From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Dec 1 00:03:33 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA22021 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 00:03:33 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.rdc1.tx.home.com (imail@ha1.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.66]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA04460 for ; Tue, 30 Nov 1999 23:29:23 -0800 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by mail.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991201073043.UFLP1169.mail.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Tue, 30 Nov 1999 23:30:43 -0800 Message-ID: <3844CF54.7A8FF568@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 01:33:40 -0600 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dave Cecconi CC: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Double Pixie???'s References: <0.3d23771a.2575c501@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Dave Cecconi wrote: > > I did the double pixie but after the toe set with my right leg, I jumped > strong off of my left leg and did the first pixie dex from in to out w/ the > setting let. W/O landing on my left leg, I landed on my right leg and jumped > hard off of my RIGHT (setting and dexing) leg and completed the other dex > catching it on my left which never touched the ground. The move you describe would be a pixie same side symposium mirage. Yes, you do get symposium. It is a good four ADD move. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Dec 1 00:04:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA22032 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 00:04:38 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.csuchico.edu (mail.CSUChico.EDU [132.241.82.14]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA05107 for ; Tue, 30 Nov 1999 23:58:17 -0800 Received: from webmail ([132.241.82.12]) by mail.csuchico.edu (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with SMTP id AAA2332; Tue, 30 Nov 1999 23:59:35 -0800 From: "Tara R. Ohr" To: Joshua Feltman , freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Hips dont fail me now... X-Mailer: Netscape Messenger Express 3.5.2 [Mozilla/4.51 [en] (Win98; U)] Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 23:59:35 -0800 Message-ID: <772826EB172A.AAA2332@mail.csuchico.edu> Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Joshua Feltman wrote: >Greetings All-- When I first started kicking a few months ago, my legs >and knees hurt. Then it was my back (mostly from stooping to pick up >the bag so much). Both of those passed with time and continued >practice. Now the trouble is my hips, particularly the outside of my >legs. The pain is not excruciating or anything, but sometimes my hips >hurt enough that I find myself not wanting to kick. Has anyone else >experienced this? Is it normal for beginners? Yes, many people have experienced this problem with the hips. It is normal to feel pain at first, but it should go away with stretching and strengthening. >Should I just take some >Advil and keep playing, or is it better to lay off for a while? If the pain is there before or during play then you defeniently want to stop playing for awhile. Let the body heal itself. Would you rather play for a lifetime or for a couple of days? Advil and any other over the counter drug is only masking the problem, NOT healing it. Ice is best when you first injure an area (although it is dificult to ice the hip joint) and then heating will help with recovery. >I don't >want to stop kicking, but at the same time, I don't want to further >injure myself. Also, I have been stretching before I kick, and I was >wondering if anyone could recommend some good stretches for the hips. >Any suggestions would be appreciated. > One great stretch that I love to do for the hip goes as follows: Sit down, cross one foot over the opposite leg so that the ankle is near the knee. Then pull the striaght leg to the chest. This should stretch the outer hip area. Switch legs. The other stretch: start on your hands and knees, place one leg in front of you so that you are balanced (one leg in front of you at 90 degrees, one leg behind you at 90 degrees) Then lean toward your front leg as if doing the splints. Another stretch is the butterfly stretch. Sit down, soles of the feet together and as close to the body as possible. Then push your knees down to the ground. I hope this helps you some. If you're interested in some more info on stretches or strength training, write me back: guru@mailcsuchico.edu I'd love to chat. Good luck with it. Tara From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Dec 1 08:01:37 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22470 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 08:01:37 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f149.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.149]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA25682 for ; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 07:43:43 -0800 Received: (qmail 36981 invoked by uid 0); 1 Dec 1999 15:44:34 -0000 Message-ID: <19991201154434.36980.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 01 Dec 1999 07:44:34 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: kaplanb@mscd.edu, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] New for me and name ideas Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 10:44:34 EST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all, Brad proposed: > Also If these moves do not have names then I have suggestions: > > Nuclear butterflier: MOTHRA OK, i just have to say this is by far the best proposed move name I've heard in the last year. My only issue is I feel "Mothra" should be a three dex flyer, since mothra had three heads and could fly. How about a shooting butterflier? I know it's possible, since i've hit it but not sealed it. I'd like to propose that ducking blurriest be called Leviathan. I'm pretty sure I've hit this clean and sealed it a couple times since worlds. Let me know what you all think(especially you Brad regarding the Mothra thing). Thanks, Ken CF Somolinos Bear Feet From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Dec 1 08:40:10 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA22512 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 08:40:10 -0800 Message-Id: <199912011640.IAA22512@list.footbag.org> X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: "Eric Wulff" To: freestyle@footbag.org Cc: brat@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] trivia style... Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 01:53:06 PST X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 166.90.37.157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all, Eric "Ironman" here in gameshow host mode to make an announcement. "Trivia Style's" pilot episode begins today "Right Here... Right Now"(if I may quote a great band).. :). If the ratings are good enough and I can keep up this will be a continued feature on the freestyle list. Sponsored by the brat himself, Steve Goldberg :). The ironman will be throwin trivia out to all you ironheads.. :) out there and keepin track of how you all are doin. Questions will be rated in difficulty and the highest total score at the end a a designated period, to be announced, will win a "Team Brat" sponsorship (pro entry fee) at the tourney of their choice in 2000, compliments of Steve Goldberg. 1. This is for fun first. Debate all you want about the subject matter but keep this in mind. 2. If I'm ever caught wrong, which could very well happen, the person correcting me gets double the points of the question I gave a wrong answer to. 3. Some classes of participants may be defined... i.e., new schoolers division & old schoolers division 4. You can debate on the list as much as you like BUT YOUR FINAL ANSWER THAT COUNTS MUST BE SENT TO ME AT *THIS* E-MAIL ADDRESS. NOT THE ONE I USUALLY POST WITH BUT MY FOOTBAG.ORG ADDRESS WHICH I USED TO SEND THIS POST. Only your first answer counts and after the answers are posted you no longer will be eligible obviously. I don't think that certain old schoolers will be eligible for the "prize" but can certainly join in and keep track of points. We'll define this later. Maybe we can even keep track of results on fw somewhere. Anyway, I will post questions a couple times a week and on no set schedule so be sure to tune into the list to keep up! Okay, for starters lets answer some of the questions posed earlier this week. It's Black Hole of Hein week on "Trivia Style"!!!!! Black Hole of Hein was 1 of a select few 3 person freestyle teams from "back in the day" when stylers could compete in team freestyle with up to 3 people. Members... Kenny Shultz, Rick Reese, David Yevin 1st kicked to(at worlds) "Momentary Lapse Of Reason" off the album of the same name by Pink Floyd. Today's questions... 1. In 3 parts... What were the nicknames of all 3 members of BHH as announced "Back In the Day" when they first competed at worlds. Rick - 1 add David - 5 adds Kenny - 7 adds 2. Worth 3 adds each... name as many 3 member freestyle teams as you can. Anyway you can... first name, last name or nicknames, or team names. Any format is acceptable. Hope ya like it... if ya do there will be more to come Eric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Dec 1 15:20:16 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA22874 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 15:20:16 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from firefly.prairienet.org (firefly.prairienet.org [192.17.3.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA06566 for ; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 14:59:58 -0800 Received: from bluestem (bluestem.prairienet.org [192.17.3.4]) by firefly.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA26948 for ; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 17:01:21 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 17:01:19 -0600 (CST) From: Philip Summers X-Sender: konrad@bluestem To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] spinning blender Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Has anyone hit a spinning blender, inspinning blender, or gyro blender? I didn't see any of these in fw movelist. -thephil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Dec 1 18:36:26 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA23210 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 18:36:26 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f174.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.174]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id SAA12433 for ; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 18:08:41 -0800 Received: (qmail 68364 invoked by uid 0); 2 Dec 1999 02:09:35 -0000 Message-ID: <19991202020935.68363.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 130.132.70.142 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Wed, 01 Dec 1999 18:09:35 PST X-Originating-IP: [130.132.70.142] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: konrad@prairienet.org, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] spinning blender Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 21:09:35 EST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Howdy. Phil asked: > >Has anyone hit a spinning blender, inspinning blender, or gyro blender? Yep, Kenny Shults hits a real nice one on the 96 tam tam jam video. Rippin' also hits one on that vid. On Sultans, Eli hits ducking butterfly to spinning blender, and Brian McKenzie hits like 5 5 adds in a row, and one of them is a spining blender, albeit an unsealed one. It's a real pretty move. Shred hard everybody. Ceiling Fan From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Dec 1 18:36:15 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA23205 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 18:36:15 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.62]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA08820 for ; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 16:02:11 -0800 Received: from r79a006587aa.hlb.cable.rcn.com ([216.164.37.251] helo=funazs) by smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #3) id 11tJib-000157-00 for freestyle@footbag.org; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 19:03:29 -0500 Message-ID: <000901bf3c57$e132fe20$fb25a4d8@hlb.cable.rcn.com> From: "MIke Furnari" To: Subject: [freestyle] laver modification Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 18:46:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi, Yeah i know, iknow that it says how to do it on the site, but....my lavers dont have any canvas on the inside, its all the same material, if i am missing something can someone please point me in the right direction, thanks alot Mike From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Dec 1 18:36:13 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA23200 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 18:36:13 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.rdc1.tx.home.com (imail@ha1.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.66]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA08148 for ; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 15:42:22 -0800 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by mail.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991201234342.FOAR1169.mail.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 15:43:42 -0800 Message-ID: <3845B36C.B952CFD@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 17:46:52 -0600 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Philip Summers CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] spinning blender References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Philip Summers wrote: > > Has anyone hit a spinning blender, inspinning blender, or gyro blender? Kenny hits spinning blender a the Tam Tam Jam on one of the tapes (is it '97 Shred?). I'm glad you asked about the gyro blender. I do think that this can be a move. But, how different is it from a swirl? Think about it... the only difference would be which direction your head is facing during the dex. Many things will be added to the move list when we get some consistency in the names. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Dec 1 23:07:29 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA23439 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 23:07:29 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail1.doit.wisc.edu (mail1.doit.wisc.edu [144.92.9.40]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA18657 for ; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 23:01:43 -0800 Received: from [128.104.49.78] by mail1.doit.wisc.edu id BAA154420 (8.9.1/50); Thu, 2 Dec 1999 01:03:02 -0600 Message-Id: <4.1.19991202002423.009111d0@students.wisc.edu> X-Sender: aredgert@students.wisc.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 01:10:44 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Aaron Edgerton Subject: [freestyle] mobius Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org What's up freestylers, This is my first time posting. I go to school here up in cold ass Madison Wisconsin where me and a small group of others play inside 'cause it's cold out there. I met some of you at Worlds this year with my buddy Matt Kain, and I would have posted earlier, but I didn't feel I was in a position to (that whole not guiltless thing you know). To those of you I met at worlds (Ian, Eli, Derric, Tony Glick, Josh Childs), what's up? I hope the bag's been kind to you. Now to my question: I was wondering if anyone could give me some pointers on how to do a mobius. I've seen the Eric Wulff video a million times, but I can't do what he does (I can torque, and I can spin, it's just putting those two together that gets me--Really I just want to know if I shoud speed through the spin, or jump and twist early, shit like that ). I've been checking the tips on the freestyle list daily. For 5 adders there's not much. Also, if anyone has any tips on hitting flurry, I'd appreciate hearing some of them too. (I can hit barrage and clipper-dlo well.) Thanks, Aaron Edgerton Madison Freestyle From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Wed Dec 1 23:54:29 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA23475 for freestyle-outgoing; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 23:54:29 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA20028 for ; Wed, 1 Dec 1999 23:48:34 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FM300801SFADI@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 00:49:59 -0700 (MST) Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 00:49:58 -0700 (MST) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: Re: [freestyle] New for me and name ideas In-reply-to: <19991201154434.36980.qmail@hotmail.com> To: KeN Somolinos Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Wed, 1 Dec 1999, KeN Somolinos wrote: > Brad proposed: > > Also If these moves do not have names then I have suggestions: > > > > Nuclear butterflier: MOTHRA > > OK, i just have to say this is by far the best proposed move name I've heard > in the last year. My only issue is I feel "Mothra" should be a three dex > flyer, since mothra had three heads and could fly. How about a shooting > butterflier? Actually Hydra was the three headed one and maybe that should go with the shooting butterflier instead of nuclear dragonfly. But I thought that since they were transformed by nuclear explosions that it would be cool to assign the names to nuclear set moves. They are proposed names as I have not landed them and have no rights to naming them. Thanks for loving them. Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Dec 2 13:34:54 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA24272 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 13:34:54 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Mark Leeman Received: from electra.cc.umanitoba.ca (root@electra.cc.umanitoba.ca [130.179.16.23]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA17559 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 13:15:47 -0800 Received: from antares.cc.umanitoba.ca (umleema0@antares.cc.umanitoba.ca [130.179.16.26]) by electra.cc.umanitoba.ca (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id PAA07869 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 15:16:56 -0600 (CST) Received: (from umleema0@localhost) by antares.cc.umanitoba.ca (8.9.0/8.9.0) id PAA28445 ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 15:16:55 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 15:16:55 -0600 (CST) To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] First caller,pdx drifter In-Reply-To: <199911280318.TAA17055@list.footbag.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org What's going on freestylers, This is my first time using this email discussion, so bare with me please. The other day me and some freinds were kicking and this discussion came up about the paradox drifer that i thought i was hitting, then when my friend pointed something out to me and i realized i was not doing it right, we think. So this is my question for those of you that can help us figure this problem out: When i do the paradox dirfer, set from my right clipper i bring the same leg from into out, no problem yet, but when i catch the bag, i am not catching it in front of my left leg. I mean that i am still doing the paradox set and still catching it with the same leg in a cross body delay, but when i do catch the bag it is kind of behing my left leg(support leg), and off to the right side a bit. So i want to know if this is still a four add or is it a three because i may not be catching the bag in the right spot to count as a cross body delay. If it is a different move does it have a name? I couldn't see it on the move list if it is there. So any responce will be helpful. If i didn't make myself clear please let me know and i will try to re-phrase my wording. P.S. Off the top of my head, when you people skooled your four add's or three's do you find it better to have a lot of moves that you are trying to hit, or do you focus on one trick until you can hit perfectly. Marq From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Dec 2 15:42:29 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA24462 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 15:42:29 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from saba.wwa.com (saba.wwa.com [198.49.174.36]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA18807 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 14:00:46 -0800 Received: from [209.107.90.78] (209-107-90-078.chicago.verio.net [209.107.90.78]) by saba.wwa.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id QAA15305; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 16:02:13 -0600 (CST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 15:17:22 -0600 To: Philip Summers , freestyle@footbag.org From: Scott Davidson Subject: Re: [freestyle] spinning blender Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Phil! >Has anyone hit a spinning blender, inspinning blender, or gyro blender? >I didn't see any of these in fw movelist. I've hit spinning blender a couple of times, it is a knee buster to be certain. As for Gyro Blender, I call that Peeking Swirl, but it is what I think you are referring to as gyro blender. It doesn't "feel" like a five add move, but it technically is. As for inspinning blender, dude, you are seeing things way ahead of your time... thanks for the insight, keep it coming along! On another note, how about others I am hitting: Backside Symposium Blizzard Blurry Symposium Whirl on both sides (not in same string, but close) Ducking Symposium Paradox Whirl Backside Symposium Blur with a slurry set. (Daryl, you are probably the only one who *really* understands my definition of slurry set, I showed you that when you were in town two weeks ago, didn't I?) Speaking of celebrities, Greg Nelson was in town last weekend, and so was Joey Marschall and Sebastian Perron (although I didn't get to hook up with joey and sebastian), so Chicago has been hoppin' lately. See ya! Enlightener Scott Davidson From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Dec 2 15:42:52 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA24472 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 15:42:52 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from admin.cgocable.net (admin.cgocable.net [24.226.1.21]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA19136 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 14:14:10 -0800 Received: from [24.226.9.44] (cgowave-9-44.cgocable.net [24.226.9.44]) by admin.cgocable.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA22127 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 17:15:00 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199912022215.RAA22127@admin.cgocable.net> X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express for Macintosh - 4.01 (295) Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 17:13:59 -0500 Subject: Re: [freestyle] laver modification From: "Neil Bearse" To: freestyle@footbag.org Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Mike wrote: > my lavers dont have any canvas on the inside, its all the same material, if i >am missing something can someone please point me in the right direction, >thanks alot > Mike Dont worry about that canvas part.. just cut the stitching to make the toe box..... thats the important part. Neil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Dec 2 16:40:21 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id QAA24527 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 16:40:21 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.119]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA23656; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 16:31:48 -0800 Received: from storefull-277.iap.bryant.webtv.net (storefull-277.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.41]) by mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix) with ESMTP id 14DF714E4; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 16:33:18 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-277.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-d/mt.gso.26Feb98) id QAA10194; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 16:33:17 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhUAy9VyyselgNNTXo8w/bkevDySQzoCFD35uDuZlt66a0ygfabRvEgH8WcA From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 19:33:17 -0500 (EST) To: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] spinning blender Message-ID: <6905-38470FCD-720@storefull-277.iap.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: Scott Davidson 's message of Thu, 2 Dec 1999 15:17:22 -0600 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Scott, you said; "" Speaking of celebrities, Greg Nelson was in town last weekend "" hehe.......I don't know about all that. But I DO know those were some pretty phat tricks you threw down on your post. And don't forget that super duper fly I saw you bustin' ! GF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Dec 2 17:51:24 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA24759 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 17:51:24 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: William Wells Received: from symail.syda.org (hidden-user@symail.syda.org [208.130.6.77]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA25779 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 17:43:02 -0800 Received: from CSPW (CS-PW [156.156.156.59]) by symail.syda.org with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id YB7RT7NL; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 20:44:28 -0500 Message-ID: <000d01bf3d2e$8c885c80$3b9c9c9c@syda.org> To: Subject: [freestyle] Frustration Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 20:34:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey all, I am bugged out. I am following all this stuff on the list and taking up a lot of the stuff that relates to the "basics" and it is all great. But Seeing what you guys can do and where some of the people on the list have gone has blown me away. I practice when I can but it doesn't seem to be enough. What kept you guys going when you all started? How long did you guys stay at the beginner level (ie. working on clippers, butterfly, mirage, pixie, atw, etc.). I know practicing with others is necessary. I have never really hack with any one other than ok "hackers" and I don't seem to be progressing very fast. I really want to go to a tournament but am waiting for one to be nearby (Philly, NY ,or Montreal). Anyways, I amsorry to bitch and moan on the list but looking for inspiration from you guys and some pointers on how to progress. William "Waiting to Fly" Wells From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Dec 2 18:00:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA24782 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 18:00:38 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA26012 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 17:49:06 -0800 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA536 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 17:50:36 -0800 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Re: mobius Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 17:50:36 -0800 Message-ID: <000a01bf3d30$cd3e4d00$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Aaron Edgerton, check mobius tips on fw now... http://www.footbag.org/moves/show/904102177 Eric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Dec 2 18:48:04 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA24820 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 18:48:04 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from firefly.prairienet.org (firefly.prairienet.org [192.17.3.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA27259 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 18:28:25 -0800 Received: from bluestem (bluestem.prairienet.org [192.17.3.4]) by firefly.prairienet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA12833 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 20:29:45 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 20:29:43 -0600 (CST) From: Philip Summers X-Sender: konrad@bluestem To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] phat tricks Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I hit an opposite side symposium reverse whirl at the end of a string WOO! Does this move have a special name? If you threw a swirl at the end of it, it would be a PHAT 5 add move. I was trying to do the swirl at the same time as the whirl with myfeet almost touching. It's really hard and I kept kicking the bag instead of jumping over it :( -phil From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Dec 2 19:12:03 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA24863 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 19:12:03 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f128.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.128]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA28297 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 19:04:47 -0800 Received: (qmail 3692 invoked by uid 0); 3 Dec 1999 03:05:33 -0000 Message-ID: <19991203030533.3691.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.148.183.120 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 02 Dec 1999 19:05:32 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.148.183.120] From: "KeN Somolinos" To: konrad@prairienet.org, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] phat tricks Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 22:05:32 EST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi. Phil asked: > >I hit an opposite side symposium reverse whirl at the end of a string WOO! >Does this move have a special name? >If you threw a swirl at the end of it, it would be a PHAT 5 add move. I >was trying to do the swirl at the same time as the whirl with myfeet >almost touching. the last move you described is a double helix. CF From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Thu Dec 2 20:14:56 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA24921 for freestyle-outgoing; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 20:14:56 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f21.law4.hotmail.com [216.33.149.21]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA29704 for ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 20:07:04 -0800 Received: (qmail 30998 invoked by uid 0); 3 Dec 1999 04:08:01 -0000 Message-ID: <19991203040801.30997.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 24.64.223.150 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 02 Dec 1999 20:08:00 PST X-Originating-IP: [24.64.223.150] From: "Jeff Lopes" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Torque. Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 20:08:00 PST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello everyone, I just feel so good today. I hit my first regular torque today! Not crispy torque, regular! My shred posse said it looked really clean and it was infront of a lot of people. After I hit it, I heard some kid go "jes-- chr--", so I was pumped about that. :) Just have to try and hit it weakside now! Now that Ive hit it, I want to start getting it like cake. Hey Peter Irish, you on this list? Your the torque master! Anyone know any drills to get better at this move? Ive looked at the write up at dallasfootbag and that helped, but I would like additional info. My back gets really sore after doing a torque (its a perfect name for this move, it really pulls back muscles) and does anyone know a good exercise to increase flex? Or muscle? Much appreciated. P.S Thanks to all of you who repsonded to my "Problems with my Juice" email. I fixed it with fabric glue....Almost took a needle to it, thank goodness I didnt. FOOTBAG RULES! KEEP SHREDDIN' HARD! Jeff "The Man O' War" Lopes From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Dec 3 09:14:26 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA25561 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 09:14:26 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f81.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.81]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA21135 for ; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 06:28:03 -0800 Received: (qmail 51226 invoked by uid 0); 3 Dec 1999 14:29:06 -0000 Message-ID: <19991203142906.51225.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 128.206.120.240 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 03 Dec 1999 06:29:06 PST X-Originating-IP: [128.206.120.240] From: "Ian Dubman" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: mobius Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 08:29:06 CST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org >From: "Eric Wulff" Aaron Edgerton, check mobius tips on fw now... > >http://www.footbag.org/moves/show/904102177 Eric et al., I have a question regarding the tips on mobius. I do not understand why you should skool spinning mirage. Skooling spinning osis makes total sense. If you remove the dex (screwed up way of thinking about it, but it is true--in my opinion), that is all this move is. But, the mirage part is gyro not spinning, right?? I don't see how skooling spinning mirage helps here--maybe with marius, but not here. Fill me in, please. Later, Ian D. MUFF PS I tried to becareful in my wording and not give them impression that I know what exactly I am talking about because I have not hit mobius (thus, I don't know what I am talking about), but I have tried on several occasions--less than spectacular results, and also, so I do not piss-off anyone with SuperAnal ideas of what the formats of our posts on a open forum should look like... I get tired of the bitching... From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Dec 3 09:15:08 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA25566 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 09:15:08 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f165.hotmail.com [216.32.181.165]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA25360 for ; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 09:07:47 -0800 Received: (qmail 60102 invoked by uid 0); 3 Dec 1999 17:08:51 -0000 Message-ID: <19991203170851.60101.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 198.168.49.221 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 03 Dec 1999 09:08:51 PST X-Originating-IP: [198.168.49.221] From: "Mickey Mayer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] First caller,pdx drifter Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 12:08:51 EST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Mark, >When i do the paradox dirfer, set from my right clipper i bring the >same >leg from into out, no problem yet, but when i catch the bag, i >am not >catching it in front of my left leg. I mean that i am still >doing the >paradox set and still catching it with the same leg in a >cross body delay, >but when i do catch the bag it is kind of behing my >left leg(support leg), >and off to the right side a bit. Oh, boy. Your problem sounds exactly like the one I was having weeks ago. I did the exact same move, thinking I was hitting pdx drifter and then "my boys" started telling me that I was getting Da Da Curve not pdx drifter so maybe that's your problem. You're getting the DD Curve. If I'm wrong, stylers, please correct me. Peace, The Mouse From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Dec 3 09:33:14 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA25595 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 09:33:14 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f75.hotmail.com [216.32.181.75]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA25627 for ; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 09:14:44 -0800 Received: (qmail 6920 invoked by uid 0); 3 Dec 1999 17:15:48 -0000 Message-ID: <19991203171548.6919.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 198.168.49.221 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 03 Dec 1999 09:15:48 PST X-Originating-IP: [198.168.49.221] From: "Mickey Mayer" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Helix Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 12:15:48 EST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey guys, Just wondering what is a helix? Notation? To Ken Somolinos: The video is nearing completion, bro. Keep in touch. Peace all, The Mouse From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Dec 3 09:53:12 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA25626 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 09:53:12 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailrelayerformercurymailsites.more.net (mailrelayerformercurymailsites.more.net [198.209.253.70]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA26508 for ; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 09:43:21 -0800 Received: from mlerf.org (mail.mlerf.org [207.160.128.29]) by mailrelayerformercurymailsites.more.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA04174 for ; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 11:44:52 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [freestyle] Re: mobius Message-Id: <000000772303027088070@mlerf.org> From: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 12:47:50 -0500 Organization: MLERF X-Mailer: CommuniGate 3.1 Reply-To: dfogle@mlerf.org (Derrick Fogle, MLERF) To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Fri, Dec 3, 1999, 8:29:06 AM US CST Ian Dubman wrote: >why you should skool spinning mirage. Skooling spinning osis makes total >sense. If you remove the dex (screwed up way of thinking about it, but it is Ian - being another person that's never hit mobius, I don't know what I'm talking about either. But I personally have much more difficulty with the timing of the gyro mirage than the spinning osis. That's why I would think that getting the gyro mirage (for me anyway) would be more important than the spinning osis. YMMV. By the way, any word on a Saturday indoor site yet? I'm itching to kick... ______________________________________ Derrick Fogle The fossilized chicken From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Dec 3 11:53:36 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA25745 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 11:53:36 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from saba.wwa.com (saba.wwa.com [198.49.174.36]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA29729 for ; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 11:34:46 -0800 Received: from [209.107.90.78] (209-107-90-078.chicago.verio.net [209.107.90.78]) by saba.wwa.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id NAA05210; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 13:36:17 -0600 (CST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <199911280318.TAA17055@list.footbag.org> Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 13:51:49 -0600 To: Mark Leeman , freestyle@footbag.org From: Scott Davidson Subject: Re: [freestyle] First caller,pdx drifter Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Mark and all! At 3:16 PM -0600 12/2/99, Mark Leeman wrote: >P.S. Off the top of my head, when you people skooled your four add's or >three's do you find it better to have a lot of moves that you are trying >to hit, or do you focus on one trick until you can hit perfectly. First I master the individual moves. Then I skool them in strings by linking them with other moves of similar difficulty. So master the moves, then string them together. Practice makes better. Shred. :-) Drop. :-( Repeat. :-) And for all of you whom I just offended, try: Shred. :-) Pass. :-) Repeat :-) See ya! Enlightener Scott Davidson From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Dec 3 11:53:34 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA25740 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 11:53:34 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from saba.wwa.com (saba.wwa.com [198.49.174.36]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA29715 for ; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 11:34:39 -0800 Received: from [209.107.90.78] (209-107-90-078.chicago.verio.net [209.107.90.78]) by saba.wwa.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id NAA05146; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 13:36:10 -0600 (CST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: copyset@pop.interaccess.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <4.1.19991202002423.009111d0@students.wisc.edu> Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 13:47:49 -0600 To: Aaron Edgerton , freestyle@footbag.org From: Scott Davidson Subject: Re: [freestyle] mobius Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi Aaron and all! At 1:10 AM -0800 12/2/99, Aaron Edgerton wrote: >This is my first time posting. I go to school here up in cold ass Madison >Wisconsin where me and a small group of others play inside 'cause it's cold >out there. I met some of you at Worlds this year with my buddy Matt Kain, >and I would have posted earlier, but I didn't feel I was in a position to >(that whole not guiltless thing you know). To those of you I met at worlds >(Ian, Eli, Derric, Tony Glick, Josh Childs), what's up? I hope the bag's >been kind to you. If you think it's cold now, just wait a month. And when it is *actually* cold out (this is the first year in recorded history that we got zero snow in November, maybe all you escapees who fled to San Francisco might want to rethink the move, ha, ha), you might want to make a Sunday day-trip to our classes in Mt. Prospect's near famous "RecPlex" facility, where classes are always free for out-of-staters passing through (otherwise $20 per 7 week session). Sundays from 1-4. Contact me before you come out, to make sure all is well that week, as we travel alot. >Now to my question: I was wondering if anyone could give me some pointers >on how to do a mobius. I've seen the Eric Wulff video a million times, but >I can't do what he does (I can torque, and I can spin, it's just putting >those two together that gets me--Really I just want to know if I shoud >speed through the spin, or jump and twist early, shit like that ). My only tip is to skool the components of mobius... osis, spinning osis, mirage, gyro mirage and torque. Once you can do all of those without trouble, then mobius will just happen. >I've >been checking the tips on the freestyle list daily. For 5 adders there's >not much. Also, if anyone has any tips on hitting flurry, I'd appreciate >hearing some of them too. (I can hit barrage and clipper-dlo well.) Thanks, My only tip on hitting flurry, is to not take advice from me, 'cause it is still a great mystery how to hit it (I am only close when the first dex is stepping followed by a double leg over). Try asking Ryan M., he is master of all things flurry. Hope to see you in the windy city soon! Scott Davidson Enlightener From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Dec 3 15:24:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA26001 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 15:24:11 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Dave Cecconi Received: from imo-d06.mx.aol.com (imo-d06.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.38]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA03380 for ; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 14:56:32 -0800 Received: from DukeBluDevils@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v24.4.) id z.0.e62e1e5d (3865) for ; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 17:57:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0.e62e1e5d.2579a4d7@aol.com> Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 17:57:27 EST Subject: [freestyle] Whirl + Swirl? To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 38 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I am really havin a hard time understanding this whirl, swirl stuff. I hit today what I BELIEVE is a whirl to swirl. I'm not even sure i am doin either one so could sum1 pleez help. Ok I set the bag w/ a toe on my right foot. I edged forward a little and turned 90 degrees to my left while dexxin in to out with my left leg. I then turned 90 degrees more in the same direction while bringing my right leg from out to in over the bag (this is the part i'm confused w/. This is practically a butterfly but I think i'm using my hips to turn while i'm dexxing.) Then i landed in a left foot clipper delay. I guess the job would be Toe>Op In (whirl)>Op Out (swirl)>Op Clip I'm not sure how to job a whirl or swirl cuz there is a semi hip turn in there. Pleez don't get mad if i mixed that whole thing up. I need so much more understanding about the whirls and swirls. -Thanx for readin -Dave Cecconi From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Dec 3 15:26:33 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id PAA26011 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 15:26:33 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from vcn.bc.ca (vcn.bc.ca [207.102.64.2]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA03985; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 15:17:35 -0800 Received: from localhost (marigold@localhost) by vcn.bc.ca (8.9.2/8.9.2) with ESMTP id PAA21728; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 15:18:58 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 15:18:58 -0800 (PST) From: Adrian Verhoef To: Scott Davidson cc: Philip Summers , freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] spinning blender In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, 2 Dec 1999, Scott Davidson wrote: > I've hit spinning blender a couple of times, it is a knee buster to be > certain. As for Gyro Blender, I call that Peeking Swirl, but it is what I > think you are referring to as gyro blender. It doesn't "feel" like a five > add move, but it technically is. As for inspinning blender, dude, you are > seeing things way ahead of your time... Spinning blenders are fun; they seem so dramatic when they are hit (probably cause its an insane move). As for gyro blender, I'm curious to see how you do the move. I can hit it on a fairly consistant basis but this seems like a move where everyone has a unique style of doing it. When I do gyro blender, my setting foot never touches the ground. As for inspinning blender, that's a tad out of my league. Though I think it's definitely possible. A good warm up move for that trick is inspinning whirl (FUN!!). Adrian Verhoef -- marigold@vcn.bc.ca From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Dec 3 17:31:34 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id RAA26287 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 17:31:34 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f256.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.240.29]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id RAA06852 for ; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 17:01:43 -0800 Received: (qmail 18267 invoked by uid 0); 4 Dec 1999 01:02:44 -0000 Message-ID: <19991204010244.18266.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 198.150.50.129 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Fri, 03 Dec 1999 17:02:44 PST X-Originating-IP: [198.150.50.129] From: "tom labeff" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Unknown Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 19:02:44 CST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org OK, I have a move that I can't place. I looked for it in Jobs on F.W., but I don't trust my ability to read Jobs yet. It goes as follows, and usually is started by dropping a lap-stall (you know what that is) through to a clipper, then Doing an out to in ATW-toe stall. If that didn't make sense, I'll leave out the lap stall part and try Jobs: clip(xbd)>op out(dex)>same toe(del) Did I do Jobs right? Does that make sense? If so, is there a name? Do I have the adds right? Is this in the least a Good move? Anybody help me? Goin' tiltless!!!! Tom 'Obi-Wan' LaBeff---Schwinn's got a slow leak. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Fri Dec 3 20:31:55 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id UAA26459 for freestyle-outgoing; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 20:31:55 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net (mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.198.119]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA12701 for ; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 20:18:50 -0800 Received: from storefull-277.iap.bryant.webtv.net (storefull-277.iap.bryant.webtv.net [209.240.199.41]) by mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix) with ESMTP id AAAB838ED; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 20:20:17 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-277.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-e/mt.gso.26Feb98) id UAA29564; Fri, 3 Dec 1999 20:20:17 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhQ7HFa0pvfceDPmCqohpkddCRqL2wIVAMJhrSpRZge+oU7pdC9Gu7TdV/VA From: GFSmoothie@webtv.net (Greg Nelson) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 23:20:17 -0500 (EST) To: enlightener@footbag.org (Scott Davidson) Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Freestyle "Presentation" Card Message-ID: <590-38489681-1861@storefull-277.iap.bryant.webtv.net> Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hey Scott and all; >Especially the "Linking and Distribution" >and "Planes and Travel" categories >should be quantified so there is no >question as to what the judges are >looking for. You mean you don't like; The better you do at doing a bunch of big add stuff without breaking it up with kicks, the better you do at "linking and distribution". ? And , if you do some low, medium and high kicks, and cover more of the area than anyone, you get the best "planes and travel" ? >Originality and Personality are one >category worth two points total. Uhmmm....so....Originality is stuff that isn't seen done. And Personality is how well you come across. i.e. if you interact with the audience, and how much you look like you're having fun, right ? Hard stuff to count objectively. Greg Nelson From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Dec 4 09:21:03 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA26992 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 09:21:03 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.rdc1.tx.home.com (imail@ha1.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.66]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA06088 for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 08:32:20 -0800 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by mail.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991204163358.DKIF1169.mail.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 08:33:58 -0800 Message-ID: <3849429D.72B9C2CC@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 10:34:37 -0600 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tom labeff CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Unknown References: <19991204010244.18266.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org tom labeff wrote: > > OK, I have a move that I can't place. I looked for it in Jobs on F.W., but > I don't trust my ability to read Jobs yet. It goes as follows, > > clip(xbd)>op out(dex)>same toe(del) > > Did I do Jobs right? mostly. You don't get any ADDs for a set, so the real notation would be: clip > op out [dex] > same toe [del]. This is called a "legover". Actually, a legover can be set from anywhere as is noted on FW in the two-ADD section. The generic Job's notation for a legover is: Set > op out [dex] > same toe [del] where 'set' implies any possible set (toe, clip, dragon, heel, etc.) > If so, is there a name? Yep. Legover. > Do I have the adds right? Almost, see above. > Is this in the least a Good move? Legovers are key in many many many moves. I'm thinking of double legover, eggbeater, merkon, etc. All of the two ADD moves are important because you can build off of them. > Goin' tiltless!!!! Good for you. It is rare to see a good tiltless player. Most people skip that phase and go straight into being bad guiltless players. Stick with tiltless for a while, you'll be glad you did. Shred on. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sat Dec 4 13:23:55 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA27150 for freestyle-outgoing; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 13:23:55 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f170.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.170]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA11468 for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 12:47:39 -0800 Received: (qmail 18576 invoked by uid 0); 4 Dec 1999 20:48:49 -0000 Message-ID: <19991204204849.18575.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 198.150.50.129 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sat, 04 Dec 1999 12:48:49 PST X-Originating-IP: [198.150.50.129] From: "tom labeff" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] Pants&Shorts Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 14:48:49 CST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Ya know, I have never shredded in anything but pants. I just got done watching a healthy portion of videos off of Dallas' page, (by the way, Derric, I want to tell you, after seeing those videos, I'll take your advice any day) ...healthy portion of videos off of Dallas' page, and I noticed that every last one of them is wearing shorts. Matter-a fact, I've never seen any pros play in anything but shorts! Does any one out there NOT wear shorts? I know pants can get in the way, but does it make that much of a difference? Any recommendations for shorts? Runnin' low on sunshine.... Thomas LaBeff From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:27:08 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28356 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:27:08 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA14061 for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 14:42:59 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FM800M01N6EPU@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 15:44:38 -0700 (MST) Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 15:44:37 -0700 (MST) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: Re: [freestyle] Frustration In-reply-to: <000d01bf3d2e$8c885c80$3b9c9c9c@syda.org> To: William Wells Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, 2 Dec 1999, William Wells wrote: > I practice when I can but it doesn't seem to be enough. What kept you guys > going when you all started? How long did you guys stay at the beginner level > (ie. working on clippers, butterfly, mirage, pixie, atw, etc.). I know about frustration as well. For me it's hitting big tricks but very short strings. I realized last night that my average string gets up to about 6 tricks. I have longer ones and shorter ones. The only thing I can say is that you hit a lot of glass ceilings in this game and eventually you break through them with enough work or sometimes with a random act of chaos. > I know practicing with others is necessary. I have never really hack with > any one other than ok "hackers" and I don't seem to be progressing very > fast. I really want to go to a tournament but am waiting for one to be > nearby (Philly, NY ,or Montreal). Get tapes. The other night I got to watch the first half hour of "sultans" for the first time and I got so excited I started blowing out some of the best combos I've ever hit. Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:27:31 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28396 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:27:31 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (law2-f45.hotmail.com [216.32.181.45]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id IAA16997 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 08:22:52 -0800 Received: (qmail 91904 invoked by uid 0); 5 Dec 1999 16:24:06 -0000 Message-ID: <19991205162406.91903.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 216.44.107.95 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 05 Dec 1999 08:24:06 PST X-Originating-IP: [216.44.107.95] From: "Stan Sagalovskiy" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] infinity Date: Sun, 05 Dec 1999 11:24:06 EST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org hi, someone explained to me what an infinity was, but i forgot :-| is it just a right/left butterfly into a left/right butterfly? i searched the footbag.org movelist Steve, found nothing. did i confuse "infinity" with another name? -Stan. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:27:06 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28351 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:27:06 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Adam Mrosko Received: from imo22.mx.aol.com (imo22.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.66]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA13876 for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 14:32:18 -0800 Received: from ZZombie2@aol.com by imo22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v24.4.) id z.0.45470bf9 (5775) for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 17:33:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0.45470bf9.257af0b6@aol.com> Date: Sat, 4 Dec 1999 17:33:26 EST Subject: [freestyle] whirls To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 38 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello stylers, I have been practicing my whirls for a while now and I still haven't hit one. My friend Jamez said that I wasn't circling the bag. So can any of you whirl hitters out there give me any advice. Thanks, Adam"ShredinnJed"Mrosko From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:27:15 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28366 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:27:15 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA14310 for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 14:55:43 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FM800H01NRNVT@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 15:57:23 -0700 (MST) Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 15:57:23 -0700 (MST) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: Re: [freestyle] Pants&Shorts In-reply-to: <19991204204849.18575.qmail@hotmail.com> To: tom labeff Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > I know pants can get in the way, but does it make that much of a difference? > Any recommendations for shorts? Yes it does. For the first year I only wore jeans because I have these skinny little chicken legs. Then I tried shorts in the privacy of my own home one day and realized my vanity would have to take a back seat. For certain tricks at the beginner level you can get away with pants, but later on the harder tricks really require the freedom of mobility shorts give you. Unless you're Big Add Chad in "She's All That". Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:27:18 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28371 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:27:18 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Adam Mrosko Received: from imo22.mx.aol.com (imo22.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.66]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA14497 for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 15:05:25 -0800 Received: from ZZombie2@aol.com by imo22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v24.4.) id z.0.49f61fb (5775) for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 18:06:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0.49f61fb.257af877@aol.com> Date: Sat, 4 Dec 1999 18:06:31 EST Subject: [freestyle] move question To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 38 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hello stylers I was watchin a Peter Irish vid when I saw him hit a move that I have been wonderin about. The job notation is toe>op out>spin>op clip. Somethin like that. Its a rev mirage ending in an osis. Thanks for the help Adam"ShredinnJed"Mrosko From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:27:29 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28391 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:27:29 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f246.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.246]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id FAA10600 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 05:16:12 -0800 Received: (qmail 13788 invoked by uid 0); 5 Dec 1999 13:17:26 -0000 Message-ID: <19991205131726.13787.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 141.84.69.5 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Sun, 05 Dec 1999 05:17:25 PST X-Originating-IP: [141.84.69.5] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Pants&Shorts Date: Sun, 05 Dec 1999 05:17:25 PST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org tom labeff Wrote: >Matter-a fact, I've never seen any pros play in anything but shorts! >Does any one out there NOT wear shorts? I know pants can get in the >way, but does it make that much of a difference? I started playing in pants (anyone who¥s been to Portland knows we get sun about every other year) and actually got very good in them. I was even hitting blurs and ripwalk on both sides wearing jeans. (BIG) however, shorts do make a reallly big difference, especially if you want to do any dextarity moves, ie most moves. Also when I finally started wearing shorts the length of my runs almost doubled. You really don¥t reallize how much pants slow you down and get in the way till you swich. Although on the plus side wearing pants my dexs were very defined (because other wise the bag would run into stray fabric). As for other options many have aluded to playing naked in the dark, something I¥ve yet to try. > Any recommendations for shorts? Look for shorts that are so small people think you¥re wearing underwear, or even better extra tight spandex. Less is better, for your game if not astetically. -Andrew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:27:26 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28386 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:27:26 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA24371 for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 22:43:17 -0800 Received: (from jriely@localhost) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA04698; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 00:44:57 -0600 (CST) Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 00:44:57 -0600 (CST) From: "Jeremiah J. Riely" X-Sender: jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu To: KeN Somolinos cc: konrad@prairienet.org, freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] phat tricks In-Reply-To: <19991203030533.3691.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Hi. > Phil asked: > > > >I hit an opposite side symposium reverse whirl at the end of a string WOO! > >Does this move have a special name? > > >If you threw a swirl at the end of it, it would be a PHAT 5 add move. I > >was trying to do the swirl at the same time as the whirl with myfeet > >almost touching. > > the last move you described is a double helix. I thought double helix was a rev swriling symposium whirl. I may be wrong but this move is very different from the one described above. At any rate I don't think doulbe helix is set from opposite side (like paradox) as the one above is. Later From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:27:24 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28381 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:27:24 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA17271 for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 17:04:51 -0800 Received: (from jriely@localhost) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA01603; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 19:06:31 -0600 (CST) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 1999 19:06:31 -0600 (CST) From: "Jeremiah J. Riely" X-Sender: jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu To: tom labeff cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Pants&Shorts In-Reply-To: <19991204204849.18575.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > I know pants can get in the way, but does it make that much of a difference? Yes From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:26:55 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28346 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:26:55 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from dnvrpop2.dnvr.uswest.net (dnvrpop2.dnvr.uswest.net [206.196.128.4]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA23542 for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 21:54:41 -0800 Received: (qmail 92318 invoked by alias); 5 Dec 1999 05:56:23 -0000 Delivered-To: fixup-freestyle@footbag.org@fixme Received: (qmail 92301 invoked by uid 0); 5 Dec 1999 05:56:22 -0000 Received: from rdialup252.dnvr.uswest.net (HELO uswest.net) (216.160.172.252) by dnvrpop2.dnvr.uswest.net with SMTP; 5 Dec 1999 05:56:22 -0000 Message-ID: <3849FEEE.27E368FD@uswest.net> Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 22:58:06 -0700 From: "Matt Wafaie" Reply-To: mattius@uswest.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Pants&Shorts References: <19991204204849.18575.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org It makes so much of a difference that it's no contest. Shorts are much much better! They allow for better range of motion, easier mobility, they're not in the way, and they allow you to better see the footbag. I highly recommend shorts over pants without question. M@ From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:27:19 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28376 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:27:19 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from c004.sfo.cp.net (c004-h015.c004.sfo.cp.net [209.228.14.102]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA16955 for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 16:48:32 -0800 Received: (cpmta 20311 invoked from network); 4 Dec 1999 16:50:12 -0800 Received: from 216-59-29-221.usa.flashcom.net (HELO ul2ju) (216.59.29.221) by smtp.flashcom.net with SMTP; 4 Dec 1999 16:50:12 -0800 X-Sent: 5 Dec 1999 00:50:12 GMT From: "Mike Stoler" To: Subject: [freestyle] Ben Job and his fabulous notation Date: Sat, 4 Dec 1999 16:51:23 -0800 Message-ID: <002c01bf3eba$da8a2930$dd1d3bd8@flascom.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Who is Ben Job? Does he still kick? He has managed to achieve footbag immortality, and not for his kicking. I think that's really cool. Rex From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:27:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28361 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:27:11 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA14083 for ; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 14:45:06 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FM800101N9X2K@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Sat, 4 Dec 1999 15:46:45 -0700 (MST) Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 15:46:45 -0700 (MST) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: Re: [freestyle] phat tricks In-reply-to: To: Philip Summers Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Thu, 2 Dec 1999, Philip Summers wrote: > I hit an opposite side symposium reverse whirl at the end of a string WOO! > Does this move have a special name? Can you give the notation? I can't picture it. Thanks, Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 11:37:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA28459 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:37:11 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from Market.NET (market.net [140.174.206.2]) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA28456 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:37:10 -0800 Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA21304 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:32:45 -0800 Received: from [206.67.46.8] (brat1.atext.com [206.67.46.8]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA02778 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:33:59 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: brat@140.174.206.2 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <002c01bf3eba$da8a2930$dd1d3bd8@flascom.com> References: <002c01bf3eba$da8a2930$dd1d3bd8@flascom.com> Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:35:45 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Ben Job and his fabulous notation Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 4:51 PM -0800 12/4/99, Mike Stoler wrote: >Who is Ben Job? As described on the freestyle page, Ben Job was a computer science student at UC Boulder. He was on this list until about a year ago when his e-mail started bouncing. I don't know where he is. Maybe Daryl does. >Does he still kick? Probably. He was pretty good. He had mad skills. Steve From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 18:07:10 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA28862 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 18:07:10 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from mail.rdc1.tx.home.com (imail@ha1.rdc1.tx.home.com [24.4.0.66]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA22610 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 12:24:19 -0800 Received: from dallasfootbag.org ([24.7.100.246]) by mail.rdc1.tx.home.com (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <19991205202555.RCMJ1169.mail.rdc1.tx.home.com@dallasfootbag.org>; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 12:25:55 -0800 Message-ID: <384ACA88.6717A007@dallasfootbag.org> Date: Sun, 05 Dec 1999 14:26:48 -0600 From: Derric Scalf X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Adam Mrosko CC: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] move question References: <0.49f61fb.257af877@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Adam Mrosko wrote: > > Hello stylers > I was watchin a Peter Irish vid when I saw him > hit a move that I have been wonderin about. The > job notation is toe>op out>spin>op clip. > Somethin like that. Its a rev mirage ending > in an osis. Flux. A torque is a miraging osis. Likewise, a flux is a reverse miraging osis. Because of this, some people call flux a reverse torque. Now for my question... Is flux actually an atomic osis, or is it a reverse miraging osis? In other words, can you set flux from clipper? Or is that just called a 'bubba osis' with no nickname? Later. -Derric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 18:07:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA28864 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 18:07:11 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from web108.yahoomail.com (web108.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.75]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA29767 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 16:54:19 -0800 Received: (qmail 1138 invoked by uid 60001); 6 Dec 1999 00:56:01 -0000 Message-ID: <19991206005601.1137.qmail@web108.yahoomail.com> Received: from [12.79.57.143] by web108.yahoomail.com; Sun, 05 Dec 1999 16:56:01 PST Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 16:56:01 -0800 (PST) From: Sean Lane Subject: [freestyle] shes all that To: freestyle@footbag.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org everyone, who is the guy in "she's all that"? and what moves does he hit? thats all, thanks -sl From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 18:07:11 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA28863 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 18:07:11 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from coins0.coin.missouri.edu (coins0.coin.missouri.edu [198.209.253.1]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA22695 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 12:28:20 -0800 Received: (from jriely@localhost) by coins0.coin.missouri.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA05315; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 14:30:02 -0600 (CST) Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 14:30:02 -0600 (CST) From: "Jeremiah J. Riely" X-Sender: jriely@coins0.coin.missouri.edu To: Adam Mrosko cc: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] move question In-Reply-To: <0.49f61fb.257af877@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org > Hello stylers > I was watchin a Peter Irish vid when I saw him > hit a move that I have been wonderin about. The > job notation is toe>op out>spin>op clip. > Somethin like that. Its a rev mirage ending > in an osis. That is a flux. A reverse dex torque. Later From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 23:08:50 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA29200 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 23:08:50 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from dnvrpop5.dnvr.uswest.net (dnvrpop5.dnvr.uswest.net [206.196.128.7]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA05728 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 22:17:15 -0800 Received: (qmail 64438 invoked by alias); 6 Dec 1999 06:19:02 -0000 Delivered-To: fixup-Freestyle@footbag.org@fixme Received: (qmail 64426 invoked by uid 0); 6 Dec 1999 06:19:01 -0000 Received: from pdialup129.dnvr.uswest.net (HELO uswest.net) (209.181.68.129) by dnvrpop5.dnvr.uswest.net with SMTP; 6 Dec 1999 06:19:01 -0000 Message-ID: <384B55BF.9772B748@uswest.net> Date: Sun, 05 Dec 1999 23:20:47 -0700 From: "Matt Wafaie" Reply-To: mattius@uswest.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] shes all that References: <19991206005601.1137.qmail@web108.yahoomail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org That's big add Chad! He doesn't hit anything too tricky. Bound by pants. From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 23:07:38 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA29190 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 23:07:38 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from ewey.excite.com (ewey-rwcmta.excite.com [198.3.99.191]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA06587 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 22:58:25 -0800 Received: from prickles ([199.172.153.88]) by fortune.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.00 201-229-116) with SMTP id <19991206065900.VWJM22679.fortune.excite.com@prickles> for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 22:59:00 -0800 Message-ID: <12007921.944463540968.JavaMail.imail@prickles> Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 22:59:00 -0800 (PST) From: Eric Wulff To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: [freestyle] trivia style answers 1st episode... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 166.90.38.48 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Howdy all! Ironamn here to finally wrap up the first round of "Trivia Style". Sorry it's been so long since we last met but my system at home basically sucks and I've been havin trouble gettin online. I actually had a second addition ready to go out on Thursday and sent it but something went wrong and it never made it to the air waves. Also, do to technical difficulties I can't view my original post right now so I am giving the answers based on my memory of the original questions... :) If I miss somethin I will catch it in a few days so don't worry. Anyway, without further delay... here ya go... **BHH(Black Hole of Hein" nicknames "as announced" back in the day... 1. of course... "Rippin" was and always will be "Rippin" Rick Reese. 1 add 2. David Yevin was certainly "Revvin"... :) 5 adds 3. Kenny Shult"s" was announced as??? yep... only GF Smoothie got it... "Bad Motor Scooter" Did you look at my post from a few weeks ago regarding GF? :) - 7 adds **3 person freestyle teams, I'm actually simply copying Becca's post to me here(with some added details)cause she may have named them all... Fred Barnum, Jack Schoolcraft, Jim Fitzgerald Dennis Ross, Jon Lind, Kenny Shults " " " " , Kevin Courtney Footboltz (Bill, Scott, Randy) Addmobiles (Gary Lautt, Mag Huges, Jimmy C) Ocean County Clippers (Eric Wulff, Russ Willi, Ed Orlando) Constance Reed, Jody Welch, and Heather Cook Jimmy Caveny, Jeff "Animal" Johnson, Dennis Ross Dennis Ross, Dave Robinson, Reed Gray On a side note... 2 people caught me in a wrong answer. This was unfortunately before this was actually an officical game. I will still give them 3 bonus points each for catching it. BHH did not kick to the song "Momentary Lapse of Reason" but "One Slip" which have the lyrics "Momentary Lapse of Reason". O.K.... Current Standings. Be sure to keep track at home also. Ken "Ceiling Fan" - 1 Dennis Lee - 3 adds (caught the Floydian "One Slip"... nice) Yacine - 3 (included here - I think the new schooler deserves 2 adds for knowin Kenny's present BAP name "Enforcer") Ian Dubman - 6 Tina Lewis - 7 Brad Kaplin - 20(repeats don't count but I'll give ya 1 add for knowin some of these teams competed more than once and when) John Schneider - 20 ( 3 add bonus-caught the Floydian slip.. nice work! :) GF the Smoothest - 22 (nice work on the "Scooter" but no footboltz?) Becca - 33 (now that's history... :) see ya soon.. ironman out From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Sun Dec 5 23:08:39 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA29195 for freestyle-outgoing; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 23:08:39 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from ra.nilenet.com (root@ra.nilenet.com [204.227.31.1] (may be forged)) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA02048 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 19:47:00 -0800 Received: from pc13 (slip26.den.nilenet.net [206.247.98.26]) by ra.nilenet.com (8.9.0.Beta5/8.9.0.Beta5) with SMTP id UAA11975 for ; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 20:47:07 -0700 (MST) Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Sun, 5 Dec 1999 20:50:20 -0700 Message-ID: <01BF3F62.57C2EAC0.genzu@nilenet.com> From: Daryl Genz To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] New Record? Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 20:48:34 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Paul, the "Sandman" Mestas hit 15 Dynos today (dropped, barely on 16 and still looked strong). I believe that's a new record. He's also hit 8 ducking refractions (same side), but I don't know if that one's a record. Shred on. Genzu Blades From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Dec 6 13:34:46 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA29937 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:34:46 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from Market.NET (market.net [140.174.206.2]) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA29934 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:34:46 -0800 Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA06700 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:30:10 -0800 Received: from [206.67.46.8] (brat1.atext.com [206.67.46.8]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA18002 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:31:30 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: brat@140.174.206.2 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19991205162406.91903.qmail@hotmail.com> References: <19991205162406.91903.qmail@hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:33:16 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] infinity Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 11:24 AM -0500 12/5/99, Stan Sagalovskiy wrote: >someone explained to me what an infinity was, but i forgot :-| The reason it's not on the move list is because infinity is not really the name for a move. It's just the name for a butterfly stall when set from the opposite clipper. It's called infinity because if you repeat butterflies (left to right and back again) it looks like an infinity sign. Steve From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Dec 6 13:34:41 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA29932 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:34:41 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA06263 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:16:43 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FMC00B018IXFI@clem.mscd.edu> for freestyle@footbag.org; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 14:18:33 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 06 Dec 1999 14:18:32 -0700 (MST) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: [freestyle] Committees To: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org I was thinking about the add system the other day (Oooo trouble). Let's forget the whole "adds schmads" campaign for a minute, since we do need a rating system for competition if not for circle shredding. Anyway, I was thinking that one of the problems with coming up with a new and better system was that it always gets discussed here and everyone gets in a huff to the point where no one wants to take the next person seriously. So how about collecting a committee of volunteers, say about 10 or so people who will work out a new system which will incorporate some of the newer ideas and phases Freestyle is going through. Then those people will present their ideas to the already existing "IFAB Advisory Board" at next years Worlds and they can decide whether or not to use the new system or if the committee should try again or make some adjustments. Now this would not stop anyone from making their suggestions on how to improve the system, but it will be the decision of the committee on whether or not to apply those suggestions. It would also be a good idea if some of the people on the committee had polar opposite views on how it should work. They could nicely make a few concessions to eachothers ideas so as to incorporate as much variety as possible and give us a great new add system. I would also suggest tearing the current system to "shreds" and rebuilding it using some of the parts but not necessarily all. Maybe it would involve changing the definition of paradox or applying adds to specialty sets like dragon or frigid osis (don't kill me they are just examples of possibilities). I don't know it all, but a committee could decide that. In the end it's really hard for one person to come up with a system on their own then put it on the list and have everyone like it (most often it's shot to hell), but if there is a group of people representing a variety of views then maybe something can be done to improve the system that so many people hate. Imagine the add system transformed into a thing of beauty and reverence. Something we can all be proud of and not fear when we say the add value of a move. One last thing. I love shreddin'! Thank you (now tear me a new one), Brad From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Dec 6 13:55:52 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA29971 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:55:52 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from Market.NET (market.net [140.174.206.2]) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA29968 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:55:51 -0800 Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA07426 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:51:16 -0800 Received: from [206.67.46.8] (brat1.atext.com [206.67.46.8]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA21715 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:52:37 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: brat@140.174.206.2 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:54:32 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Committees Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 2:18 PM -0700 12/6/99, Brad Kaplan wrote: > Anyway, I was thinking that one of the problems with coming up with a >new and better system was that it always gets discussed here and everyone >gets in a huff to the point where no one wants to take the next person >seriously. No, the problem is that this forum cannot by definition be the forum where decisions actually get made. But your assessment is otherwise correct. >So how about collecting a committee of volunteers, say about >10 or so people who will work out a new system which will incorporate some >of the newer ideas and phases Freestyle is going through. Go for it. >Then those >people will present their ideas to the already existing "IFAB Advisory >Board" Umm. IFAB used to mean Int'l Footbag Advisory Board, so saying "IFAB Advisory Board" would be a bit redundant. :-) But anyway now it's called the IFC, for International Footbag Committee. This is exactly where new systems should be proposed. >at next years Worlds It would be a mistake to wait until Worlds. For anything to be seriously considered, it'd need to be submitted to the IFC freestyle committee long before the actual meeting where rule changes are voted in (which is at Worlds). > Now this would not stop anyone from making their suggestions on how >to improve the system, Nothing will. :-) >but it will be the decision of the committee on >whether or not to apply those suggestions. The IFC freestyle committee members are almost all active participants on this e-mail discussion list. :-) I wonder what exactly the problem you're trying to solve is, but don't let me dissuade you from rallying the troops. :-) >It would also be a good idea >if some of the people on the committee had polar opposite views on how it >should work. Heh heh. That sounds like a formula for getting absolutely nothing done. I mean, most proposals are made by people who are thinking similarly and want to get a constructive, coherent plan on the table. If there are polar opposites, then that means there should be multiple factions presenting distinct proposals and lobbying for or against them to the IFC. But we don't have that many people or that much time, so I think probably the right thing is just to have a few smart people who have similar ideas to sit down and agree on some basic things and then iterate with maybe slightly larger group to come up with a single proposal. >They could nicely make a few concessions to eachothers ideas >so as to incorporate as much variety as possible and give us a great new >add system. When you say "add system" do you mean "system of measuring difficulty of individual tricks"? There are a million ways we could go from considering the theory of difficulty for the sport at both the micro and macro levels (tricks vs. routines). > I would also suggest tearing the current system to "shreds" and >rebuilding it using some of the parts but not necessarily all. Hahhahahahhahahahahhahahahahahahahhahahahahahaha. (Hah.) Sorry; I just laughed when I read that. Don't know why. I'll leave it as an exercise to the reader. :-) > In the end it's really hard for one person to come up with a system >on their own then put it on the list and have everyone like it (most >often it's shot to hell), but if there is a group of people representing a >variety of views then maybe something can be done to improve the system >that so many people hate. Imagine the add system transformed into a >thing of beauty and reverence. Something we can all be proud of and not >fear when we say the add value of a move. That's what I think we've been doing for the last 4 years on this discussion list. :-) But either way, while your comments are mostly dead on (despite my ribbing), what exactly are you saying? You haven't presented an actionable proposal, exactly. You just fantasized a bit in public about some etherial committee that would do a bunch of work to benefit the community. Who exactly do you anticipate would do this? Are you offering to organize it? Do you want people to submit an application to you to join the committee? I'm a bit confused as to the goal of your message. Steve From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Dec 6 13:57:50 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA29981 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:57:50 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from inetsrv.callplus.co.nz (mail.callplus.co.nz [202.27.103.146]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA07015 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 13:42:50 -0800 Received: by INETSRV with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 10:44:01 +1300 Message-ID: <8186832B88B9D211959E002035F378234B127E@INETSRV> From: Adrian Dick To: "'freestyle@footbag.org'" Subject: [freestyle] Internet Hein Combo Week Date: Tue, 7 Dec 1999 10:43:57 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by list.footbag.org id NAB29981 Welcome to the first annual Internet Hein Combo Week. - December 6 - December 13. Throughout this week you are allowed to post your most hein combos without being embarrassed at showing off. Just remember that some of us live so far away we dont get to see you shred, so this is all we got ! Shred it up ! From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Dec 6 19:34:36 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA30448 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 19:34:36 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (jsishipping.com [207.33.33.34]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA15012; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 17:28:07 -0800 Received: from jsisfo22.jsishipping.com ([207.33.33.89]) by jsisfomg1.jsishipping.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-14027) with SMTP id AAA488; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 17:29:32 -0800 From: "Eric Wulff" To: "'freestyle'" Subject: [freestyle] Re: mobius Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1999 17:29:40 -0800 Message-ID: <001801bf4052$88dddac0$592121cf@jsisfo22.jsishipping.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi all, sorry bout the spinning mirage comment in my tips for mobius. I personally do not prescribe to the gyro def excepted by the masses and used on fw. HOWEVER, I should've used gyro in this case and generally try to in order to avoid confusion. Simply a mistake of habit on my part. Once again, sorry and I have now corrected my tips for mobius. Eric From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Dec 6 21:06:10 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA30536 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 21:06:10 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: Forest Schrodt Received: from ego.mind.net (IDENT:mail@ego.mind.net [206.99.66.9]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA21187 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 20:57:00 -0800 Received: from 206.151.158.116 (ip110.mind.net [206.151.158.116]) by ego.mind.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA26052 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 20:58:48 -0800 Message-ID: <384C2318.309@mind.net> Date: Mon, 06 Dec 1999 20:58:39 +0000 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Committees References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Hi everyone, after reading Brad and then Steve's reply about getting a commitee to come up with some changes to the ADD system I got to thinking, and what I think might work is this. At the next Western Regionals(Steve's event and second only to Worlds for drawing the best stylers), all Open competetors who make it to the finals and any one else who wants to be involved, form the commitee that will make any necessery changes to the ADD system in time for worlds. The meeting times of the commitee could be part of the scheduling of Western regionals and be manditory for the Open finalists. I personally think that it should be the dicision's of the very top players of the world to make any changes to the ADD system for it is they who are pushing the sport the hardest. I personally would feel very confident in any decision that a commitee made up with such people like, Rippin, Peter, Big Bad Wulfy, Scott D., Tuan, Regulator, Bob w/the Green, Da Torch, Gentzu, etc.... The very top players are really the ones who I think have a complete understanding of the game, not just in shredding but in competing and judging as well. Just some of my thoughts. Forest From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Mon Dec 6 21:12:12 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA30548 for freestyle-outgoing; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 21:12:12 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from Market.NET (market.net [140.174.206.2]) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA30545 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 21:12:11 -0800 Received: from kaos.atext.com (kaos.atext.com [204.62.245.13]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA21394 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 21:07:32 -0800 Received: from [206.67.46.8] (brat1.atext.com [206.67.46.8]) by kaos.atext.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA16534 for ; Mon, 6 Dec 1999 21:08:51 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: brat@140.174.206.2 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <384C2318.309@mind.net> References: <384C2318.309@mind.net> Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1999 21:10:48 -0800 To: freestyle@footbag.org From: Steve Goldberg Subject: Re: [freestyle] Committees Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 8:58 PM +0000 12/6/99, Forest Schrodt wrote: >all Open competetors who make it to the finals and any one >else who wants to be involved, form the commitee that will make any >necessery changes to the ADD system in time for worlds. Hah ahhah aha ha ha hahahhahahahah ha ah ah ah hahahhahah ah ah ah ha hahahhahahahahhaha. (Hah.) Good one, Forest. Steve From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Dec 7 10:45:06 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA31292 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 10:45:06 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f269.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.240.47]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id GAA10626 for ; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 06:43:12 -0800 Received: (qmail 92229 invoked by uid 0); 7 Dec 1999 14:44:37 -0000 Message-ID: <19991207144437.92228.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 141.84.137.103 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 07 Dec 1999 06:44:37 PST X-Originating-IP: [141.84.137.103] From: "Andrew McCargar" To: freestyle@footbag.org Subject: Re: [freestyle] Committees Date: Tue, 07 Dec 1999 06:44:37 PST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Mad(in a good way) Teva wearer Forest wrote: >all Open competetors who make it to the finals and any one >else who wants to be involved, form the commitee that will make any >necessery changes to the ADD system in time for worlds. To which the one and only Steve Goldberg replied: >Hah ahhah aha ha ha hahahhahahahah ha ah ah ah hahahhahah ah ah ah ha >hahahhahahahahhaha. (Hah.) >Good one, Forest. Although I may have stated that differently, Steve has a point. One of the requierments to make this kind of project work is that the individual members have to be motivated enough to work it out to the end. I would say most players really don't have the drive to do that. And of course even if they do, this is a long long long process. As for assembling a commity to solve all this: First someone needs to put the players together, not an easy task in and of itself. Second is the choise of the participants, if they are more or less like minded they will probably tend to come up with a solution which misses a lot. If they have many polerized opinions they will tend to come up with a half-assed sollution to keep every one quiet. ie. this is really not an easy thing to do. On the other hand the odds that this list mutually agrees on a commonly created anything is close to nill. As the saying goes "A donkey is a horse designed by a commitee" Still I'm interested to see if anyone tries this. -Andrew From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Dec 7 10:45:08 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA31297 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 10:45:08 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f From: William Wells Received: from symail.syda.org (hidden-user@symail.syda.org [208.130.6.77]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA13110 for ; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 08:12:08 -0800 Received: from CSPW (CS-PW [156.156.156.59]) by symail.syda.org with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id YB7R4J26; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 11:13:58 -0500 Message-ID: <000b01bf40cd$6926ff60$3b9c9c9c@syda.org> To: Subject: Re: [freestyle] Committees Date: Tue, 7 Dec 1999 11:09:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org At 8:58 PM +0000 12/6/99, Forest Schrodt wrote: >all Open competetors who make it to the finals and any one >else who wants to be involved, form the commitee that will make any >necessery changes to the ADD system in time for worlds. Steve then replyed: >Hah ahhah aha ha ha hahahhahahahah ha ah ah ah hahahhahah ah >ah ah ha hahahhahahahahhaha. (Hah.) >Good one, Forest. I understand what you mean about making it manditroy for all open players to have to help, hell its hard enough getting enough who want to compete in open. (I think from what i have heard...) But it still isn't a laughing matter, just state why he is being absurb and save the laughter for something else. he is trying to help, don't even come close to makeing him think twice about trying to help next time. P.S. I undestand that you get a lot of these laughing matters and are getting tired of replying in full length but be patience with us... please. Forest Also Wrote: >The very top players are really the ones who I think have a complete >understanding of the game, not just in shredding but in >competing and judging as well. I agree with what forest wrote above. People like me or with less experience who haven't been around as much won't know what has worked and also how things work (in terms of the moves mechanics), as completely as any "veteran" player (skill and years of play). The people who do make the changes have to be "qualified", not just any joe off the street. My two cents, Will From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Dec 7 10:45:05 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA31287 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 10:45:05 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from inetsrv.callplus.co.nz (mail.callplus.co.nz [202.27.103.146]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id DAA04485 for ; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 03:52:20 -0800 Received: by INETSRV with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Wed, 8 Dec 1999 00:53:50 +1300 Message-ID: <8186832B88B9D211959E002035F378234B129B@INETSRV> From: Adrian Dick To: "'Forest Schrodt'" , freestyle@footbag.org Subject: RE: [freestyle] Committees Date: Wed, 8 Dec 1999 00:53:43 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org Well, I have a change which I think everyone will agree with. You do not get a symposium add for 1/2 dex tricks. It seems like it has already been agreed on, but not made an official change to the add system. This will clear up the following tricks: Symposium Butterfly - 3 adds Any Pogo Set - 1 add Da Da Curve - everyone knows this is 4 adds, but it has never really made sense because it should be 5 with current Symposium definition. What do you say Whanganui? From owner-freestyle@list.footbag.org Tue Dec 7 10:45:04 1999 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by list.footbag.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA31286 for freestyle-outgoing; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 10:45:04 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: list.footbag.org: majordom set sender to owner-freestyle@footbag.org using -f Received: from clem.mscd.edu (pmdf@clem.mscd.edu [147.153.1.3]) by Market.NET (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA25073; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 00:06:43 -0800 Received: from localhost by clem.mscd.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #39336) with SMTP id <0FMD003012MBL9@clem.mscd.edu>; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 01:08:35 -0700 (MST) Date: Tue, 07 Dec 1999 01:08:35 -0700 (MST) From: Brad Kaplan Subject: Re: [freestyle] Committees In-reply-to: To: Steve Goldberg Cc: freestyle@footbag.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freestyle@footbag.org On Mon, 6 Dec 1999, Steve Goldberg wrote: > Heh heh. That sounds like a formula for getting absolutely nothing > done. I mean, most proposals are made by people who are thinking > similarly and want to get a constructive, coherent plan on the table. > If there are polar opposites, then that means there should be > multiple factions presenting distinct proposals and lobbying for or > against them to the IFC. Yes and as optomistic as it sounds I think it's possible to get it done in one shot with one group even if there are opposing views. That way there are people from more than one walk of freestyle representing the whole community rather than a few who all agree, but don't represent the many viewpoints. > When you say "add system" do you mean "system of measuring difficulty > of individual tricks"? There are a million ways we could go from > considering the theory of difficulty for the sport at both the micro > and macro levels (tricks vs. routines). I mean difficulty of individual tricks. I know this is a tough one because of how different everyones playing style is and to an extent the difficulty is quite subjective. In order to get close enough to a great system everyone may have to just grin and bare one trick that doesn't work as well for another that better suits their style. > > I would also suggest tearing the current system to "shreds" and > >rebuilding it using some of the parts but not necessarily all. > > Hahhahahahhahahahahhahahahahahahahhahahahahahaha. (Hah.