (or dragon) > same front (swirl) > same dragon >SNAP DRAGON: >a butterfly stall ending in a dragon >toe or clip > op out > op dragon I met Ken Somolinos last year and he was showing me some moves and among them was a Stepping "Snap Dragon." He simply called it a Stepping Butterdragon. I think... Butterfly stall ending in dragon toe or clip > op out > op dragon should be called "Butterdragon" and... Reverse swirl to dragon should be called a "Snap Dragon" Also regarding the "Dragster," >DRAGSTER: >a drifter caught on a dragon >clip > op in > same dragon why not simply call it "Drafter" (Dragon + Drifter = Dra(gon) (Dri)fter = Drafter ). I think there are too names with "Drag" in them. Let's keep it simple guys :) The rest of the moves and names are cool with me. Mickey "The Mouse" Mayer From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:02:05 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA14978 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:02:05 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web803.mail.yahoo.com (web803.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.63]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA02334 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 10:47:49 -0700 Message-ID: <19991004175129.7542.rocketmail@web803.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.253.156.60] by web803.mail.yahoo.com; Mon, 04 Oct 1999 10:51:29 PDT Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 10:51:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Jamez Risden Subject: [freestyle] Holy sh*t To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Man I dont believe it. I go out to the driveway to shred and before ten minutes is up im already hitting ducking/diving butterflys. An hour later im taking the dog out and i put on these regular old sandals and hit a ripwalk. I think im movin' too fast! Just started shreding June of this year. But then again i practice more than anyone else in the world since i have no job and im not in school half the time. Any way i have a couple of questons....... 1.Guiltless is 3 add and up? 2.Trippless is 4 add and up? 3.Any other slang i need to know? 4.What should I school on first out of the blur, ripwalk and stepping butterfly?(i leanrd them all pretty much at the same time)I just want to know if its ok to school them all at the same time, or if its best to do them one at a time. I dont really practice them at all right now, i just throw them into my shreds. 5.Anyone have any advice on hitting the original torque? Ive been doing it crispy style and Adam says its cooler that way but I like Peter Irish style. 6.Why does everyone say that you have to go to a tourney to gain skill? How can you judge that? Have you ever watched somone shred that had never been to tourniments but still loves the sport? I have never been to one...i just watch a lot of videos and practice all the time. I think im doing fine. 7.awwwww forget it....ive rambled on too much. no no no dontstopakickin' Jamez Risden ===== From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:02:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA14988 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:02:11 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f124.hotmail.com [216.32.181.124]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA06536 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 12:39:55 -0700 Received: (qmail 92328 invoked by uid 0); 4 Oct 1999 19:39:24 -0000 Message-ID: <19991004193924.92327.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 198.168.49.221 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 04 Oct 1999 12:39:21 PDT X-Originating-IP: [198.168.49.221] From: "Mickey Mayer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] The adds system Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 15:39:21 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Jamez wrote: >Once upon a time I was just mindin' my own buisiness, >thinking about shreddin,(as usual...just ask adam >mrosko)when suddenly i thought.......why not ditch the >cross-body add? That would make the adds system soooo >much more accurate in jugding the difficulty of a >trick. I hit dragon all the time and it's a pretty hard move. Takes lots of practice to hit. So you're saying that my dragon under "your" adds system is worth only 1 add? That's the equivalent of a toe stall!!! No way is my dragon worth a measly one add. Think about it :) Mickey "The Mouse" Mayer From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:02:15 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA14998 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:02:15 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Matthew Cross Received: from imo20.mx.aol.com (imo20.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.10]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA07198 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 12:57:57 -0700 Received: from MatthewL329@aol.com by imo20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id rUDDa08846 (3941); Mon, 4 Oct 1999 15:57:11 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 15:57:10 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] hop over To: ermik3@yahoo.com, freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL for Macintosh sub 56 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey ERM, crank your ankle for a nice solid inside delay, and hold it out in front of you. the trick is not to move the foot the bag is delayed on, but the entire rest of your body around that. the bag is liable to fall off if you just jump up and swing that leg back under the other, so do like the trick and hop over. good luck matt From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:02:22 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA15008 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:02:22 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.118]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA07230 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 12:59:38 -0700 Received: from postoffice-272.iap.bryant.webtv.net (postoffice-272.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.247]) by mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with ESMTP id MAA19878; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 12:59:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from production@localhost) by postoffice-272.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-d/mt.gso.26Feb98) id MAA08465; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 12:59:27 -0700 (PDT) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhUAvtoWsDtLXwAN9GZF58Z3TS2c06YCFGW8vGq3dil3T4QLaKMIfnLWsxWy From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 15:59:27 -0400 (EDT) To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: Dork Message-ID: <13902-37F9071F-8714@postoffice-272.iap.bryant.webtv.net> Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Pagan. New name for Dork or Dorque? gf From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:02:26 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA15018 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:02:26 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f138.hotmail.com [216.32.181.138]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA09501 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 13:42:51 -0700 Received: (qmail 14667 invoked by uid 0); 4 Oct 1999 20:42:17 -0000 Message-ID: <19991004204217.14666.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 198.168.49.221 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 04 Oct 1999 13:42:14 PDT X-Originating-IP: [198.168.49.221] From: "Mickey Mayer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] hop over Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 16:42:14 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Erm, Do an inside stall, keep it low to the ground about half a foot and hop with your support leg. As you are hopping you must keep your leg (the one with the bag) real steady and you can even lower this leg so to absorb the "shock." Really the easiest way to get a hop-over and build your confidence is to practice with a really flat "ploppy" bag. That's how I learnt it anyway. Practice, Practice Mickey "The Mouse" Mayer From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:02:29 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA15028 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:02:29 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f194.hotmail.com [216.32.181.194]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA10212 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 13:56:51 -0700 Received: (qmail 31178 invoked by uid 0); 4 Oct 1999 20:56:17 -0000 Message-ID: <19991004205617.31177.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 198.168.49.221 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 04 Oct 1999 13:56:08 PDT X-Originating-IP: [198.168.49.221] From: "Mickey Mayer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] A new (bad)way?! Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 16:56:08 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Ernest, Regarding the Reebok Classic shoes that you just got. You are going to drive yourself mad with that toe area. I recently got one of my friends into freestyle, the "real" freestyle and he had been playing with those Reeboks. After weeks of telling him that Rod Lavers were the way to go, he asked me if he could try on my pair. He could not believe how sweet the shoe was. I decided to try on his shoes and I went crazy. That damn toe area is nearly impossible to stall with. You're darn right it's a challenge. Good luck pulling ANY move that requires a toe stall. The only advantage they have over the Lavers are their insides (like you pointed out). Anyway I hope you didn't screw yourself. Good luck. Keep shreddin' Mickey "The Mouse" Mayer From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:03:52 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA15055 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:03:52 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo27.mx.aol.com (imo27.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.71]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA11287 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 14:21:33 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo27.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zMPLa24699 (4001) for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 17:21:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <346772a6.252a743c@aol.com> Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 17:21:00 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Some more moves To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org OH... I see. HAHA I know I couldn't hit that. I'm sure others can though. It sounds like a pretty sweet move to me. Anyone ever hit this? Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:04:09 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA15068 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:04:09 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web114.yahoomail.com (web114.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.86]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA10849 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 14:06:59 -0700 Message-ID: <19991004210536.2778.rocketmail@web114.yahoomail.com> Received: from [204.137.104.61] by web114.yahoomail.com; Mon, 04 Oct 1999 14:05:36 PDT Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 14:05:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Aaron Johnson Subject: [freestyle] Thanks to all... To: Footbag MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey All: I would like to thank all of those people that took a little time to inform me what I need to do, and to get. I'm not sure what the difference is between the Sipa Sipa and the Juice, but the Juice is on the way via FootMart (the lesser of the two). I also have a "Tricks of the Trade" Video by Kenny Shults, on the way. I should be doing some serious, rip-roaring shredding in no time! :) Will I have to up-grade to a better footbag when I start pulling 20-30 tricks together? Well, maybe I will just focus on 20-30 kicks in a row for now!! BA HA Thanks again!!! aj From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:04:17 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA15081 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:04:17 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA12984 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 14:52:31 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJ300N01M3301@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 15:52:15 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 15:52:15 -0600 (MDT) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] hop over In-reply-to: <19991004070353.871.rocketmail@web804.mail.yahoo.com> To: ermo naarits Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, 4 Oct 1999, ermo naarits wrote: > Please tell me the easiest way to do hop over Try it without the bag. Just hold your inside stall (no bag) and jump over it. Try not to move the foot, the bag would be on, too much as slight movement would throw the bag off. Try it back and forth, then use a bag. Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:04:21 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA15091 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:04:21 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailjay.creighton.edu (mailjay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.126]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA14388 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 15:25:21 -0700 Received: from bluejay.creighton.edu (bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by mailjay.creighton.edu (8.8.6 (PHNE_17135)/8.8.6) with ESMTP id RAA08628 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 17:25:11 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 17:25:10 -0500 (CDT) From: Sean Wingert To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Gyro Reverse Mirage In-Reply-To: <199910032329.QAA11384@list.footbag.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Is there a special name for Gyro Reverse Mirage? Sean From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:04:24 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA15104 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:04:24 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA13340 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 14:58:29 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJ300N01MCFLR@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 15:57:52 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 15:57:51 -0600 (MDT) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] A new way?! In-reply-to: <3.0.6.32.19991003234504.0082d210@pop.mindspring.com> To: Ernest Crvich Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all! Speaking of shoes, my girl friend was in a thrift store the other day and saw a pair off shoes made by Adidas called "finalists". She said they are absolutely identical to the lavers except they are made with a canvas mesh instead of nylon. I didn't get to see them myself so I don't know if they are lighter or heavier or what, but I thought it was worth mentioning IF they still make them and anyone wants to go about finding them. Later, Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:04:25 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA15106 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:04:25 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA16598 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 16:13:44 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991004231343.YPHR17351.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org> for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 16:13:43 -0700 Message-ID: <37F9345D.7AA6F81E@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 18:12:29 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] a place for everything and everything in its place. References: <19991004134336.81882.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ian Dubman wrote: > > Um, what about toe > op in > ??? > Yes. What about it. Since I have massive trouble with this set, I'm not even going to try to come up with a name for it. Right now, I've just been going with toe-set blur or toe-set torque, etc. If someone would like to come up with a name for this set, I would be more than happy to set it up so that all of those moves will be displayed next to each other on the list. Let me know if you have any ideas - Sunil? Ian? Also, I forgot the bubba set: clip > op out (plant) > As far as I know, if you do a clipper set legbeater or a clipper set tapdown, they are both called a bubba butterfly. Is there another name for 'bubba same side'? And, the bock set: clip > op in (plant) > (back) spin > note here that I am saying back spin. As described in an earlier post, this spin is indeed a back spin because after the dex, the bag is on the other side of the body. Eg. From a right foot clipper - left leg goes in to out followed by a plant (this is a blurry/stepping type of set) - you spin counterclockwise (this is a back spin because after the dex, the bag is on the right side of your body). And, a twinspinning set: clip > same out (plant) > (back) spin > again, this is not inspinning (though it would be if there was no dex). Instead, after the dex, the bag has switched sides on the body turning this into a back spin. Comments? -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:04:27 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA15119 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:04:27 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Bryan Fournier Received: from imo20.mx.aol.com (imo20.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.10]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA22671 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 18:31:31 -0700 Received: from ShReDStEiN@aol.com by imo20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id yXWGa21483 (3996); Mon, 4 Oct 1999 21:30:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 21:30:21 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Some more moves To: reiddm@magma.ca, freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Windsen Pan wrote: >consecutive smogs together. Anyways, the move i hit was:toe >same in[dex]>op >out[dex]>same out[dex]>same toe [del]. I'm thinking pixie double switchover? >any cool name for it? THat pixie-double switch over is like reverse of Daryl's enterrage... hitting those two moves as a combo would be quite bitchin' ~Bryan F. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 04:56:46 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA15349 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 04:56:46 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f183.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.183]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA29131 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 21:06:02 -0700 Received: (qmail 9402 invoked by uid 0); 5 Oct 1999 04:05:28 -0000 Message-ID: <19991005040528.9401.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 04 Oct 1999 21:05:27 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] reference, and shoes Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 00:05:27 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello stylers. I'd appreciate it if when people reply to a previous message, they cut and paste the relevant parts to which they are referring. It's really frustrating and pointless to receive e-mails that go like this: "Oh yeah, good point. And about that move, i hit that all the time. And for the second part of that, move your leg faster. I don't like the name of the last one. Bjork Godmunsdottir." I've received a bunch of e-mails like this lately, and the subject line usually is equally mysterious. Give antecedents to your pronouns. Cut and paste. Cause I don't know what you're talking about! As for the whole shoe debate, i say people should keep in mind what sort of style they use. If the proposed reebok sneakers have a worse toe box than the Lavers, but a better instep, then look at your style and decide if the pros would outweigh the cons. I wouldn't buy a pair as a gift for Sunil, but Scott D or Rippin' might really dig em. If a pair of shoes had particularly good outsteps, most people wouldn't care, but a guy like Jon Schneider probably would. Take that sort of thing into account when deciding on a freestyle shoe. Keep shredding hard everybody, Ken C-Fan Somolinos nyfa/Bear Feet From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 05:02:09 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA15364 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 05:02:09 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from Market.NET (market.net [140.174.206.2]) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id FAA15361 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 05:02:09 -0700 Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA29625 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 21:18:55 -0700 Received: from [206.67.46.8] (brat1.atext.com [206.67.46.8]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA00197 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 21:18:24 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: brat@market.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19991005040528.9401.qmail@hotmail.com> References: <19991005040528.9401.qmail@hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 21:18:47 -0700 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] reference, and shoes Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 12:05 AM -0400 10/5/99, KeN Somolinos wrote: >Hello stylers. >I'd appreciate it if when people reply to a previous message, they >cut and paste the relevant parts to which they are referring. It's >really frustrating and pointless to receive e-mails that go like >this: Ken, welcome to my hell. . Of course, the Subject: line is meant to mitigate this problem. Anyway, more importantly, I'd request that folks STOP copying the ENTIRE FRIGGIN' MESSAGE into their replies. Most e-mail programs insert the entire message you're repyling to into your outgoing message reply and you're *supposed* to edit it down by deleting all but the most relevant lines. But since nobody ever does this (okay, some people do), I end up doing it all myself for you. :-) Steve From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 05:20:59 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA15418 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 05:20:59 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA29967 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 21:28:21 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991005042752.DLXG17351.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 21:27:52 -0700 Message-ID: <37F97E02.76B5CA9@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 23:26:42 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jamez Risden CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Holy sh*t References: <19991004175129.7542.rocketmail@web803.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Jamez Risden wrote: > > 1.Guiltless is 3 add and up? Yes. > 2.Trippless is 4 add and up? Yes. > 3.Any other slang i need to know? and yes. Tiltless means all twos and higher. The reason that I'm pointing this out is because if you've been kicking for a few months, you should strive for tiltless play. You asked if you were going too fast. Probably yes. Before you start worrying about playing out of your fours, you should have ALL of your threes on both sides - equally. Don't dig yourself into a hole from the start. If you are hitting your fours on both sides, that is great. But, I have a feeling you are sacrificing your weak side so that you can hit all of these new moves on your strong side. Don't do that. Before you should even worry about guiltless play, you should be able to hit 10+ tiltless on demand. Try for 30+ tiltless with a lot of threes. Then worry about taking the twos out of your game - slowly. The same holds true for tripless. You should be able to do 30+ guiltless with a lot of fours before you start to think seriously about tripless play. Don't rush yourself. If you do, you'll have to do the remedial skooling on the weak side later. I can tell you from experience - that sucks. > 6.Why does everyone say that you have to go to a > tourney to gain skill? How can you judge that? Have > you ever watched somone shred that had never been to > tourniments but still loves the sport? If you go to a tournament, you will understand. Until then, it can't be explained. I promise you that your game will improve faster than you ever thought possible if you go to a big tournament. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 07:35:39 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA15999 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 07:35:39 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net (gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.121.85]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA04154 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 23:40:08 -0700 Received: from Sam (dialup-209.245.74.2.LosAngeles1.Level3.net [209.245.74.2]) by gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA03939; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 23:40:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <001e01bf0efc$63500800$024af5d1@Sam> Reply-To: "Sam Colclough" From: "Sam Colclough" To: , "Ernest Crvich" References: <3.0.6.32.19991003231505.00811940@pop.mindspring.com> Subject: Re: [freestyle] Some more moves Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 23:39:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Yeah I talk to this guy on the net and he has a cool homepage with some freestyle info. He's been playing longer than me and his game sounds solid.. WAAAAAAAAA! From: Ernest Crvich > At 08:59 PM 10/3/99 EDT, Windsen Pan wrote: > > Today I got into some heavy shredding and hit some new moves. The first > >thing I did wasn't a new move but I thought it was cool: I linked 2 > >consecutive smogs together. > > Based on the length of time this guy has reportedly been doing freestyle > (six months or so), my response to this posting is as follows: I quit. > > -- > Ernest "Scratch" Crvich > http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich > Geek Code v3.1: GCS d- s+:-- a- C++ W++ N++ w+ M- V-- t+ e++ h+ > Have footbag, will shred. > From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 07:41:08 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA16053 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 07:41:08 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net (gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.121.85]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA04695 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 23:46:50 -0700 Received: from Sam (dialup-209.245.74.2.LosAngeles1.Level3.net [209.245.74.2]) by gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA09757 for ; Mon, 4 Oct 1999 23:46:48 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <003e01bf0efd$528006a0$024af5d1@Sam> Reply-To: "Sam Colclough" From: "Sam Colclough" To: "Freestyle Mailing List" References: <19991004210536.2778.rocketmail@web114.yahoomail.com> Subject: Re: [freestyle] Thanks to all... Date: Mon, 4 Oct 1999 23:46:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org You don't have to upgrade your footbag. The sport really doesn't require a lot of money spent on equipment. Just buy the video and the footbag. And have some good shoes. That's it. Just take good care of your footbag otherwise you'll take numberous hits for $20.00 dollars and that adds up, I know. From: Aaron Johnson To: Footbag Sent: Monday, October 04, 1999 2:05 PM Subject: [freestyle] Thanks to all... > Hey All: > I would like to thank all of those people that took a > little time to inform me what I need to do, and to > get. I'm not sure what the difference is between the > Sipa Sipa and the Juice, but the Juice is on the way > via FootMart (the lesser of the two). I also have a > "Tricks of the Trade" Video by Kenny Shults, on the > way. I should be doing some serious, rip-roaring > shredding in no time! :) Will I have to up-grade to a > better footbag when I start pulling 20-30 tricks > together? Well, maybe I will just focus on 20-30 > kicks in a row for now!! BA HA > Thanks again!!! > aj > From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 07:55:09 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA16118 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 07:55:09 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from lorica.ucc.usyd.edu.au (lorica.ucc.usyd.edu.au [129.78.64.15]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA05279 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 00:07:16 -0700 Received: from [10.0.5.71] (p1351.net10.usyd.edu.au [10.0.5.71]) by lorica.ucc.usyd.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA12763 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 17:05:27 +1000 (EST) X-Sender: mattsb@pop.ozemail.com.au Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 17:11:21 +1000 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Matt Baker Subject: [freestyle] Crossbody outside? Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org This may be a silly question (always a good indication of one if you start with that), but I am having immense trouble conceptualizing a crossbody outside. What the hell? How can you get a leg across your body, and then hit it with the outside of the shoe? I'm assuming that I have the definition or interpretation wrong, but at the moment it's giving me and my friends some holiday brain material. Thanks -matt. Muttley | mattsb@ozemail.com.au From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 17:05:24 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA16937 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 17:05:24 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (smtp10.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.200.246]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id DAA12453 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 03:37:26 -0700 Received: from smegma (user-2ivf07p.dialup.mindspring.com [165.247.128.249]) by smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA09708 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 00:39:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19991005003940.0084b300@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: ecrvich@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 00:39:40 -0400 To: Freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] reference, and shoes In-Reply-To: <19991005040528.9401.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 12:05 AM 10/5/99 EDT, KeN Somolinos wrote: >As for the whole shoe debate, i say people should keep in mind what sort of >style they use. If the proposed reebok sneakers have a worse toe box than >the Lavers, but a better instep, then look at your style and decide if the >pros would outweigh the cons. And there it is, as clear as an azure sky of deepest summer. Thanks, Ken. "This is what I'm saying." -- Paul Reiser -- Ernest "Scratch" Crvich http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Geek Code v3.1: GCS d- s+:-- a- C++ W++ N++ w+ M- V-- t+ e++ h+ Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 17:05:28 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA16942 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 17:05:28 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Owen Parrish Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com (imo18.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.8]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id DAA12564 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 03:39:36 -0700 Received: from SuperOwen@aol.com by imo18.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zDALa28766 (3953) for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 06:39:08 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <1ffe3e18.252b2f43@aol.com> Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 06:38:59 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Crossbody outside? To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 14 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Alright, imagine this....cliper stall, turn your foot so the outside is facing the sky. This is a xbody outside. I know, sounds gruesome, that's what I thought. The only way I can acheive it is by stalling on a normal outside, then wrapping it around. Try doing that first. Owen "Total Package" Parrish From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 17:05:21 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA16932 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 17:05:21 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (smtp10.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.200.246]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id DAA12452 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 03:37:26 -0700 Received: from smegma (user-2ivf07p.dialup.mindspring.com [165.247.128.249]) by smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA14329 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 00:28:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19991005002833.0083e290@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: ecrvich@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 00:28:33 -0400 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] A new way?! In-Reply-To: <19991004205617.31177.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 04:56 PM 10/4/99 EDT, Mickey Mayer wrote: >had been playing with those Reeboks. After weeks of telling him that Rod >Lavers were the way to go, he asked me if he could try on my pair. He could >not believe how sweet the shoe was. I decided to try on his shoes and I went To reiterate what I said, I have been using Lavers for "real freestyle" for four years. I am quite familiar with their performance. 8^) For my feet and my style, the Reeboks are a better shoe (and I'm hoping I'll find something even better yet). I'm not asking you to switch, or even to believe me. I'm simply informing those who might be interested in alternatives (in addition to Tevas). Mo' choices is mo' better. >crazy. That damn toe area is nearly impossible to stall with. You're darn >right it's a challenge. Good luck pulling ANY move that requires a toe >stall. It's not that bad. I can still hit eggbeaters and blurs just fine...they require more control and finesse now, which may not be a bad thing at all. And after only four sessions with these shoes, I've significantly improved my string length, confidence, and overall enjoyment. What else could I ask for? Oh right, conformity! I always forget that one. >The only advantage they have over the Lavers are their insides (like Not true: weight, cushioning, and price are others. Enjoy your Lavers, I'll enjoy my Classics, Ernesto -- Ernest "Scratch" Crvich http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Geek Code v3.1: GCS d- s+:-- a- C++ W++ N++ w+ M- V-- t+ e++ h+ Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 17:05:31 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA16947 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 17:05:31 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f18.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.18]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA20813 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 07:13:43 -0700 Received: (qmail 94281 invoked by uid 0); 5 Oct 1999 14:13:12 -0000 Message-ID: <19991005141312.94280.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.206.120.240 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Oct 1999 07:13:12 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.206.120.240] From: "Ian Dubman" To: derric@dallasfootbag.org, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] a place for everything and everything in its place. Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 09:13:12 CDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >From: Derric Scalf >Yes. What about it. Since I have massive trouble with this set, I'm >not even going to try to come up with a name for it. Right now, I've >just been going with toe-set blur or toe-set torque, etc. If someone >would like to come up with a name for this set, I would be more than >happy to set it up so that all of those moves will be displayed next to >each other on the list. Let me know if you have any ideas - Sunil? >Ian? Derric 'The Devil' Scalf. Well, though Sunil and I are the only two people who even mentioned it, I beleive toe mirage set followed by a same side component was decided to be "slapping". The opposite component was a bit more ambiguous, since adding a characterization only lends length to the name. So, "toe blur" will not be "[name] pdx mirage"--especially since the dex is not paradox, hehe--it would simply be "toe-set blur". So, a slapping mirage(same side) and a "toe-set blur"(opp side) for now--this works all moves, but I am late for class and have no more time for examples. I actually see no problem with just dedicating this opposite side category as "toe-set ..." moves--though I personally prefer just "toe...", as in "toe blur", "toe torque", etc., that is just a matter of my spoken vocabulary. If anyone sees a problem with any moves in this classification, please speak now. On a more dreary note, my days of almost daily skoolin' have slipped into oblivion. I keep mustering up a session or two here or there, but I am losing a bit of the edge... Tis a sad story...Work, school, and skool... Later, Ian D. MUFF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 17:05:17 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA16927 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 17:05:17 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Owen Parrish Received: from imo21.mx.aol.com (imo21.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.65]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id DAA12280 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 03:32:52 -0700 Received: from SuperOwen@aol.com by imo21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zYVZa04068 (3953) for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 06:32:29 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 06:32:28 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Holy sh*t To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 14 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org This may be half in jealousy trying to slow you down, since i've been kicking for a year and can't hit all that stuff you just said, but, I know it's also correct. Don't get ahead of yourself. Skool everything you can do now of your weakside. As a matter o fact, have no weakside. I'm proud to say that mine, is actually quite strong. I can do mirages, legovers, butterflys, infinities, clip mirages, and para mirages, on both sides, and string them together pretty well. Just make sure that you learn thing on BOTH sides. It will slow you down in the short run, but in the long run, you'll be thankful. Owen "Total Package" Parrish From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 5 18:16:12 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA17038 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 18:16:12 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.118]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA26532 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 10:06:36 -0700 Received: from postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.91]) by mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with ESMTP id KAA01978; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 10:06:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from production@localhost) by postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-d/mt.gso.26Feb98) id KAA26596; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 10:06:32 -0700 (PDT) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhRpa/6FauIF64FGvwjIWlCQygS7XwIUKmhwOOdclamB5SRm9SaJyq3JIYI= From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 13:06:31 -0400 (EDT) To: mufreestyle@hotmail.com (Ian Dubman) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] a place for everything and everything in its place. Message-ID: <8080-37FA3017-11598@postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Ian Dubman" 's message of Tue, 05 Oct 1999 09:13:12 CDT Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ian wrote: <> Here's experience talkin'......You can maintain your game on once a week, it just FEELS like you're losing your edge. I know, not improving really sucks ! GF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 02:41:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA17384 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 02:41:11 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from lorica.ucc.usyd.edu.au (lorica.ucc.usyd.edu.au [129.78.64.15]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA06497 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 18:15:07 -0700 Received: from [10.0.5.71] (p1351.net10.usyd.edu.au [10.0.5.71]) by lorica.ucc.usyd.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA08201 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 11:14:41 +1000 (EST) X-Sender: mattsb@pop.ozemail.com.au Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <1ffe3e18.252b2f43@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 11:20:30 +1000 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Matt Baker Subject: Re: [freestyle] Crossbody outside? Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >Alright, imagine this....cliper stall, turn your foot so the outside is >facing the sky. This is a xbody outside. I know, sounds gruesome, that's >what I thought. erk. Do you get an extra add for "painful contortion" [XBD][DEL][OW!] Muttley | mattsb@ozemail.com.au From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 02:40:46 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA17372 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 02:40:46 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA01168 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 14:22:40 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zGCNLj4ca_ (4254) for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 17:19:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <346f388c.252bc546@aol.com> Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 17:19:02 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Some more moves To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Thanks Sam for th kind words. But there's a possible error that i saw in your post. you've been kicking longer than i have right? I may be worng. Anyways. Sam is freaking awesome himself. I'm with his idea for naming that move "cokewalk" hehe. Thanks again Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 03:02:48 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA17445 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 03:02:48 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f19.law4.hotmail.com [216.33.149.19]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA08116 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 19:12:33 -0700 Received: (qmail 65974 invoked by uid 0); 6 Oct 1999 02:12:02 -0000 Message-ID: <19991006021202.65973.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 4.54.82.130 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Oct 1999 19:12:01 PDT X-Originating-IP: [4.54.82.130] From: "Amber Wolles" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Just wondering... Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 19:12:01 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was just wondering if you guys like to shred by yourself or with a group more? Do you improve more when you are alone or with others? I find that I do better with other people, because they can give me feedback and encouragement. I would appreciate any thoughts on this. ~Thanks Keep on Shreddin' Everyone -Amber From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 03:24:21 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA17504 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 03:24:21 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law-f153.hotmail.com [209.185.131.216]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA08920 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 19:34:24 -0700 Received: (qmail 96634 invoked by uid 0); 6 Oct 1999 02:33:55 -0000 Message-ID: <19991006023355.96633.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 203.43.147.235 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Oct 1999 19:33:55 PDT X-Originating-IP: [203.43.147.235] From: "Lynton Stephens" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Move list - again Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 19:33:55 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all you Sultans!- I just realised that these 2 moves dont actually need names, they are simply tapping barrage and pixie barrage. Tappage: Tapping double mirage TOE > OP OUT (plant) > SAME IN > SAME IN > OP TOE Smearage: Pixie double mirage TOE > SAME IN > OP IN > SAME IN > OP TOE Eli - sorry for poaching `Guillotine'. Maybe I'll let you have it, but Cataclysm is mine and mine only!! (now I got the dibs). Rip it up- Lynton From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 03:45:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA17570 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 03:45:38 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law-f316.hotmail.com [209.185.130.243]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA09582 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 19:55:08 -0700 Received: (qmail 92467 invoked by uid 0); 6 Oct 1999 02:54:34 -0000 Message-ID: <19991006025434.92466.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 203.43.147.235 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Oct 1999 19:54:30 PDT X-Originating-IP: [203.43.147.235] From: "Lynton Stephens" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 19:54:30 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi again Sultans- There are heaps of moves being hit lately with a duck/dive after a set. Just check out Dave Holton on Sultans. Also, smear, atom smasher and fairy mirage can be hit with a duck/dive. A few days ago I hit omelette, smudge and fairy reverse mirage with a duck/dive between the 2 dexes (after some trying). I was gonna give them names, but maybe there is a way to avoid all my confusing names :) by having a MODIFIER applying to moves with a duck/dive action AFTER THE FIRST DEX. I'm only making this up (suggestions??), but it could be "Alpine". So, an atomic ducking reverse mirage becomes, much more simply, an Alpine Omelette. 2 words, not 4, and no names to remember. Pixie diving mirage (`Assassin') would be Alpine Smear. Pixie diving reverse mirage would be Alpine Smudge. Blurry diving mirage (Spike Hammer) could be Alpine Blur. Stepping diving pdox DLO (?) would be Alpine Fog. Get it? There are plenty more. Cool moves (e.g. Gauntlet: `alpine' blurry torque), &/or well established ones (e.g. Ripped Warrior: alpine ripwalk) could still have names, obviously. I think it would be a handy way of describing moves, but let me know what you think. Note that diving DLO is different from alpine DLO, ducking switch is different from alpine switch. There is no overlap. Just a thought, rip it up all- Lynton From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 04:27:30 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA17849 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 04:27:30 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f137.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.137]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA10306 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 20:29:28 -0700 Received: (qmail 70512 invoked by uid 0); 6 Oct 1999 03:28:59 -0000 Message-ID: <19991006032859.70511.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Oct 1999 20:28:58 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: mfcshred@hotmail.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 23:28:58 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all. >Blurry diving mirage (Spike Hammer) could be Alpine Blur. Spike Hammer/Spy Camera is blurry ducking mirage. Oh, and absolutely nothing personal in the least, but I don't like the proposed set/concept names of slapping, alpine, or furious. I think furious whirl is a great name, i love it, but i think a barraging set should remain "barraging." Barraging torque is barroque, furious osis doesn't feel the same. Again, these are just my subjective opinions, and nothing personal against all you crazy shredheads out there. Keep up the good work everyone! Ken CF Somolinos nyfa From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 05:16:51 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA17970 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 05:16:51 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA11483 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 21:28:27 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991006042823.PYEL13309.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 21:28:23 -0700 Message-ID: <37FACFB3.66745E0F@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 23:27:31 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: KeN Somolinos CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex References: <19991006032859.70511.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Oh, and absolutely nothing personal in the least, but I don't like the > proposed set/concept names of slapping, alpine, or furious. I think furious > whirl is a great name, i love it, but i think a barraging set should remain > "barraging." Barraging torque is barroque, furious osis doesn't feel the > same. One comment here. A torque is a blurry osis. A flux is an atomic osis. Just because a move is called "furious osis" doesn't mean that it isn't a barroque. I like the idea of having individual move names. But, I also like the idea of having strictly defined set names. Each move should be able to be broken down into a set and a move. That way, when you are talking about a move, everyone can picture it. How many times have you been asked what a ripped warrior is? When you say a blurry ducking butterfly, people understand. That doesn't mean that you should stop calling it a ripped warrior. It just means that having easy to follow components make describing a move a lot easier. The one thing that I'm worried about is that the whole set naming thing will lag behind the move naming. Take blurrier for example. Since it was named before the blurry set was defined, it is a bit confusing. Blurrier isn't even blurry. I don't see any harm in defining the sets for the sake of consistency. Just my opinion. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 05:17:10 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA17980 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 05:17:10 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-1.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.119]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA11290 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 21:19:02 -0700 Received: from postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.91]) by mailsorter-105-1.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with ESMTP id VAA03673; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 21:18:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from production@localhost) by postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-d/mt.gso.26Feb98) id VAA26593; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 21:18:55 -0700 (PDT) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAuAhUAgv5nFTsYeeZ7oBySJRhzlW0UYGkCFQDIVMRUW9iAdzxNzreS5hLMYyXSnQ== From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 00:18:55 -0400 (EDT) To: footbug@hotmail.com (KeN Somolinos) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Message-ID: <8077-37FACDAF-28261@postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "KeN Somolinos" 's message of Tue, 05 Oct 1999 23:28:58 EDT Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ken wrote: >I think furious whirl is a great name, i >love it, but i think a barraging set should >remain "barraging." Yep, I totally agree ! GF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 05:17:15 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA17990 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 05:17:15 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from dept.english.upenn.edu (sunilj@DEPT.ENGLISH.UPENN.EDU [130.91.75.246]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA11513 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 21:29:50 -0700 Received: from localhost (sunilj@localhost) by dept.english.upenn.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3/SAS.05) with ESMTP id AAA04248; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 00:29:43 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 00:29:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Sunil Jani To: Derric Scalf cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] a place for everything and everything in its place. In-Reply-To: <37F6DA7B.71F64C49@dallasfootbag.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Sat, 2 Oct 1999, Derric Scalf wrote: > > furious: > clip > op in > same in > > Furious refers to barraging (set) paradox moves (ie the barraging equivalent of blurry), so it should be: clip>op in > same in> OP (paradox) > "furious same side"? clip>op in>same in>[plant] same (dex) this is called "high stepping"... as in high stepping butterfly (ie the barraging equivalent to stepping). clip>op in>same in> [plant] same out> op clip... -SJ From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 05:36:10 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA18042 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 05:36:10 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f222.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.222]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA11750 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 21:45:11 -0700 Received: (qmail 85205 invoked by uid 0); 6 Oct 1999 04:44:42 -0000 Message-ID: <19991006044442.85204.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Oct 1999 21:44:41 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: derric@dallasfootbag.org, footbug@hotmail.com Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 00:44:41 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all, Derric wrote: > >One comment here. A torque is a blurry osis. A flux is an atomic >osis. Just because a move is called "furious osis" doesn't mean that it >isn't a barroque. I understand that, I just don't prefer "furious" to "barraging." Oh, and according to current definitions, a torque is not a blurry osis, not even when crispy, and a flux is not atomic, regardless of the style it is done. >I like the idea of having individual move names. >But, I also like the idea of having strictly defined set names. Same here. >How many >times have you been asked what a ripped warrior is? When you say a >blurry ducking butterfly, people understand. Um, actually people usually just laugh at the thought of a skinny short kid hitting a move called "Ripped Warrior." Also, a ripped warrior is a stepping ducking butterfly. >The one thing that I'm worried about is that the whole set naming thing >will lag behind the move naming. Take blurrier for example. Since it >was named before the blurry set was defined, it is a bit confusing. >Blurrier isn't even blurry. Whirling dervish doesn't have a whirl. Set names are fine, but we needn't go overboard naming all the different sets/cases for sets. Shred on folks. Ken CF Somolinos Bear Feet/nyfa From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 06:02:03 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA18092 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 06:02:03 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.118]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA12181 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 22:13:18 -0700 Received: from postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.91]) by mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with ESMTP id WAA11466; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 22:13:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from production@localhost) by postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-d/mt.gso.26Feb98) id WAA29822; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 22:13:19 -0700 (PDT) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAuAhUAhsvbClVKviBeImVu2wHsBAJibRQCFQCwudtqmjp2gcOih1W/lm4IarOMYg== From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 01:13:19 -0400 (EDT) To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] A new way?! Message-ID: <8078-37FADA6F-22921@postoffice-273.iap.bryant.webtv.net> Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all ! This is to all the shoe messages. You can do extremely well in just about any low top shoes, no matter what your style is. Whatever shoes you get used to are the ones that work best for you. Fifteen years ago ( aghhh ) I kicked in high tops( it WAS the 80's ). A year later was running shoes. Although I did not enjoy as much success as Sweet Feet Pete and his Threepeat, I liked them A LOT. And Pete did some SERIOUS toe moves in HIS running shoes. Some of you newbies wouldn't remember, but he would just GO OFF on the rake strings : ) Then I had some generic Playboy low tops that were kinda like a ripoff of the old Nike Avengers ( a greatly underappreciated shoe ), Andy Linder's favorites if I recall correctly. I remember seeing Andy pull Ripsteins and Double atw's on BOTH sides (toes and insides), like in '86 ! Anyways......Then Torbin Wigger gets Jay Moldenhauer and me a pair of the much coveted, illustrious Kaepa's. Jay and I liked them so much, that we used them brand new ( we didn't modify our shoes, then ) in the '89 Worlds Finals, good for a 4th place! I thought those shoes were magical. I didn't know what I was gonna do when they broke down. Looking back, I realize I was kicking a lot, every day, which is what will make the magic : ) . So, then came the new shoe of choice, not to be mentioned here because of their sheer EVIL. My shins and knees started to recover once I got into a pair of Lavers. I am still enjoying my Lavers, after several years. What I came all this way to say is, kick a HUGE amount in the shoes you have and never be afraid to try some new ones. Sorry to go on and on, I guess I was just in a sharing mood : ) Take care, shred hard ! GF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 06:47:21 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA18204 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 06:47:21 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from harrier.prod.itd.earthlink.net (harrier.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.121.12]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA12942 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 23:02:10 -0700 Received: from Sam (dialup-209.244.72.125.LosAngeles1.Level3.net [209.244.72.125]) by harrier.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA22166 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 23:01:55 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <001c01bf0fc0$39d28a60$7d48f4d1@Sam> Reply-To: "Sam Colclough" From: "Sam Colclough" To: References: <346f388c.252bc546@aol.com> Subject: Re: [freestyle] Some more moves Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 23:01:19 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Windsen Pan wrote: > Thanks Sam for th kind words. But there's a possible error that i saw in your > post. you've been kicking longer than i have right? I may be worng. nope your not wrong, I meant to say youve been kicking LESS time than me and you rock. Anyways. > Sam is freaking awesome himself. I'm with his idea for naming that move > "cokewalk" hehe. thanks a lot! From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 06:47:53 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA18220 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 06:47:53 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mimas.csuchico.edu (mimas.CSUChico.EDU [132.241.82.12]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA12944 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 23:02:11 -0700 Received: (from guru@localhost) by mimas.csuchico.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA21153; Tue, 5 Oct 1999 23:01:05 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 23:01:05 -0700 (PDT) From: "Tara R. Ohr" X-Sender: guru@mimas.csuchico.edu To: Amber Wolles cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Just wondering... In-Reply-To: <19991006021202.65973.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I think you need both when you practice. It's good to work with others, so that you can give and receive new ideas. And it's good to spend time alone perfecting a move you may have learned in the circle. Both are definiently important in practice. -tara From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 18:43:58 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA19090 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 18:43:58 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f137.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.137]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA30565 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 10:18:36 -0700 Received: (qmail 37186 invoked by uid 0); 6 Oct 1999 17:18:11 -0000 Message-ID: <19991006171811.37185.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.206.120.240 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 06 Oct 1999 10:18:08 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.206.120.240] From: "Ian Dubman" To: footbug@hotmail.com, derric@dallasfootbag.org Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 12:18:08 CDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >From: "KeN Somolinos" >Oh, and >according to current definitions, a torque is not a blurry osis, not even >when crispy, and a flux is not atomic, regardless of the style it is done. I need some clarification, please explain this to me. According to what Derric is putting in as the OFFICIAL moves page, torque IS a blurry osis (see the recent "place for everything" post); furthermore, flux has ALWAYS been atomic osis(or at least since rev miraging opp [component] has implied "atomic"). Are you confusing "op [any component]" with "op [dex]" so that only moves with two dexs get the notation? I don't beleive that is correct--it is entirely too exclusive for a lot of moves. Late, Ian From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 18:43:33 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA19085 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 18:43:33 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Will Wells Received: from symail.syda.org (hidden-user@symail.syda.org [208.130.6.77]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA31158 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 10:35:44 -0700 Received: by EXCH01 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <4MLTGQTJ>; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 13:35:47 -0400 Message-ID: <239F4317F94BD211A99A00104B72344049510D@EXCH01> To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Practice Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 13:35:45 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey All I have been "hacking" for a long time (Two summers, but passively) and have all the basics down, but recently I started trying big tricks(For you guys fundamental moves, I don't know why I never tryied them before, guess I didn't thnk I was good enough, I just awed at what you guys accomplish...) Anyways I started pulling Pixies and Mirages and found out that my left leg is a little worse than my right and that I was wondering if practicing these moves will improve my toe/inside stall instead of just practicing them[left toe/inside stalls] by themself. By now my legs are strong and flexible enough to pull dex's easy (In fact I find them easy) but I was just wondering if I could just practice the fun stuff like mirage and pixie and if I did would my left leg catch up if I did both sides equally? Also is it just me or is it more enjoyable to play in public places and with people? Will "?" Wells From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 20:33:22 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA19240 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 20:33:22 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f142.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.142]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA01051 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 11:59:17 -0700 Received: (qmail 3333 invoked by uid 0); 6 Oct 1999 18:58:48 -0000 Message-ID: <19991006185848.3332.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 06 Oct 1999 11:58:48 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: mufreestyle@hotmail.com, derric@dallasfootbag.org Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 14:58:48 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello all Ian wrote: >I need some clarification, please explain this to me. According to what >Derric is putting in as the OFFICIAL moves page, torque IS a blurry osis If you do an original style osis, there is no set. None. You just do a quick mirage, but it is not a set. The bag isn't traveling up after the dex. So this is not a blurry osis, because blurry implies: 1. a set 2. pdx. So even a crispy torque is not blurry, since there is no dex after the set, it is not paradox, and therefore cannot be blurry. >furthermore, flux has ALWAYS >been atomic osis (or at least since rev miraging opp [component] has >implied >"atomic"). Are you confusing "op [any component]" with "op [dex]" so that >only moves with two dexs get the notation? No, I am not confusing anything. When Eli first proposed atomic, I believe he said it was a reverse miraging set where the next dex was in to out. Later this was modified to a more inclusive definition, which was probably a good thing, but flux has not "ALWAYS" been atomic osis. Just as blurry, stepping, pixie, and fairy are sets, i think "atomic" should only be used as a set name when it is actually a set. The original way of doing eggbeater and flux didn't involve a set at all, it was just moving your legs really fast. Crispy eggbeater and OR eggbeater are two different moves, and I feel only the former should be considered atomic. A while back there was some controversy about how blurry should be defined, with Derric proposing blurry be stepping set followed by opp component and people like Eric Wulff and myself arguing that blurry remain as stepping pdx. When was this officially resolved and changed to Derric's definition? Just wondering. Ken CF Somolinos nyfa/Bear Feet From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 22:57:16 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA19350 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 22:57:16 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA05897 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 14:59:16 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJ700001BM28Z@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 15:56:26 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 15:56:26 -0600 (MDT) From: KAPLAN BRADLEY M Subject: Re: [freestyle] Crossbody outside? In-reply-to: To: Matt Baker Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Tue, 5 Oct 1999, Matt Baker wrote: > How can you get a leg across your body, and then > hit it with the outside of the shoe? This is called a "Dragon". Owen replied with what it looks like and it just sounded painful the way he described it. In actuality it's not, with some stretching and practice. Here's a good way to start. Do a regular outside delay. Then bring your foot around behind you (as if you were doing an osis, but keep the outside delay) until it is in the xbody position. Again it will take some practice and stretching, but doesn't it all. Good luck, BRAD By the way, get "Sultans Of Shred". I have yet to get a copy, but I believe Jon Schneider is on it and he is the DRAGONMASTER. You can get it by e-mailing Eli Piltz ezshredz@yahoo.com From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 23:13:01 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA19389 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 23:13:01 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA06411 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 15:19:18 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJ700601COB88@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 16:19:23 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 16:19:23 -0600 (MDT) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: [freestyle] Flyers To: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Unfortunately I really suck at flyers. But I think they are great. Especially the harder they get. I can hit a couple the end of a string moves, but can't link them or play out of them other than to kick the bag. Eric Wulff is my idol in this area. HOWEVER, I was playing the other day and hit some new ones (for me at least) and was wondering if anyone has hit them or seen them or tried them or even cares about them. The first one was done just like a legbeater but instead of the xbody delay you do a flying clipper. Job's toe> op out> op out> xbody flyer The other was a ripwalk but with a flying clip instead of a delay. I don't feel like Jobbing it (Jobing it?) because I'm sure y'all know what I mean. And I have to say, I've heard criticism from people who think flyers are stupid and I absolutely disagree. Personally I think they are harder to throw into a string, link, and play out of because of all the jumping up and down and they deserve much respect and much more play. One last thing. Does anyone out there hit flyers with a toe instead of xbody? I was trying to hit a flying blur the other day and I could hit it, but the bag always flew off and was totally unplayable. Comments, questions, criticisms??? Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 6 23:35:27 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA19417 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 23:35:27 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f230.hotmail.com [216.32.181.230]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA07577 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 15:50:40 -0700 Received: (qmail 58695 invoked by uid 0); 6 Oct 1999 22:50:12 -0000 Message-ID: <19991006225012.58694.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 198.168.49.221 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 06 Oct 1999 15:50:12 PDT X-Originating-IP: [198.168.49.221] From: "Mickey Mayer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Crossbody outside? Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 18:50:12 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Here's a nice story. I met Ken Somolinos at a tournament an he showed the dragon. I was soon impressed by this move that I immediatally started to practice my flexibility. After a day or two of seeing no improvement. I decided to manually bend my leg into the dragon move. I bend and bend and bend then suddenly I heard a POP. I was in pain for a day or so but now I can get dragon whenever I want. Just something to consider if all else fails. Bon Appetit. HAHAHHAHAHAHHAHHA Mickey "The Mouse" Mayer From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 7 00:42:40 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA19514 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 00:42:40 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Josh Childs Received: from imo23.mx.aol.com (imo23.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA09234 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 16:46:43 -0700 Received: from Nageylum@aol.com by imo23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id iZTKa17430 (3998); Wed, 6 Oct 1999 19:45:50 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.35109552.252d392e@aol.com> Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 19:45:50 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex To: mufreestyle@hotmail.com, derric@dallasfootbag.org CC: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 41 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 10/6/1999 7:53:12 PM !!!First Boot!!!, footbug@hotmail.com writes: << When was this officially resolved and changed to Derric's definition? >> list serve is turning in to a cat fight . . . . . he he he i think this happens as soon as it gets put up on footbag.org. i could be wrong but i just assume that footbag.org is right, it can't do any wrong. look at steve his site i great. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 7 00:42:28 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA19509 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 00:42:28 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from firefly.prairienet.org (firefly.prairienet.org [192.17.3.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA08450 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 16:19:43 -0700 Received: from bluestem.prairienet.org (bluestem.prairienet.org [192.17.3.4]) by firefly.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA14428 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 18:19:48 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from konrad@localhost) by bluestem.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA18667; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 18:19:47 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 18:19:46 -0500 (CDT) From: Philip Summers Subject: [freestyle] xbd toe set To: freestyle@footbag.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I've been playing around with a move that goes something like: op out [dex] > toe set > same out [dex] > op clip [xbd][del] after a move that ends on a right toe, I scoop the bag back like I'm gonna throw a pendulum, but then I bend my leg in to xbd letting the bag go up the left side of my body, finishing off with an infinity butterfly. Where I live, there's not my footbag action so I'm not up to speed on all the new moves and concepts. Maybe someone's already doing this move, but if not, I propose that it be a one-add set for a delayed bag wrapped around the support leg [dex] just before the set, called "penny" (for pendulum). I've also hit mirage and pdx mirage and osis (both ways) off a penny set Also, here's a new one- set > back spin [bod]> jump [bod]> clip [xbd][del]> op in [dex]> (land) like a spinning reverse eclipse, TRY IT! it's fun. I showed it to Scott D at MW regionals and he seemed to like it. I call it "Calypso". From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 7 00:53:23 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA19556 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 00:53:23 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from admin.cgocable.net (admin.cgocable.net [24.226.1.21]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA09657 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 17:03:23 -0700 Received: from [24.226.9.44] (cgowave-9-44.cgocable.net [24.226.9.44]) by admin.cgocable.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA24960 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 18:31:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199910062231.SAA24960@admin.cgocable.net> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express for Macintosh - 4.01 (295) Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 18:43:30 -0400 Subject: [freestyle] Kicks From: "Neil Bearse" To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey. i was at a sports store today, and i found a pair of Adidas shoes, called the Adidas Beta. theyre green with the 3 stripes on em, with nice flat insides and outsides, and seem to be quite light. they have a nice toe box, which almost seems modify-able. Anyone tried these? Neil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 7 06:08:06 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA20074 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 06:08:06 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net (gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.121.85]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA20493; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 22:08:04 -0700 Received: from Sam (dialup-209.245.79.116.LosAngeles1.Level3.net [209.245.79.116]) by gull.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA11117; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 22:08:05 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <000001bf1081$dcf91440$744ff5d1@Sam> Reply-To: "Sam Colclough" From: "Sam Colclough" To: , "Freestyle Mailing List" Subject: [freestyle] California State Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 22:07:12 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello, I need some information on the California State Footbag Championships. I don't have that much money so I'll probably just be able to afford a round trip airplain ticket. I'm sure there are people sharing hotels right? And do we have to register in advance? I live in Los Angeles, is there anybody commuting up there? I am a high school student so its hard for me to do things like this unless I have all the facts, thats where you come in. :c) Anyway, this will be my first tournament and I'm not great so I plan to enter in open singles freestyle. Thanks a lot for any info you can give me about schedule or people I can room with or just what to do to prepare for a tournament. (ex. routine and stuff)... Thanks again, Sam Colclough From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 7 06:06:53 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA20047 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 06:06:53 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f27.hotmail.com [216.32.181.27]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id SAA11952 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 18:24:58 -0700 Received: (qmail 20170 invoked by uid 0); 7 Oct 1999 01:24:34 -0000 Message-ID: <19991007012434.20169.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 216.44.107.75 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 06 Oct 1999 18:24:34 PDT X-Originating-IP: [216.44.107.75] From: "Stan Sagalovskiy" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] leg "clicks" Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 21:24:34 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org alright, i've been practicing a lot lately, just stalls and allarounds, and my right leg keeps 'clicking' or something. i can usually snap it back into place (it's not as painful as it sounds) but i was just wondering if that's common with beginners and if i should just practice it off or chill for a week or so, and let it rest. thanks all. -Stan. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 7 06:07:12 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA20053 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 06:07:12 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from inetsrv.callplus.co.nz (mail.callplus.co.nz [202.27.103.146]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA11912 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 18:22:39 -0700 Received: by INETSRV with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id <4LRH9BBF>; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 14:22:00 +1300 Message-ID: <8186832B88B9D211959E002035F378233AE60B@INETSRV> From: Adrian Dick To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] First in 2000 to hit Mobius? Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1999 14:22:00 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Just in case anyone wants to know who will be the first in the world to shred it up in the new millenium - it will be me and Stuart in New Zealand !! We have a list of all the moves we can hit and we are going to run through them when it hits Midnight... WOOHOOO ! PS. the first 4 dex move to be hit should be called Millenium... just coz it sounds cool From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 7 06:07:26 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA20058 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 06:07:26 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web803.mail.yahoo.com (web803.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.63]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id SAA12632 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 18:50:27 -0700 Message-ID: <19991007015600.10469.rocketmail@web803.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.248.158.167] by web803.mail.yahoo.com; Wed, 06 Oct 1999 18:56:00 PDT Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 18:56:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Jamez Risden Subject: [freestyle] damnit I cant think of a subject To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all, Like I said about a month ago, im dumb but not that dumb. I am totally aware that I need to keep both of my sides even. I only hit my blur on my bad side. Ive hit it on my good side once but ive only tried a couple of times. I proud yet ashamed to say that the only move I have trouble with on my right foot is the atw. hehehe. My right foot atw sucks yet i can do the paradon circling the bag twice with my right foot. Now for a couple of questons. 1.What is an infinity? Someone led me to belive it is a clipper to op side butterfly. That cannot be right cause thats just two seperate moves. 2.How can I get ahold of this sultons of shred video ive been hearing about? It sounds phat and i need some VHS so i dont have to sit here on the net for two hours waiting for ten seconds of video to load. 3.Why would anyone want to go trippless? There are sooo many phat ass 3 add tricks that I wish i could do. I just dont see why anyone would want to push them out of their shred. Im not talking about the easy ones like whirl or butterfly. Im talking about the eggbeater and stuff like that. I just cant seem to get my feet to do any of that frontside stuff. I have trouble with the double mirage or barrage is what i belive its called. Well Id better stop typing so I can go to dallasfootbag.org to check out some video. Ive watched them all about 50 times cause for some reason I cant watch the ones at footbag.org. Is anyone else having this problem? Ugh! I cant wait to see the new site. dontstopashredin' i KNOW i wont Jamez Risden ===== From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 7 06:07:28 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA20063 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 06:07:28 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.clearsail.net (mail.clearsail.net [207.252.227.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA14588 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 19:54:18 -0700 Received: from rtgilber (usr84.clearsail.net [207.252.227.84]) by mail.clearsail.net (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA12384 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 20:22:30 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002701bf1064$af9ded80$54e3fccf@rtgilber> From: "James Gilbert" To: Subject: [freestyle] Linking Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 20:38:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was putting together some moves for my routine in the Texas State, and was thinking of some moves I could do that would fall under the Unusual catagory. What are some good ways (worth two or three adds, i'm trying to go tiltless) to link a pincher or sole delay? I'm mainly wanting ideas for the pincher because i'm not totally confident in my sole delays so I probably won't do them in my routine. Also, is dragon in the Unusual catagory? I can do them by outside delaying the bag and moving my foot into crossbody and can sometimes do a mirage out of a dragon. That would be another possibility. James "ska boy" Gilbert sorry if my nickname sucks, everyone at school either calls me that or "hacky sack boy", but i'm trying to get everyone to call the sport footbag, it's correct name From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 7 06:27:56 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA20126 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 06:27:56 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from vortex.more.net (vortex.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA22390 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 22:39:20 -0700 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by vortex.more.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA07330 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 00:39:22 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: [freestyle] Linking Message-Id: <000000398363022119587@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 00:39:47 -0500 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 3.1 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Wed, Oct 6, 1999, 8:38:34 PM US CST James Gilbert wrote: >What are some good ways (worth two or three adds, i'm trying to go tiltless) >to link a pincher or sole delay? I'm mainly wanting ideas for the pincher >because i'm not totally confident in my sole delays so I probably won't do Right clip -> left mirage -> right calf delay (or pincher). A "Cork" 'cause its like a torque but it stops short at the calf. Try ATW's to heel, calf, and sole (the sole can be pretty hard). Then again, TX State won't be using the complex judging system, so you shouldn't need to worry about "filling the comp cards". Just try to strike a balance between doing tricks and keeping the bag off the ground. ______________________________________ Derrick Fogle From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 7 06:37:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA20148 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 06:37:11 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f260.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.240.37]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA22719 for ; Wed, 6 Oct 1999 22:47:51 -0700 Received: (qmail 734 invoked by uid 0); 7 Oct 1999 05:47:25 -0000 Message-ID: <19991007054725.733.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 06 Oct 1999 22:47:24 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: dogbert@clearsail.net, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Linking Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 01:47:24 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey stylers, James Gilbert asked: > >What are some good ways (worth two or three adds, i'm trying to go >tiltless) >to link a pincher or sole delay? OK, in a routine tiltless/guiltless shouldn't be on your mind. If you do a squeeze, that's an individual move. If you do a stepping squeeze, that's another move that gets marked down in your unusual category. I don't think they use the world's judging system at Texas States, but the idea is doing the easier components of your harder moves separately from the hard moves is a good way to fill up cards. Different squeeze moves: stepping squeeze, stepping same side squeeze,ducking squeeze,diving squeeze, stepping ducking squeeze. I'm sure pixie squeeze, spinning squeeze, fairy squeeze and a bunch more are possible, but I haven't hit tried any of them. >Also, is dragon in the Unusual catagory? No, but I think it should be. Dragons are useful in competition though, because it is a unique xbody move. Good luck competing, and have fun at Texas states! Ken CF Somolinos nyfa/Bear Feet From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:22:44 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA21956 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:22:44 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.118]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA11091 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 08:31:51 -0700 Received: from postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net (postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.246]) by mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with ESMTP id IAA00232; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 08:31:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from production@localhost) by postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-d/mt.gso.26Feb98) id IAA16418; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 08:31:57 -0700 (PDT) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhRK5EvygEPktxsbO4vgU3bpYIE3qgIUERRahs8VLSKOMKUHd5vi/vhvKiQ= From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1999 11:31:57 -0400 (EDT) To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Linking Message-ID: <26666-37FCBCED-5885@postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF)'s message of Thu, 07 Oct 1999 00:39:47 -0500 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Derrick wrote: >Then again, TX State won't be using the >complex judging system, so you >shouldn't need to worry about "filling the >comp cards". Just try to strike a balance >between doing tricks and keeping the >bag off the ground. Excellent point! "Filling the cards" is just for Worlds ( it's not too soon to start skoolin' next years routine ) and Western Regionals, right? GF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:21:48 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA21941 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:21:48 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-1.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.119]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA10861 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 08:19:58 -0700 Received: from postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net (postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.246]) by mailsorter-105-1.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with ESMTP id IAA24898; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 08:19:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from production@localhost) by postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-d/mt.gso.26Feb98) id IAA15792; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 08:19:58 -0700 (PDT) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhRVxETpvtYRDqUT9s4JofuAeTaH1gIUfoOtssU4k8XQwpSnY9RimhXYFTk= From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1999 11:19:58 -0400 (EDT) To: dogbert@clearsail.net (James Gilbert) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Linking Message-ID: <26666-37FCBA1E-5860@postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "James Gilbert" 's message of Wed, 6 Oct 1999 20:38:34 -0500 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >What are some good ways (worth two or >three adds, i'm trying to go tiltless) to link >a pincher Try spinning pinch, or stepping pinch or pixie pinch ( I suppose you could go fairy pinch, I just never have ). You can also do a miraging pinch, cross body pinch, or gyro pinch. With the exception of x-body, you could do all those to the lap, also. Here's a couple goodies: Around the world pinch pinch [del] > same in [dex] > same pinch [uns] [del] Whirling pinch Clip [del] > op out [dex] > same pinch [uns] [del] Rippin used to do whirling pinch a lot. Hope this helps, GF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:22:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA21946 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:22:11 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA10825 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 08:17:58 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991007151804.EOLY16965.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 08:18:04 -0700 Message-ID: <37FCB995.DA5C47A5@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 10:17:41 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ian Dubman CC: footbug@hotmail.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex References: <19991006171811.37185.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ian Dubman wrote: > > >From: "KeN Somolinos" > > >Oh, and > >according to current definitions, a torque is not a blurry osis, not even > >when crispy, and a flux is not atomic, regardless of the style it is done. > > I need some clarification, please explain this to me. According to what > Derric is putting in as the OFFICIAL moves page, torque IS a blurry osis > (see the recent "place for everything" post); furthermore, flux has ALWAYS > been atomic osis(or at least since rev miraging opp [component] has implied > "atomic"). Are you confusing "op [any component]" with "op [dex]" so that > only moves with two dexs get the notation? I don't beleive that is > correct--it is entirely too exclusive for a lot of moves. Ian, You are ABSOLUTELY correct. Sure, a torque can be done original style and it doesn't seem very blurry - there is no plant after the dex. But, a blurry set is defined as: clip > op in (plant) > op This means that you can follow the blurry set with anything on the other side - whirl, mirage, butterfly or osis. A crispy torque (plant after the first dex) is indeed blurry. I'm not trying to step on anyone's toes, but this is the only way that makes sense to me. Blurry does NOT imply paradox. It only implies "other side". If someone can give me a more concise definition of blurry without using the word "paradox", I might be persuaded to change my opinion. But, the way it is now, no one can define paradox. If blurry must have a paradox component, then blurry suddenly becomes undefined as well. Let's keep it easy - blurry means "stepping opposite side". Same with atomic - it means: toe > op out (plant) > op -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:21:35 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA21936 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:21:35 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from vivid.Vivid.com (vivid.vivid.com [207.105.222.252]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA30811 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 01:34:56 -0700 Received: from vivid.com (adsl-63-195-54-113.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.195.54.113]) by vivid.Vivid.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id BAA22204 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 01:25:10 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <37FC5A85.D0ECF958@vivid.com> Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 01:32:06 -0700 From: Ethan Klein X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] footbag as release Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org jammed solo today. went long and hard. began the session feeling depressed/crestfallen/passionate about a girl in my life. Looked forward to and knew that i could just let the pent-up energy/fixation of my situation flow out through my footbag jam. When you're deep within the act of skooling... breaking down a move/combo, trying it again and again, chiseling away at it, making finite adjustments, finding that groove where you subconsciously just keep tossing the sack back to yourself for another try... you can't help but to just think about footbag... and when I do mentally flow back into contemplating my sub-optimal female situation, it's from a refreshed perspective, I'm generally more at ease. I've always felt thankful toward footbag for providing me a means to temporarily dismiss stressful/painful things in my life and just focus down into something that I know and love. I've always thought that footbag gives so much back. just thoughts - ethan -- (--- Ethan Klein --) * home - 415-753-6695 * * work - 415-817-9705 * From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:22:27 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA21951 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:22:27 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f28.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.28]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA12086 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 08:58:05 -0700 Received: (qmail 49544 invoked by uid 0); 7 Oct 1999 15:57:45 -0000 Message-ID: <19991007155745.49543.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 07 Oct 1999 08:57:44 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: derric@dallasfootbag.org, mufreestyle@hotmail.com Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 11:57:44 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello all, Derric wrote: >Sure, a torque can be done original style >and it doesn't seem very blurry - there is no plant after the dex. But, >a blurry set is defined as: > >clip > op in (plant) > op With an original style torque, dlo, clipper set mirage, the plant occurs when the delay does. How can something be called a set, when the bag is no longer traveling up or at its apex when the second component of the move is executed? It's simply not a set. The only set involved in a torque is a clipper set. To me a stepping set is when the bag leaves your clipper foot, your other leg moves over it superquick, and then you watch the bag shoot up towards your face. If a clipper set mirage becomes a blurry "set," then a haze has two sets in one move, and becomes a double blurry. In this vein of seeing a "set" as strictly a bunch of components that don't take into account whether the bag is still on the way up after the initial components in the definition are executed, then a blizzard could be considered a shooting toe, even when the bag is on the way down after the dexes are executed. Does anybody think this as ridiculous as I do? Ken CF Somolinos Bear Feet/nyfa From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:23:16 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA21988 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:23:16 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f88.law4.hotmail.com [216.33.149.88]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA15744 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 10:19:34 -0700 Received: (qmail 56830 invoked by uid 0); 7 Oct 1999 17:18:10 -0000 Message-ID: <19991007171810.56829.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 161.38.3.19 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 07 Oct 1999 10:18:08 PDT X-Originating-IP: [161.38.3.19] From: "Zeke Ibardaloza" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Flyers Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 12:18:08 CDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >From: Brad Kaplan > . > The first one was done just like a legbeater but instead of the xbody >delay you do a flying clipper. Job's toe> op out> op out> xbody flyer > The other was a ripwalk but with a flying clip instead of a delay. > > And I have to say, I've heard criticism from people who think flyers >are stupid and I absolutely disagree. Personally I think they are harder >to throw into a string, link, and play out of because of all the jumping >up and down and they deserve much respect and much more play. > One last thing. Does anyone out there hit flyers with a toe instead >of xbody? I was trying to hit a flying blur the other day and I could hit >it, but the bag always flew off and was totally unplayable. > Comments, questions, criticisms??? >W'sup, > Unfortunately I really suck at flyers. But I think they are great. >Especially the harder they get. >Eric Wulff is my idol in this area Flyers? Wooooooo, Zeke like fliers! :P I try to put a coulple of flyers into all my strings. I usually hit four or five of them in a row and end the string or try to keep going with an osis.I still cant get any guiltless flyer stings, flying clipper always seems to pop back in there. Wow,so thats like a flying leg beater. I cant hit that move but I've hit fairy (flying ) butterfly. Later, ZEKE From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:23:32 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA21998 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:23:32 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA23708 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 14:43:22 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA330 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 14:43:26 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1999 14:43:26 -0700 Message-ID: <001c01bf110c$fdafcd60$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ian wrote.. >I need some clarification, please explain this to me. According to what >Derric is putting in as the OFFICIAL moves page, torque IS a blurry osis I don't know what is up here... A torque IS a miraging osis and a blurry osis is a blurry osis... or "extra crispy torque" if you like. These are 2 very different moves. A torque is definitely NOT a blurry osis... I don't know if that clarifies anything for you Ian but that's my opinion... ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:29:06 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22009 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:29:06 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f167.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.167]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA26532 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 16:05:02 -0700 Received: (qmail 3622 invoked by uid 0); 7 Oct 1999 23:04:39 -0000 Message-ID: <19991007230439.3621.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.206.120.240 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 07 Oct 1999 16:04:39 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.206.120.240] From: "Ian Dubman" To: footbug@hotmail.com, derric@dallasfootbag.org Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 18:04:39 CDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Derric said: >Ian, >You are ABSOLUTELY correct. I say: Psshheww!! I had thought I was a moron for a day or two... ;-) Actually, I find this whole thread extremely amusing, and I am very surprised to find myself wasting time away from my books to provide continued posts on the matter. But... Two quotes need to be paid attention to in Derric's last post: 1. "Sure, a torque can be done original style and it doesn't seem very blurry - there is no plant after the dex." (It is what is after the hyphen is the true meat of that statement) 2. "Let's keep it easy - blurry means 'stepping opposite side'." That does not sound too absurd to me. >Does anybody think this as ridiculous as I do? Probably not. And, to everyone who does... I think you seriously need to reevaluate why this is such a big deal. Derric is revamping a list of moves that is sorely outdated. In doing so, he is trying make it easier for everyone out there to catch on to new moves and classify them. And doing this by volunteering his own time, I might add. I, personally, may not like everything that is on the list, but until I devote a chunk of my time, and get off my ass, and help Derric, Steve, Eric Cote, etc, I am not going to flagrantly point out all things I don't agree with. We can be suggestive to those helping us, and I am sure they will appreciate it a lot more, if we are being polite while doing so. Catch the drift?? Later, Ian From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:29:08 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22019 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:29:08 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.120.62]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA28003 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 16:55:12 -0700 Received: from Sam (dialup-209.245.72.124.LosAngeles1.Level3.net [209.245.72.124]) by snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA01274 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 16:55:01 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <001f01bf111f$4a51dac0$7c48f5d1@Sam> Reply-To: "Sam Colclough" From: "Sam Colclough" To: References: <000000398363022119587@mlerf.org> Subject: Re: [freestyle] Linking Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1999 16:54:25 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org From: Derrick Fogle, MLERF > Then again, TX State won't be using the complex judging system, so you > shouldn't need to worry about "filling the comp cards". Just try to strike a > balance between doing tricks and keeping the bag off the ground. What is the complex judging system? What is the simple judging system? Which one will be in use during California State champs? Thanks. -Sam From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:29:24 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22029 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:29:24 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from ux4.isu.edu (mta@ux4.isu.edu [134.50.250.16]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA24319 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 14:57:11 -0700 Received: from isu.edu ([134.50.103.15]) by ux4.isu.edu (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with ESMTP id AAA44EA; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 15:58:24 -0600 Message-ID: <37FD18C2.408ED7A8@isu.edu> Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 16:03:46 -0600 From: Bob Green X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: James Gilbert , "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] Linking References: <002701bf1064$af9ded80$54e3fccf@rtgilber> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org James Gilbert wrote: > > What are some good ways (worth two or three adds, i'm trying to go tiltless) > to link a pincher or sole delay? > > Hey James and stylers! If you want link, some of my favorites to play out of squeeze include the basic around the world (bring it up and catch it on the same sqeeze foot after releasing) and pixie (catch it on opposite toe after releasing). Disclaimer: I do not know if these are worth two adds or not, and I really do not care....they are just fun. If you want to play out of a squeeze with a little bit more difficult of a move you could do an opposite side osis (I think this is called a mekenosis), opposite side squeeze, or mirage with the opposite leg doing the dexterity. I have done all of these, and they are fun too....just a bit more difficult. Some suggestions for unusual squeeze moves have already been made. Derrick Fogle said: >Right clip -> left mirage -> right calf delay (or pincher). A "Cork" 'cause >its like a torque but it stops short at the calf. Try ATW's to heel, calf, and >sole (the sole can be pretty hard). Ken Somolinos said: >Different squeeze moves: stepping squeeze, stepping same side squeeze,ducking >squeeze,diving squeeze, stepping ducking squeeze. I'm sure pixie squeeze, >spinning squeeze, fairy squeeze and a bunch more are possible, but I haven't hit >tried any of them. Bob Green (me) says: Pixie squeezes (and cloud delays) are possible, I have done them. In addition, you could try a butterfly cross-body squeeze. I call this a vice-grip though I do not know if it already has a name. If not, this is my suggestion for Derric on his move list. Vice grip is an appropriate name for two reasons: 1) The notion of a squeeze and grip are similar, 2) Do this the wrong way (scissoring your legs too much) and you will figure out why! Other moves that I have come close to hitting and therefore know are possible are pixie cross-body squeeze, and pixie butterfly cross-body squeeze. If any one else has squeeze suggestions, please post them. If you can't tell by reading this, I like squeezes a lot. See ya later, Bob From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:29:27 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22039 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:29:27 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA25186 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 15:19:29 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991007221903.LAHY16965.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 15:19:03 -0700 Message-ID: <37FD1C45.D866A8AA@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 17:18:45 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: KeN Somolinos CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex References: <19991007155745.49543.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org KeN Somolinos wrote: > > Derric wrote: > >Sure, a torque can be done original style > >and it doesn't seem very blurry - there is no plant after the dex. But, > >a blurry set is defined as: > > > >clip > op in (plant) > op > > With an original style torque, dlo, clipper set mirage, the plant occurs > when the delay does. How can something be called a set, when the bag is no > longer traveling up or at its apex when the second component of the move is > executed? Right. I think you misunderstood what I wrote. For a move to be blurry, a plant is required after the dex and before the next component. So, a crispy torque is a blurry osis. As you said, for original style moves, there is no defined "set", so you probably wouldn't want to call an original torque a blurry osis. In the case of ripwalk (blurry butterfly), dlo (blurry legover) and torque (blurry osis), you will probably never refer to the moves as blurry - especially if you do them all original style. The common names are very easy to remember and they sound a lot better. But, what about blurry rev whirl and blurry dyno. These moves involve no paradox component, but they are completely different than stepping rev whirl and stepping dyno. As new moves are created that do not fit into the ambiguous definition of paradox, there are just that many more problems that will arise. This is why I want to call all "stepping opposite side" moves "blurry". Would you rather say "stepping opposite side dyno" or "blurry dyno"? The reason I have applied this "blurry" concept to pre existing moves (ripwalk, torque, etc.) is for the sake of consistency. I don't want the definition of blurry to have to include the undefinable paradox component. It is important to note that paradox exists only to fill a hole in the add system. But, adds have nothing to do with freestyle. Adds belong only in competition. So, why are we limiting the naming of freestyle moves to a patch that was designed to fix the add system? No set requires that there be a paradox component. Why would it? A set simply tells you what happens while the bag is on its way up. A move tells you what is done after the set. Sure, there is some gray area where a set and a move blur together. That happens. I guess my main point is that sets have nothing to do with adds, so why name sets based on whether or not an extra add is awarded? The reason I posted that list of definitions for sets is to get feedback. I think that these are great discussions and I hope I don't piss anyone off with what I'm trying to do. If anyone has a more concise definition for any of those sets, please, post it to the list. As far as including paradox in a set... I just don't think that would make anything easier. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:29:32 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22049 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:29:32 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from smtp2.ncal.verio.com (smtp2.ncal.verio.com [207.20.246.162]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA25185 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 15:19:28 -0700 Received: from jon (as52-157.okldca.pacific.verio.net [207.20.232.157]) by smtp2.ncal.verio.com (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA02862 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 15:19:28 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <009801bf1111$fc91e800$0300a8c0@jon> From: "Jon Azen" To: "freestyle" Subject: [freestyle] Intermediate Comp rmoves? Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1999 15:19:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello, What are some typical moves in an intermediate routine in a competition? I assume maybe mirage, legover, atw, butterfly, etc? Is this correct? Thanks, Jon Oakland, Ca From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:29:59 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22059 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:29:59 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web802.mail.yahoo.com (web802.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.62]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id SAA30558 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 18:17:58 -0700 Message-ID: <19991008012432.12850.rocketmail@web802.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.248.158.64] by web802.mail.yahoo.com; Thu, 07 Oct 1999 18:24:32 PDT Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1999 18:24:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Jamez Risden Subject: [freestyle] New 7 add move???? To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was at the dallas footbag site watching Derric Scalf ripp some sh*t up and I think he could hit this sweet move ive been thinkin' about. I dont know if its on the movelist cause im too lazy to go check it out. Well anyway i noticed he pogos pretty damn good and he can do a whirling osis. Put those together and you got a sweet 6add move. clip>op in[dex]>op in[pdx][dex]>spin[bod]>clip[xbd][del] once you have mastered that you could throw a dive in between the first and second dex for a whopping 7 adds! I would try for it but im not worried about hitting 7 add tricks yet, im still workin' on 3's and 4's. If this hasent been done yet then somone needs to hit it and name the damn thing! you can do it Derric neverstopashredin' Jamez Risden ===== From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:30:28 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22072 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:30:28 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA31441 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 18:52:01 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991007234311.MHBA16965.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 16:43:11 -0700 Message-ID: <37FD2FFE.54B3C226@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 18:42:54 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jamez Risden CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] damnit I cant think of a subject References: <19991007015600.10469.rocketmail@web803.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Jamez Risden wrote: > > Now for a couple of questons. > 1.What is an infinity? It is a butterfly set from opposite clipper. clip > same out > op clip > 2.How can I get ahold of this sultons of shred video > ive been hearing about? Get in touch with Eli Piltz. He's going to be at Texas State with a NEW video (I'm starting rumors here - I think he and Dave will be at Texas State, and I think they have a new tape ready) > 3.Why would anyone want to go trippless? There are > sooo many phat ass 3 add tricks that I wish i could > do. This has come up a bit. There are many more fours than threes. Some cool threes that would be lost are atom smasher, merkon, eggbeater, etc. But, think if you made those into fours - pdx atom smasher, gyro dlo, pixie eggbeater. The possibilities are endless. To make a long story short, I've seen a lot of people who can do all fours. But, in order to keep it looking smooth and increase string length, almost everyone does the threes. Tripless is down the road a bit... > Well Id better stop typing so I can go to > dallasfootbag.org to check out some video. Ive > watched them all about 50 times cause We'll get some more up there soon so that you don't have to watch the same ones over and over. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:30:31 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22083 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:30:31 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA31444 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 18:52:02 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991008001350.MSAW16965.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 17:13:50 -0700 Message-ID: <37FD372E.584DB967@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 19:13:34 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Lynton Stephens CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex References: <19991006025434.92466.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Well, at the risk of starting something else ;) I'm going to say that I really like what Lynton has proposed here. I've been talking with some friends about whether or not there is a need to name the pixie ducking set. Then, we started thinking about naming the blurry ducking set, the stepping ducking set, the atomic ducking set, the fairy ducking set, etc. Lynton's idea takes care of all of that with a very simple approach. Would people please read this again and provide feedback? I like it. Lynton Stephens wrote: > > I was gonna give them names, but maybe there is a way to avoid all my > confusing names :) by having a MODIFIER applying to moves with a duck/dive > action AFTER THE FIRST DEX. > > I'm only making this up (suggestions??), but it could be "Alpine". > So, an atomic ducking reverse mirage becomes, much more simply, an Alpine > Omelette. 2 words, not 4, and no names to remember. > Pixie diving mirage (`Assassin') would be Alpine Smear. > Pixie diving reverse mirage would be Alpine Smudge. > Blurry diving mirage (Spike Hammer) could be Alpine Blur. > Stepping diving pdox DLO (?) would be Alpine Fog. Get it? > There are plenty more. > > Cool moves (e.g. Gauntlet: `alpine' blurry torque), &/or well established > ones (e.g. Ripped Warrior: alpine ripwalk) could still have names, > obviously. I think it would be a handy way of describing moves, but let me > know what you think. Here are my thoughts: Why not have a different modifier to distinguish between ducks and dives? That way, alpine smear would be the name for only one move (either pixie ducking mirage or pixie diving mirage). What about spinning/gyro ducking/diving moves? Would an alpine gyro dlo mean a duck before the dlo or between the dexes of the dlo? -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:30:34 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22093 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:30:34 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA31447 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 18:52:03 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991008001354.MSBF16965.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 17:13:54 -0700 Message-ID: <37FD3731.BC846BD3@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 19:13:37 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Philip Summers CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] xbd toe set References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Philip Summers wrote: > > I've been playing around with a move that goes something like: > > after a move that ends on a right toe, I scoop the bag back like I'm > gonna throw a pendulum, but then I bend my leg in to xbd letting the bag > go up the left side of my body, finishing off with an infinity. Yep. that is a cross body toe set. There isn't a cool name for it as far as I know. The cool thing about it is that it is a x-bdy set so you can do pdx moves (pdx whirl, mirage, etc.) Play around with it. I don't see many people doing them. Try doing a blurry set off of a toe. I haven't hit it (it is real easy to slur the set) but I think it might be possible to hit a x-bdy toe set blur or something. Enjoy The hardest part about the x-bdy toe set is playing into it. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:32:59 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22128 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:32:59 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA31505 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 18:56:09 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJ900001HDW5M@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 19:56:20 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 19:56:20 -0600 (MDT) From: "Brad Kaplan" Subject: Re: [freestyle] Kicks In-reply-to: <199910062231.SAA24960@admin.cgocable.net> To: Neil Bearse Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Wed, 6 Oct 1999, Neil Bearse wrote: > Hey. i was at a sports store today, and i found a pair of Adidas > shoes, called the Adidas Beta. theyre green with the 3 stripes on em, with What are they made out of? Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:33:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22138 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:33:11 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA32292 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 19:16:55 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJ900201ICJNV@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:17:07 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 20:17:07 -0600 (MDT) From: "Brad Kaplan" Subject: Re: [freestyle] damnit I cant think of a subject In-reply-to: <19991007015600.10469.rocketmail@web803.mail.yahoo.com> To: Jamez Risden Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Wed, 6 Oct 1999, Jamez Risden wrote: > 1.What is an infinity? Someone led me to belive it is > a clipper to op side butterfly. That cannot be right > cause thats just two seperate moves. That's exactly what it is. You set with a clipper, do an out to in dex with that same leg and delay the bag on the opposite clipper. I think you said you landed ripwalk right? Well it's that move but with out the first dex, if that makes sense. Check out the move list on FOOTBAG.ORG it explains almost every move conceived of. > 2.How can I get ahold of this sultons of shred video > ive been hearing about? E-mail Eli Piltz (ezshredz@yahoo.com) > 3.Why would anyone want to go trippless? There are > sooo many phat ass 3 add tricks that I wish i could > do. I ask myself that same question and I still can't see a reason to get rid of eggbeaters, scrambled eggbeaters, omelettes, Atom smashers, tapping mirages, smears, fairie mirages, etcetera,etcetera,etcetera.... Later, Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:33:17 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22148 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:33:17 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.120.62]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA01100 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:04:46 -0700 Received: from Sam (dialup-209.245.72.124.LosAngeles1.Level3.net [209.245.72.124]) by snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA24022 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:04:56 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <001101bf1139$d267f6a0$7c48f5d1@Sam> Reply-To: "Sam Colclough" From: "Sam Colclough" To: "Freestyle Mailing List" Subject: [freestyle] routine faq? Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:04:21 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Is there a faq or a web page that tells about how to go about setting up a routine? Like the length of time it should be and specifications for music. If not can you guys tell me some info about routines? I know you all are pros so.... :c) -Thanks, Sam Colclough http://www.penny-lane.com/sam http://mp3.com/hs From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:33:19 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22158 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:33:19 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA01391 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:17:28 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA612 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:17:36 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:17:39 -0700 Message-ID: <002901bf113b$adf63640$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ken wrote... >A while back there was some controversy about how blurry should be >defined, >When was this officially resolved and changed Actually, as well you may know, there is no "official" for definitions of names & sets. There is no governing body in this area. List consensus wins. I think most folks on the list agree with the idea that a blurry set is anything that starts with the same set that is at the beginning of a blur and followed by a component on the op side. So that is how it might wind up being defined on footbag.org. I, of course, consider this a stepping set to the op side. Not a blurry set. ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:33:47 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22169 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:33:47 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA02004 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:36:05 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA694 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:36:09 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] California State Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:36:13 -0700 Message-ID: <002e01bf113e$45b99ce0$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Sam, regarding details on Cal State go to footbag.org - events. Also, I wanted to let you know, since this is your first tourney and you're planning on buying a plane ticket, that this is one of the more casual tourneys in footbag. That means it is real casual. This is not a bad thing at all... One of the coolest guys in all of footbag is running it and it is a total blast. Want to let you know in advance though that it is in the format kinda like a Big Weekend Get Together... a picnic style tourney I call it. Some footbag competition, some partyin & Shreddin... and if it's like the one I went to last year most people are stayin right at Chris's house or camping in his yard. A Great Time... Maybe I'll see ya there.. ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 08:33:50 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22179 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 08:33:50 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA01670 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:25:46 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA675 for ; Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:25:54 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: RE: [freestyle] Flyers Date: Thu, 7 Oct 1999 20:25:57 -0700 Message-ID: <002a01bf113c$d6789580$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I care... :) Brad wrote.. >The first one was done just like a legbeater but instead of the xbody >delay you do a flying clipper. I think you mean finishing with a butterflyer.. Awesome! I think that is really cool Brad! I have done this move. However, I haven't got the set to a point yet where I feel the flyer is legitimate. In other words, I jumped and kicked the bag but it wasn't at a height where I really needed to jump to get to it. I dream of putting it in combos and mixing them up. >The other was a ripwalk but with a flying clip instead of a delay. I >don't feel like Jobbing it (Jobing it?) because I'm sure y'all know what I >mean. >And I have to say, I've heard criticism from people who think flyers >are stupid and I absolutely disagree. "Ripfly"... yes.. also try stepping butterflyer... and I also disagree.. obviously.. >One last thing. Does anyone out there hit flyers with a toe instead >of xbody? I was trying to hit a flying blur the other day and I could hit >it, but the bag always flew off and was totally unplayable. Yes.. I've seen it but can't tell you who. Blurry Dragonflyer... or stepping paradox Dragonflyer... Sweet! ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 16:41:02 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA22483 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 16:41:02 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f166.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.166]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA17543 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 06:59:33 -0700 Received: (qmail 53021 invoked by uid 0); 8 Oct 1999 13:59:17 -0000 Message-ID: <19991008135917.53020.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.206.120.240 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 08 Oct 1999 06:59:17 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.206.120.240] From: "Ian Dubman" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 08:59:17 CDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >A torque IS a miraging osis and a blurry >osis is a blurry osis... or "extra crispy torque" if you like. >These are >2very different moves. A torque is definitely NOT a >blurry osis... >I don't know if that clarifies anything for you Ian but that's my >opinion... Yes, that is what I thought for the most part, but you straightened it out a bit more. Thanks. Ian D. MUFF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 16:40:51 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA22478 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 16:40:51 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f220.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.220]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA16804 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 06:20:26 -0700 Received: (qmail 23899 invoked by uid 0); 8 Oct 1999 13:20:11 -0000 Message-ID: <19991008132011.23898.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 141.84.137.72 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 08 Oct 1999 06:20:11 PDT X-Originating-IP: [141.84.137.72] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] sets Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 06:20:11 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi gang, I'm a bit behind on this, but anyway Ken Somonlinos wrote: >With an original style torque, dlo, clipper set mirage, the plant >occurs when the delay does. How can something be called a set, when the bag >is no longer traveling up or at its apex when the second >component of the move is executed? It's simply not a set. I agree with this to a point. I agree a normal torque is not blurry and for the sake of the move list it would be really silly to link it to other blurry moves when most people hit it original recipy. Calling it mirajing would make a lot more sence. However I would also call the first miraje in a torque or the first reverse miraje in an eggbeater a set even though the bag is not still on the way up when the dex is finished. Why? because there is a definate timing issue with the first dex which can be carried over to other moves. Nameing sets after all should acomplish 2 things, allow us to better explain complicated moves and if possible explain how those moves are performed. Anyway nothing that hasn't been said before, the real reason I wrote is that someone (I really don't feel like searching through the mountain of recent posts) said that barrajing (sp?) cann't be a set because the bag isn't still going up after the set, well it can. I had meant to hold off on posting this till I'd mastered the set, but for a while now I've been toying with what I call twisted, a barrajing set compleated before the bag has peaked out. I still don't have it consistant but I can set above my knee and have almost hit barrajing miraje (twisted blur). It always sounds a little sad when people write in with what they can almost hit, so I'll write back when I finally get some of these moves down. And before I forget megga props to Derric (sp? sorry) for cleaning up the move list and the set names in a very logical way. I've been a big proponent of standardising the set names for clarity and I'm very glad to see it happen, and especially to see it happen with a lot of open feed back. Sorry for the long post. -Andrew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 8 21:07:48 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA22852 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 21:07:48 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f39.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.39]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA24636 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 11:38:22 -0700 Received: (qmail 85718 invoked by uid 0); 8 Oct 1999 18:38:08 -0000 Message-ID: <19991008183808.85717.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 08 Oct 1999 11:38:08 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] sets, food processor, barraging pdx Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 14:38:08 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi everybody. Apologies for responding to multiple threads in a single e-mail. First off, Derric, I think stipulating a plant when describing a set is a good thing too. I don't know how much of a problem I have with your definition of blurry, since all moves that are currently blurry will remain so under your definition. When I asked when this became an official change, it was really just a question. I think Ian took it as me being rude, but it was honestly just something i was wondering. I think Eric summed it up by saying nothing is official, just list serve consensus. I think it's great that Derric is revising the moves list, in my post a while back where I listed the common names of many moves, I also listed a whole bunch of mistakes on the moves list that Derric has since repaired. Speaking of the moves list, Jamez Risden proposed a 6 add move (he described a blurry blender) and asked if it has been hit. Well the answer is yes, it is called a Food Processor, is listed on the moves list, and Paul Munger, Ahren Gehrman, and Chad Devlahovich hit this. I'm sure other people do too, but those are a few that come to mind. I think a dive in between the dexes would make it a lot harder than with a duck in between. I've tried the ducking version, but my blenders are pretty "the," so I don't think i've hit it clean. I'm really sure Eli could hit this. Andrew McCargar wrote about a barraging set and called it "twisted." A barraging pdx mirage would be called a furious mirage to my knowledge, even though I don't like the name "furious" for a set. This runs into the same problems Derric talked about, about having a set imply pdx after the set is completed. Speaking of paradox and sets, let's look at the nuclear set for a moment. If you do a nuclear set, then a leg over with your non-set leg, this is a pdx eggbeater. if you do a nuclear set, then a same leg leg over, it's a double switch over, with no pdx add. Same goes for pdx legbeater vs barfly with a plant. Catch my drift? Shouldn't the pdx be in the set? Now how about this. Gauntlet is 7 adds because even though a dex and a duck separate the set and the torque, the torque is still considered pdx. Now, a nuclear torque involves a very pdx like motion after the pdx reverse mirage set, but the add system wouldn't give it a pdx for the same reason the 2nd dex of atom smasher doesn't get a pdx add. bear with me. What if you did a nuclear set, and then did a torque where the dex leg was also the set leg? Would you get an initial pdx add for the nuclear set, and then another pdx add because the move you just hit was pdx torque with another dex? Isn't this move less paradox than nuclear torque though? Anybody see what I mean? Just some thoughts. Ken CF Somolinos Bear Feet/nyfa From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 9 00:04:44 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA22970 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 00:04:44 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA32122 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 15:00:22 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991008220036.BOVT16965.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org> for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 15:00:36 -0700 Message-ID: <37FE6985.6E60DECC@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 17:00:37 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] New 7 add move???? References: <19991008012432.12850.rocketmail@web802.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Jamez Risden wrote: > > Well anyway i noticed he pogos pretty damn good and he > can do a whirling osis. Put those together and you > got a sweet 6add move. > clip>op in[dex]>op > in[pdx][dex]>spin[bod]>clip[xbd][del] A whirling osis is a blender, so the move you are describing is a blurry blender (more commonly called a 'food processor'). I could be wrong, but I think Big Add Chad hits this on Sultans of Shred. It is a sick move - I can't get past the pdx blender part of it. > once you have mastered that you could throw a dive in > between the first and second dex for a whopping 7 > adds! Whoa! Easy there... don't get too excited :) I've never seen anyone hit a ducking pdx blender, much less a blurry ducking blender (on a side note, would that be an alpine food processor?). Cool ideas for moves. I'm sure that somebody could come close to it - maybe Dave, Ken or Ironman. Hmmm... Rippin and Eli could probably get the ducking pdx blender part of it. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 9 00:04:43 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA22969 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 00:04:43 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA31587 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 14:50:52 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991008215108.BKLA16965.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org> for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 14:51:08 -0700 Message-ID: <37FE674A.A55E962F@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 16:51:06 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] sets References: <19991008132011.23898.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello all. Andrew McCargar wrote: > for a while now I've been toying with what I > call twisted, a barrajing set compleated before the bag has peaked out. I > still don't have it consistant but I can set above my knee and have almost > hit barrajing miraje (twisted blur). Not to burst your bubble, but that set has already been named. a furious set is: clip > op in > same in (plant) > op and high stepping (from high plains drifter) is: clip > op in > same in (plant) > same Fury is short for furious mirage - the move that you described. The possibilities of this set are endless. I'm just waiting for someone to hit nemisis (furious barfly). Later. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 9 01:36:30 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA23086 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 01:36:30 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Bryan Fournier Received: from imo-d08.mx.aol.com (imo-d08.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.40]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA03680 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 17:15:13 -0700 Received: from ShReDStEiN@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id nQMZ0TSJzL (4158); Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:14:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.af7b2368.252fe2f8@aol.com> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:14:48 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Flyers To: ewulff@jsishipping.com, freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 10/8/99 12:50:53 AM Pacific Daylight Time, ewulff@jsishipping.com writes: << I dream of putting it in combos and mixing them up. >> (in describing flyers) that has "got" to be the next generation... seriously...new stuff that will come up at worlds 2000. Vancouver eh. ~Bryan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 9 06:46:33 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA23490 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 06:46:33 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA07182 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:06:21 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA2175 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:06:37 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:06:36 -0700 Message-ID: <000b01bf1203$4d7cf560$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi.. Ken wrote.. >With an original style torque, dlo, clipper set mirage, the plant occurs >when the delay does. How can something be called a set, when the bag is no >longer traveling up or at its apex when the second component of the move is >executed? It's simply not a set. The only set involved in a torque is a >clipper set. This is so right on! Go Ken.. go Ken.. If I may I would like to add.... another difference between "extra crispy/blurry/stepping set" torque and a "real" torque is that in the extra crispy version one launches with their dex leg and in the *real* version one launches with their set leg. ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 9 06:46:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA23500 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 06:46:38 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA07507 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:18:05 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA2224 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:18:20 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] Intermediate Comp rmoves? Date: Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:18:20 -0700 Message-ID: <000d01bf1204$f0ed0ea0$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Jon wrote.. >What are some typical moves in an intermediate routine in a competition? >I assume maybe mirage, legover, atw, butterfly, etc? Is this correct? Yes... exactly.. some etcs. might be clipper, flying clipper or dlo, paradox mirage, datw if you're at the top of the bracket. I would say do what you can, don't worry about repeating tricks, keep the bag off the ground and kick to music that is your style. Eric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 9 06:46:36 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA23495 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 06:46:36 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA07374 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:12:36 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA2242 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:12:49 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:12:50 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01bf1204$2bb64d40$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I think that actually both Ian and Derric wrote.. >2. "Let's keep it easy - blurry means 'stepping opposite side'." How bout step-op means stepping opposite side? There are 2 kinds of stepping butterfly... 1 is same and 1 is op... Only one of these moves happens to have a name.. rip-walk.. That seems to be the simplest and most straight forward way to go about it. When a move is cool enough to have a name, or when someone is cool enough to name a move... let it be named. But why try to formulate a system for naming coupled components of a move? ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 9 06:47:09 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA23520 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 06:47:09 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA07729 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:29:07 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA2247 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:29:21 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] damnit I cant think of a subject Date: Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:29:21 -0700 Message-ID: <000f01bf1206$7a92ad80$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >It is a butterfly set from opposite clipper. I always thought an infinity was butterfly op butterfly... hence the bag travels the path of the sign for infiniti. Anyone?... anyone.. ? ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 9 06:47:13 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA23530 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 06:47:13 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.clearsail.net (mail.clearsail.net [207.252.227.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA08194 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:53:14 -0700 Received: from rtgilber (216-148-160-158.clearsail.net [216.148.160.158]) by mail.clearsail.net (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA06676 for ; Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:42:21 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <006001bf11f9$d1367840$9ea094d8@rtgilber> From: "James Gilbert" To: References: <37FC5A85.D0ECF958@vivid.com> Subject: Re: [freestyle] footbag as release Date: Fri, 8 Oct 1999 20:58:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ethan wrote : > I've always felt thankful toward footbag for providing me a means to temporarily dismiss stressful/painful things in my life and just focus down into something that I know and love. I've always thought that footbag gives so much back It totally agree with Ethan. Footbag is a great way to escape the crap that happens in life. I got dumped by my girlfriend yesterday and was really bummed out. Then I started working on my routine for Texas State and trying to find better moves to do and how to link them. I forgot about being dumped and was absorbed in my session. Did the same today, going to do the same tomorrow. Footbag is such a great sport. James "ska boy" Gilbert From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 9 08:59:25 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA23640 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 08:59:25 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.120.62]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA15905 for ; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 01:07:33 -0700 Received: from Sam (dialup-209.245.69.203.LosAngeles1.Level3.net [209.245.69.203]) by snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA24132 for ; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 01:07:51 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <002c01bf122d$4d2ebc40$cb45f5d1@Sam> Reply-To: "Sam Colclough" From: "Sam Colclough" To: "Freestyle Mailing List" Subject: [freestyle] I need a ride to California State Champs Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 01:07:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello, I am in desperate need of transportation to the California State Championships. I live in Burbank. If anyone from OOPS is going on Friday, I'll skip school and go with you. Or I can fly to San Francisco and go with somebody from bay area? Well, PLEASE CONTACT ME if you can help. E-mail me with your phone number. Thanks for your time. Sam Colclough http://www.penny-lane.com/sam http://mp3.com/hs From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 9 09:00:12 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA23652 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 09:00:12 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.120.62]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA15944 for ; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 01:13:04 -0700 Received: from Sam (dialup-209.245.69.203.LosAngeles1.Level3.net [209.245.69.203]) by snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA26484 for ; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 01:13:22 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <004e01bf122e$123c4ac0$cb45f5d1@Sam> Reply-To: "Sam Colclough" From: "Sam Colclough" To: "Freestyle Mailing List" References: <000f01bf1206$7a92ad80$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> Subject: Re: [freestyle] damnit I cant think of a subject Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 01:12:45 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Eric Wulff wrote: > > I always thought an infinity was butterfly op butterfly... hence the bag > travels the path of the sign for infiniti. Anyone?... anyone.. ? I heard it was a clipper set butterfly so you end in the same position and can repeat it infinite times. But I am Sam Colclough and you are Eric Wulfffff so I bow down. _______( __) / / / \ ___/__/ /_ \_ From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 03:25:35 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA27030 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:25:35 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.clearsail.net (mail.clearsail.net [207.252.227.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA24952 for ; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 11:10:45 -0700 Received: from rtgilber (usr111.clearsail.net [207.252.227.111]) by mail.clearsail.net (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA29560 for ; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 12:59:17 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001501bf1282$51d7aa40$6fe3fccf@rtgilber> From: "James Gilbert" To: References: <000d01bf1204$f0ed0ea0$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> Subject: Re: [freestyle] Intermediate Comp rmoves? Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 13:15:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Jon wrote: >>What are some typical moves in an intermediate routine in a competition? >>I assume maybe mirage, legover, atw, butterfly, etc? Is this correct? and Eric replied: >Yes... exactly.. some etcs. might be clipper, flying clipper or dlo, >paradox mirage, datw if you're at the top of the bracket. I was going to enter in novice at Texas State since it is my first competetion, but after reading this I think I might should go intermediate, help me out here, Here is my routine so far, I still need to make it longer,( L means Left foot, R means Right foot), I usually drop the bag the first time on the pixie mirage and maybe drop one more time, i've made it through a couple times without dropping: L clip, L paradox mirage, R atw in, R atw out, L leg over, L atw in, L pixie, R atw clip, L mirage, R pixie, L pixie legover, R pixie mirage, R mirage, L legover, L butterfly, L paradox mirage, R pixie butterfly, L mirage, R dragonfly kick, R clip, R mirage Also does anybody know how long the routine for novice or intermediate will be? Thanks, James "ska boy" Gilbert From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 03:25:59 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA27045 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:25:59 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Message-ID: <19991009213546.17312.rocketmail@web601.yahoomail.com> Received: from [161.98.1.201] by web2003.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 09 Oct 1999 14:35:45 PDT Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 14:35:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Eli Piltz Subject: [freestyle] Re: can't think of a subject (NASTY RUMORS) To: freestyle@list.footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > From: Derric Scalf > Get in touch with Eli Piltz. He's going to be > at Texas State with a NEW > video (I'm starting rumors here - I think he > and Dave will be at Texas > State, and I think they have a new tape ready) What's with all the molarchy?!! Dave and I won't have a new video ready in time for TX state. Gee, let me recall why.... oh, yeah, it's because someone from Dallas with the initials D.S. who loves to do blurry osis (who will go unnamed for his own protection) hasn't sent us the world's footage he promised a long time ago. We've got plenty of World's footage, but we really want a few select things those guys have. No really, Dave and I do appreciate "D.S.'s" work and look forward to getting that tape, but don't go starting crazy rumors, you silly willy. Adios, Eli From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 03:25:33 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA27025 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:25:33 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA16688 for ; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 02:40:59 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJB00O01XKU0Z@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 03:41:18 -0600 (MDT) Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 03:41:18 -0600 (MDT) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: [freestyle] Cool rewind moves To: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org These are just some two trick, forward and backward combos (move then exact rewind of that move). I'm sure you get the picture. I just think these are some cool ones. They are not all super hard and I've by no means landed most of them, but I'd like to and I'd like other people to as well. eggbeater, smear legbeater, blur back to back atom smashers Spinning butterfly, torque spinning pdx mirage, flux pixie butterfly, Dlo flurry, pixie paradon Pixie same side butterfly (name?), Stepping same side legover (?) Entourage, pixie switchover dyno, twirl Swirl, reverse swirl (or as I like to call it... swirl:) Fairie mirage, Scrambled eggbeater Pdx mirage, reverse toe set drifter Pdx drifter, royale Pdx legbeater, Blurry drifter Vortex, corkscrew (really clean) Just some ideas for everyone to throw around. Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 03:25:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA27035 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:25:38 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web601.yahoomail.com (web2003.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.68.203]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA29855 for ; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 14:05:43 -0700 Message-ID: <19991009210638.15401.rocketmail@web601.yahoomail.com> Received: from [161.98.1.201] by web2003.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 09 Oct 1999 14:06:38 PDT Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 14:06:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Eli Piltz Subject: [freestyle] Re: (Nuclear Torque) food processor and the like To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > From: "KeN Somolinos" > Now, a nuclear torque > involves a very pdx like motion after the pdx > reverse mirage set, but the > add system wouldn't give it a pdx for the same > reason the 2nd dex of atom > smasher doesn't get a pdx add. bear with me. I'ma grinnin anda bearin. > What if you did a nuclear > set, and then did a torque where the dex leg > was also the set leg? (paradox tapping torque) I think you would get a paradox add for the torque, but not the rev. mirage (nuclear). When you tap, you are only doing a partial dex and in the case of nuclear, I think it needs to be completed for pdox classification; get me? > Isn't this > move less paradox than nuclear torque though? > Anybody see what I mean? Dude, I've seen what you mean for a long time. Nuclear Torque is definitely deserving of 2 pdox adds. It's the hardest trick I've ever come close to- far harder than any sixes I've hit. Anyone care to share? Eli ===== From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 03:25:40 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA27040 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:25:40 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web601.yahoomail.com (web2003.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.68.203]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA30348 for ; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 14:20:10 -0700 Message-ID: <19991009212106.16441.rocketmail@web601.yahoomail.com> Received: from [161.98.1.201] by web2003.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 09 Oct 1999 14:21:06 PDT Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 14:21:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Eli Piltz Subject: [freestyle] Re: can't think of a subject (INFINITY) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Wulff wrote: > Infinity = butterfly op butterfly... Anyone? Rippin' distinguishes butterfly from infinity as the latter being clipper to opp butter fly (not necessarily op btrfly to op btrfly), as opposed to same side or toe set. As we all know, Rippin' is omniscient. ;) Eli ===== From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 03:26:24 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA27075 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:26:24 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (oe1.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.240.105]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA00607 for ; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 15:38:21 -0700 Received: (qmail 58551 invoked by uid 65534); 9 Oct 1999 22:38:14 -0000 Message-ID: <19991009223814.58550.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [207.207.0.138] Reply-To: "Mike Lin" From: "Mike Lin" To: Subject: [freestyle] first timer Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 17:38:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all! I've been freestyling for about 4 or 5 months now, and I decided to compete in the Texas State Footbag Championships in Austin as a novice. This will be the first footbag tournament of my life, and I'm not quite sure what kind of footwear is required while competing. Is barefoot allowed? Toe stalls are so much easier that way. =) Any info would be greatly appreciated, thanks! -Mike Lin (Argastes) From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 03:30:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA27090 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:30:38 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f27.hotmail.com [216.32.181.27]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA21422 for ; Sun, 10 Oct 1999 20:02:54 -0700 Received: (qmail 7281 invoked by uid 0); 11 Oct 1999 03:02:47 -0000 Message-ID: <19991011030247.7280.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 216.44.107.81 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 10 Oct 1999 20:02:47 PDT X-Originating-IP: [216.44.107.81] From: "Stan Sagalovskiy" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] beginners question (clipper) Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 23:02:47 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi, I'm relatively new to the game, i'm only beginning to try the clipper. Right now i'm actually just trying to hit the bag with the leg behind the support leg. my foot is twisting so that i have absolutely no problem hitting the bag with the bottom of the shoe but i just can't get the inside flat. am i hitting it too far away from my body? i'm not sure if i'm doing it right. any ideas? (i know.. silly question, just practice practice practice.. but it's been a week of serious practicing, and i'm making very little progress) thanks. Stan. p.s. great kicking nyfa.. freaking amazing. makes me want to get up in the middle of the night and start practicing. =) From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 03:30:39 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA27095 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:30:39 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from spike.excite.com ([199.172.152.97]) by fortune.excite.com (InterMail v4.01.01.07 201-229-111-110) with ESMTP id <19991009193830.XRYM1457.fortune@spike.excite.com> for ; Sat, 9 Oct 1999 12:38:30 -0700 From: "Allan Haggett" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] missing subject Message-Id: <939497921.15798.480@excite.com> Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 12:38:41 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 199.60.118.213 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ello! Mr. Wulff wrote: >I always thought an infinity was butterfly op >butterfly... hence the bag >travels the path of the sign for infiniti. >Anyone?... >anyone.. ? >ew This is what I was always thought..... I've heard lotz of people on this list say 'work your infinities until you get bored' that doesn't sound like clip>op-butt, to me... it just makes sense that its butterfly to butterfly as they feed each other.... the bag travelling the path of the sign for infiniti cements it for me anyway. Allan ________________________________________________________________ Get FREE voicemail, fax and email at http://voicemail.excite.com Talk online at http://voicechat.excite.com From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 03:30:43 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA27108 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:30:43 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from firefly.prairienet.org ([192.17.3.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA17112 for ; Sun, 10 Oct 1999 17:53:42 -0700 Received: from bluestem.prairienet.org (bluestem.prairienet.org [192.17.3.4]) by firefly.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA29105 for ; Sun, 10 Oct 1999 19:53:41 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from konrad@localhost) by bluestem.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA08093; Sun, 10 Oct 1999 19:53:39 -0500 (CDT) Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 19:53:39 -0500 (CDT) From: Philip Summers Reply-To: Philip Summers Subject: [freestyle] BLURry To: freestyle@footbag.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I always thought that a blurry set meant 'stepping paradox'; otherwise the move wouldn't look like a blur ( or a blizzard ). To get super technical, a blurry eggbeater should be called a blizzardy eggbeater because the second dex is out to in. But, there's no need to use two different names because the direction of the second dex is implied by whatever move you're doing. A ripwalk is not a "blurry butterfly"; it doesn't look like a blur ( or a blizzard ); the butterfly component isn't paradox. I also don't think it's correct to call a ripwalk a stepping butterfly, it looks like a stepping infinity to me. I have seen: clip > op in > op out > same out > op clip called a 'blurry barfly' or 'blurriest'. That's awfully confusing, because it's not blurry. It's a stepping barfly. .................................................................... I also have something to say about the 'alpine' concept. When I throw a stepping set, I can decide mid-move whether I want to try to finish it off with a mirage, pdx mirage, switch-over, etc... but if I set it waist high, I can't then decided to duck under it. I have to decide in advance that I want to Step and then Duck, so I angle my hips differently and I throw my weight up harder. I think putting the ducking/diving modifier first as part of the set name is a good idea, but there should be two different names to distinguish between ducking and diving. But here's another thing. I've come close to hitting clip > op in > spin > op out > op clip It's like a ripwalk with a spin in the middle. This would be another big move with an extra component between set and sub-move. If people start to hit moves like that, then maybe there will be need for term like 'cyclone' meaning "spin between set and move". cyclone stepping infinity -> cyclone ripwalk cyclone pixie mirage -> cyclone smear cyclone atomic mirage -> cyclone atom smasher :P Until people start to hit moves like that, they don't need names. But apparently, shredders are hitting lots of dexing-to-ducking moves, so I say keep it simple and add a modifier onto the setname. Alpine for ducking and... Himalayan for diving?? ( maybe that's too long ) well, that's my 200 cents worth keep Shredding! -Phil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 03:31:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA27124 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:31:11 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA06658 for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 19:00:09 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJG00J01KVH3R@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 15:54:53 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 15:54:53 -0600 (MDT) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: [freestyle] name that move/cool moves To: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I had a great dream last night that I hit this move (of course I haven't). I was wondering if anyone has hit it or if it has a name. toe> op out> same out> op body xbody delay (osis) (it's a double dexing flux) I suggest "Acid Reflux" I was also thinking of some other cool moves: Pixie flux fairie flux pixie drifter (toe> same in (plant)> same in> same clip) (I finally nailed this one after 3 weeks of trying. WAHOO!!:-) does this one have a name? I know clip set is "high plains drifter" and boy do I dislike that name. pixie torque (toe> same in (plant)> op in> op body xbody delay (osis) (hit once) fairie torque Atomic Flux Tapping paradon So all of you who are way better than me should give these a try. I've landed two so now it's up to you to land the rest. GOOD LUCK and GOD SPEED, Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 03:32:32 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA27137 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:32:32 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Dave Cecconi Received: from imo-d07.mx.aol.com (imo-d07.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.39]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id GAA14757 for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 06:33:53 -0700 Received: from DukeBluDevils@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zNMJ0eD0gs (3864) for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 09:33:54 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.8d700105.25334141@aol.com> Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 09:33:53 EDT Subject: [freestyle] I need help w/ the clipper stall To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi, My name is Dave and I am new to the list but not new to the sport. I have always watched it and I know everything about it but I just started to try it myself. I have the toe stall down ok, but I can't get the clipper. I have only done it once when I did an osis delay but that was it. I guess I got lucky. When I watch video's of Ahren Grehman, he does it so easily but I noticed that he gets his foot alot closer to the ground and still manages to turn it sideways to catch the bag. I can't turn my foot that far when it is down that low. Is it possible that there are any stretches or warm ups I can do to train my foot to do that. Or does anyone have anything that can help? Thanks. Dave Cecconi From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 04:23:34 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA27478 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:23:34 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo-d08.mx.aol.com (imo-d08.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.40]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA09622 for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:26:33 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zCRO0dP7u3 (4190) for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 23:26:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.93e53850.25340475@aol.com> Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 23:26:45 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Intermediate Comp rmoves? To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I promise this will my finals words about competing intermediate(i'm prob getting on matt's nerves..hehe) I'm in the same hole James Gilbert with my questions about intermediate competition. They are actually doubts rather than questions. I can hit the EXACT same moves as James does but some moves i dont hit as much as he does and some i moves i hit that he doens't mention. I was planning on competing intermediate but I am not sure anymore. James says he can get through his run pretty well. Well, my consistancy isn't as good as his but I do hit some moves that he doesnt include in his run like double atw, double legover and double atw as well as various other that i wont mention strictly for the element of surprise. Should i be focusing on consistancy and less drops? thats what i have been told. And whats the number of drops i should stay under? Anyways, I promise i will ask no more of this subject. Thanks. Cya all at TX states Windsen Pan oh yea..james, intermediate runs are 90 secs long. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 04:24:24 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA27488 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:24:24 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.clearsail.net (mail.clearsail.net [207.252.227.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA10104 for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:33:56 -0700 Received: from rtgilber (216-148-160-188.clearsail.net [216.148.160.188]) by mail.clearsail.net (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA03639 for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 22:22:23 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <003a01bf1463$62225c00$67e3fccf@rtgilber> From: "James Gilbert" To: References: <0.8d700105.25334141@aol.com> Subject: Re: [freestyle] I need help w/ the clipper stall Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 22:39:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Is it possible that there are any stretches or warm ups I can > do to train my foot to do that. What I did that really helped me is to just stand on one leg and have your other leg in clipper position. Practice standing like that to get your balance down. Turn your ankle of the foot in clipper position so your inside of your foot is flat (parallel to the ground). Try to get your foot parallel to the ground the best you can. Your foot and leg will more and more flexible. Then practice dropping the bag from waist high or a little higher and trying to catch the bag in clipper delay. Cushion with the leg catching the bag and bend and cushion with your support leg also. Practice, practice, practice, and practice some more. Hope this helps. >When I watch video's of Ahren Grehman, he does it so easily but I >noticed that he gets his foot alot closer to the ground and still manages to >turn it sideways to catch the bag. Everyone does it a little different. I delay the bag in clipper position where my foot is about 6 or 7 inches off the ground. Do whatever feels right for you. James "ska boy" Gilbert From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 04:24:29 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA27498 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:24:29 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail1.doit.wisc.edu (mail1.doit.wisc.edu [144.92.9.40]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA10202 for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:36:56 -0700 Received: from [128.104.48.67] by mail1.doit.wisc.edu id WAA47138 (8.9.1/50); Mon, 11 Oct 1999 22:37:13 -0500 Message-Id: <199910120337.WAA47138@mail1.doit.wisc.edu> X-Sender: mklewand@students.wisc.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 22:25:55 -0500 To: Brad Kaplan , freestyle@footbag.org From: Matthew Kain Lewandowski Subject: Re: [freestyle] Cool rewind moves Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > These are just some two trick, forward and backward combos (move then >exact rewind of that move). > dyno, twirl Isn't the reverse of a Dyno actually a gyro whirl? (since Dyno is technically dex>spin>del - even though it is often done in such a way that the dex and spin happen simultaneously) I believe that a twirl reverse would technically be a gyro swirl. Just thought I would bring this up due to a 2 hour dyno argument that I had several weeks ago... A couple other comments from the rarely vocal Madison-scene: 1. Has anyone tried to hit a shooting-opposite side blender? Seems like a pretty attainable 7 adder (even though its add count is disputable) 2. We've been calling fairy mirage a "fear" (like a smear) and a fairy reverse mirage a "fudge" (like a smudge - kinda dumb but along the same lines as the above). Anyone like these names? 3. Has anyone named a swirling pick-up? We've been calling it a stick-up... in fact has anyone mastered the swirling set? Hard stuff... That's all Later Matt Kain From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 04:35:23 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA27527 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:35:23 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA10400 for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:40:40 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991012034107.SAXB8414.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:41:07 -0700 Message-ID: <3802ADA3.C80F6601@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 22:40:19 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dave Cecconi CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] I need help w/ the clipper stall References: <0.8d700105.25334141@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Clippers? Try this page http://dallasfootbag.org/tutorials/the_clipper_delay.html Dave Cecconi wrote: > > Hi, > My name is Dave and I am new to the list but not new to the sport. I have > always watched it and I know everything about it but I just started to try it > myself. I have the toe stall down ok, but I can't get the clipper. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 04:45:56 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA27550 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:45:56 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA10940 for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:55:50 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA2983 for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:56:25 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] damnit I cant think of a subject Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:56:44 -0700 Message-ID: <004701bf1465$cd671300$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Sam wrote... >I heard it was a clipper set butterfly so you end in the same position and >can repeat it infinite times. But I am Sam Colclough and you are Eric >Wulfffff so I bow down. > > _______( __) > / / / \ >___/__/ /_ \_ Oh stop it and get up... besides... looks like you are in a vast majority here which includes the likes of Rippin.. among others.(thanks Eli) In other words, you are right and I am wrong. I still like my idea of infinity though.. sniff.. sniff.. ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 04:58:45 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA27572 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:58:45 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA11221 for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 21:04:55 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991012040529.SKLV8414.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org> for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 21:05:29 -0700 Message-ID: <3802B358.2062DD64@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 23:04:40 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] BLURry References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Philip Summers wrote: >> >> I always thought that a blurry set meant 'stepping paradox'; otherwise >> the move wouldn't look like a blur ( or a blizzard ). Nope. Blurry does not imply paradox. Nor does it require a blur as the beginning portion of a move. Paradox is an unidentifiable concept that is applied only to counting adds. Blurry is a set name - this has nothing to do with adds. Blurry means: stepping opposite side. or, clip > op in > op >> A ripwalk is not a "blurry butterfly"; it doesn't look like a blur ( or a >> blizzard ); the butterfly component isn't paradox. Actually, a ripwalk IS a blurry butterfly. Sure, ripwalk sounds better - call it a ripwalk. And no, there isn't a paradox add in the move. Nor is there a paradox add in a blurry rev whirl, blurry dyno, blurry barfly (blurriest), or blurry osis (crispy torque). >> I have seen: >> clip > op in > op out > same out > op clip >> called a 'blurry barfly' or 'blurriest'. That's awfully confusing, >> because it's not blurry. It's a stepping barfly. Nope. Stepping barfly doesn't exist. A stepping down double down (blurrier) does. A stepping set is: clip > op in > same Make sense? -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 05:23:18 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA27601 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 05:23:18 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f32.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.32]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA11596 for ; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 21:17:54 -0700 Received: (qmail 56299 invoked by uid 0); 12 Oct 1999 04:18:00 -0000 Message-ID: <19991012041800.56298.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 11 Oct 1999 21:17:59 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: mklewand@students.wisc.edu, kaplanb@mscd.edu, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Cool rewind moves Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 00:17:59 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Howdy Matt Kain asked: >Isn't the reverse of a Dyno actually a gyro whirl? Yep >2. We've been calling fairy mirage a "fear" (like a smear) and a fairy >reverse mirage a "fudge" (like a smudge - kinda dumb but along the same >lines as the above). Anyone like these names? Yep. >3. has anyone mastered the swirling set? Hard stuff... Jon Schneider has a very good reverse swirling set from dragon. He hits swirling pdx mirage (twist) and ripstein (f-b) using this. ceiling fan nyfa/bear feet From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 19:37:46 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA28358 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 19:37:46 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA25189 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 02:06:41 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJH00C01FZ47G@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:06:40 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:06:40 -0600 (MDT) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: Re: [freestyle] damnit I cant think of a subject In-reply-to: <004701bf1465$cd671300$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> To: Eric Wulff Cc: "'freestyle'" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, 11 Oct 1999, Eric Wulff wrote: > Oh stop it and get up... besides... looks like you are in a vast majority > here which includes the likes of Rippin.. among others.(thanks Eli) In > other words, you are right and I am wrong. I still like my idea of > infinity though.. sniff.. sniff.. Now now, I agree with you! It's how infinity was first explained to me anyway. I was also wondering what you called the ripwalk flyer in the post the other day about flyers. I know it already has a name, but I thought of one that just sounded so cool to me, Ripped Skywalker. But oh well (unless we can change it). Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 19:37:59 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA28377 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 19:37:59 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Bryan Fournier Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com (imo16.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.6]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA03941 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 08:20:28 -0700 Received: from ShReDStEiN@aol.com by imo16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id lJHNa12219 (4190); Tue, 12 Oct 1999 11:19:14 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.7b13822c.2534ab72@aol.com> Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 11:19:14 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Cool rewind moves To: kaplanb@mscd.edu, freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 10/11/99 7:43:42 PM Pacific Daylight Time, kaplanb@mscd.edu writes: << Spinning butterfly, torque >> Torque>Gyrating mirage From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 19:37:37 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA28353 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 19:37:37 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA25037 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 01:58:52 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJH00B01FMPWM@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 02:59:13 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 02:59:13 -0600 (MDT) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: [freestyle] Re: used to be rewind NOW JUST CHAT ABOUT OTHER MOVES In-reply-to: <199910120337.WAA47138@mail1.doit.wisc.edu> To: Matthew Kain Lewandowski Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, 11 Oct 1999, Matthew Kain Lewandowski wrote: > 2. We've been calling fairy mirage a "fear" (like a smear) and a fairy > reverse mirage a "fudge" (like a smudge - kinda dumb but along the same > lines as the above). Anyone like these names? > 3. Has anyone named a swirling pick-up? We've been calling it a > stick-up... in fact has anyone mastered the swirling set? Hard stuff... I like those names very much. You got my vote and that's what I'll call them too. Except "stick up"...no offense! Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 19:37:51 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA28363 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 19:37:51 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from ego.mind.net (IDENT:mail@ego.mind.net [206.99.66.9]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA25996 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 02:49:35 -0700 Received: from 206.151.159.152 (ip221.mind.net [206.151.159.152]) by ego.mind.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id CAA07011 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 02:50:10 -0700 Message-ID: <3802A1CF.5CCC@mind.net> Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 02:49:54 +0000 From: Forest Schrodt X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Stepping inspins? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was playing around with some ideas for different tricks today and starting thinking about what could be done with stepping and pixie inspin tricks. What stepping inspin tricks have been hit out there? Perhaps stepping inspining clipper, or stepping inspining whirl, or stepping inspinning osis(not torque). I have not hit any of these yet but would love to hear who has. Just wanted to share some of my rambling thoughts and push the envelope a little bit. Forest From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 19:38:06 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA28393 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 19:38:06 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Tony Glick Received: from Allman144@aol.com by imo22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zMXZa19934 (15544) for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 12:32:48 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.b40501b9.2534bcb0@aol.com> Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 12:32:48 EDT Subject: [freestyle] Re: BLURry To: freestyle@list.footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL NetMail version 2.0 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Philip said: "If people start to hit moves like that, then maybe there will be need for term like 'cyclone' meaning "spin between set and move". cyclone stepping infinity -> cyclone ripwalk cyclone pixie mirage -> cyclone smear cyclone atomic mirage -> cyclone atom smasher" I think Philip's idea is great, and the term cylcone sounds good. If I did a cyclone fog and the spin (away from the set side) was after the first dex would the paradox still be there for the second dex? Tony Glick From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 20:00:18 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA28434 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 20:00:18 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991012191224.BXUB8414.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 12:12:24 -0700 Message-ID: <380387F5.8FA5C833@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 14:11:49 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tony Glick CC: freestyle@list.footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: BLURry References: <0.b40501b9.2534bcb0@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Tony Glick wrote: > > I think Philip's idea is great, and the term cylcone sounds good. If I did a cyclone fog and the spin (away from the set side) was after the first dex would the paradox still be there for the second dex? > Oooohhh... good question. Who says spins don't deserve paradox? On a side note, a spin of this type (cyclone, if you will) is a (back) spin. Let's say that you start out from a left foot clipper. Do a quick mirage with your right leg and the bag is on the left side of your body. So, when you spin clockwise, it is a (back) spin. A bock set (named after the beer) is a stepping (front) spin. so, if you start from a left foot clipper - Do a quick mirage with your right leg and the bag is on the left side of your body. So, when you spin counterclockwise, it is a (front) spin. And about that cyclone fog... are you coming close to this? That is a sick move. I would have just as much of a chance of hitting alpine cyclone fog. Hehe... but that will come in time... -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 12 21:10:36 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA28488 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 21:10:36 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA14745 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 13:18:05 -0700 Received: (from jriely@localhost) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA13476; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 15:18:17 -0500 (CDT) Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 15:18:17 -0500 (CDT) From: "Jeremiah J. Riely" X-Sender: jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex In-Reply-To: <000c01bf1204$2bb64d40$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > >2. "Let's keep it easy - blurry means 'stepping opposite side'." > > How bout step-op means stepping opposite side? I think blurry should mean stepping paradox, how about calling stepping oposite side miraging. So a torque is a miraging osis. We could make it so if you just say miraging it means clipper set miraging, and if it is a toe miraging move then say toe miraging. But with toe miraging, there has to be a distinction between which side the next component it going to be on. So there would have to be a name for toe miraging same side, Ian came up with slapping (similar to tapping) to indicate toe miraging same side. > There are 2 kinds of stepping butterfly... 1 is same and 1 is op... I think the definition of stepping should be changed so it means only stuff on the same side. Then there would only be one kind of stepping butterfly. Then you also have stepping opposite butterfly, or miraging butterfly, or ripwalk. Later From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:19:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31872 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:19:38 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA30588 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 20:37:53 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA1912 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 20:38:29 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Re: (Nuclear Torque) food processor and the like Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 20:38:33 -0700 Message-ID: <004901bf152c$6df6d320$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Our friend Ken... > What if you did a nuclear > set, and then did a torque where the dex leg > was also the set leg? to which our bud Eli.. >Dude, I've seen what you mean for a long time. >Nuclear Torque is definitely deserving of 2 pdox >adds. It's the hardest trick I've ever come >close to- far harder than any sixes I've hit. >Anyone care to share? to which I say... I DO... I care man... I love you g... Anyway, I've been amazingly busy lately and want to find some time to iron this out even further.. I didn't want to put anything out here before I really put some starch in it... no what I'm sayin mang?? BUT.. here's a taste of an idear... ** :).. Any dex which passes both over and under(in theory) the bag can build to be worth 2 ADDS each AFTER the first is completed. This means that "toe-op dex-op" can build and so can paradoxes. Not stepping sets, butterfly dexes, or "final dex same" though. Therefore... Nuclear Torque is worth either 6 or 7 adds depending on which side you do the torque on. Set is 2... same torque is 4.. or op torque is 5 Other changes... Atom Smasher.. 4 adds.. 1,2,1 Paradox Atom Smasher.. 5.. 2(paradox),2,1 Toe Blur.. 4.. 1,2,1 Triple atw.. 5.. 1,2,1,1 Triage.. 5.. 1,2,1,1 I've got 3 other modifications which are even simpler and no moves lose adds but some gain where desperately needed. Also, these modifiers would help the add system grow with future technical revolutions. If I may throw in a little politics, I've passed this by "The Enforcer" and have his endorsement. :) o.k.... give it too me.. :) watcha think so far? ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:19:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31861 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:19:11 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Aaron de Glanville Received: from smtp6.mindspring.com (smtp6.mindspring.com [207.69.200.110]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA15463 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 13:36:50 -0700 Received: from aaron (user-33qtjan.dialup.mindspring.com [199.174.205.87]) by smtp6.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA15117 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 16:36:52 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19991012133528.00779c10@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: aadegl@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 13:35:28 -0700 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex In-Reply-To: References: <000c01bf1204$2bb64d40$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >> >2. "Let's keep it easy - blurry means 'stepping opposite side'." >> >> How bout step-op means stepping opposite side? > >I think blurry should mean stepping paradox What exactly does paradox mean? Thanks, Aaron de Glanville From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:19:46 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31878 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:19:46 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f159.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.159]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id RAA24640 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 17:48:42 -0700 Received: (qmail 52745 invoked by uid 0); 13 Oct 1999 00:48:53 -0000 Message-ID: <19991013004853.52744.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 17:48:52 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: kaplanb@mscd.edu, ewulff@jsishipping.com Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] damnit I cant think of a subject Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 20:48:52 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi stylers! how's it going? Brad wrote: > I was also wondering what you called the ripwalk flyer in the >post the other day about flyers. I know it already has a name, but I >thought of one that just sounded so cool to me, Ripped Skywalker. Hm, my only beef with your proposed name is that I do a move which is a ripped warrior flyer kick. Flying ripwalk isn't that "ripped" if you know what I mean. Ken CF Somolinos bear feet/nyfa From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:22:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31902 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:22:38 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA04766 for ; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 15:05:15 -0700 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FJK00G01APZVG@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 16:05:59 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 16:05:58 -0600 (MDT) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: Re: [freestyle] Cool rewind moves In-reply-to: <0.7b13822c.2534ab72@aol.com> To: Bryan Fournier Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Tue, 12 Oct 1999, Bryan Fournier wrote: > Torque>Gyrating mirage Uh, I don't think those are rewind. Gyrating mirage rewound would be toe set cork screw wouldn't it. Hey I thought of another cool one. Back Side Symp. Legbeater to Pogo Blur. Always thinkin' Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:22:39 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31911 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:22:39 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Dave Cecconi Received: from imo-d02.mx.aol.com (imo-d02.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA21398 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 16:25:02 -0700 Received: from DukeBluDevils@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zYGFCSX76_ (4465) for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 19:25:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.6ad3388b.25351d4c@aol.com> Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 19:25:00 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] I need help w/ the clipper stall To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I just read something on a dallas footbag site about the osis. It says that you "Catch the bag on a [right] toe stall. Flick up and towards the left a tad, and spin into the bag. End with a clipper stall with the left foot. Now correct me if I'm wrong, but for an osis, don't u spin away from the bag EG: right toe>flick up and left>spin away(in this case right)>left clipper stall That is the way I have been performing the osis. Have I been spinning the wrong way? From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:22:44 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31922 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:22:44 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA31683 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 20:59:59 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA2965 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 21:00:39 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] BLURry Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 21:00:45 -0700 Message-ID: <005001bf152f$87028a00$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org The funky freshest freestyle list dude Derric Scalf... >Nope. Stepping barfly doesn't exist. A stepping down double down >(blurrier) does. >A stepping set is: >clip > op in > same I say WOE big Nelly... stepping barfly exists blurry barfly exists blurriest exists x-body>op in>op out>same out>op x-body exists They are all descriptions of the same move. Different little footbag cultures around the world may understand, call them and describe them differently and there are majorities and minorities of opinion etc. Once again, there is no official governing body of naming stuff.. dig it y'll.. :) ew and a stepping set is... x-body>op launch dex in.. period.. that is.. if y'll just got to have it in notation somehow... :) notation is very limiting for describing moves... From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:22:46 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31932 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:22:46 -0700 Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:22:46 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f155.hotmail.com [216.32.181.155]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA03899 for ; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 14:36:16 -0700 Received: (qmail 42596 invoked by uid 0); 13 Oct 1999 21:36:32 -0000 Message-ID: <19991013213632.42595.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 198.168.49.221 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 14:36:32 PDT X-Originating-IP: [198.168.49.221] From: "Mickey Mayer" To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 17:36:32 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all, About two weeks, unless my memory fails me, I believe that Derric Scalf asked everyone on the list to cast in their vote for making new names of moves official. Just wondering what's going on with these names and if they will be on the footbag.org freestyle list soon. Thanks. Mickey "The Mouse" Mayer From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:22:49 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31942 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:22:49 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA04519 for ; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 14:58:28 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA372 for ; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 14:59:07 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Stepping inspins? Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 14:59:21 -0700 Message-ID: <001e01bf15c6$34ecb820$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Styleee guy Forest.. >What stepping inspin tricks have been hit out there? bock setting mirage... "Leaning Jowler".. Hit First(and only so-far I believe) by Tuan "Disco Ninja" Vu. I think Paul V. and "the Enforcer" would especially appreciate the name Disco tagged to this one. ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:23:02 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31952 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:23:02 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA10144 for ; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 17:23:52 -0700 Received: (from jriely@localhost) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA09902; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 19:24:37 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 19:24:37 -0500 (CDT) From: "Jeremiah J. Riely" X-Sender: jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: BLURry In-Reply-To: <380387F5.8FA5C833@dallasfootbag.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Let's say that you start out from a left foot clipper. Do a quick > mirage with your right leg and the bag is on the left side of your > body. So, when you spin clockwise, it is a (back) spin. What you have described above is a bock set. I have always known bock set as miraging inspining. I think it is much more simple to call any spin that has a dex before it an inspin if it is the same direction spin as a regular inspin is or a back spin if it is the same direction as a back spin. In other words, if you were to do an nuclear inspin to something it would be rich foot clipper > right leg paradox rev. mirage > spin counterclockwise. I think the spin in this move should be considered an inspin because that is what it is, it just has a dex before it. What does everyone else think about this? > A bock set (named after the beer) is a stepping (front) spin. wait a minute, you said in an earlier post that stepping has to mean clip > op in dex > same. A bock set can't have a stepping component because it doesn't matter what leg does the next thing. Anyway, a bock set is a miraging inspin. I don't know what you are describing below, but a bock set has the spin in the other direction. I think what is below may be a leaning gyro or something, I don't remember. > so, if you start from a left foot clipper - Do a quick mirage with your > right leg and the bag is on the left side of your body. So, when you > spin counterclockwise, it is a (front) spin. > Later From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:23:43 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31962 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:23:43 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from Sam (dialup-209.245.68.214.LosAngeles1.Level3.net [209.245.68.214]) by hawk.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA09487 for ; Tue, 12 Oct 1999 20:56:48 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <000901bf152e$e3947720$d644f5d1@Sam> Reply-To: "Sam Colclough" From: "Sam Colclough" To: "Freestyle Mailing List" Subject: [freestyle] California State99 Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 20:56:09 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi guys, I really need help in the transportation department. It sucks being 16 and flying to another city for a tournament when your parents can't help you. It is very possible that I can fly into San Francisco Friday night. If there anyone that can pick me up and take me to the tournament? Of course I would be willing to compensate for time, gas, and effort. This will be my first tournament so I'm shaky on the proceedings. I talked to Mike Stoler of OOPS Footbag club and he said that no one from Hermosa Beach is going that he knows of. Email me with some information, I'd appreciate it. Thanks Sam Colclough http://www.penny-lane.com/sam http://mp3.com/hs From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:23:46 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31972 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:23:46 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Bryan Fournier Received: from imo-d07.mx.aol.com (imo-d07.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.39]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA11391 for ; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 17:59:02 -0700 Received: from ShReDStEiN@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id lCXBK.6i6_ (3858); Wed, 13 Oct 1999 20:57:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.61876cb9.25368496@aol.com> Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 20:57:58 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Cool rewind moves To: kaplanb@mscd.edu CC: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 10/13/99 3:06:12 PM Pacific Daylight Time, kaplanb@mscd.edu writes: << On Tue, 12 Oct 1999, Bryan Fournier wrote: > Torque>Gyrating mirage Uh, I don't think those are rewind. Gyrating mirage rewound would be toe set cork screw wouldn't it. Hey I thought of another cool one. Back Side Symp. Legbeater to Pogo Blur. Always thinkin' Brad >> I must have forgotton to retitle that message...its a cool combo though, its zoom set...anyway I'll keep quiet now Bryan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:23:49 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31982 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:23:49 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA16107 for ; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 20:00:35 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA695 for ; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 20:01:16 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Re: BLURry Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 20:01:30 -0700 Message-ID: <002a01bf15f0$6b32f820$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Tony G... >If I did a cyclone fog and the spin (away from the set side) was after the first >dex would the paradox still be there for the second dex? in my opinion... Absolutely DS the man... >Oooohhh... good question. Who says spins don't deserve paradox? I certainly don't... :] >On a side note, a spin of this type (cyclone, if you will) is a (back) >spin. This happens to be another one of the modifiers I think adds "officially" need. Paradox in a spinning move.... yes.. Also, the "In" of an "In-Spin" should be worth 1 add same as the "over" dex getting 1 add in a "double over" down. Also, I would propose that a spin in either direction out of a stepping set is an in-spin. Why?... either way you are spinning into the set.... but more importantly... neither way is significantly more difficult than the other and they are both worth another add. ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:24:22 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31992 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:24:22 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.rdc1.tx.home.com (imail@ha1.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.66]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA22394 for ; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 23:31:03 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by mail.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991014063150.FXCU20092.mail.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Wed, 13 Oct 1999 23:31:50 -0700 Message-ID: <380578CF.7DFAC575@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 01:31:43 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Jeremiah J. Riely" CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org "Jeremiah J. Riely" wrote: > I think blurry should mean stepping paradox, how about calling stepping > oposite side miraging. So a torque is a miraging osis. We could make it so > if you just say miraging it means clipper set miraging, This would work. So a blur would be a miraging mirage or a blurry mirage - one and the same, right? But, for cases without paradox (eg. stepping op side dyno), they would just be miraging. So, the whole 'blurry' concept would only be used for counting adds (like the current pdx definition). Is this what you are saying? The only problem I have with this is that a stepping/blurry set involves a plant. So, for this definition to be complete it would have to have a plant in it as follows: A 'Miraging' set is: clip > op in (plant) > op The fact that some miraging moves are pdx and some aren't doesn't matter at all. Would this appease everyone? > But with toe miraging, there has > to be a distinction between which side the next component it going to be > on. So there would have to be a name for toe miraging same side, Ian came > up with slapping (similar to tapping) to indicate toe miraging same side. The two people that I have seen hit this set on demand are Ian and Sunil. Since they do it, they get to name it. And, the names are: slapping (don't call it slappy): toe > op in (plant) > same ionic (or quantum - which sounds better?): toe > op in (plant) > op The slapping name comes from the tapping concept which is: toe > op out (plant) > same Cool with everyone? Let me know what you think about the blurry/miraging thing. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:24:25 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA32002 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:24:25 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com (imo11.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.1]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA27120 for ; Thu, 14 Oct 1999 16:21:42 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo11.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zCZMa05338 (4158) for ; Thu, 14 Oct 1999 19:21:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.dad63d61.2537bf8d@aol.com> Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 19:21:49 EDT Subject: [freestyle] TX States To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 41 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey, Does anyone know what time to show up for TX States? Also, anyone got any more info like hotels, sponsors, and stuff like that? Anyways, I'll cya there! Thanks Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 07:24:28 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA32012 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 07:24:28 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA01086 for ; Thu, 14 Oct 1999 19:05:05 -0700 Received: (from jriely@localhost) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA29402; Thu, 14 Oct 1999 21:05:48 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 21:05:48 -0500 (CDT) From: "Jeremiah J. Riely" X-Sender: jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex In-Reply-To: <380578CF.7DFAC575@dallasfootbag.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > > I think blurry should mean stepping paradox, how about calling stepping > > oposite side miraging. So a torque is a miraging osis. We could make it so > > if you just say miraging it means clipper set miraging, > > This would work. So a blur would be a miraging mirage or a blurry > mirage - one and the same, right? But, for cases without paradox (eg. actually, miraging mirage wouldn't exsist, it would have to be miraging paradox mirage, or blurry mirage. > stepping op side dyno), they would just be miraging. So, the whole > 'blurry' concept would only be used for counting adds (like the current > pdx definition). Is this what you are saying? Yes, 'blurry' in my opinion should mean miraging paradox > The only problem I have with this is that a stepping/blurry set involves > a plant. So, for this definition to be complete it would have to have a > plant in it as follows: > > A 'Miraging' set is: > clip > op in (plant) > op No. The plant doesn't have to be in there. A drifter is a miraging clipper, whether it has a plant or not is arbitrary. Shit, I just realized that drifter doesn't fit into the definition of miraging, but I think it should. Same thing with stepping clipper (like a whirl sort of), that doesn't fit into the definition of stepping, but doesn't everyone think of a stepping clipper like a stepping butterfly but with no dex on the buttefly? I don't know how to fix this. It seems only to apply to 2 moves. Anyway, miraging symposium rev. whirl doesn't have a plant in it either. Also, you do not have to plant on many blurry moves, blurry symposium whirl or backside symposium blur for example. Stepping and slapping are the only sets that require a plant. > ionic (or quantum - which sounds better?): > toe > op in (plant) > op Personaly, I prefer toe miraging, but both of those names are good. The plant is not required in one of these sets. A symposium toe blur is an ionic symposium mirage and there is no plant of the first mirage leg. > The slapping name comes from the tapping concept which is: > toe > op out (plant) > same Yeah. But your sentace above is unclear. Slapping is toe > op out (plant) > same > Let me know what you think about the blurry/miraging thing. Yeah, send some feedback. I'm pretty sure there were a few people who were adament about blurry meaning stepping paradox and not stepping op, oh wait, now it would be miraging paradox wouldn't it :-). P.S. I found a problem similar to the drifter/stepping clipper probelm with slapping and ionic. Ionic clipper *should* be toe > op in > same clip but that doesn't fit the defintion of ionic. Also, a slapping clipper should be like a funky toe whirl (toe > op in (plant) > op clip), but that wouldn't fit the definition of slapping. Anyone see a simple solution to these issues? The definition could be modified slightly so that the sets ending in 'same' could be 'same or op clip' and the sets ending in 'op' could be 'op or same clip'. This would fix it perfectly, but make the definitions a little more complicated. What do other think? later From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 17:23:42 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA32632 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 17:23:42 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f132.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.132]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id EAA20701 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 04:29:50 -0700 Received: (qmail 25728 invoked by uid 0); 15 Oct 1999 11:30:12 -0000 Message-ID: <19991015113012.25727.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 192.35.17.13 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 04:30:12 PDT X-Originating-IP: [192.35.17.13] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] BLURry Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 04:30:12 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ok, first I'd like to say that I really think Derric's proposal is the clearest, and easiest to understand proposal I've seen. For all of you who think blurry should be defined as stepping paradox, I'd like to say you're all on crack, but more rationally I'll say your going to confuse a lot of players. We creat set names to help describe like moves, what good do they do if most people cann't figure out what they are, and if they all have differing deffenitions, ie set X means a type of dex followed by a same dex, set Y is a type of dex followed by a paradox, and so on. I-man wrote: >and a stepping set is... >x-body>op launch dex in.. period.. that is.. if y'll just got to >have it in notation somehow... :) Ok, as my memory serves me Scott D. named this set after seeing Gensu doing stepping butterfly (or so I read) and at that time he proposed that the set name "stepping" could also be used to apply to other same side moves. So before we abuse, redefine, or take liberties with this, Scott did you infact name this, and if so what did you mean? From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 17:23:44 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA32637 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 17:23:44 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f216.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.216]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA25502 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 06:47:07 -0700 Received: (qmail 98747 invoked by uid 0); 15 Oct 1999 13:47:29 -0000 Message-ID: <19991015134729.98746.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.206.120.240 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 06:47:29 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.206.120.240] From: "Ian Dubman" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: (Nuclear Torque) food processor and the like Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 08:47:29 CDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Mr E.W. sayz... >taste of an idear... > >** :).. Any dex which passes both over and under(in theory) the bag can >build to be worth 2 ADDS each AFTER the first is completed. This means >that >"toe-op dex-op" can build and so can paradoxes. Not stepping sets, >butterfly dexes, or "final dex same" though. I like this. Your examples were well represented, also. I was trying to think of an example that would not work, but none came to mind. >I've got 3 other modifications which are even simpler and no moves lose >adds >but some gain where desperately needed. Also, these modifiers would help >the add system grow with future technical revolutions. Geez, this guy is absolutely bubbling with good posts and ideas. What are you waiting for?? Give them up!! Later, Ian D. MUFF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Oct 15 18:56:55 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA00346 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 18:56:55 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Tony Glick Received: from Allman144@aol.com by imo26.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zRPHa21033 (3970) for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 13:49:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.c75f523f.253883fc@aol.com> Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 09:19:56 EDT Subject: [freestyle] Re: BLURry To: freestyle@list.footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 17 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Eric wrote: << Also, I would propose that a spin in either direction out of a stepping set is an in-spin. Why?... either way you are spinning into the set.... but more importantly... neither way is significantly more difficult than the other and they are both worth another add. >> Yes! Exactly! I agree 100%. Tony Glick From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 16 01:49:28 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA00846 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 01:49:28 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA07384 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 13:48:31 -0700 Received: (from jriely@localhost) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA27078; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 15:49:27 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 15:49:27 -0500 (CDT) From: "Jeremiah J. Riely" X-Sender: jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Slapping is toe > op out (plant) > same I meant to say slapping is toe > op in (plant) > same sorry later From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 16 01:49:40 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA00851 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 01:49:40 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from homer.tomahawktech.com (tomahawktech.com [206.191.48.232]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA09315 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 14:46:21 -0700 Received: from dave (Administrators@localhost) by homer.tomahawktech.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA00251 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 17:49:29 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Message-ID: <004901bf1757$431f94c0$d38dfea9@dave> From: "Dave Reid" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: (Nuclear Torque) food processor and the like Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 17:50:13 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org The almighty Eric Wulff wrote: >I've got 3 other modifications which are even simpler and no moves lose adds >but some gain where desperately needed. Also, these modifiers would help >the add system grow with future technical revolutions. > >If I may throw in a little politics, I've passed this by "The Enforcer" and >have his endorsement. :) Ok, who agrees that we should all pitch in a couple of bucks each so that Mr.Wulff his mysterious "The Enforcer" friend can take a couple of days off work and produce the answers to all of the existing freestyle debates? :) The "Bonus Add" idea is very much like previous full/half add ideas. Pros: - small change that is easy for the freestyle community to accept (not that there has been a problem with people accepting anything :) ) - no undeserving moves getting extra credit Cons: - some lesser moves don't get any bonus even though they are tougher than their equal-add counterparts due to the full over/under dex (clip mirage vs. toe mirage, legover vs. rev legover) (I know this is a weak argument, but I had to give something in the cons category :) ) I don't really understand why the clause was necessary at the end to eliminate butterfly, etc. Those are all non-over/under dexes that wouldn't seem to qualify anyway... Dave From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 16 01:55:48 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA00882 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 01:55:48 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA16322 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 18:08:31 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA529 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 18:09:26 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] damnit I cant think of a subject Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 18:09:32 -0700 Message-ID: <003001bf1773$1b7e4080$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ceiling Fan... >Hm, my only beef with your proposed name is that I do a move which is a >ripped warrior flyer kick. Flying ripwalk isn't that "ripped" if you know >what I mean. Good point.. I can dig it.. ew by the way.. sweet flyer dude!.. :) From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 16 03:53:01 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA01055 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 03:53:01 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA17236 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 18:34:49 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA568 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 18:35:44 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ducking/diving after a dex Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 18:35:49 -0700 Message-ID: <003201bf1776$c7819000$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org JJR... >No. The plant doesn't have to be in there. A drifter is a miraging >clipper, whether it has a plant or not is arbitrary. Shit, I just >realized that drifter doesn't fit into the definition of miraging, >but I think it should. Same thing with stepping clipper (like a whirl >sort of), that doesn't fit into the definition of stepping, but >doesn't everyone think of a stepping clipper like a stepping >butterfly but with no dex on the buttefly? I don't know how to fix this Some good points about the plant stuff JJ. For starters,.. everyone, where are some of you folks getting your "definitions" from? A mirage can not and will not ever be a set or related to the set which is at the beginning of a rip-walk and blur... according to me. Someone said earlier, and I totally agree, that a mirage from a cross body has a clipper type set. The dex is not involved in the set. Just because a mirage and step could both be dexes which go in the same direction off a x-body set does not mean they are the same thing. Would anyone ever call a whirl a miraging clipper stall?... well? How's this for detailed notation?... -Step Set... x-body>op launch-in-plant (of course with a little same launch after that x-body mixed in for zip:) -Mirage... x-body>op launch-same in>same plant>op delay I knew how to do mirage, paradox mirage and butterfly for 6 to 8 years before I learned blur or rip-walk. Mirage as a move didn't help me learn the set for blur and rip-walk in the least. I had to school the "step"... like mad.. ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 16 03:53:02 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id DAA01056 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 03:53:02 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.118]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA18553 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 19:25:07 -0700 Received: from postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net (postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.246]) by mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AC9D717; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 19:26:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from production@localhost) by postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-d/mt.gso.26Feb98) id TAA23807; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 19:26:01 -0700 (PDT) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQdbJgBha1wMiPJ00KJHGXzP5GoUQIUZmospLFgVYR1FqjVhWfCgKKfpHc= From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 22:26:01 -0400 (EDT) To: ewulff@jsishipping.com (Eric Wulff) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: (Nuclear Torque) food processor and the like Message-ID: <19973-3807E239-940@postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Eric Wulff" 's message of Tue, 12 Oct 1999 20:38:33 -0700 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Eric the Great: <<** :).. Any dex which passes both over and under(in theory) the bag can build to be worth 2 ADDS each AFTER the first is completed. This means that "toe-op dex-op" can build and so can paradoxes. Not stepping sets, butterfly dexes, or "final dex same" though.>> You've got my vote, Ironman : )) GF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 16 05:14:34 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA01349 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 05:14:34 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA19850 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 20:10:38 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA665 for ; Fri, 15 Oct 1999 20:11:34 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'GF Smoothie aka Greg nelson'" Cc: "'freestyle list'" Subject: RE: [freestyle] (Nuclear Torque) food processor and the like Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 20:11:40 -0700 Message-ID: <003b01bf1784$2b6aba80$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <19973-3807E239-940@postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net> X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 0000000046854878464FD311A3E100A0C967D58684FB3D00 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Uh.. I said.. <<** :).. Any dex which passes both over and under(in theory) the bag >>can build to be worth 2 ADDS each AFTER the first is completed. This >>means that "toe-op dex-op" can build and so can paradoxes. Not >>stepping >>sets, butterfly dexes, or "final dex same" though.>> to which the Smoothest Smoothie of em all.. :) >You've got my vote, Ironman : )) Cool GF.. next I'm runnin for prez.. actually this has gotten very little response from the list folk.. I don't know quite what that means... anybody?.. as Floyd would say... Pink that is.. is there anybody out there?.. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 16 16:11:31 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA01661 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 16:11:31 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web1005.mail.yahoo.com (web1005.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.95]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id DAA01870 for ; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 03:12:40 -0700 Message-ID: <19991016102616.15732.rocketmail@web1005.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [158.252.241.151] by web1005.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 03:26:16 PDT Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 03:26:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Ahren Gehrman Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: (Nuclear Torque) food processor and the like To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Uh, > Ok, who agrees that we should all pitch in a couple > of bucks each so that > Mr.Wulff his mysterious "The Enforcer" friend can > take a couple of days off > work and produce the answers to all of the existing > freestyle debates? :) "The Enforcer"? Yeah, who is this mysterious man called "Enforcer"? ===== From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Oct 16 16:11:37 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA01666 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 16:11:37 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from smtp6.mindspring.com (smtp6.mindspring.com [207.69.200.110]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id GAA08282 for ; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 06:33:28 -0700 Received: from smegma (user-2ivf21m.dialup.mindspring.com [165.247.136.54]) by smtp6.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA11518 for ; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 09:34:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19991016093408.0080d310@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: ecrvich@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 09:34:08 -0400 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Ernest Crvich Subject: Re: [freestyle] Cool rewind moves In-Reply-To: <0.61876cb9.25368496@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 08:57 PM 10/13/99 EDT, Bryan Fournier wrote: >In a message dated 10/13/99 3:06:12 PM Pacific Daylight Time, >kaplanb@mscd.edu writes: > >>On Tue, 12 Oct 1999, Bryan Fournier wrote: >>> Torque>Gyrating mirage > >> Uh, I don't think those are rewind. Gyrating mirage rewound would be > >I must have forgotton to retitle that message...its a cool combo though, its >zoom set...anyway I'll keep quiet now Wasn't your point that a toe-set torque and a spinning reverse mirage are rewound? I noticed the ubiquitous paradon/barrage (aka fiesta) wasn't on the list, but I suppose that's considered too pedestrian nowadays. Let me be the first to say how nifty it is that atom smasher is itself rewound...a palindromic move, you might say. Any other palindromes? -- Ernest "Scratch" Crvich http://www.mindspring.com/~ecrvich Geek Code v3.1: GCS d- s+:-- a- C++ W++ N++ w+ M- V-- t+ e++ h+ Have footbag, will shred. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 17 05:34:18 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA02760 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 17 Oct 1999 05:34:18 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f77.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.77]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA13967 for ; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 10:48:04 -0700 Received: (qmail 26379 invoked by uid 0); 16 Oct 1999 17:48:36 -0000 Message-ID: <19991016174836.26378.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 10:48:35 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: ecrvich@mindspring.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Cool rewind moves Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 13:48:35 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all, Ernest Crvich asked: > Let me be the first to say how nifty it is that atom smasher is itself >rewound...a palindromic move, you might say. Any other palindromes? Ripwalk, Faerie in-legover, pixie leg over, Ripped warrior, Nemesis, stepping butterfly, Magellan, toe blizzard, ducking clipper, Nuclear drifer and tap to name a few. Fun stuff. Ceiling Fan nyfa/bear feet From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 17 05:35:09 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA02781 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 17 Oct 1999 05:35:09 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Tony Glick Received: from Allman144@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zZUK0R47e_ (3972) for ; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 19:18:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.4211757e.253a61b7@aol.com> Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 19:18:15 EDT Subject: [freestyle] Re: Eric's post To: freestyle@list.footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 17 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Eric said: "Some good points about the plant stuff JJ. For starters,.. everyone, where are some of you folks getting your "definitions" from? A mirage can not and will not ever be a set or related to the set which is at the beginning of a rip-walk and blur... according to me. Someone said earlier, and I totally agree, that a mirage from a cross body has a clipper type set. The dex is not involved in the set. Just because a mirage and step could both be dexes which go in the same direction off a x-body set does not mean they are the same thing. Would anyone ever call a whirl a miraging clipper stall?... well?" Eric, after reading your post three times I THINK I understand it. Are you saying that a drifter is NOT miraging clipper? If it isn't, what is it? I am confused! Help me out here. Tell "The Enforcer" I said hi :) Tony Glick From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 17 05:35:28 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA02791 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 17 Oct 1999 05:35:28 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from admin.cgocable.net (admin.cgocable.net [24.226.1.21]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA30630 for ; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 21:41:29 -0700 Received: from [24.226.9.44] (cgowave-9-44.cgocable.net [24.226.9.44]) by admin.cgocable.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA15797 for ; Sun, 17 Oct 1999 00:42:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199910170442.AAA15797@admin.cgocable.net> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express for Macintosh - 4.01 (295) Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 00:55:00 -0400 Subject: [freestyle] Move in Question, oh wise ones... From: "Neil Bearse" To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey everyone... ive got a quick question. a friend of mine hit a sweet move the other day, which was somethin like a mirage straight into a butterfly.... it was set from a toe, so i was THINKIN that it was a toe ripwalk, but then i was watchin clips and it seems that there is a plant between the dexes in a ripwalk. his was set from a right toe. then went inside out with his left leg, while going outside in with his right leg, ending in a left clipper delay so thats toe >op in>op out>op clip but no plant inbetween the dexes.. whassat called? Neil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 17 06:08:51 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA02899 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 17 Oct 1999 06:08:51 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f82.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.82]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA31917 for ; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 22:16:45 -0700 Received: (qmail 22519 invoked by uid 0); 17 Oct 1999 05:17:20 -0000 Message-ID: <19991017051720.22518.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 22:17:19 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: jester21@cgocable.net, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Move in Question, oh wise ones... Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 01:17:19 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all. Neil Bearse asked what this was: >set from a right toe. then went >inside out with his left leg, while going outside in with his right leg, >ending in a left clipper delay > >so thats > toe >op in>op out>op clip > >but no plant inbetween the dexes.. whassat called? That's a toe set Da Da Curve. Oh the memories, my first 4 add move. Be sure to accentuate the double leg over part to make them dexes clean. Oh, and toe ripwalk is also a move, which is pretty cool and lots of fun. Shred on. Ken CF Somolinos bear feet/nyfa From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Oct 17 06:19:17 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA02933 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 17 Oct 1999 06:19:17 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Matt Cross Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com (imo17.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.7]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA32025 for ; Sat, 16 Oct 1999 22:21:22 -0700 Received: from MatthewL329@aol.com by imo17.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zTQIa17057 (7814) for ; Sun, 17 Oct 1999 01:21:52 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.c5529eb8.253ab6ef@aol.com> Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 01:21:51 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Cool rewind moves To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 214 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Rewind means palindromic, right? This one's pretty simple, I like to do it time to time pendulum> atw> rake the atw's behind the back. it's fun lookin, and fun doin. yeeeeehaw... Good luck to Windsen at Texas States Matt From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 18 16:56:14 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA05045 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 16:56:14 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from ego.mind.net (IDENT:mail@ego.mind.net [206.99.66.9]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA23479 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 01:52:45 -0700 Received: from 206.151.159.210 (ip277.mind.net [206.151.159.210]) by ego.mind.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA13912 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 01:53:50 -0700 Message-ID: <380A7D79.75C9@mind.net> Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 01:53:00 +0000 From: Forest Schrodt X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Carpool or ride? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Howdy folks, I was just wondering if anyone is traveling south through Oregon on Interstate 5 for the Cal State tourney. I live in Ashland Oregon which is the last town on I5 before you cross the border to California. I would love to catch a ride or carpool for I really don't want to drive all that way by myself. Hope to see you all there. Forest 541-552-0680 From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 18 16:56:16 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA05050 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 16:56:16 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f62.law4.hotmail.com [216.33.149.62]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA02037 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 07:32:53 -0700 Received: (qmail 54693 invoked by uid 0); 18 Oct 1999 14:33:34 -0000 Message-ID: <19991018143334.54692.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 152.163.161.208 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 07:33:33 PDT X-Originating-IP: [152.163.161.208] From: "Daniel Kramer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: RE: [freestyle] (Nuclear Torque) food processor and the like Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 07:33:33 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org << actually this has gotten very little response from the list folk.. I don't know quite what that means... anybody?.. >> I think it's almost universally accepted that a full dex should be rewarded differently than a half dex. That's probably why not too many people have responded. I, and I'm sure many others, would like to see a nice long list of moves to see how they're affected by this modification. Please don't forget to include moves that do not change. Thanks. DanK From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 18 22:04:07 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA05471 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 22:04:07 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA14579 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 13:37:25 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA1419 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 13:38:38 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Re: Eric's post Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 13:38:56 -0700 Message-ID: <004301bf19a8$cd24bbc0$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Tony Glick... >Eric, after reading your post three times I THINK I understand it. Are you >saying that a drifter is NOT miraging clipper? If it isn't, what is it? I >am confused! Help me out here. Tell "The Enforcer" I said hi :) No, I am trying to point out that move's notations can be the same but that doesn't mean they are the same move. Notation is limiting in description. A whirl and a stepping clipper would have the same notation. x-body>op in>op cross body delay. These are definitely different moves and neither has a mirage in it.(x-body>op in Also, I would say that a drifter IS a miraging clipper but if someone asked me what the set was I would say... it was a "xbody set" or a "toe set" or whatever it was. The in dex is not part of the set in a mirage.. when the in dex is part of the set it becomes a step. ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 18 22:17:53 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA05500 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 22:17:53 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA16910 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 14:29:03 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA1508 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 14:30:16 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Re: (Nuclear Torque) food processor and the like Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 14:30:33 -0700 Message-ID: <004501bf19b0$04323140$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Torch.. >"The Enforcer"? >Yeah, who is this mysterious man called "Enforcer"? why he's the "Bad Motor Scooter".. of course.. e dub From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 18 22:45:29 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA05575 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 22:45:29 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo25.mx.aol.com (imo25.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.69]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA17541 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 14:46:58 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo25.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zWJLa08114 (4426) for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 17:47:24 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.e91bab8.253cef6c@aol.com> Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 17:47:24 EDT Subject: [freestyle] tx states To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 41 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org hey guys, can anyone let me in on what happened on the 2nd day of tx states. I had to leave which makes me sooo pissed at the moment. did we ever get to finish the golf round? thanks Windsen Pan p.s. oh yea...does anyone have my cd that i used for my routine..i forgot to pick it up after freestyle competions. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Oct 18 23:55:18 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA05628 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 23:55:18 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA20656 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 15:58:51 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991018225956.LPI318.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 15:59:56 -0700 Message-ID: <380BA62C.636C2ADD@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 17:58:52 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dave Cecconi CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] I need help w/ the clipper stall References: <0.6ad3388b.25351d4c@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Dave Cecconi wrote: > > Now correct me if I'm wrong, but for an osis, don't u spin away from the bag? > > That is the way I have been performing the osis. Have I been spinning the > wrong way? Osis is an odd move - hard to define. But, you can set a left foot osis from anywhere - right clipper, left clipper, right toe, left toe, dragon, heel, sole, anything. The thing that makes it an osis is the little half-spin into a clipper. So, no, you haven't been spinning the wrong way. You just haven't been spinning in every possible way. Make sense? -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 19 05:24:13 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA06094 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 05:24:13 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA27223 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 18:46:49 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991019014802.DEAX318.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org> for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 18:48:02 -0700 Message-ID: <380BCD94.5C2EEC29@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 20:47:00 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] (Nuclear Torque) food processor and the like References: <003b01bf1784$2b6aba80$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Okie dokie. Sorry about not being able to clutter everyone's mailboxes for the past few days - I was in Austin at a GREAT tournament (thanks Tina!). But, I'm back in full force with a need to write. Eric Wulff wrote: > <<** :).. Any dex which passes both over and under(in theory) the bag > >>can build to be worth 2 ADDS each AFTER the first is completed. This > >>means that "toe-op dex-op" can build and so can paradoxes. Not >>stepping > >>sets, butterfly dexes, or "final dex same" though.>> So, what you are saying is that there are two types of dexes - full and half. When a leg goes over and under, it is a full dex and when it just goes over it is a half dex, right? You can't forget the bubba set. That is not toe set - it is, by your notation, a "clip-op dex-op". This is most definitely a complete dex. I see where you are coming from counting only a half dex on stepping and pixie sets. How does it apply to these moves? pixie gyro mirage - pixie set from right toe > spin counterclockwise > mirage with left leg > catch on right toe. By adding this spin element, does it make the first pixie set a full dex? **I know that this doesn't have a second full dex, but what if it did? Pixie gyro rev mirage, etc... - My first question is this - does a spin alter the completness (is that a word?) of a dex? Also, are all legovers only half dexes? IN legovers? I'm thinking scrambled eggbeater here - no bonus add? Bubba op in legover (clipper set scrambled eggbeater) - still just three adds? What about the gyro out legovers? Still just a half dex? Swirls - full dex? what about whirling sets? Blistering whirl - does it get the bonus add? How about a move I've seen Chad come close on - a whirling pdx whirl. I do like your "bonus" add as a patch to the ADD system. Does it take everything into account, maybe not. Then again, what does? I am absolutely one hundred percent behind this IF it can have a set definition. I really hate paradox which has to be defined on a move by move basis. You have to know which move is paradox, you can't really figure out which moves are paradox by a Job's notation sort of thing. Spinning paradox - 'nuff said. Dan K. said: > I, and I'm sure many others, would like to see a nice long list of moves to > see how they're affected by this modification. Please don't forget to > include moves that do not change. Yes! let us see a list of moves with all kinds of stuff - spins, inspins, gyros, swirls, ducking, pixie spins, fairy whirls, twirls, whirling swirls, fairy dynos, pixie blenders, etc, etc. I don't think we need another paradox (something that works in most but not all cases). If this bonus add holds up for all cases, let's do it. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 19 05:24:10 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA06089 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 05:24:10 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from firefly.prairienet.org (firefly.prairienet.org [192.17.3.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA25936 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 18:10:27 -0700 Received: from bluestem.prairienet.org (bluestem.prairienet.org [192.17.3.4]) by firefly.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA27246 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 20:11:41 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from konrad@localhost) by bluestem.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA18923; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 20:11:41 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 20:11:40 -0500 (CDT) From: Philip Summers Subject: [freestyle] Paradox moves To: freestyle@footbag.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In response to the nuclear torque debate: It seems to me that a nuclear torque has two paradox dexterities in it, making it a whopping 7-add move. I'm not sure if there is an "official" definition of paradox, but it seems to be clip > op in/out (plant). I think there are other situations that are really paradox even though they aren't clipper set. The second dex in the atom smasher is a good example. Right toe set; your left leg comes over the bag from out to in passing in front of your support leg. That position is almost like the position you're in right after a clipper set. The only difference is which leg is planted. To complete the mirage you have to uncross your legs, moving the front leg out of the way of the other. Isn't that a paradox-like motion? I would define paradox as a dexterity performed by a leg that comes from behind the other, excluding same toe delays, and in the case of out to in op clipper delays. According to this, here's some moves that would be affected: atom smasher: 4 adds toe blur: 4 paradox blur/blizzard: 5 nuclear mirage: 5 (called nuclear atom smasher by some people???) atomic whirl: 6 paradox blurry whirl: 6 Since I can't do any of those moves, my powers of visualization probably aren't enough to be defining them. But, if you agree/disagree please respond. -Phil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 19 05:25:16 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA06110 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 05:25:16 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA28276 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 19:09:41 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA1817 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 19:10:56 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Re: BLURry Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 19:10:53 -0700 Message-ID: <000101bf19d7$2da95b80$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Andrew Mc.... >Ok, as my memory serves me Scott D. named this set after seeing Gensu >doing >stepping butterfly (or so I read) and at that time he proposed that the set >name "stepping" could also be used to apply to other same side moves. So >before we abuse, redefine, or take liberties with this, Scott did you infact >name this, and if so what did you mean? Actually, both Scott D. and I came up with different names for a move at about the same time. I found out that 2 skuls of stylers were starting to call this move either a "stuttering butterfly"(ew idea) or a "stepping butterfly"(sd idea). Stepping seemed to be catching on better so that is where it is today. Later I thought that, when describing a group of components within a move, the "stepping" in stepping butterfly could be universally used to describe the set in any move which contains the same set as rip-walk or blur or stepping butterfly or haze or fog.. etc. These all contain the EXACT same type of SET. Why we are trying to define a set based on what it is to be followed by it is still beyond me in this case. What is done after the set is what defines the move... not the set. blur... stepping paradox mirage rip-walk.. stepping op butterfly haze... stepping dlo fog.. stepping paradox dlo blurry whirl... stepping paradox whirl ripped warrior.. stepping ducking butterfly jack knife.. stepping diving butterfly No confusion... clear cut... easy... logical... blah.. blah.. blah.. :) ee dub From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 19 06:55:10 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA06184 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 06:55:10 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from smtp.email.msn.com (cpimssmtpu02.email.msn.com [207.46.181.18]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA02938 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 23:01:52 -0700 Received: from n694 - 142.194.49.207 by email.msn.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 23:02:36 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01bf19f8$1efacd00$cf31c28e@n694> From: "Jeff Lopes" To: Subject: [freestyle] Eric Wulff is a God Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 23:06:30 -0700 Organization: Microsoft Corporation MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Dear Eric, My name is Jeff Lopes and I am an up and coming freestyler. On footbag.org you were the first guy I saw shred it up, and I from then on I was hooked. I started shreddin' like crazy, and have gotten to intermediate in 3 months of practise. I can hit a ripwalk 1 in like 15 trys, and I have watched your demo on the site over and over and you do it so smoothly. I was wondering if there are any tips you could give me on this move, cause I love the look of it and I want it in my routine. You are a god man! I am a big fan of yours and hopefully I will see you next year in Vancouver if you go to Worlds. I cant wait to see all the pro's rip it up. Thanks a lot Iron Man. Sincerly, Jeff "The Man O' War" Lopes From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 19 06:55:56 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA06194 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 06:55:56 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA03025 for ; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 23:04:34 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991019060550.GPGZ318.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Mon, 18 Oct 1999 23:05:50 -0700 Message-ID: <380C0A03.6FD0E647@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 01:04:51 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Philip Summers CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Paradox moves References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Philip Summers wrote: > > I would define paradox as a dexterity performed by a leg that comes from > behind the other, excluding same toe delays, and in the case of out to in > op clipper delays. > According to this, here's some moves that would be affected: > atom smasher: 4 adds > toe blur: 4 > paradox blur/blizzard: 5 > nuclear mirage: 5 (called nuclear atom smasher by some people???) actually, this would be a pdx atom smasher - nuclear atom smasher would have three dexes. > atomic whirl: 6 > paradox blurry whirl: 6 Basically, everyone is trying to patch the ADD system. As far as patches go, I like the examples you gave - but what about spins, swirls, ducks, inspins, fairy spins? Everything must be taken into account when making a patch. I think more examples are in order so that we can see exactly what you mean with the leg coming from behind the other one. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 19 18:46:02 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA06753 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 18:46:02 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from diana.sfsu.edu (root@diana.sfsu.edu [130.212.10.239]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA32351 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 10:52:18 -0700 Received: from default (madmax-69.sfsu.edu [130.212.201.69]) by diana.sfsu.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA10230 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 10:50:44 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19991019105002.007adac0@sfsu.edu> X-Sender: tuhuge@sfsu.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 10:50:02 -0700 To: From: Tu Vu Subject: Re: [freestyle] Eric Wulff is a God In-Reply-To: <000c01bf19f8$1efacd00$cf31c28e@n694> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 11:06 PM 10/18/99 -0700, Jeff Lopes wrote: >Dear Eric, > . >You are a god man! I am a big fan of yours and hopefully I will see you >next year in Vancouver if you go to Worlds. I too, think eric is a god man, if would only forgive me for constantly bailing on him to kick. Watch the amazing Eric Wulff this weekend at the california state championships. 2 huge From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 19 18:46:00 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA06748 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 18:46:00 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from firefly.prairienet.org (firefly.prairienet.org [192.17.3.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA25538 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 07:34:42 -0700 Received: from bluestem.prairienet.org (bluestem.prairienet.org [192.17.3.4]) by firefly.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA21108 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 09:35:55 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from konrad@localhost) by bluestem.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA17334; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 09:35:56 -0500 (CDT) Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 09:35:55 -0500 (CDT) From: Philip Summers Subject: Re: [freestyle] Paradox moves To: freestyle@footbag.org In-Reply-To: <19991019050323.37447.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Tue, 19 Oct 1999, KeN Somolinos wrote: > > Hi. > >atomic whirl: 6 > How'd you come by that add count? > CF That was a mistake. Sorry, I should have proofread. atomic whirl should be 5 nuclear whirl should be 6 -Phil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Oct 19 20:43:09 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA06883 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:43:09 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from admin.cgocable.net (admin.cgocable.net [24.226.1.21]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA04932 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:54:09 -0700 Received: from [24.226.9.44] (cgowave-9-44.cgocable.net [24.226.9.44]) by admin.cgocable.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA00447 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 15:21:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199910191921.PAA00447@admin.cgocable.net> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express for Macintosh - 4.01 (295) Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 15:33:23 -0400 Subject: [freestyle] Sandbags... From: "Neil Bearse" To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Whats everyones view on sandbags? i heard of people using the dirty juice at worlds... if i were to get a new footbag should i get the dirty juice, or pellet filled. what are the pros/cons? thanx neil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 02:28:10 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA07178 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 02:28:10 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA06327 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 13:19:59 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991019202117.PTKO318.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org> for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 13:21:17 -0700 Message-ID: <380CD28E.556860B4@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 15:20:30 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: BLURry References: <000101bf19d7$2da95b80$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Eric Wulff wrote: > These all > contain the EXACT same type of SET. Why we are trying to define a set based > on what it is to be followed by it is still beyond me in this case. What is > done after the set is what defines the move... not the set. > > blur... stepping paradox mirage > rip-walk.. stepping op butterfly > haze... stepping dlo > fog.. stepping paradox dlo > blurry whirl... stepping paradox whirl > ripped warrior.. stepping ducking butterfly > jack knife.. stepping diving butterfly > I can get with this (except for ripped warrior and jack knife - which butterfly is it that ends the move?). All I want is a unique name for a uniqe move. If you say stepping op butterfly, that is clearly a ripwalk. If you say toe set ducking mirage, which mirage is it? In this case, you would have to specify further - toe set ducking same side mirage or toe set ducking op mirage. Before people get into an uproar, I'm not saying that "toe set ducking same side mirage" be the common name for the move. But, it is the "technical" name for the move. With that said, how about this: Stepping means clip > op in > "same side" is implied unless otherwise noted in the name of the move (eg ripwalk - stepping op butterfly). Blurry is a specific stepping op case that applies to certain moves only. Blurry is not a set. Stepping op side is not a set. Only the Stepping is a set. I think this should have ew's vote - since it is basically what he said above. How about it? Eric Wulff also wrote: > Also, I would propose that a spin in either direction out of a stepping set > is an in-spin. Why?... either way you are spinning into the set.... but > more importantly... neither way is significantly more difficult than the > other and they are both worth another add. I don't like this. What is a stepping inspinning mirage if you can spin either direction? Suddenly there are two of every stepping inspinning moves. If you define inspinning as spinning into the set, why wouldn't mobius have an inspin? Spins are hard to define, but I think the goal should be to have a unique name for a unique move. I don't like two moves sharing names or two names sharing moves. For the sake of clarity.... -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 02:28:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA07179 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 02:28:11 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web123.yahoomail.com (web123.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.191]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA08070 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 14:10:56 -0700 Message-ID: <19991019211305.742.rocketmail@web123.yahoomail.com> Received: from [204.137.104.61] by web123.yahoomail.com; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 14:13:05 PDT Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 14:13:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Aaron Johnson Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shoes... To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Howdy folks! Just a quick question. What shoes is everybody using? I haven't been able to locate the Rod Lavers in any of the area athletic stores, and I wouldn't feel comfortable ording them because each shoe is sized differently. Are there any other shoes that people feel strongly about that has helped them acheive success with their footbag game. I saw a pair of All-Star Converse that looked like they might work ok. I guess I am just not sure what to really be looking for. Is mesh important or do you need leather. Should they have flat soles, or should they be arched. Any advise will be greatly apprectiated! Thanks. A johnson From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 02:28:10 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA07173 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 02:28:10 -0700 Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 02:28:10 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA09666 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 14:55:50 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA1620 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 14:57:09 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 14:57:07 -0700 Message-ID: <002701bf1a7c$e5754d00$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org DANK!... >I think it's almost universally accepted that a full dex should be rewarded >differently than a half dex. That's probably why not too many people have >responded. You may be right rabbit... yea.. However, this isn't exactly full dex vs half dex either... >I, and I'm sure many others, would like to see a nice long list of moves to >see how they're affected by this modification. Please don't forget to >include moves that do not change. I don't have time for a comprehensive list right now but I'll be back. In the mean time hear are some tasty morsels... and remember, you can make a list also my friends.. :) changes.. atom smasher.. 4 para atom smasher.. 5 tatw... 5 triage... 5 toe blur... 4 plasma.. 6 the same.. fog blur haze bet wetter pixie buttery smear leg beater blah.. blah.. blah ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 02:28:14 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA07184 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 02:28:14 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA12099 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 16:11:35 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991019231254.RXNH318.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 16:12:54 -0700 Message-ID: <380CFACA.3990E67A@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 18:12:10 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Neil Bearse" CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Sandbags... References: <199910191921.PAA00447@admin.cgocable.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Juices typically have 5 stitches per seam. That is enough to hold in pellets, but not sand. Most dirty juices have 7 stitches per seam. Again, not NEARLY enough to hold in sand. I loved my dirty juice until it got to the point where I had to add sand after every day of play. If you want a sandfilled bag, get in touch with Paul Mestas (303) 487-0326. He machine sews his bags so that sand does not fall out. Great quality stuff. You can also order his stuff off of http://www.worldfootbag.com The best thing about dirt bags is that they are a bit heavier - so wind doesn't affect them much. Also, they don't roll - makes for a great putter in golf. Later. -Derric "Neil Bearse" wrote: > > Whats everyones view on sandbags? i heard of people using the dirty > juice at worlds... if i were to get a new footbag should i get the dirty > juice, or pellet filled. what are the pros/cons? > thanx > neil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 02:29:31 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA07209 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 02:29:31 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Bryan Fournier Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com (imo16.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.6]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA16296 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 17:58:45 -0700 Received: from ShReDStEiN@aol.com by imo16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id bUQZa12219 (4255); Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:58:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.b70bad05.253e6dd1@aol.com> Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:58:57 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Sandbags... To: jester21@cgocable.net, freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 26 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In a message dated 10/19/99 1:00:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time, jester21@cgocable.net writes: << i heard of people using the dirty juice at worlds... >> yeah whats up with these "dirty juices" are they good or not? its been a good 3 months since worlds, that should be plenty of break in time for who ever got one. Please talk! they are 32 panels but whats the deal with the break-in and shred-ability I'm curious about these doohickies... thanx list ~Bryan F. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 02:29:42 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA07219 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 02:29:42 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Matt Cross Received: from imo26.mx.aol.com (imo26.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.70]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA12698 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 16:27:35 -0700 Received: from MatthewL329@aol.com by imo26.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zGTCa21033 (4398) for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 19:27:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.d3350bed.253e5877@aol.com> Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 19:27:51 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Sandbags... To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL for Macintosh sub 56 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Neil, I've kicked with a bunch of bags. I found that actual dirtbags are great for freestyle, but can stick to your toes a little bit because they're so floppy. I don't know about dirty juices, but what I do know is that the pretty common view on the matter is that Carol Wedemyer (sp?) handmade bags are the best of what's around. Anyone think otherwise? Matt From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 02:29:45 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA07229 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 02:29:45 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.clearsail.net (mail.clearsail.net [207.252.227.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA13271 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 16:41:31 -0700 Received: from rtgilber (usr102.clearsail.net [207.252.227.102]) by mail.clearsail.net (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA08858 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 18:29:20 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000501bf1a8c$5b0d38c0$66e3fccf@rtgilber> From: "James Gilbert" To: Subject: [freestyle] 5 add move Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 18:47:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Sorry but i'm just so happy that I hit my first 5 add move today that I had to post it, it was a pixie ducking butterfly. I hit it twice while I was shredding today. I'm so motivated and pumped up from the Texas State competition this past weekend. I also hit a spinning osis, and a weakside pixie butterfly today. I am schooling my weak side really hard now. At Texas States I also hit a symposium double leg over. A special thanks to all the pros who let me shred with them in Austin. You guys are great and got me inspired. James "ska boy" Gilbert From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 02:29:49 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA07239 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 02:29:49 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f47.hotmail.com [216.32.181.47]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA13288 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 16:41:44 -0700 Received: (qmail 74017 invoked by uid 0); 19 Oct 1999 23:42:34 -0000 Message-ID: <19991019234234.74016.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 207.167.115.74 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 16:42:33 PDT X-Originating-IP: [207.167.115.74] From: "Ryan Britt" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Re: eric wulff is a god Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 23:42:33 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >My name is Jeff Lopes and I am an up and coming freestyler. Hi Jeff! It's great to see new people discover what an incredible sport footbag is. >I started shreddin' like crazy, and have gotten to >intermediate in 3 months of practise. I can hit a ripwalk 1 in like >15 >trys, Hitting ripwalks after three months? That's pretty good, but I must caution you about something. Have you mastered the basic 2 and 3 add moves? Can you string together a number of the basic moves without trouble? Are you able to keep long strings going, or do you drop frequently? Do you use BOTH sides of your body equally? (That is very important) Any pro will tell you that before you attempt those crazy high add moves, you MUST master the basics first. It will make you a much better player in the long run. Take me for example. I've been playing footbag seriously since June. After a few months I was starting to hit some difficult 4 add moves like the da da curve. I was really excited, but then I realized something. I could do a da da curve on my right side, but couldn't even do a simple around the world stall on my left side. I realized that I dropped the bag far too much, and couldn't string very many moves together. So here's what I did: I said "heck with those high add moves" and I focused on the basics. I skooled around the world's, legovers, mirages, and a few other things. Today, I can't really do any 4 add moves. However, I can create long, dropless strings made of basic moves without too much trouble. Also, my weakside is almost completely gone (this is wonderful, because having a weak side is very frustrating). In my opinion, I've become much more controlled and consistent. I'm not saying that hitting ripwalks after three months is a bad thing. However, make sure you have completely mastered the basics first. It will definately make you a better player. Keep kicking! - Ryan Britt From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 02:29:53 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA07249 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 02:29:53 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from firefly.prairienet.org (firefly.prairienet.org [192.17.3.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA16285 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 17:58:17 -0700 Received: from bluestem.prairienet.org (bluestem.prairienet.org [192.17.3.4]) by firefly.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA22658 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 19:59:36 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from konrad@localhost) by bluestem.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA04980; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 19:59:36 -0500 (CDT) Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 19:59:35 -0500 (CDT) From: Philip Summers Subject: [freestyle] spins To: freestyle@footbag.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I'm not clear on the difference between spinning, inspinning, and gryo. Also, I've heard of "Blurrage" which is a blurry barrage. Has anyone hit a barraging mirage? (doubling the first dex in a blur instead of the second) What about blurry blur? or stepping blur? -Phil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 06:38:53 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA07927 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 06:38:53 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Windsen Pan Received: from imo24.mx.aol.com (imo24.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.68]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA18328 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 18:50:32 -0700 Received: from PHoEtOiD34@aol.com by imo24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v23.6.) id zMXCa06991 (4459) for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 21:51:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0.26502127.253e7a18@aol.com> Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 21:51:20 EDT Subject: Re: [freestyle] Sandbags... To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 41 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I second derric's comments. those bags are freakin sweet!!! I luv em more than juices now. thanks derric for letting me buy it from ya=) Windsen Pan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 06:41:55 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA07942 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 06:41:55 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA22173 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:24:15 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA424 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:25:35 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Re: (Nuclear Torque) food processor and the like Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:25:38 -0700 Message-ID: <007301bf1aaa$c886c060$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org of course.. DS "enlisted man" wrote all the > stuff... >So, what you are saying is that there are two types of dexes - full and >half. When a leg goes over and under, it is a full dex and when it just >goes over it is a half dex, right? Kinda, but I'd rather not call them full or half dexes and they key here is that the dex leg PASSES over and under. Some dexes can build to 2 adds each and some can't. The ones that build to 2 adds are x-dexes >You can't forget the bubba set. Actually.. I can.. what is it? >This is most definitely a complete dex. good.. :) can't argue with that.. >How does it apply to these moves? pixie gyro mirage You tell me... looks like another over under dex could build off that to me. Does that seem unjust? >My first question is this This is by far NOT your first question.. :) >does a spin alter the completness (is that >a word?) of a dex? >Also, are all legovers only half dexes? IN legovers? looks like it... what the @#%*! are you calling an in legover... like >op in>same delay... In this case yes... as the original post describes.. >scrambled eggbeater here - no bonus add? you tell me... what's a scrambled eggbeater?.... clip>op out>op out> delay? or even slip>same out>op out>delay.. If so.. no X-dex and why should it? >What about the gyro out legovers? Still just a half dex? Well, if you can follow this by another dex which passes both over and under than it would built to 2 adds worthiness... (is that word?).. :) but legovers in themselves are not x-dexes >Swirls - full dex? why? over.. delay >what about whirling sets? Blistering whirl - does it get the bonus >add? How about a move I've seen Chad come close on - a whirling pdx >whirl. DS my man... that's the same question like 5 times... whirl is an over dex to me. set over plant... paradox whirl is a different story... again, if someone wants to do a paradox whirling anything into another, or out of another, op dex op than it would be worth 2 adds. >I do like your "bonus" add as a patch to the ADD system. good... not a patch... a modification.. >Does it take everything into account, maybe not. No.. but it is an improvement for sure. >Then again, what does? my sentiments exactly.. >I am absolutely one hundred percent behind this good.. >IF it can have a set definition. It does... I'll work on making it a little more clear.. >I really hate paradox which has to be defined on a move by >move basis. Don't hate it... it's your friend... :) And it isn't called paradox for nothing. And it isn't defined on a move for move basis.. kinda lost me there... >You have to know which move is paradox, you can't really >figure out which moves are paradox by a Job's notation sort of thing. you can't tell alot of moves from one another via job's notation.. don't take that out on paradox.. >Spinning paradox - 'nuff said. no way... I doubt we're even close... thanx alot for your input DS... I look forward to more from you and anyone. Might take me awhile to respond though. til then.. this is ewede.. :) From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 06:42:22 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA07952 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 06:42:22 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f81.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.81]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA19972 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 19:24:21 -0700 Received: (qmail 94265 invoked by uid 0); 20 Oct 1999 02:25:08 -0000 Message-ID: <19991020022508.94264.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 19:25:07 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: konrad@prairienet.org, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] spins Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 22:25:07 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello all you wacky freestylers. Phillip Summers wrote: >Also, I've heard of "Blurrage" which is a blurry barrage. Has >anyone hit a barraging mirage? (doubling the first dex in a blur >instead of the second) >What about blurry blur? or stepping blur? Barraging mirage is called triage. Barraging paradox mirage is called Fury. Sunil has hit both of these. I know Tuan hits Triage, and that Sunil and Tu have hit barraging pdx reverse mirage. How many people out there hit blurrage anyway? I've only seen Tuan do them. As for blurry blur, to my knowledge nobody has hit it yet, though i've seen Peter Irish come pretty damn close. Red, Tuan, and I think Noah have hit blurry symposium blur, but that is "easier" than blurry blur. All very hein stuff indeed. Keep pushing that envelope everybody! Ceiling Fan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 08:16:31 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA08038 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 08:16:31 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA28430 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 00:12:35 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991020071355.ZDRX318.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 00:13:55 -0700 Message-ID: <380D6B8D.EC6AB2B7@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 02:13:17 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Philip Summers CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] spins References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Philip Summers wrote: > > I'm not clear on the difference between spinning, inspinning, and gryo. > > Also, I've heard of "Blurrage" which is a blurry barrage. Has > anyone hit a barraging mirage? Yes. This is called a fury. In fact, the whole barraging set is called a furious set. So, there is a furious whirl (barraging op whirl). If you do a furious same side trick, that is called high stepping (after high plains drifter and stepping). So, there is a high stepping butterfly, high stepping whirl, etc. > What about blurry blur? Usually, the second or third dex is symposium. If the second dex is symp, it is a pogo pdx blur, and if the third dex is symp, it is a blurry voodoo. I've never seen anyone do it by planting after each dex... not yet at least. > or stepping blur? I haven't seen this one yet. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 17:35:34 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA08581 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 17:35:34 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f75.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.75]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA14262 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 06:34:29 -0700 Received: (qmail 4432 invoked by uid 0); 20 Oct 1999 13:35:21 -0000 Message-ID: <19991020133521.4431.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.206.120.240 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 06:35:21 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.206.120.240] From: "Ian Dubman" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] spins Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 08:35:21 CDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >From: "KeN Somolinos" How many people out there hit >blurrage anyway? Though I have not seen him hit it recently, I have seen James Widman hit this as a few times. As for triage, fury, and his most recent attempt at Super Hein--tri-plains drifter, please see the Tsunami. I saw him bust out some crazy stuff in Texas--as was Big Add, Kamikaze, D. Holton, and Eli. Good stuff guys. Later, Ian D. MUFF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 17:35:39 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA08586 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 17:35:39 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web1301.mail.yahoo.com (web1301.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.151]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA18103 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 08:43:29 -0700 Message-ID: <19991020154507.22302.rocketmail@web1301.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [205.221.166.42] by web1301.mail.yahoo.com; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 08:45:07 PDT Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 08:45:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Jane Jones Subject: Re: [freestyle] Sandbags... To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > jester21@cgocable.net writes: > > << i heard of people using the dirty > juice at worlds... >> Dirty Juices are the bomb. Alex Zerbe, Peter Irish and I pretty much only kicked with those at worlds. I think the world champ would even vouch for a dirty juice's freestyle-abilty. the only problem with a dirty juice is that the sand eventually gets kicked out. Luckily our friend blows glass so we have a glass funnel small enough to fit between the seams of the bag to refill with sand. The best sand we've found for refilling with is toy box sand. You can by it anywhere and it's nice and fine so it doesn't clog the funnel. The thing I like most obout dirty juices is the facile lasts longer and the bag doesn't get too big and floppy the more it breaks in. We're still kicking with dirty juices we broke in over a year ago...and they are only just now starting to wear thin. I think the plastic beads that regular juices are stuffed with are really hard on facile and cause your bag to blow panels faster and also stretch the material out too much. cool to hear more people are turning to dirty juices! Now if we could find a way to mass produce tiny funnels ( maybe use jewler's funnels) or find a way to make the sand not leak out of the seams. Paul Mestas' bags are sweet because they're machine sewn so they don't leak sand. I haven't kicked one long enough to know if that entirely holds true. See ya, Jane ===== From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 17:35:45 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA08591 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 17:35:45 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web218.mail.yahoo.com (web218.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.68.118]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA19059 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 09:20:46 -0700 Message-ID: <19991020162334.19578.rocketmail@web218.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [205.221.166.38] by web218.mail.yahoo.com; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 09:23:34 PDT Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 09:23:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Alex Zerbe Subject: Re: [freestyle] Sandbags... To: "Neil" Bearse , freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org --- Neil Bearse wrote: > Whats everyones view on sandbags? i heard of > people using the dirty > juice at worlds... if i were to get a new footbag > should i get the dirty > juice, or pellet filled. what are the pros/cons? > thanx > neil > Hey Neil and the gang, I LOVE SAND BAGS!!!!!! They are the best. Right now I'm kicking with a Jane Jones bag and it is the Bizomb!! If you are going to get a new bag I highly recomend sandbags. However, the major drawback is that they leak (except Paul Mestas Revoultion bags) and once they are empty the only way I have found to fill them, is to use a miniature funnel which I have had custom made. (almost impossible to find. Talk to glass blowers) The soloution for this problem is to find a happy medium. I think the next breakthrough for bag fillings is.......SEED-BEADS!! They are heavy like sand, and don't leak like beads. That what Jane is starting to fill her bags with. Shred on my brothas and sistas ZERBE ===== From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 18:52:33 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA08737 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 18:52:33 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Tony Glick Received: from Allman144@aol.com by imo29.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id zOEEa16946 (6097) for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 13:57:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <5442208d.253f5c9f@aol.com> Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 13:57:51 EDT Subject: [freestyle] Maintaining your game To: freestyle@list.footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL NetMail version 2.0 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey fellow shredders. I have got a little dilemma here. Due to the fact that my engineering classes pretty much take up all of my time, I don't have a lot of time to kick. When I kick it is hard for me to work on new stuff because I have to continuously fine tune my already existing moves. My question is, what are some good ways to MAINTAIN my game? I just have time right now to do anything but that. I would REALLY appreciate any feedback on this. Thanks! Tony Glick From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Oct 20 19:11:00 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA08763 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 19:11:00 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f117.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.117]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA23683 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 11:09:29 -0700 Received: (qmail 46337 invoked by uid 0); 20 Oct 1999 18:10:24 -0000 Message-ID: <19991020181024.46336.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 11:10:24 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: janejones2000@yahoo.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Sandbags... Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 14:10:24 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all, Jane wrote: > >Paul Mestas' bags are sweet because they're machine >sewn so they don't leak sand. I haven't kicked one >long enough to know if that entirely holds true. I kicked with one of Paul's 20 panels at worlds and it worked real well. I have a few of his 4 panel bags, which are really good. They leak sand at a much slower rate than dirtbags, but they DO eventually lose sand. Paul is proudest of his bags with more panels, so it's probably unfair to judge from only having used a 4 panel. Just wanted to say that they do lose sand, but much more slowly than other sand-type bags. On a related note, I'd just like to say I think change is good. When I started to freestyle in the summer of 97, I was under the impression that the only usable shoe was the Adidas Rod Laver, and the only good footbag was a pellet filled juice. It's good to see people kicking in Nikes, Tevas, and Lavers these days, and using Carol bags, Abshire Bags, and Mestas' Revolution sand bags. Keep trying new things everybody, make the sport flourish. Ken CF Somolinos bear feet/nyfa From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 00:51:18 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA09101 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 00:51:18 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.clearsail.net (mail.clearsail.net [207.252.227.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA28592 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 13:09:49 -0700 Received: from rtgilber (216-148-160-131.clearsail.net [216.148.160.131]) by mail.clearsail.net (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA12110; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 14:57:12 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000201bf1b37$f0934dc0$83a094d8@rtgilber> From: "James Gilbert" To: "Aaron Johnson" Cc: References: <19991019211305.742.rocketmail@web123.yahoomail.com> Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shoes... Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 21:49:02 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Aaron >What shoes is everybody using? Almost every freestyler uses Rod Lavers or Teva sport sandals. Many prefer the Rod Lavers. I use Lavers. Both are very good for freestyle. > I wouldn't feel comfortable ording them because each shoe is sized differently. If you have any pair of Adidas shoes like running, indoor soccer, or whatever (except for soccer or baseball cleats) order the size you wear in those. I had a pair of Adidas indoor soccer shoes and I got my Lavers in the same size. The two pairs of shoes fit the same. In my experience Nike sizes have been very close to Adidas sizes. If i'm not mistaken the WFA Footmart will let you return the shoes as long as you haven't made any modifications to them. >Should they have flat soles, or should they be arched. Flat soles are best. The most important things are the insides and toe areas. The insides, toes, and outsides need to be flat and wide. Rod Lavers are the best shoes you can get for freestyle. Or if you prefer sandals, Tevas are the best. I haven't found anything that has measured up to Lavers. James "ska boy" Gilbert From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 00:51:21 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA09106 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 00:51:21 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.clearsail.net (mail.clearsail.net [207.252.227.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA28886 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 13:18:15 -0700 Received: from rtgilber (216-148-160-131.clearsail.net [216.148.160.131]) by mail.clearsail.net (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA13533 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 15:06:10 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002201bf1b39$314ed900$83a094d8@rtgilber> From: "James Gilbert" To: References: <199910191921.PAA00447@admin.cgocable.net> Subject: Re: [freestyle] Sandbags... Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 15:25:02 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Whats everyones view on sandbags? I think sandbags are great. I shredded with some of Paul Mestas's and I really liked them. They have great stallability and are more steady and wind does not affect them very much at all when you're shredding. The thing I kind of didn't like was not really being able to feel the bag on my foot when doing stalls, especially on clippers. James "ska boy" Gilbert From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 00:51:24 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA09111 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 00:51:24 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA32660 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 14:45:46 -0700 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA1338 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 14:47:10 -0700 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Re: Eric Wulff is a Geek Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 14:47:08 -0700 Message-ID: <006501bf1b44$aa0a6fc0$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org ew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 00:52:16 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA09131 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 00:52:16 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f34.hotmail.com [216.32.181.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA04904 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 16:58:17 -0700 Received: (qmail 15844 invoked by uid 0); 20 Oct 1999 23:59:12 -0000 Message-ID: <19991020235912.15843.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 216.44.107.109 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 16:59:12 PDT X-Originating-IP: [216.44.107.109] From: "Stan Sagalovskiy" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] modifying rod lavers? (2) Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 19:59:12 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org i'm reading that page at footbag.org on modifying rod lavers.. and i just don't get what to cut and where.. "stiches that hold down the front toe area" <-- ?? can anyone help.. should i cut? what should i cut? and how should i cut it? thanks again. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 00:52:20 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA09141 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 00:52:20 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f32.hotmail.com [216.32.181.32]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA02041 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 15:40:51 -0700 Received: (qmail 93967 invoked by uid 0); 20 Oct 1999 22:41:43 -0000 Message-ID: <19991020224143.93966.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 216.44.107.57 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 15:41:42 PDT X-Originating-IP: [216.44.107.57] From: "Stan Sagalovskiy" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] rod lavers modifications? Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 18:41:42 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org hi, i just got my first pair of rod lavers (for $55) and i was looking at the modifications page at www.footbag.org, and here i am.. thinking.. take out a blade and cut up these brandnew, still white shoes? does it actually make a difference? stupid Q probably, wouldn't have a separate page for it if it didn't.. but still? i don't know, just wondering. thanks all! -Stan. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 00:52:23 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA09151 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 00:52:23 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.120.62]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA04595 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 16:54:42 -0700 Received: from Sam (dialup-209.245.72.105.LosAngeles1.Level3.net [209.245.72.105]) by snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA22137 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 16:55:54 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <001101bf1b56$8d529440$6948f5d1@Sam> Reply-To: "Sam Colclough" From: "Sam Colclough" To: "Freestyle Mailing List" References: <19991020022508.94264.qmail@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [freestyle] spins Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 16:54:35 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org From: KeN Somolinos > Barraging mirage is called triage. Barraging paradox mirage is called Fury. > Sunil has hit both of these. I know Tuan hits Triage, and that Sunil and Tu > have hit barraging pdx reverse mirage. How many people out there hit > blurrage anyway? *In a meager voice* I can hit a clipper set mirage and a clip set > (no plant while) SAME out > same osis... From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 01:22:36 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA09277 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 01:22:36 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Aaron de Glanville Received: from smtp5.mindspring.com (smtp5.mindspring.com [207.69.200.82]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA05690 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 17:19:36 -0700 Received: from aaron (user-33qtjir.dialup.mindspring.com [199.174.206.91]) by smtp5.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA08567 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:20:56 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19991020171948.012713cc@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: aadegl@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 17:19:48 -0700 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] rod lavers modifications? In-Reply-To: <19991020224143.93966.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org DON'T DO IT!!! DON'T DO IT!!! (crazed laughter) Aaron de Glanville "uncut" >hi, > >i just got my first pair of rod lavers (for $55) and i was looking at the >modifications page at www.footbag.org, and here i am.. thinking.. take out a >blade and cut up these brandnew, still white shoes? >does it actually make a difference? stupid Q probably, wouldn't have a >separate page for it if it didn't.. but still? >i don't know, just wondering. >thanks all! > >-Stan. > From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 01:48:46 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id BAA09322 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 01:48:46 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from admin.cgocable.net (admin.cgocable.net [24.226.1.21]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA06735 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 17:46:39 -0700 Received: from [24.226.9.44] (cgowave-9-44.cgocable.net [24.226.9.44]) by admin.cgocable.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA24968 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:48:42 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199910210048.UAA24968@admin.cgocable.net> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express for Macintosh - 4.01 (295) Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 21:00:57 -0400 Subject: Re: [freestyle] modifying rod lavers? (2) From: "Neil Bearse" To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Stan Wrote: >should i cut? what should i cut? and how should i cut it? you cut the stitches that hold down the piece that has the laceholes in it. right where that strip attaches to the toe box, you'll see a square of stitching. take an exacto knife of something and slowly pop these stitches.. make sure not to cut the BOTTOM line of stitching, only the top and sides.. you'll see. YES it does help a lot...you'll see when you lace these puppies for freestyle, a nice huge toe box opens up for your delaying pleasure :) Neil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 02:09:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA09354 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 02:09:38 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from firefly.prairienet.org (firefly.prairienet.org [192.17.3.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA07835 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 18:19:56 -0700 Received: from bluestem.prairienet.org (bluestem.prairienet.org [192.17.3.4]) by firefly.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA18908 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:21:20 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from konrad@localhost) by bluestem.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA02044; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:21:20 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:21:20 -0500 (CDT) From: Philip Summers Subject: [freestyle] spins To: freestyle@footbag.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org What's the difference between spinning, inspinning, and gyro? Can anyone out there explain them to me? examples of different spinning moves? examples in Jobs notation? -Phil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 04:47:57 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA09882 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 04:47:57 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Aaron de Glanville Received: from smtp5.mindspring.com (smtp5.mindspring.com [207.69.200.82]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA08507 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 18:40:48 -0700 Received: from aaron (user-33qtjir.dialup.mindspring.com [199.174.206.91]) by smtp5.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA23880 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 21:42:14 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19991020184109.006b5570@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: aadegl@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 18:41:09 -0700 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Repost: "Adds Revised-2" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Repost of the old "AR-2" in the context of a discussion with the Torch. Too wordy? Just read the amendments and skip to the scores. >>Start with the add system we all know (and love?). >> >>Include TWO SIMPLE AMENDMENTS: >> >>1. the paradox dex must be the first to occur (to score an add) >> >>2. a bonus dex add is awarded for: >> A) every dex after the first, except in the case of "complementary" >>double-dex moves (two legs dexing in same direction). >> B) every spin/gyro in a dex move not awarded the above bonus [To this, I further simplify, and say don't count delays, in agreement with the pros who have (very convincingly) contended that delays are obsolete as an add catagory. This optional mod is reflected in the scores below.] >O.K. I understand what's getting the extra add but why? Do you have a >logical reason why? What is it that justifies giving these amendments an >extra add? Mabey you already explained it before but I kinda missed it if >you did. I'm not saying you're wrong but I need to know more. It's good >that you're thinking though. If you don't say anything nothing will happen. > >"Torch" Torch~ The rationale behind both amendmends was purely in service of coming up with more accurate final ratings. I just experimented with different formulas until I hit on an easy one that "worked" (my other system, "DAFTT" is much more accurate, but nobody was stoked on the idea of using increments of 0.5!). The idea was primarily to separate the easier 3 add moves from the harder ones, although most multiple dexterity moves clearly get favored. You'll note that the "complementary" moves not earning the bonus basically just include d.l.o, ripwalk, and dada--but since ripwalk and dada end on a clipper, they remain 4 (r)adds. In any case, I find the final scores pretty satisfying, at least compared to the old system: (RADD scores): atw - 1 legover - 1 clipper - 1 butterfly - 2 osis - 2 paradox mirage - 2 whirl - 2 swirl - 2 double legover - 2 torque - 3 eggbeater - 3 barrage - 3 atom smasher - 3 blur - 3 ripwalk - 3 legbeater - 4 barfly - 4 blurry whirl - 4 gyro d.l.o - 4 paradox torque - 5 flurry - 5 mobius - 5 blurriest - 6 paradon swirl - 6 It's obviously not perfect. It doesn't even attempt to be--just significant improvement with minimal, basic changes. Thanks for the interest, aa From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 04:47:54 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA09877 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 04:47:54 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Aaron de Glanville Received: from smtp5.mindspring.com (smtp5.mindspring.com [207.69.200.82]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA08462 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 18:39:40 -0700 Received: from aaron (user-33qtjir.dialup.mindspring.com [199.174.206.91]) by smtp5.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA04555 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 21:41:05 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19991020184001.0127233c@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: aadegl@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 18:40:01 -0700 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] WRAP ("Wulff's Revised Adds Proposal") In-Reply-To: <003b01bf1784$2b6aba80$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> References: <19973-3807E239-940@postoffice-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Wulff's words: ><<** :).. Any dex which passes both over and under(in theory) the bag >>>can build to be worth 2 ADDS each AFTER the first is completed. This >>>means that "toe-op dex-op" can build and so can paradoxes. Not >>stepping >>>sets, butterfly dexes, or "final dex same" though.>> > Bonus dex add... I like it... ;) I guess this particular formulation is still a little unclear to me. Does "over and under" = "behind / in front" = "one full dex"? I suspect not, but tell me for sure. If so, why wouldn't a double atw get the bonus? I'd second the request for a modest list of revised scores (including 1-6 add moves). As you know by now, I infinitely prefer this line of inquiry to "the add system is fine the way it is and even if it's not why bother to change it" mentality that my own similar suggestions were overwhelmingly greeted with over a year ago. So sincere props to these new ideas and possibilities. A revised scoring system has implications beyond just the competitive arena--scores, however imperfect and arbitrary, still have an almost subliminal effect upon people's idea of difficulty (witness the crippling weight placed on "guiltless" and "tripless"). goodwill to y'all (my freestyle family) Aaron de Glanville "uncut" PS Finally hit my first Amber Wolles about a week back... ;) From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 04:48:05 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id EAA09888 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 04:48:05 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.clearsail.net (mail.clearsail.net [207.252.227.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA11427 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 19:46:10 -0700 Received: from rtgilber (usr105.clearsail.net [207.252.227.105]) by mail.clearsail.net (8.9.3/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA03127 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 21:34:01 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001501bf1b6f$60da43e0$69e3fccf@rtgilber> From: "James Gilbert" To: Subject: [freestyle] Dragon Move Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 21:52:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Today I was experimenting, and I hit these moves: toe > op out > op outside delay it's butterfly ending in a dragon delay and toe > same out > op outside delay same thing as above Has anybody else hit these moves above?? I bet Jonathan Schneider has hit them. by accident when trying to do the above moves I hit: toe > op out > op heel delay and toe > same out > op heel delay Any special names for these? James "ska boy" Gilbert From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 05:36:25 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA10003 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 05:36:25 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: "Matt Wafaie" Received: from dnvrpop3.dnvr.uswest.net (dnvrpop3.dnvr.uswest.net [206.196.128.5]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA15271 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 21:39:49 -0700 Received: (qmail 17599 invoked by alias); 21 Oct 1999 04:41:11 -0000 Delivered-To: fixup-freestyle@footbag.org@fixme Received: (qmail 17459 invoked by uid 0); 21 Oct 1999 04:41:07 -0000 Received: from rdialup243.dnvr.uswest.net (HELO uswest.net) (216.160.172.243) by dnvrpop3.dnvr.uswest.net with SMTP; 21 Oct 1999 04:41:07 -0000 Message-ID: <380E98C2.D5253C2D@uswest.net> Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 22:38:27 -0600 Reply-To: mattius@uswest.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Around the world Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org In order for around the world to be properly done is it required to pass the dex straight over the top of the bag and catch it or is it okay to kind of go around in front and back then catch it? M@ From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 05:36:28 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA10008 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 05:36:28 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: "Matt Wafaie" Received: from dnvrpop3.dnvr.uswest.net (dnvrpop3.dnvr.uswest.net [206.196.128.5]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA15810 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 21:44:48 -0700 Received: (qmail 27133 invoked by alias); 21 Oct 1999 04:46:11 -0000 Delivered-To: fixup-freestyle@footbag.org@fixme Received: (qmail 26794 invoked by uid 0); 21 Oct 1999 04:45:59 -0000 Received: from rdialup243.dnvr.uswest.net (HELO uswest.net) (216.160.172.243) by dnvrpop3.dnvr.uswest.net with SMTP; 21 Oct 1999 04:45:59 -0000 Message-ID: <380E99E8.2CA76A72@uswest.net> Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 22:43:20 -0600 Reply-To: mattius@uswest.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Shoes... References: <19991019211305.742.rocketmail@web123.yahoomail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Get some shoes that have a relatively flat insole. You also want the toe flat, not rounded. Get some that aren't to heavy and that will be comfortable. Landing can do a number on your feet if your shoes are uncomfortable. M@ From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 06:06:37 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA10060 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 06:06:37 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA16547 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 22:09:37 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991021051103.QDVU318.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 22:11:03 -0700 Message-ID: <380EA052.4E61AEFA@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 00:10:42 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Philip Summers CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] spins References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Philip Summers wrote: > > What's the difference between spinning, inspinning, and gyro? > Can anyone out there explain them to me? > Great questions. I've been asking myself the same thing for a while now. Currently, I don't think any of these terms are really defined... at least, not consistently. Anyone care to define these? > examples of different spinning moves? > > examples in Jobs notation? This would be great. Later. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 06:06:40 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA10065 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 06:06:40 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from news.rdc1.tx.home.com (ioracle@ha2.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.67]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA16626 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 22:12:11 -0700 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by news.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991021051338.QEPY318.news.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 22:13:38 -0700 Message-ID: <380EA0ED.7A32A6A4@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 00:13:17 -0500 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mattius@uswest.net CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Around the world References: <380E98C2.D5253C2D@uswest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Matt Wafaie wrote: > > In order for around the world to be properly done is it > required to pass the dex straight over the top of the bag > and catch it or is it okay to kind of go around in front and > back then catch it? The dex should be done with the ankle. Your foot goes around the bag, not over it. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 06:26:00 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id GAA10114 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 06:26:00 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f188.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.188]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA17056 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 22:24:24 -0700 Received: (qmail 22196 invoked by uid 0); 21 Oct 1999 05:25:22 -0000 Message-ID: <19991021052522.22195.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 22:25:21 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: aadegl@mindspring.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Repost: "Adds Revised-2" Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 01:25:21 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all, Aaron de Glanville proposed > >> >TWO SIMPLE AMENDMENTS: > >> > >>1. the paradox dex must be the first to occur (to score an add) > >> > >>2. a bonus dex add is awarded for: > >> A) every dex after the first, except in the case of "complementary" > >>double-dex moves (two legs dexing in same direction). > >> B) every spin/gyro in a dex move not awarded the above bonus > > >osis - 2 >atom smasher - 3 >ripwalk - 3 >legbeater - 4 >blurry whirl - 4 >paradox torque - 5 >blurriest - 6 All right, so by this system, a toe blizzard, fairy mirage, and regular blizzard are all equal in difficulty to an osis. A ripwalk is considered harder than these moves, but is equal to a barrage in difficulty. A legbeater is harder than atom smasher, and two adds harder than blizzard, but is the same difficulty as blurry whirl. Pdx torque is harder than blurry whirl, but easier than blurriest. I'm sorry, but this seems even more flawed than the current add system. Ken CF Somolinos From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 07:10:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA10160 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 07:10:38 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Aaron de Glanville Received: from smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (smtp10.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.200.246]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA18073 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:08:56 -0700 Received: from aaron (user-33qti2h.dialup.mindspring.com [199.174.200.81]) by smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA07158 for ; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 02:10:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19991020230917.00afb02c@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: aadegl@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:09:17 -0700 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Repost: "Adds Revised-2" In-Reply-To: <19991021052522.22195.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org KeN mentioned that >Aaron de Glanville proposed >> >> >>TWO SIMPLE AMENDMENTS: >> >> >> >>1. the paradox dex must be the first to occur (to score an add) >> >> >> >>2. a bonus dex add is awarded for: >> >> A) every dex after the first, except in the case of "complementary" >> >>double-dex moves (two legs dexing in same direction). >> >> B) every spin/gyro in a dex move not awarded the above bonus >> >> >>osis - 2 >>atom smasher - 3 >>ripwalk - 3 >>legbeater - 4 >>blurry whirl - 4 >>paradox torque - 5 >>blurriest - 6 > >All right, so by this system, a toe blizzard, fairy mirage, and regular >blizzard are all equal in difficulty to an osis. Whoa, there, Hoss! Did you even *look* at those scores above yer head? It's amazing how the simplest mods are still difficult to understand at first--I don't mean that as patronizing in the least bit. osis - 2 (bod, clip) blizz/toe blizz - 3 (dex, dex, dex bonus) fairy mirage - 3 (dex, dex, dex bonus) THAT is already a huge improvement to the old add system. > A ripwalk is considered >harder than these moves, no. ripwalk - 3 (dex, dex, clip) >but is equal to a barrage in difficulty. barrage - 3 (dex, dex, dex bonus) Yes, a debatable point, without a doubt. > A >legbeater is harder than atom smasher, --by one add, no different than the existing system! >but is the same difficulty as blurry whirl. More grey area, I'd say (yes, I can hit both...) You don't seem to have thought very hard about this. I'm not saying that you have no valid points, just that your knee-jerk dismissiveness smells a little suspicious ("why is everybody always picking on *me*?" ;) ). What's behind this? Scathing critique is still welcome. unwavering good will, Aaron de Glanville "uncut" SF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 08:19:14 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA10214 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 08:19:14 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web1004.mail.yahoo.com (web1004.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.94]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA18828 for ; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:51:46 -0700 Message-ID: <19991021065355.3927.rocketmail@web1004.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.178.164.120] by web1004.mail.yahoo.com; Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:53:55 PDT Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:53:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Ahren Gehrman Subject: Re: [freestyle] Repost: "Adds Revised-2" To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Yo. Not that I really give a shit about adds much anymore, but I don't agree with this system. Why? Aaron de Glanville says that he is satisfied with the scores of these moves under his new system. Look at them. Look at them very close. Tell me if you agree with them. As somebody who can do every move listed and scored here, I say no. No this does not make since. > atw - 1 > legover - 1 > clipper - 1 > butterfly - 2 > osis - 2 > paradox mirage - 2 > whirl - 2 > swirl - 2 > double legover - 2 > torque - 3 > eggbeater - 3 > barrage - 3 > atom smasher - 3 > blur - 3 > ripwalk - 3 > legbeater - 4 > barfly - 4 > blurry whirl - 4 > gyro d.l.o - 4 > paradox torque - 5 > flurry - 5 > mobius - 5 > blurriest - 6 > paradon swirl - 6 ? Torch From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 17:33:42 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA10784 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 17:33:42 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f211.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.211]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id DAA29140 for ; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 03:59:42 -0700 Received: (qmail 88242 invoked by uid 0); 21 Oct 1999 11:00:41 -0000 Message-ID: <19991021110041.88241.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 141.84.137.106 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 04:00:41 PDT X-Originating-IP: [141.84.137.106] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] modifying rod lavers? (2) Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 04:00:41 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Stan, you asked: >i'm reading that page at footbag.org on modifying rod lavers.. and i >just don't get what to cut and where.. "stiches that hold down the >front toe area" <-- ?? >can anyone help.. should i cut? what should i cut? and how should i >cut it? To which I should reply, you can check out my page on modifying shoes at http://members.xoom.com/NemesisDS/shoes.html Admitedly It's not that much more descriptive than the one at footbag.org but it is an illustrated guide, which is a step up. -Andrew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 17:33:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA10779 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 17:33:38 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f71.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.71]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id EAA30516 for ; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 04:20:14 -0700 Received: (qmail 43550 invoked by uid 0); 21 Oct 1999 11:21:12 -0000 Message-ID: <19991021112112.43549.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 141.84.137.106 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 04:21:12 PDT X-Originating-IP: [141.84.137.106] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: BLURry Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 04:21:12 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Eric Wulff wrote: >These all contain the EXACT same type of SET. Why we are trying to >define a set based on what it is to be followed by it is still beyond >me in this case. What is done after the set is what defines the >move... not the set. > blur... stepping paradox mirage > rip-walk.. stepping op butterfly > haze... stepping dlo > fog.. stepping paradox dlo > blurry whirl... stepping paradox whirl > ripped warrior.. stepping ducking butterfly > jack knife.. stepping diving butterfly First, I don's know how it was for you, but for me ripwalk helped me learn blur, however it was learning stepping butterfly that helped me learn stepping miraje. So at least for me the sets do infact feel different, you have to check your motion differently for the second dex making the set different, maybe not enough to merit a seperate name which brings me to point two. Fortunatly we only have two legs, which means after each set there are only two options, same or opp. For me it is a lot less complicated to just give each option a different name. Instead of saying "stepping opposite" you just say "blurry" seems simple to me, other thoughts? -Andrew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 18:43:49 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA10897 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 18:43:49 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from saba.wwa.com (saba.wwa.com [198.49.174.36]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA09724 for ; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 10:20:34 -0700 Received: from [209.107.90.78] (209-107-90-078.chicago.verio.net [209.107.90.78]) by saba.wwa.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id MAA08483; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 12:22:02 -0500 (CDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19991020230917.00afb02c@pop.mindspring.com> References: <19991021052522.22195.qmail@hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 12:30:33 -0600 To: Aaron de Glanville , freestyle@footbag.org From: Scott Davidson Subject: Re: [freestyle] Repost: "Adds Revised-2" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Aaron and all! I have to apologize for not keeping up with this thread... I am now catching up and am astonished by these interpretations... >>>osis - 2 >>>atom smasher - 3 >>>ripwalk - 3 >>>legbeater - 4 >>>blurry whirl - 4 >>>paradox torque - 5 >>>blurriest - 6 >It's amazing how the simplest mods are still difficult to understand at >first--I don't mean that as patronizing in the least bit. Count me in as lost. >osis - 2 (bod, clip) >blizz/toe blizz - 3 (dex, dex, dex bonus) >fairy mirage - 3 (dex, dex, dex bonus) > >THAT is already a huge improvement to the old add system. I can't see how that's an improvement. If you devalue osis, and BTW when you say it is (bod, clip) you are missing an element called delay unless you are saying the clip is the delay,then you are missing the xbody. If anything, the only way I would say osis is a 2 would be when you go osis op osis op osis op osis... due to less spin. But only in that instance... osis same osis same osis etc is a full spin. The problem with devaluing the osis is you then devalue allmoves that involve osis, torque is 3, mobius is 4, Ptorque is 5... it just doesn't make sense. It causes a ripple effect. As for the rest of it, I am totally lost. See ya! Scott Davidson Enlightener. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Oct 21 18:49:15 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA10921 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 18:49:15 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f103.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.103]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA10934 for ; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 10:58:47 -0700 Received: (qmail 20723 invoked by uid 0); 21 Oct 1999 17:59:46 -0000 Message-ID: <19991021175946.20722.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 21 Oct 1999 10:59:45 PDT X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: aadegl@mindspring.com, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Repost: "Adds Revised-2" Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 13:59:45 EDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all, > >Aaron de Glanville proposed > >>TWO SIMPLE AMENDMENTS: >>1. the paradox dex must be the first to occur (to score an add) >>2. a bonus dex add is awarded for: >> A) every dex after the first, except in the case of "complementary" >>double-dex moves (two legs dexing in same direction). >osis - 2 (bod, clip) >blizz/toe blizz - 3 (dex, dex, dex bonus) OK, I don't see how smudge, blizzard, or toe blizzard do not fall under the heading of proposed amendement #2a. As such, they should not receive a bonus dex add. It is still my understanding that this system rates blizzard, toe blizzard, and smudge as equal to osis. I agree with Ahren Gehrmann that t